If we were to shoehorn planeswalkers into Ravnican guilds...

  • #1
    Blame my boredom for starting this silly discussion XD

    So, exactly as the title says; If the Ravnican guilds were to recruit our planeswalkers and the planeswalkers go with that, who'll be in which guild? Of course, be mindful that in the case of planeswalkers who have multicolored versions, just because those colors fit one of the guilds doesn't mean they fit that guild. And yes, of course, many planeswalkers certainly don't feel they belong in any guild at all, so think of this thread as "If a guild wanted to invite a planeswalker as an honorary guest member" scenario XD

    My opinions:

    (*) Planeswalkers with cards (do refrain from delving too deep into their card's abilities, unless you can't really think of anything else XD).
    - Ajani: Seems pretty Selesnyan for me. He specializes in supporting people, and his people do see him as a good leader.
    - Jace: Azorius. So far the main effect of his magic is to restrict people one way or another. Between mind-wiping to prevent people doing some things, counterspells, etc etc.
    - Liliana: I'm voting for Orzhoz, considering that she's a seductive lady who'll make a hell out of your life later, she seems to fit the Orzhov.
    - Chandra: Izzet, most likely.
    - Garruk: Gruul, too easy. I guess most beastmasters will go along fine with Gruul's ideals.
    - Elspeth: Her war skills certainly makes her a good fit for Boros.
    - Tezzeret: Dimir, most likely.
    - Sarkhan: Gruul. His reverence for dragons certainly mirrors general beastmasters' affinity to their beasts.
    - Bolas: Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely Dimir. Although in his case, it's less of 'being invited as honorary guest member' and more of 'hey, how did he get in here?'
    - Sorin: Seems pretty Dimir for me. Sneaky, planning, and generally not good with people.
    - Nissa: Tough cookie. Despite knowing black mana and having been to Lorwyn before (where the elves are black/green), her methodologies have nothing to do with Golgari's. And her pride may not sit well with Selesnya either. Orzhov, maybe?
    - Gideon: Even without him being an 'acquaintance' of Aurelia (a very, very loose acquaintance), he's pretty Boros, considering that he prefers to go down and dirty.
    - Koth: Gruul, maybe? So far we know he's a landscaping specialist, and Gruul does know a bit about it. Scratch that. His attitude towards Phyrexian invasion hints more towards Boros.
    - Venser: Izzet, considering how much of a genius artificer he is.
    - Karn: Azorius, maybe? Not sure if he fits elsewhere.
    - Tamiyo: I'm voting for Izzet based on what we know of her so far; She seems to be pursuing knowledge for knowledge's sake.
    - Tibalt: Rakdos, oh dear, Rakdos.
    - Vraska: Being a revenge-seeker, she indeed doesn't seem Golgari anymore despite being who she is. Bari once said he thinks Vraska feels more Dimir right now, and I think I agree.
    - Domri: Well, Gruul :)

    (*) Planeswalkers without cards (I don't remember well on many of the oldwalkers, so I'll leave many of them blank with the rest of you hopefully filling in the gap Smile If you want XD)
    - Urza: Izzet? He is a skilled artificer after all, and despite his super-soldier projects he doesn't seem fitting for Simic.
    - Freyalise: Selesnya? Well, I sure know squat about her XD
    - Serra: Selesnya, considering the way she built her realm.
    - Teferi: Maybe Azorius, but I'm not sure.
    - Jaya: Izzet, probably, because although she is a Task Mage, she's not exactly a homicidal maniac like the Rakdos, which has mercenaries as their occasional trade.
    - Jeska: Toss up between Gruul or Boros, but I'm voting Gruul due to her barbarian upbringing.
    - Tevesh Szat: Dimir is likely, but considering that he exists solely to screw up everyone else, Rakdos is also quite likely.

    - Sifa: Rakdos, probably. So far we only know she's evil and mean.
    - Ral Zarek: Doesn't seem like he's strayed far from the Izzet.
    - Dack Fayden: Izzet?

    Feel free to contribute if you have spare time Smile

    PS: Ya, I noticed after finishing this post that somehow I don't think anyone here is a fit for Simic/Golgari XD maybe I overlooked things?
    Last edited by magac: 3/1/2013 6:16:26 AM
  • #2
    I disagree with your assessment of Jace. I think he's far closer to Dimir than Azorius. Restricting people's movements (and counterspelling) and mind-wiping is very firmly in character with the memory excision and intrusion practices that the Dimir use. He's also very secretive, somewhat of a loner, and keeps to himself as much as possible, using the information he gains from his pursuits for his own ends.

