They could have saved a good amount of fans from being butthurt over this 'Elder Dragon' thing if they just brought back the Lord sub-type. I mean, it's in their title.
Narset is probably Sultai, judging from her eyes. Switched her fate with Taigam. Sarkhan would be shocked at this revelation. Not all change is good. I expect to see the story unfold this week
Blue eyes make one Sultai?
The only thing that looks like Sultai is her golden breastplate...and even that might be just her walker attire.
Moreover, she is in a kind of martial art pose again....nope, not seeing the Sultai here.
thx. This picture confuses me as I originally thought we had seen a VERY different pic of Narset with a hair whip. If this is untrue and the character just looked like her I'll be relieved as the armored Narset looks much cooler IMO
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Oh no, we got that picture it just vanished from the Mothership rather conveniently. I'm not sure which I prefer but I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for Walker Narset.
@Ravnica colors; I like how people are arguing if its more white or blue. It's almost like the world as it is exists due to the planning of a white-blue mage...
@Elder; I don't mind the use of the term. A bit of headcanon here, but they are elders because they are the progeny of Ugin, who is an elder. Works for me. Your mileage may vary.
@Elder; I don't mind the use of the term. A bit of headcanon here, but they are elders because they are the progeny of Ugin, who is an elder. Works for me. Your mileage may vary.
There, it says clearly, they hadn't talked about it and the elder in question was in regards to the age and not the race.
If you meant Ugin is an elder Dragon and that is why they are that way? Doesn't get around the problem that Elder has specific connotations and this has caused problems with two separate definitions being attributed to it.
Narset is probably Sultai, judging from her eyes. Switched her fate with Taigam. Sarkhan would be shocked at this revelation. Not all change is good. I expect to see the story unfold this week
Blue eyes make one Sultai?
The only thing that looks like Sultai is her golden breastplate...and even that might be just her walker attire.
Moreover, she is in a kind of martial art pose again....nope, not seeing the Sultai here.
This. She's a heretic, not a traitor. Looking at Ojutai's censoring and thoughtcrime attitude, she's probably true Jeskai clan member (as opposed to being Ojutai's brood member). Maybe because she remember the other timeline, or has seen it in her visions, or just for finding and reading Shu Yun's scroll.
Oh no, we got that picture it just vanished from the Mothership rather conveniently. I'm not sure which I prefer but I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for Walker Narset.
It is so different from the Narset in the DTK boosters that I now suspect it was just an old concept art or sketch for her original KTK version. Could also be used to represent the young DTK Narset before becoming 'heretic'.
You know, if they really wanted to have Narset as a walker AND some familiar face to talk to Sarkhan, they could have just said that she became a walker as Zurgo mortally wounded her, planeswalked away and thus was immune to the temporal changes.
Thats not how this way of time traveling seems to be working.
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I have been in the camp that Narset's spark ignited when Zurgo went to kill her. So being on a different plane would save her from the temporal changes of Tarkir. I'd imagine that Narset would come back to Tarkir eventually to find Taigam/Oujati leading "Jeskai", which would lead to major issues. And it make senses why she's called a "heretic" because she would be talking a time of Khans and when dragons are extinct. I dont think Mr. Oujati would appreciate that "blasphemy".
Not sure if anyone pointed this out already (probably yes), but Shu Yun's scroll is probably the Scroll of Ghostfire, the one Chandra steals from that monastery and that has Ugin's spell (Ghostfire) in it, right? The whole "Ojutai forces the Red out of Jeskai by making them forget/decline the bloodfire/ghostfire thing" points to that. Narset probably went after the scroll in the new timeline. This all is a giant red arrow pointing to Zendikar II, I think.
On a side note, the flavor text for Arashin Sovereign refers to how, while the Dromoka order does a good job of fostering trust between the draconian rulers and the non-draconian subjects, the other orders have to put up with intermittent rebellions.
I notice that this includes the Ojutai and Kolaghan orders.
I suppose with Kolaghan's BR, it's to be expected; maybe not overthrow Kolaghan herself, but certainly try to prove yourself stronger than one of the regent warleaders and secure a Klingon Promotion...only for the OTHER regents to beat you back down. Regardless, Kolaghan isn't maintaining the purely commensal attitude that Alesha thought she saw. But Ojutai's interesting. For all the teaching he does, it would appear that he overdoes the "history and life center around me" attitude.
And/or that he didn't do as good a job of censoring the Jeskai past as he thought...(Where ARE the efreet, these days? I doubt they've spent the past 1,280 years just stuck in the Fire Rim...) I wouldn't be surprised if Dromoka at least allows allusions to the Abzan past (albeit without the Abzan name) as What Not To Do.
