If MTG was a third person story, Jace is the main character, or Chandra, or someone else.
If MTG was a first person story, you are the main character, well in your viewpoint anyway.
After Magic Origins the story follows the same group of people, because WOTC wants the people to become attached to the same characters? I don't know. Before that, we visited different planes, each with different planeswalkers and characters that may or may not show up in the previous or next plane. The way I see things is that there is one character that is consistent ever since we left Dominaria after Onslaught Block. That consistent character is you.
I know that if you write a story, you have to have a character to represent as the main character, but couldn't they just make a character to represent "you" as the planeswalker, and each plane has its own different version of "you", while the actual "you" creates your own story via playing the game? So while the canonical storyling has "you" do this, do that, join this faction, become hero, the true "you" who creates your own destiny, via playing the game can be the bad guy, join different faction, or, I don't know, do something else. The only thing you don't have control over is what plane you visit.
Just imagine this. An RPG with an actual pre-built character with a backstory, vs a character you have to create and build your own stats, and has no name, in which you have to give.
What's the point of having a canonical "you" if your "you" doesn't do anything the canon "you" does? You say that the only thing you wouldn't have control over would be what plane visit, but your proposal means that you have control over nothing.
Generally my thought on it. We'd basically be non-existent too. So I guess third person? They use first person sometimes but that's not quite what you mean.
It's like reading the Doom novels. The main character isn't "you" but when you play Doom, you don't have to follow what the main character in the Doom novels has to do. The main character in terms of MTG books or online short stories is one of many representations of "you", kind of like how in the Pokemon manga has a main character, but in the games, you are the main character.
I'm not stating what currently is, but what should be. Basically saying, following the same characters throughout the multiverse becomes bland for me.
The difference is that in both those games, you are required to follow the same story beats that the main character from the book does. You may use a different weapon or have a different pokemon team, but you still kill all the bosses and beat all the gyms in the same order. MtG can't do that. There is no point in having separate canonical and personal "yous" because there is so much variation in what the two versions would do that nobody would end up satisfied.
Why can't you just imagine yourself as a planeswalker if the story being first person is so important?
I'd call it a third-person story. Jace and Nahiri and Goblin Piledriver et al. guide the narrative, not us, and nothing we do can change its course (aside from tangentially by favoring certain products and characters). We're passive observers to all times and places in the Multiverse and our interest in it amounts to little more than summoning its residents to beat each other up for our great amusement.
I think that the closest approximation to "us" in the game world is Tamiyo. She collects and carries a literal library of stories -- from times and places nearly as old as the game itself -- that function as spells. She's also generally a passive observer.
I don't think you are properly labeling the points of view here. "I ran down the hall" is first person. "He/She ran down the hall" is third person. "You ran down the hall" is second person, and that would appear to be what you are describing here.
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I don't think you are properly labeling the points of view here. "I ran down the hall" is first person. "He/She ran down the hall" is third person. "You ran down the hall" is second person, and that would appear to be what you are describing here.
"You" are second person only in the author's point of view, but is first person in your point of view, in which you refer to yourself as "I". If I had said "I", you would have viewed it as "that guy who posted this."
Saying he stole my car in your viewpoint means something different from my viewpoint, which is, I stole your car. I am writing this in terms of my viewpoint stating that the story's main characters should be written in your viewpoint, meaning it is first person in your viewpoint. It is only first person to whoever reads the story but to the author, "you" represents the readers the author is trying to address.
If I call you "you", do you call yourself "you"? No. You call yourself "I". It is still first person because you are following your story, not me, or should I say in your viewpoint, "I am following the story, not him."
What I am trying to say in this thread is to have different characters every time a new block comes out because if we were the main character, we pretty much visit whatever plane WOTC releases in their card sets, rather than seeing Jace and gang all the time.
What WOTC wants with the new way of storytelling is constant characters that you can follow, but if you were put in the story, even if there were totally different characters in each plane's story, there is one constant character in each plane. You.
I don't think you are properly labeling the points of view here. "I ran down the hall" is first person. "He/She ran down the hall" is third person. "You ran down the hall" is second person, and that would appear to be what you are describing here.
"You" are second person only in the author's point of view, but is first person in your point of view, in which you refer to yourself as "I". If I had said "I", you would have viewed it as "that guy who posted this."
Saying he stole my car in your viewpoint means something different from my viewpoint, which is, I stole your car. I am writing this in terms of my viewpoint stating that the story's main characters should be written in your viewpoint, meaning it is first person in your viewpoint. It is only first person to whoever reads the story but to the author, "you" represents the readers the author is trying to address.