    Yes, he can and will sometimes go out of his way to help others, but it's my understanding that he does so only to the extent that he can benefit from it. He doesn't strictly belong as U/B, and for the time being, remains mono-blue. But I think he tends Dimir over Azorius.

    I also think Sorin tends a bit more Orzhov than Dimir (the hedonism and pleasure-seeking aspects of him fit Orzhov's opulence and such a lot better than the shadowy nature of the Dimir). And as it says in his profile, he does occasionally do things for the good of others (Avacyn, the Eldrazi), but only when it's in his best interest, another trait of Orzhov. And of course, he's got a B/W card.
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  • #3
    Hm. A guilds would invite as honorary member:

    Azorius: Jace for his restricting magic, possibly Venser as "external artifice help".
    Orzhov: Liliana as expert in dark deals, Bolas just for intimidation purposes ("we'll pay nicely to you to scare the soul out of our indebted").
    Dimir: Bolas in case they need a new mastermind, Jace for mindreading/erasing, Liliana for summoning spirits, Tezzeret for knowledge and ambition, Vraska for silent assassinations, Tamiyo as field reporter/journalist.
    Izzet: Chandra for her passion for studying piromancy, Jace as powerful mind (possibly an instrument to Firemind), Tamiyo for "studying for the sake of studying", Tezzeret for tinkering, Karn for being Karn (MUST STUDY DAT GOLEM!!!).
    Rakdos: Chandra for BOOM, Garruk as a workhorse-ogre-substitute (or circus performer), Sarkhan on basis "we all are mad about something huge and wingy", Tibalt for being Tibalt.
    Golgari
    : Liliana as necromancer and closest related to death, Vraska already has a history of working for them.
    Gruul: Ajani as walking powerup, Chandra as "burn the authority", Domri is already invited, Garruk as the nastiest fighter down there, Koth as the only nature-based walker.
    Boros: Ajani and Chandra for offence, Elspeth, Gideon, Koth and possibly Karn for protection of meek.
    Selesnya: Elspeth and Gideon as honorable knights who cares a great deal about her people, Jace for mind control, Nissa as elven battlemaster.
    Simic: Tamiyo for research, Nissa as spiritualist?