Once more, why on Earth shall she be Sultai? Because the Temporal Trespass gal has blue eyes? On a BLUE spell? Oh, come on....
Because Taigam stayed with the clan this time and she became the heretic. And last week's Uncharted Realms had a running theme of "Time travel didn't work the way you thought it would, Sarkhan". Its building pathos. The one person Sarkhan wanted to see in Tarkir again is now incredibly different in a way that is tragic to him.
Her robes are blue with red and white tinges. Her golden breastplate is different from the Sultai ones.
But it's still golden. The Ojutai aren't much about opulence.
And most of which, she is striking a martial art pose.
Taigam never stopped being a martial artist just because he defected. Narset would be the same.
In my opinion, she found the archive Shu Yun left behind. She will be Jeskai colors.
I think that's more likely. I was merely putting forward a theory based on the art on the booster pack. Hell, it might be both. She distanced herself from the Ojutai-clan while she figured things out. The Silumgar-clan took her in because they respect power. Just because she lives with them doesn't mean she's one of them (see Gideon not being Boros).
Not sure if anyone pointed this out already (probably yes), but Shu Yun's scroll is probably the Scroll of Ghostfire, the one Chandra steals from that monastery and that has Ugin's spell (Ghostfire) in it, right? The whole "Ojutai forces the Red out of Jeskai by making them forget/decline the bloodfire/ghostfire thing" points to that. Narset probably went after the scroll in the new timeline. This all is a giant red arrow pointing to Zendikar II, I think.
The scroll Chandra stole was a plant from Bolas to set the events of Zendikar into motion, and Chandra stole it from a completely different world than Tarkir (Kephalai). More than likely it was just a reproduction that hinted at how to mimic Ghostfire.
Ojutai killed the ghostfire warriors, who were the individuals who had killed dragons. As far as we know he did not purge the knowledge of ghostfire itself completely. The knowledge he sealed away was the history of the clans, not necessarily their techniques, as they are still all martial artists. But since Shu Yun had his scroll (which was a history) hidden, it's doubtful that it found it's way to Kephalai.
Not sure if anyone pointed this out already (probably yes), but Shu Yun's scroll is probably the Scroll of Ghostfire, the one Chandra steals from that monastery and that has Ugin's spell (Ghostfire) in it, right? The whole "Ojutai forces the Red out of Jeskai by making them forget/decline the bloodfire/ghostfire thing" points to that. Narset probably went after the scroll in the new timeline. This all is a giant red arrow pointing to Zendikar II, I think.
Shu Yun's scroll didn't exist until Sarkhan changed time.
I have been in the camp that Narset's spark ignited when Zurgo went to kill her. So being on a different plane would save her from the temporal changes of Tarkir. I'd imagine that Narset would come back to Tarkir eventually to find Taigam/Oujati leading "Jeskai", which would lead to major issues. And it make senses why she's called a "heretic" because she would be talking a time of Khans and when dragons are extinct. I dont think Mr. Oujati would appreciate that "blasphemy".
Being off world doesn't shield one from a change in one's personal history. Any other walker who had been to Tarkir will have their memories altered too.
How many times do I have to say it? Ugin is not confirmed as an Elder Dragon.
I said it was headcanon. In my mind there's no way in hell Ugin looks as much like Bolas as he does without some shared lineage.
The problem is, when you say that sort of thing in a public forum, you spread misinformation. I've had to debunk Ugin = Elder THREE TIMES in the past day. I don't want people propagating their headcanon. I understand where you're coming from, but there are people paying attention that will take the statement as the gospel truth.
Not sure if anyone pointed this out already (probably yes), but Shu Yun's scroll is probably the Scroll of Ghostfire, the one Chandra steals from that monastery and that has Ugin's spell (Ghostfire) in it, right? The whole "Ojutai forces the Red out of Jeskai by making them forget/decline the bloodfire/ghostfire thing" points to that. Narset probably went after the scroll in the new timeline. This all is a giant red arrow pointing to Zendikar II, I think.
The scroll Chandra stole was a plant from Bolas to set the events of Zendikar into motion, and Chandra stole it from a completely different world than Tarkir (Kephalai). More than likely it was just a reproduction that hinted at how to mimic Ghostfire.
Ojutai killed the ghostfire warriors, who were the individuals who had killed dragons. As far as we know he did not purge the knowledge of ghostfire itself completely. The knowledge he sealed away was the history of the clans, not necessarily their techniques, as they are still all martial artists. But since Shu Yun had his scroll (which was a history) hidden, it's doubtful that it found it's way to Kephalai.