If I call you "you", do you cal yourself "you"? No. You call yourself "I". It is still first person because you are following your story, not me, or should I say in your viewpoint, "I am following the story, not him."
This is very confusing.
Stories that use first person PoV are narrated by a character in the story as a first-hand account of the events in the story. Sherlock Holmes stories are most often this, narrated by John Watson. Percy Jackson (the first series) is also a good example.
Second person stories are stories of which you, the reader are the narrator. The video game Doom, mentioned above, is a good example, as well as the overwhelming majority of any choose your own adventure books. The Magic blurbs saying "You are a planeswalker, blah blah blah," are another example of this.
Third person PoV uses a narrator that is outside of the story. The majority of literature today, as well as most of the Magic story articles, are written using this style.
These are the most common definitions of PoVs. This Wikipedia page is a good description. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narration I'm not entirely sure what you are saying. Your reply, especially the second paragraph, doesn't make sense to me. Could you please try to explain it again?
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"You say 'learn from history,' but that does not mean 'learn the same bull***** the people in history learned alongside phrenology and alchemy.'" - The Blinking Spirit
I don't think you are properly labeling the points of view here. "I ran down the hall" is first person. "He/She ran down the hall" is third person. "You ran down the hall" is second person, and that would appear to be what you are describing here.
"You" are second person only in the author's point of view, but is first person in your point of view, in which you refer to yourself as "I". If I had said "I", you would have viewed it as "that guy who posted this."
Saying he stole my car in your viewpoint means something different from my viewpoint, which is, I stole your car. I am writing this in terms of my viewpoint stating that the story's main characters should be written in your viewpoint, meaning it is first person in your viewpoint. It is only first person to whoever reads the story but to the author, "you" represents the readers the author is trying to address.
If I call you "you", do you cal yourself "you"? No. You call yourself "I". It is still first person because you are following your story, not me, or should I say in your viewpoint, "I am following the story, not him."
This is very confusing.
Stories that use first person PoV are narrated by a character in the story as a first-hand account of the events in the story. Sherlock Holmes stories are most often this, narrated by John Watson. Percy Jackson (the first series) is also a good example.
Second person stories are stories of which you, the reader are the narrator. The video game Doom, mentioned above, is a good example, as well as the overwhelming majority of any choose your own adventure books. The Magic blurbs saying "You are a planeswalker, blah blah blah," are another example of this.
Third person PoV uses a narrator that is outside of the story. The majority of literature today, as well as most of the Magic story articles, are written using this style.
These are the most common definitions of PoVs. This Wikipedia page is a good description. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narration I'm not entirely sure what you are saying. Your reply, especially the second paragraph, doesn't make sense to me. Could you please try to explain it again?
The story would be written as one of many representations of the average magic player in order to progress the story into the new plane when the new block releases, so while it does not refer to you personally, it refers to one of many mtg players, who is a planeswalker according to the lore. When you play, you are telling the story your way, but when the author writes the story, it is written as one of many representations of the magic playing audience. Jace isn't that representation because he has a card. Jace is your ally, or enemy, not you. Do you catch what I mean?
The story would be written as one of many representations of the average magic player in order to progress the story into the new plane when the new block releases, so while it does not refer to you personally, it refers to one of many mtg players, who is a planeswalker according to the lore. When you play, you are telling the story your way, but when the author writes the story, it is written as one of many representations of the magic playing audience. Jace isn't that representation because he has a card. Jace is your ally, or enemy, not you. Do you catch what I mean?
I think I got you know. You mean have the player character be a protagonist in the story, kind of like with Duels of the Planeswalkers. Technically, a story like that is second-person, but that could differ depending on how it is written.
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"You say 'learn from history,' but that does not mean 'learn the same bull***** the people in history learned alongside phrenology and alchemy.'" - The Blinking Spirit
The story would be written as one of many representations of the average magic player in order to progress the story into the new plane when the new block releases, so while it does not refer to you personally, it refers to one of many mtg players, who is a planeswalker according to the lore. When you play, you are telling the story your way, but when the author writes the story, it is written as one of many representations of the magic playing audience. Jace isn't that representation because he has a card. Jace is your ally, or enemy, not you. Do you catch what I mean?
I think I got you know. You mean have the player character be a protagonist in the story, kind of like with Duels of the Planeswalkers. Technically, a story like that is second-person, but that could differ depending on how it is written.
The main character would be the typical mtg player, in story terms, a planeswalker. I guess you can view it in first, second, or third person, but all in all the main character is one of many representations of the player character, and that is how it should be, well, in terms of the storyline as a whole. I'd say it would be written as "I" while referring to the reader.