    How they can invite themselves:
    Ajani: Gruul or Boros. His power lies in community, and the cat is guite passionate about his people; but a bit on wilder side.
    Chandra: who has the biggest explosions and smallest red tape there? Izzet! Too caring for others and clean to be Rakdos.
    Domri: already Gruul.
    Elspeth: Boros or Selesnya for ability to fight but caring most about her people.
    Garruk: another wild son for Gruul.
    Gideon: Moral code, distrust to pyromancers. safety of others first, so primarily Azorius. Getting himself into fight while protecting others second, so maybe Boros, depending on his mood.
    Jace: is very sad that "everyone want me for mind magic", plus certain talk with Emmara at first part of Secretist, so likely Selesnya for now.
    Karn: pacifist with occasional "Karn SMASH!"? Boros? I'm not sure here.
    Koth: serious guy with strong aversion to baddies and being told what to do? Boros or Gruul, or Gruul or Boros.
    Liliana: Orzhov, that's easy. Prolonged life, luxury and good fit for her talents.
    Bolas: has a history of organising "spy" networks, so easily the new leader of Dimir.
    Nissa: run away from Ravnica, fast? Maybe will try as devkarin-like shaman for Golgari, but she definitely doesn't belong here.
    Sarkhan: goes to Rakdos for passion to destruction.
    Sorin: to Orzhov for respect and ability to use dark methods. And occasional noble goals.
    Tamiyo: Izzet? She seems too controlled to be there, but doesn't really fit elsewhere.
    Tezzeret: enormous ambitions. Ingenious abilities. Necromancy. Dimir or Orzhov.
    Tibalt: Rakdos.
    Venser: Izzet for sitting there, tinkering and not thinking of consequences?
    Vraska: Golgari for the lack of "noble revenge" guild.
  • #4
    Ajani: None. He’d probably be uncomfortable on Ravnica because … well, there don’t seem to be any other members of his species anywhere on the plane. Would any of the guilds even accept him when they'd see him as a space alien?
    Bolas: None. Why would he join a guild? He’d sit back and try to play them all off one another. He’d probably end up using the Dimir most often as his tool of choice, but he’d never stoop to actually being one of them.
    Chandra: None, mainly just because I don’t think any of them would take her! She might fit in best among the Izzet, but she’s no scientist and they’d know it. That probably means she’d end up an underling or assistant of some kind, and there’s no way she’d put up with that!
    Domri: Gruul. He already belongs to them.
    Elspeth: Selesnya. She values peace and harmony a great deal, but she also understands that they must be protected through force when needed. Of all the guilds, I think they’re also the one most likely to remind her of Bant. Then again, maybe that would give her flashbacks, who knows?
    Garruk: Gruul. Even cursed and half-mad the way he is now, all of his ideals line up perfectly with theirs. I doubt they’d care too much about what a loner he is, either; they’d give him his space and let him run around with his beasts.
    Gideon: The Gateless Movement. His time with the Boros has made him uncomfortable with their methods and with Aurelia herself on a personal level. He believes strongly in justice and protecting the innocent, and I think pretty soon he’s going to realize the Gateless are the ones who truly stand for that as well.
    Jace: Dimir. Sneaking about, reading peoples’ minds or worse, then erasing their memories so they never even realize it happened? He’d fit right in.
    Karn: Azorius. He's a pacifist, and would approve of their methods of nonviolent containment. He also has a great deal of experience as an authority figure and is used to handing out laws, both as the creator and ruler of Argentum and as the Father of Machines. On the other hand, the Izzet want Karn so bad they can taste it. He's the only known being in the multiverse who can travel through time. Niv-Mizzet would gladly burninate everyone in his own vanity guild to learn that trick.
    Kiora: Simic. From the little we know about her, she’s really into sea monsters. And, well, the Simic kind of have a monopoly on that particular resource on Ravnica. Admittedly, her attitude toward them is really different from them – she seems to revere them as spiritual totems, while they want to splice them with everything else. She might see that as heresy, or she might be first in line to get some tentacles added. We can't really say for sure yet.
    Koth: None. He expressly stated that he’ll never stop fighting the Phyrexians on Darksteel Plate. Even in a thought experiment, I can’t imagine any scenario in which he’d leave Mirrodin and be on Ravnica looking for a club to join.
    Liliana: None. I just can’t see her willingly playing nice with any of the guilds for longer than it takes for her to get whatever she wants – at which point she’d drop them like a sack of bricks and get back to her demon-hunting. She’s a girl with a mission, after all.
    Nissa: None. She’s too xenophobic! She visited Ravnica once before and was terrified by it.
    Ral: Izzet. He already belongs to them.
    Sarkhan: I’m gonna have to place him in two guilds, simply because he’s so different before and after his breakdown. In his original incarnation he would have done well with the Gruul, especially their more spiritual side. After having his mind shattered by Bolas, he’s so incoherently self-destructive that the only guild he could possibly fit in would be Rakdos.
    Sorin: Orzhov. As a vampire, he’s clearly down with using other people as nothing more than a means to extend his life. Plus, he’s already shown that he’s perfectly comfortable using religious trappings to emotionally manipulate people – to a good cause, of course.
    Tamiyo: Azorius. She was really hard to place, because she’s ultimately an sociologist, and none of the guilds are really “about” that. Finally, I realized that she’d be PERFECT for the Azorius for one reason: taking the census would be her dream come true! XD
    Tezzeret: Dimir, though he might actually be too openly ambitious/evil/insane for them.
    Tibalt: Rakdos. He's a half-devil who enjoys torturing people just for the evulz, and on his new card he looks like a strung-out junkie about to stab someone. He'd love it here.
    Venser: Izzet, for the same reasons mineralica stated. He was a smart guy who liked tinkering around with machines, but apparently tended to get too caught him in his little projects to think of what they’d be used for.
    Vraska: Dimir. She faked her own death to take deliciously ironic vengeance using secrets, lies, and sleeper agents. That green mana symbol isn't fooling anyone, she's not Golgari.
  • #5
    Fun topic!