Yes, yes, I remember she didn't stole it *from* Tarkir, but can't it be the same scroll? I don't know, it just seems like this is all connected. The scroll she stole is the one that teaches Ghostfire, which is a Ugin spell. Ugin looks to be connected to the Jeskai somehow, due to all the cards showing that, and the whole Ojutai thing about "forgetting that knowledge" suggests that. Am I really just tying stuff that can't be tied together?
Yes, yes, I remember she didn't stole it *from* Tarkir, but can't it be the same scroll? I don't know, it just seems like this is all connected. The scroll she stole is the one that teaches Ghostfire, which is a Ugin spell. Ugin looks to be connected to the Jeskai somehow, due to all the cards showing that, and the whole Ojutai thing about "forgetting that knowledge" suggests that. Am I really just tying stuff that can't be tied together?
I think you might be tying things together a bit too much. The scroll Chandra stole was really simple, and only hinted at how to perform ghostfire. Chandra was already a gifted pyromancer, so it wouldn't have been too hard for her I think. The Jeskai scrolls would have probably been a lot more technical.
Just saw a cute term for the new elder dragons, "neo-elder dragons". I like it cause it's similar in showing us the power difference between them and the old elders. Kinda like the power difference between old walkers and neo-walkers. Thoughts?
This is just perfect. Whoever thought of this is A GENIUS.
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Just saw a cute term for the new elder dragons, "neo-elder dragons". I like it cause it's similar in showing us the power difference between them and the old elders. Kinda like the power difference between old walkers and neo-walkers. Thoughts?
This is just perfect. Whoever thought of this is A GENIUS.
I think this just goes to show that you should never underestimate the potential negative impacts of annoying the Vorthos community. Once they feel you have betrayed them they'll successfully coin a term that'll stick permanently in the game. It's like a bumper sticker you just cant seem to peel off or paint over no matter it's age.
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Wizards. listen. The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
I say from now on we call them neo-elder dragons and see how long before MaRo tries to ban that term. He hated the fact we refer to Jace as a neo-walker.
To be fair, there were people using the term in a somewhat viscous way. But on the other side, WotC does need to fully accept that such intense changes can and will be met with some deserving vitriol.
I think this just goes to show that you should never underestimate the potential negative impacts of annoying the Vorthos community. Once they feel you have betrayed them they'll successfully coin a term that'll stick permanently in the game. It's like a bumper sticker you just cant seem to peel off or paint over no matter it's age.
And this is what frustrates me to no end, continuity followers aren't even demanding that much from WOTC, not even picketing for a physical product to happen and stuff. (And yet we always get the same reasonings over and over thrown at our faces: Market data, number of populace etc. etc.) Just a semblance of stuff being sustained, you can remove all the physical products aside, at least just give us that.
That is why even though I try my best to be positive with the Neowalkers and latch onto something to them, the looming problems with inconsistency and the loose usage of the retcon stick is making me hesitate to fully commit.
thx. This picture confuses me as I originally thought we had seen a VERY different pic of Narset with a hair whip. If this is untrue and the character just looked like her I'll be relieved as the armored Narset looks much cooler IMO
The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
@Elder; I don't mind the use of the term. A bit of headcanon here, but they are elders because they are the progeny of Ugin, who is an elder. Works for me. Your mileage may vary.
When it was a world with untamable, ever-changing terrain wrapped up in a "lands-matter/ramp into enormous creatures" package?
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How many times do I have to say it?
Ugin is not confirmed as an Elder Dragon.
http://dougbeyermtg.tumblr.com/post/108287169989
There, it says clearly, they hadn't talked about it and the elder in question was in regards to the age and not the race.
If you meant Ugin is an elder Dragon and that is why they are that way? Doesn't get around the problem that Elder has specific connotations and this has caused problems with two separate definitions being attributed to it.
This. She's a heretic, not a traitor. Looking at Ojutai's censoring and thoughtcrime attitude, she's probably true Jeskai clan member (as opposed to being Ojutai's brood member). Maybe because she remember the other timeline, or has seen it in her visions, or just for finding and reading Shu Yun's scroll.
It is so different from the Narset in the DTK boosters that I now suspect it was just an old concept art or sketch for her original KTK version. Could also be used to represent the young DTK Narset before becoming 'heretic'.
We'll probably have Surrak "Dragonfeeder", Zurgo Bellstriker (known in storyline), and Anafenza for the last 3 "Khans".
That leaves Narset as an outlier. Will she be the walker that many have wished for or predicted?