In terms of the storyline in one block, a different character can be the main character, who doesn't have to be a planeswalker. Currently a planeswalker must be a main character because the reader must follow that same character to a new plane. If a representation of the mtg player is the overarching storyline main character with a specific character being the main character in the plane only, there can be different kinds of "main" characters in each plane, rather than seeing the origins 5 all the time. It also means we don't have to see all 3 eldrazi destroyed or captured in 4 sets.
Right now, it feels as if the player is spectating and not taking part in the story. Because this main character is a representation of the mtg player, that character must not have a card.
We have heard of neowalkers right? If the player is supposed to be a planeswalker, are they supposed to be a special breed of planeswalker?
I'm posting this because WOTC wants constant character(s) throughout all the planes we visit, but that may get boring. What they don't realize is that we, as planeswalkers, are the constant character to every plane that we visit, which means that there is no need to have the same 5 characters, who must be planeswalkers. If the story is written with one of many representations of the player, and written in first person, as in "I" then there is no need to follow a bunch of the same characters. The player character of course, has no specific color allegiance.
It makes it so that a non planeswalker can be a hero. Even though that character can't planeswalk, a representation of the player can, in which the player meets new characters in the new plane. What I hated about Pokemon anime is seeing the "choke in the playoffs" Ash Ketchum every season, while the games have a different main character model.
"We" are not really actually part of the story, in-universe. The 'You are a Planeswalker' thing is mostly for marketing purposes, and has no relevancy in the story. The only place it comes into play is for the gameplay, as a way to explain why you can play all these spells and locations from anywhere in the multiverse.
However, if Wizards started incorporating it into the lore, that might get messy. Suddenly, we'd have all these 'Mysterious Planeswalkers/ Unnamed Planeswalkers' running around. Then the player base wants names, and depictions, and then they become just another known 'walker. There's a reason the canonical Duels 15 story has Jace doing everything you did; it keeps it all neat and tidy, and allows Wizards to continue using their main characters as they wish.
Also, MAGIC had always followed a bunch of the same characters for the longest time. We had Urza, the Weatherlight crew, Karn, Kamahl, Freyalise, Eladamri, Teferi. Then Bolas came back, and the Neowalkers were introduced, and we've arrived at current times. Changing this now would be kinda messy, and people would continually ask "When are we going to see X again?" (More so than they already do).
It's a fine sentiment, to want some kind of actual in-story representation, but it's not the story Wizards wants to tell, at least not right now.
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I'd really rather they never do that. Even executed in the best possible manner it seems like a bad idea. It also doesn't feel like it would add anything to the story. I'm all for expanding the roster of characters we follow (sad Tamiyo didn't join) but this doesn't seem like the solution.
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If MTG was a first person story, you are the main character, well in your viewpoint anyway.
After Magic Origins the story follows the same group of people, because WOTC wants the people to become attached to the same characters? I don't know. Before that, we visited different planes, each with different planeswalkers and characters that may or may not show up in the previous or next plane. The way I see things is that there is one character that is consistent ever since we left Dominaria after Onslaught Block. That consistent character is you.
I know that if you write a story, you have to have a character to represent as the main character, but couldn't they just make a character to represent "you" as the planeswalker, and each plane has its own different version of "you", while the actual "you" creates your own story via playing the game? So while the canonical storyling has "you" do this, do that, join this faction, become hero, the true "you" who creates your own destiny, via playing the game can be the bad guy, join different faction, or, I don't know, do something else. The only thing you don't have control over is what plane you visit.
Just imagine this. An RPG with an actual pre-built character with a backstory, vs a character you have to create and build your own stats, and has no name, in which you have to give.
I'm not stating what currently is, but what should be. Basically saying, following the same characters throughout the multiverse becomes bland for me.
Why can't you just imagine yourself as a planeswalker if the story being first person is so important?
I think that the closest approximation to "us" in the game world is Tamiyo. She collects and carries a literal library of stories -- from times and places nearly as old as the game itself -- that function as spells. She's also generally a passive observer.
"You say 'learn from history,' but that does not mean 'learn the same bull***** the people in history learned alongside phrenology and alchemy.'" - The Blinking Spirit
"You" are second person only in the author's point of view, but is first person in your point of view, in which you refer to yourself as "I". If I had said "I", you would have viewed it as "that guy who posted this."
Saying he stole my car in your viewpoint means something different from my viewpoint, which is, I stole your car. I am writing this in terms of my viewpoint stating that the story's main characters should be written in your viewpoint, meaning it is first person in your viewpoint. It is only first person to whoever reads the story but to the author, "you" represents the readers the author is trying to address.
If I call you "you", do you call yourself "you"? No. You call yourself "I". It is still first person because you are following your story, not me, or should I say in your viewpoint, "I am following the story, not him."