    - Ajani - I agree about Selesnya. Excluding Ajani Vengeant, an obvious Boros mood for him, he has made tokens as Ajani Goldmane and Ajani, Caller of the Pride.
    - Jace - Dimir possibly. I don't think he's a fan of order like the Azorius, or of knowledge like the izzet. Plus most people who played against Jace, The Mind Sculptor probably thought he was evil beyond reproach, so Dimir could work. Then again, Omniscience tells us that the pursuit of knowledge appeals to him. So Izzet could work. I think he'd be OK at Azorius, Dimir or Izzet, but he'd be a bit different from the pack.
    - Liliana
    - Chandra - Rakdos if anything. She loves to destroy things, and acts as she pleases.
    - Garruk - Gruul I think. A love of nature but also somewhat primal.
    - Elspeth - Boros, but she'd probably be one of the coolest-headed Boros in the guild.
    - Tezzeret - Probably Dimir, but before being Bolas' pawn I think he could have been Azorius due to his artifact background, and I would consider Azorius (or WU) the artifact pair.
    - Sarkhan - Gruul I think. He has a primal love of beasts, but particularly flying fire-breathing beasts.
    - Bolas - Dimir and Rakdos for the Multiverse's biggest baddie.
    - Sorin - I'm unsure. I mean, he was WB in Dark Ascension, but he was more of a bad guy with a conscience rather than a heartless, greedy plutocrat. I say guildless.
    - Nissa - Selesnya maybe? I don't know about her to be honest.
    - Gideon - Given that he's hanging out with Aurelia, the Warleader, Boros seems quite right. I'd see him in Azorius as well, although he'd be the most liberal and aggressive of them I think.
    - Koth - I don't know to be honest. I'd almost say Boros due to his dogged determination to fight Phyrexia (and that Mirrodin was aligned to Boros colours), but I think he could be guildless too.
    - Venser - I guess Azorius based on his colours?
    - Karn - Probably Azorius I think.
    - Tamiyo - I'll say a soft Izzet. She's a scholar and the Izzet seem to value knowledge more than other guilds. Again, she's probably not as radical as the average Izzet.
    - Tibalt - Rakdos I'd say.
    - Vraska - Golgari by default.
    - Domri - Gruul by default.
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  • #6
    Well I'd have only 2 objections based on what I know,
    Nissa is definitely Selesnya, lorwyn and zendikar elves are all naturist
    And Sorin, his concern for humanity on innistrad seems a lot more like orzhov, maybe, but I don't think Dimir.
  • #7
    Nissa is mono-green. Selesnya is too civilized for her.
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  • #8
    I guess that if Nissa had to make an alliance in Ravnica, she would choose the Gruul of all guilds. She's been there once and she loathed the urban environment, so it would make sense to ally with the anti-city guild. There aren't many elves among the Gruul, but it's not hard to picture her holding hands with Nikya of the Zhur-Taa clan while crushing some Orzhov cathedrals and Izzet blistercoils.

    Freyalise also makes sense in Gruul, she was originally a red mage if I'm not mistaken.

    Bolas is complicated. The guilds which have more in common with him are Dimir and Izzet. The way he harvested mana from the Maelstrom reminds me of Izzet techniques, but the years of planning and recruiting agents in each shard are very Dimir.
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  • #9
    I'd think that Nissa would fit right in with the Dimir, actually. Releasing the Eldrazi was a pretty colossal dick move on her part, and There's only one guild that does that kind of thing. Although she could also be simic, if there's more focus on the messing with powers that you don't understand aspect of her freeing the Eldrazi than the backstabby aspect.


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  • #10
    Quote from The Waffle King
    I'd think that Nissa would fit right in with the Dimir, actually. Releasing the Eldrazi was a pretty colossal dick move on her part, and There's only one guild that does that kind of thing. Although she could also be simic, if there's more focus on the messing with powers that you don't understand aspect of her freeing the Eldrazi than the backstabby aspect.


    Except that she didn't free the Eldrazi on purpose. It was mostly fault of green's "smashing them unnatural flying pieces of rock will make them unnatural brood spawn go away" logic. Gruul logic.

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    Instead of helping Sorin reinforce the spell containing the Eldrazi, she shattered the main Hedron and released the enchantment imprisoning the titans. Nissa thought the titans would flee, that they would leave Zendikar far behind them. She was wrong (...).


    Plus, the Dimir aren't above any other guild in terms of dickery. Augustin IV killed Szadek and had Razia killed in an attempt to put the city under his control. Razia is a warmongering [insert demeaning word here]. Niv routinely immolates people.
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  • #11
    Just because Sarkhan's colors are red/green doesn't mean that he would find a home in the Gruul Clans; there's no dragons to worship. For Sarkhan, the dragon is an aesthetic ideal, and a religious exaltation. Giant four limbed beasts wouldn't, and couldn't, live up the power of a dragon. Sarkhan would be in the Izzet; there's no other guild that actually possesses dragons, and all other dragons of the plane seem scattered and scarce. Sarkhan would probably come to worship Niv-Mizzet in the same way he worships Bolas, which of course would probably run the same course of him being turned into a pawn.
  • #12
    and There's only one guild that does that kind of thing


    It's not like the Rakdos kill people right and left, the Selesnya brainwash and use people as human shields, the Boros want a police state and basically intimidate bystanders with promises of violence, the Gruul destroy everything in their path, the Izzet blow everything in their path, the Simic mix and match everything in their path, the Orzhov enslave people and the Azorius enslave people in all but name.