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Per the flavor text of the Ugin's Fate promo version of Ainok Tracker, it's going to be "Surrak, the Hunt Caller"
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Thats not how this way of time traveling seems to be working.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
She defects to Sultai and he stays behind.
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Once more, why on Earth shall she be Sultai? Because the Temporal Trespass gal has blue eyes? On a BLUE spell? Oh, come on....
Her robes are blue with red and white tinges. Her golden breastplate is different from the Sultai ones.
And most of which, she is striking a martial art pose.
In my opinion, she found the archive Shu Yun left behind. She will be Jeskai colors.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I notice that this includes the Ojutai and Kolaghan orders.
I suppose with Kolaghan's BR, it's to be expected; maybe not overthrow Kolaghan herself, but certainly try to prove yourself stronger than one of the regent warleaders and secure a Klingon Promotion...only for the OTHER regents to beat you back down. Regardless, Kolaghan isn't maintaining the purely commensal attitude that Alesha thought she saw. But Ojutai's interesting. For all the teaching he does, it would appear that he overdoes the "history and life center around me" attitude.
And/or that he didn't do as good a job of censoring the Jeskai past as he thought...(Where ARE the efreet, these days? I doubt they've spent the past 1,280 years just stuck in the Fire Rim...) I wouldn't be surprised if Dromoka at least allows allusions to the Abzan past (albeit without the Abzan name) as What Not To Do.
Because Taigam stayed with the clan this time and she became the heretic. And last week's Uncharted Realms had a running theme of "Time travel didn't work the way you thought it would, Sarkhan". Its building pathos. The one person Sarkhan wanted to see in Tarkir again is now incredibly different in a way that is tragic to him.
But it's still golden. The Ojutai aren't much about opulence.
Taigam never stopped being a martial artist just because he defected. Narset would be the same.
I think that's more likely. I was merely putting forward a theory based on the art on the booster pack. Hell, it might be both. She distanced herself from the Ojutai-clan while she figured things out. The Silumgar-clan took her in because they respect power. Just because she lives with them doesn't mean she's one of them (see Gideon not being Boros).
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Ojutai killed the ghostfire warriors, who were the individuals who had killed dragons. As far as we know he did not purge the knowledge of ghostfire itself completely. The knowledge he sealed away was the history of the clans, not necessarily their techniques, as they are still all martial artists. But since Shu Yun had his scroll (which was a history) hidden, it's doubtful that it found it's way to Kephalai.
TerribleBad at Magic since 1998.A Vorthos Guide to Magic Story | Twitter | Tumblr
[Primer] Krenko | Azor | Kess | Zacama | Kumena | Sram | The Ur-Dragon | Edgar Markov | Daretti | Marath
Being off world doesn't shield one from a change in one's personal history. Any other walker who had been to Tarkir will have their memories altered too.
The problem is, when you say that sort of thing in a public forum, you spread misinformation. I've had to debunk Ugin = Elder THREE TIMES in the past day. I don't want people propagating their headcanon. I understand where you're coming from, but there are people paying attention that will take the statement as the gospel truth.
Yes, yes, I remember she didn't stole it *from* Tarkir, but can't it be the same scroll? I don't know, it just seems like this is all connected. The scroll she stole is the one that teaches Ghostfire, which is a Ugin spell. Ugin looks to be connected to the Jeskai somehow, due to all the cards showing that, and the whole Ojutai thing about "forgetting that knowledge" suggests that. Am I really just tying stuff that can't be tied together?
TerribleBad at Magic since 1998.A Vorthos Guide to Magic Story | Twitter | Tumblr
[Primer] Krenko | Azor | Kess | Zacama | Kumena | Sram | The Ur-Dragon | Edgar Markov | Daretti | Marath
This is just perfect.
I think this just goes to show that you should never underestimate the potential negative impacts of annoying the Vorthos community. Once they feel you have betrayed them they'll successfully coin a term that'll stick permanently in the game. It's like a bumper sticker you just cant seem to peel off or paint over no matter it's age.
The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
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StaffTo be fair, there were people using the term in a somewhat viscous way. But on the other side, WotC does need to fully accept that such intense changes can and will be met with some deserving vitriol.
And this is what frustrates me to no end, continuity followers aren't even demanding that much from WOTC, not even picketing for a physical product to happen and stuff. (And yet we always get the same reasonings over and over thrown at our faces: Market data, number of populace etc. etc.) Just a semblance of stuff being sustained, you can remove all the physical products aside, at least just give us that.
That is why even though I try my best to be positive with the Neowalkers and latch onto something to them, the looming problems with inconsistency and the loose usage of the retcon stick is making me hesitate to fully commit.