What I am trying to say in this thread is to have different characters every time a new block comes out because if we were the main character, we pretty much visit whatever plane WOTC releases in their card sets, rather than seeing Jace and gang all the time.
What WOTC wants with the new way of storytelling is constant characters that you can follow, but if you were put in the story, even if there were totally different characters in each plane's story, there is one constant character in each plane. You.
This is very confusing.
Stories that use first person PoV are narrated by a character in the story as a first-hand account of the events in the story. Sherlock Holmes stories are most often this, narrated by John Watson. Percy Jackson (the first series) is also a good example.
Second person stories are stories of which you, the reader are the narrator. The video game Doom, mentioned above, is a good example, as well as the overwhelming majority of any choose your own adventure books. The Magic blurbs saying "You are a planeswalker, blah blah blah," are another example of this.
Third person PoV uses a narrator that is outside of the story. The majority of literature today, as well as most of the Magic story articles, are written using this style.
These are the most common definitions of PoVs. This Wikipedia page is a good description. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narration I'm not entirely sure what you are saying. Your reply, especially the second paragraph, doesn't make sense to me. Could you please try to explain it again?
"You say 'learn from history,' but that does not mean 'learn the same bull***** the people in history learned alongside phrenology and alchemy.'" - The Blinking Spirit
The story would be written as one of many representations of the average magic player in order to progress the story into the new plane when the new block releases, so while it does not refer to you personally, it refers to one of many mtg players, who is a planeswalker according to the lore. When you play, you are telling the story your way, but when the author writes the story, it is written as one of many representations of the magic playing audience. Jace isn't that representation because he has a card. Jace is your ally, or enemy, not you. Do you catch what I mean?
I think I got you know. You mean have the player character be a protagonist in the story, kind of like with Duels of the Planeswalkers. Technically, a story like that is second-person, but that could differ depending on how it is written.
"You say 'learn from history,' but that does not mean 'learn the same bull***** the people in history learned alongside phrenology and alchemy.'" - The Blinking Spirit
The main character would be the typical mtg player, in story terms, a planeswalker. I guess you can view it in first, second, or third person, but all in all the main character is one of many representations of the player character, and that is how it should be, well, in terms of the storyline as a whole. I'd say it would be written as "I" while referring to the reader.
In terms of the storyline in one block, a different character can be the main character, who doesn't have to be a planeswalker. Currently a planeswalker must be a main character because the reader must follow that same character to a new plane. If a representation of the mtg player is the overarching storyline main character with a specific character being the main character in the plane only, there can be different kinds of "main" characters in each plane, rather than seeing the origins 5 all the time. It also means we don't have to see all 3 eldrazi destroyed or captured in 4 sets.
Right now, it feels as if the player is spectating and not taking part in the story. Because this main character is a representation of the mtg player, that character must not have a card.
We have heard of neowalkers right? If the player is supposed to be a planeswalker, are they supposed to be a special breed of planeswalker?
I'm posting this because WOTC wants constant character(s) throughout all the planes we visit, but that may get boring. What they don't realize is that we, as planeswalkers, are the constant character to every plane that we visit, which means that there is no need to have the same 5 characters, who must be planeswalkers. If the story is written with one of many representations of the player, and written in first person, as in "I" then there is no need to follow a bunch of the same characters. The player character of course, has no specific color allegiance.
It makes it so that a non planeswalker can be a hero. Even though that character can't planeswalk, a representation of the player can, in which the player meets new characters in the new plane. What I hated about Pokemon anime is seeing the "choke in the playoffs" Ash Ketchum every season, while the games have a different main character model.
However, if Wizards started incorporating it into the lore, that might get messy. Suddenly, we'd have all these 'Mysterious Planeswalkers/ Unnamed Planeswalkers' running around. Then the player base wants names, and depictions, and then they become just another known 'walker. There's a reason the canonical Duels 15 story has Jace doing everything you did; it keeps it all neat and tidy, and allows Wizards to continue using their main characters as they wish.
Also, MAGIC had always followed a bunch of the same characters for the longest time. We had Urza, the Weatherlight crew, Karn, Kamahl, Freyalise, Eladamri, Teferi. Then Bolas came back, and the Neowalkers were introduced, and we've arrived at current times. Changing this now would be kinda messy, and people would continually ask "When are we going to see X again?" (More so than they already do).
It's a fine sentiment, to want some kind of actual in-story representation, but it's not the story Wizards wants to tell, at least not right now.
Decks:
Casual
R Burn R
EDH
R Godo Voltron R
RUG ETB Overload RUG
BW Clerics Pain and Drain BW
GW Spirits!!! GW
RUG Landfall Silliness RUG