    No, she must be Dimir, because only Dimir are dumb enough to automatically distrust a vampire who was more than willing to help and blow up everything they hold dear.
  • #13
    So just pooling up your opinions so far, especially highlighting the ones that differ from mine:

    - Ajani: Some see his potential in Gruul and Boros for his people-centric mentality. Maybe true Smile
    - Jace: Too sneaky and sinister for Azorius hm? I guess I can't argue XD
    - Chandra: Slight hint of Rakdos eh? Well, she does love solving problems with explosions XD
    - Elspeth: Her community-driven mentality does sound good for Selesnya. I approve Smile
    - Sarkhan: Tru dat Gruul doesn't have plenty of dragons, and considering how blindly he worships Nicol Bolas (before getting screwed), he probably may repeat the mistake by going to Izzet indeed. That could be hilarious.
    - Sorin: Hm, I dunno. I think Orzhov's idea of enjoying life may not fit Sorin, but then again, both of them take pleasure from draining things (blood for Sorin, everything for Orzhov), so yeah, maybe true XD.
    - Nissa: Selesnya for her potential Naturist way?
    - Gideon: Yea true as I said he's not best pals with Aurelia, but if we were to take the out of the equation, will he still not fit for Boros? He probably looks too intimidating for a mere arrester too XD.
    - Tamiyo: echelon_house, I love your for that quote XDXDXD.

    More input are welcome Smile
  • #14
    Ajani: Boros, granted his beginnings as Ajani Vengeant & because he prefers to support, but is capable of fighting when called for. I doubt he would go Gruul because they have a very "doggy-dog world/kill-or-be-killed" mentality.

    Chandra: Izzet, simply because she'd be allowed to blow up things with few repercussions. Otherwise, I could also see her doing jobs for the Rakdos or Boros.

    Garruk: Gruul, without a single doubt. His beliefs match perfectly with the Gruul's doggy-dog-world mentality. Selesnya is too civil and religious for him. Golgari, perhaps, although I think they're too black/dirty for him. The circle-of-life thing might resonate with Garruk.

    Gideon: Boros. Boros all the way, despite his stance against Aurelia. I think he more closely embodies the ideals of the Boros (if only in a glorified way).

    Jace: Dimir, due to introverted behavior, his fondness of manipulating memories, and his love for knowing/prying into others' secrets.

    Karn: Not sure at all, since I know nothing of his personality.

    Liliana: Orzhov, due to deep-seated greed, conceited nature, and otherwise self-serving mentality. Perhaps Rakdos, for the sadism and masochism.

    Nissa: Upon giving this thought, she might well fit in with the Gruul, because her culture is described as being very "Spartan"; complete with rigorous physical training. She may also agree with Golgari mentality, of nature's circle. I doubt Selesnya bc they're too religious.

    Sarkhan: I have to agree with magac; Sarkhan would most likely follow a "worthy dragon" than his inherent colors. Beyond that, I would say he would be Gruul. His treatment of unworthy dragons is very Gruul.

    Sorin: Orzhov. Hedonistic, yet philanthropic. His upper class background also fits well with the wealthy Orzhov.

    Tamiyo: Izzet bc of her pursuit of knowledge for knowledge's sake. It's too bad we don't know more of her personality.

    Tibalt: Perfect fit for Rakdos, complete with an extreme love for S&M.

    Venser: If he were still alive, I would say he'd be Izzet (despite his planeswalker card being U/W) bc of his love for knowledge & artifice. The only white part of him seems to be his fondness for teleporting things, in order to better control his situation.

    Vraska: Judging from what I've read, she seems quite Dimir (especially with her whole network of assassins that never see her; if that's not Dimir-like, I don't know what is).
  • #15
    This is an interesting topic. Here are my thoughts:

    Ajani: Either Boros or Selesyna. He has exhibited an early penchant for righteous fury, but he also has his spiritual and communal side.

    Chandra: I don't think she'd really be too keen on the idea of being tied down and following the rules. But if I were to pick one, it would be Izzet: lots of experiments, goggles, and explosions

    Garruk: Not much of a choice here: Gruul all the way.

    Gideon: Our planeswalking hieromancer is a perfect fit in the Boros Legion: he's all about doling out that righteous fury.

    Jace: Like Chandra he's very independent. His thirst for knowledge would lead him either to the Izzet or Dimir.

    Karn: Well, he is a pacifist that can bring down judgement on anyone who gets out of line. The closest one I can think of for him would be Azorious.

    Liliana: Like just about everyone else said: Orzhov. She's already a veteran at making deals with supernatural beings, and she has expensive tastes.

    Nissa: Tough choice since I don't know a whole lot about her. I'm thinking either Gruul or Golgari.

    Sarkhan: I don't think he'd end up being yet another Gruul 'walker despite those being the colors of his first incarnation. And he's not hedonistic enough to be Rakdos. As a few others have already stated, his reverence of dragons overrides any of his social needs, so no guild for him (though he'd probably go Izzet if not for the fact that Niv would make him do math).

    Sorin: An Orzhov all the way: he has a dark thirst to satisfy but he recognizes and values community.

    Tamiyo: She's a scolar who seeks knowledge. Izzet is the most scholarly of the guilds.

    Tibalt: No question: Rakdos is a sadist's dream come true. And I think I'll go ahead and call this: I predict his next incarnation will be named Tibalt, the Sadist.

    Venser: Probably Izzet since he likes to toy around with time and space. Though he is WU he isn't authoritative enough to be Azorious.

    Vraska: She's established as a Golgari, but her secretive nature and affinity to assassination would make her a good Dimir candidate. But only as a freelancer, since she only does the jobs she wants to do.

    Domri: He's Gruul. We know this.

    Ral: We already know he's Izzet.

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  • #16
    Alright, I suppose I should actually finally chime in. Mostly to debunk some of these thoughts. A common misconception is confusing color combination with the guilds. Even MaRo has said that the guilds aren't the definitive combination of those colors.

    Ajani: People keep lumping him into Boros because of his first card, but I'm not sure they're actually looking at what made him that combination. It wasn't disciplined fury, it was unbridled rage, and that doesn't fit well with what the Boros are about, they are about focused zeal. As Ajani is now, he's very Selesnyan, sacrificing of himself for the betterment of the community.
    Chandra: Chandra stole the crap out of a pair of Elemental Gauntlets, we know that, but her ideals have nothing to do with the Izzet's. She's a free spirit, bent on following her own path. She has NO interest in experiments so you're all letting her appearance and magic determine where you think she should go. I won't lie though, Chandra is a VERY tough one to place. She enjoys civilization too much to go into the Gruul, but is too independent for most of the guilds. Another misconception attached to her is that pyromancer=wizard. You have to remember that Keral Keep was a monastery, not an academy. It was the exploration of the spiritual side of their magic. Someone earlier made mention of Rakdos, and they are certainly independent, but she has no sadism in her nature. She also does NOT like to just blow up stuff.
    Elspeth: She could either go Boros or Selesnya depending on when you're talking about. Selesnya for the embrace of being part of something larger, and Boros for her righteous zeal stirred by the Phyrexians.
    Garruk: Yeah, Gruul. No question.
    Gideon: People keep placing him with Boros, and while he's allied with them, it isn't because of their ideals, it's because of their methods. Heiromancy is not a red/white magic, he would actually be more at home in the Azorius. His master even specifically taught him to divorce his emotions from his magic, something that the Boros do NOT preach. Really, I think the only reason he isn't with the Azorius is because he wouldn't embrace the bureacracy, even if he believes in their approach to the law.
    Jace: As much as he doesn't want to admit it, Jace is Dimir. An argument could be made for Izzet, but only in philosophy, not in method.
    Karn: Karn would feel most at home in Selesnya. He desires peace and unity, the chance to explore the nature of the worlds around him.
    Kiora: We've word of god that Kiora shares no trait with the Simic. She's got more in common with the Gruul, just with an aquatic point of view.
    Koth: Boros. Unity and Justice, that's his spiel.
    Liliana: This one is really hard to say. Ultimately, an argument could be made for both Rakdos and Orzhov.
    Nissa: This one is tough. I think the question wouldn't be which guild she joined, but which group of elves. The Vigean are right out, but both the Devkarin and Silhana have principles that would appeal to her.
    Sarkhan: When Sarkhan first encountered Bolas, he was in awe, at both the power the Elder Dragon possessed, but also how a dragon could be so utterly deviant from what he worshipped. The same would apply to Niv here. There's no primal fury in their hearts, both apex predators, but they aren't what he could ever have predicted. So... a complicated individual.
    Sorin: Sorin despises excess. That throws both Rakdos and Orzhov out of the running for Sorin. He isn't the type to kneel to any other power either. If any guild could meet with his approval, he'd probably place himself at the top and demand anyone to say otherwise. And then melt them from the inside out.
    Tamiyo: I could see Izzet because their principles are in line with hers, but I honestly think her subject matter has more in common with the Simic. She's fascinated by natural cycles, the world around her and studying it. Just for the fact she's not a biomancer, she's deeply connected to the same things the Simic are.
    Tezzeret: Dimir. His ambition borders on being lust and his methods are right in line with making that happen. His preferred tools run towards the Izzet, but they have too much excess. Tezzeret is a deep believer in simplicity and that's something the Izzet don't quite get.
    Tibalt: Rakdos, no question.
    Venser: He's Izzet. Right down to his GIGANTIC PLANE SPANNING EGO. ( I don't like him. )
    Last edited by Barinellos: 3/12/2013 9:00:58 PM
  • #17
    ^I actually read the older counterpart to this thread on the Wizards forum, and there you made the mention of Tibalt being a better candidate for the Simic. It seemed like a legitimate reason, so why return ot the idea of him being "Rakdos, no question"?
  • #18
    Quote from Baryonyx
    ^I actually read the older counterpart to this thread on the Wizards forum, and there you made the mention of Tibalt being a better candidate for the Simic. It seemed like a legitimate reason, so why return ot the idea of him being "Rakdos, no question"?


    Mostly because we got a look at the new Simic since then. While he might fit the Vigean interests of exploring the body, that's... not really what the current Combine does.
  • #19
    Quote from Barinellos

    Sarkhan: When Sarkhan first encountered Bolas, he was in awe, at both the power the Elder Dragon possessed, but also how a dragon could be so utterly deviant from what he worshipped. The same would apply to Niv here. There's no primal fury in their hearts, both apex predators, but they aren't what he could ever have predicted. So... a complicated individual.


    The more I think about it, the more I want to see a meeting between Sarkhan and Ral Zarek. It'd probably erupt into a Duel Deck after one mention of "that discourteous old lizard."

    Mind you, Sarkhan would also have issues with Ravnica's general draconic extermination, which was one of the things he hated about his home plane. I can see him vacillating between sympathizing with the Gruul and submitting to Niv. He'd probably view Niv's deviance from the draconic ideal as the result of the city "domesticating" him, and would try to work towards returning Ravnica to a more primal state to awaken the sleeping dragon. Sort of like Zomaj Hauc.
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  • #20
    Quote from Don_Quixote
    Mind you, Sarkhan would also have issues with Ravnica's general draconic extermination, which was one of the things he hated about his home plane. I can see him vacillating between sympathizing with the Gruul and submitting to Niv. He'd probably view Niv's deviance from the draconic ideal as the result of the city "domesticating" him, and would try to work towards returning Ravnica to a more primal state to awaken the sleeping dragon. Sort of like Zomaj Hauc.


    The major problem, of course, is that Niv was like that since birth.
    Even then, there is a world of difference between Niv wiping out his brethren and the warlords doing it.
  • #21
    If memory serves, when the dragons were wiped out on his home plane, it was largely by the warlords to see if they could.
    That's what Sarkhan found fault with, it was so pointless. They weren't doing it for territory or because the dragons were a threat; they were having a "who's the biggest jerkface" contest.

    I doubt Sarkhan would be bothered by Niv butchering his kind, dragons kill dragons all the dang time on Jund.
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  • #22
    Quote from Barinellos
    The major problem, of course, is that Niv was like that since birth.


    I didn't say that Sarkhan would be correct. I was just theorizing that, upon arriving at a plane covered entirely by city, he might draw the conclusion that the namby-pamby dragon is like that because it's been millennia since he last went on a proper hunt.

    Quote from Barinellos
    Even then, there is a world of difference between Niv wiping out his brethren and the warlords doing it.


    Granted, but we haven't set a baseline for how much information Sarkhan would have. I was working under the idea that he would jump to the conclusion that the onward march of industrialization was responsible for the lack of flappy fire-lizards.

    If Sarkhan is told that Niv is responsible for the dearth of dragons, he would have a very different view of it. I'm not wholly convinced that he wouldn't still labor under the conviction that the citysprawl was keeping Niv from connecting with his inner predator, though. We actually do see a little bit of draconic bloodlust surface from Niv when fighting the nephilim--he flees once he is actually endangered, of course, but one might argue that he did so because he is so used to decadent comforts.
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  • #23
    I agree with Borinellos for the most part.

    Ajani
    I don't think it was so much unbridled rage as a lust for vengeance. Heck, it was in his name. Vengeance is a primal law and being an outcast, I don't think he really seeks out belonging to a group (like Elspeth) as much as individuals whom he can trust. Individuals who he feels deserve his boons. He finds causes of his own to take up, not others'.
    I think Selesnya is too extreme for Ajani. He'd prefer to inspire a group for a climactic revolt a la Gruul over sharing a prescribed hivemind like Selesnyans.

    I think Ajani, much like Chandra, just wouldn't find any guild of Ravnica of particular interest. The guilds are all a bunch of mafias you're either with or against. Chandra and Ajani would be more likely to help the guildless overthrow the tyranny of the guilds' rule.

    Tibalt
    I sure do agree with the fitting in with old Simic and not old Rakdos but present Rakdos and not present Simic. When it comes to present Rakdos Vs old Simic, I feel like old Simic is too much about what they can create where Tibalt would get bored. He wants grown subjects to experiment on. The new carnival Rakdos looks very open to his brand of experimentation. He'd come to understand and desire paincasting from Rakdos, Lord of Riots, if he doesn't already.

    Tezzeret
    I feel he's already found his home on New Phyrexia. He may even become its new ruler.
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  • #24
    Quote from Barinellos
    The major problem, of course, is that Niv was like that since birth.


    Sarkhan does not know this stuff though. I don't think he is sane enough to study the history of Niv Mizzet.

    I think I agree that Ajani is Selesnya. Cahndra is probably Gruul in my opinion but she might not be too attached to any guild in the long run. It just fits with independence and that is her strongest trait so it kinda makes sense more than any other guild.

    I think Bolas would take over Dimir because it is smart and sneaky and manipulutive and stuff, which also matches what Bolas is like. So they would make good servants. I mean he already has Tezzeret as his slave so more guys like him would be good. (I know he has Sarkhan too but Sarkhan is crazy so he has limited usefulness and Rakdos is not totally Bolas's style.) But I think once Bolas was involved in Dimir he would make it a bit less subtle because the whole sneaky scheming is more behind the scenes than he usually operates. Bolas manipulates but he doesn't seem to care so much about whether this is secret.

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  • #25
    Quote from Sphynx
    I agree with Barinellos for the most part.

    Ajani
    I don't think it was so much unbridled rage as a lust for vengeance. Heck, it was in his name. Vengeance is a primal law and being an outcast, I don't think he really seeks out belonging to a group (like Elspeth) as much as individuals whom he can trust. Individuals who he feels deserve his boons. He finds causes of his own to take up, not others'.
    I think Selesnya is too extreme for Ajani. He'd prefer to inspire a group for a climactic revolt a la Gruul over sharing a prescribed hivemind like Selesnyans.

    I think Ajani, much like Chandra, just wouldn't find any guild of Ravnica of particular interest. The guilds are all a bunch of mafias you're either with or against. Chandra and Ajani would be more likely to help the guildless overthrow the tyranny of the guilds' rule.

    Man, your read on Ajani is completely wrong.
    All Ajani ever wanted as an outcast was to fit in, not to overthrow anything. He did as much as he could to prove himself, largely unsuccessfully.

    He also doesn't want the attention that leading people brings, that's why he didn't take the position as kha after his brother's death. It's why he's currently on Bant instead of acting the part of folk hero amongst his own followers.

    Tezzeret
    I feel he's already found his home on New Phyrexia. He may even become its new ruler.
    Not a chance. The praetors could chew him to bits.
    Besides that, he doesn't actually agree with Phyresis and thinks Phyrexians themselves are contemptible. They aren't going to bow to him given his disposition towards them.

    Quote from Don_Quixote
    I didn't say that Sarkhan would be correct. I was just theorizing that, upon arriving at a plane covered entirely by city, he might draw the conclusion that the namby-pamby dragon is like that because it's been millennia since he last went on a proper hunt.

    Granted, but we haven't set a baseline for how much information Sarkhan would have. I was working under the idea that he would jump to the conclusion that the onward march of industrialization was responsible for the lack of flappy fire-lizards.

    If Sarkhan is told that Niv is responsible for the dearth of dragons, he would have a very different view of it. I'm not wholly convinced that he wouldn't still labor under the conviction that the citysprawl was keeping Niv from connecting with his inner predator, though. We actually do see a little bit of draconic bloodlust surface from Niv when fighting the nephilim--he flees once he is actually endangered, of course, but one might argue that he did so because he is so used to decadent comforts.

    The thing is, Niv isn't exactly a subtle being. He's had multiple biographies made, he is the living embodiment of vanity. It isn't hard to find out what happened.
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