I wonder if this "Alternate Present" thing that the Temur believe in is like Agyrem from original Ravnica. I mean, I understand that it's involved with the weird time travel the plot involves, but it does have an odd similarity.
I believe it is an Agyrem of a more sinister nature...that being to draw in the Eldrazi Titans with the presence of all those high-mana dragonstorms, then trap them within the pocket plane. The constantly spawning storms would keep them busy. Leaving Ugin to send Sorin and whomever else on wild goosechases across the multiverse while he does whatever potentially devious spirit dragons do.
I wonder if this "Alternate Present" thing that the Temur believe in is like Agyrem from original Ravnica. I mean, I understand that it's involved with the weird time travel the plot involves, but it does have an odd similarity.
I believe it is an Agyrem of a more sinister nature...that being to draw in the Eldrazi Titans with the presence of all those high-mana dragonstorms, then trap them within the pocket plane. The constantly spawning storms would keep them busy. Leaving Ugin to send Sorin and whomever else on wild goosechases across the multiverse while he does whatever potentially devious spirit dragons do.
The question becomes why Ugin didn't volunteer Tarkir for the Eldrazi in the first place.
Because he specifically avoided it altogether and chose Zendikar to throw under the bus, strong-arming Nahiri into sacrificing her own world. http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/ur/lithomancer-2014-10-29
I wonder if this "Alternate Present" thing that the Temur believe in is like Agyrem from original Ravnica. I mean, I understand that it's involved with the weird time travel the plot involves, but it does have an odd similarity.
I believe it is an Agyrem of a more sinister nature...that being to draw in the Eldrazi Titans with the presence of all those high-mana dragonstorms, then trap them within the pocket plane. The constantly spawning storms would keep them busy. Leaving Ugin to send Sorin and whomever else on wild goosechases across the multiverse while he does whatever potentially devious spirit dragons do.
The question becomes why Ugin didn't volunteer Tarkir for the Eldrazi in the first place.
Because he specifically avoided it altogether and chose Zendikar to throw under the bus, strong-arming Nahiri into sacrificing her own world. http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/ur/lithomancer-2014-10-29
Because "Sparsely Populated" is not how I'd describe a world full of dragons.
I wonder if this "Alternate Present" thing that the Temur believe in is like Agyrem from original Ravnica. I mean, I understand that it's involved with the weird time travel the plot involves, but it does have an odd similarity.
I believe it is an Agyrem of a more sinister nature...that being to draw in the Eldrazi Titans with the presence of all those high-mana dragonstorms, then trap them within the pocket plane. The constantly spawning storms would keep them busy. Leaving Ugin to send Sorin and whomever else on wild goosechases across the multiverse while he does whatever potentially devious spirit dragons do.
The question becomes why Ugin didn't volunteer Tarkir for the Eldrazi in the first place.
Because he specifically avoided it altogether and chose Zendikar to throw under the bus, strong-arming Nahiri into sacrificing her own world. http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/ur/lithomancer-2014-10-29
Well he did list some criteria for the plane to trap the Eldrazi on: It should be 1. large, 2. rich in magic, and 3. sparsely populted. As for being large, how do we really know which planes are large or small? We only see what the story tellers tell us and then we have to frame of reference to compare them to each other. A story that only visits a handful of locations may seem small but be happening on a plane that is much larger and unexplored.
For point 2, again we don't really know how magical most planes are, but some do get a description as such and I seem to remember Zendikar being called a plane full of wild magic. (At one point Chandra actually had trouble controlling her magic because of it.) While Tarkir may have a lot of magic, based on the stories I'm not sure it would qualifiy as 'rich' or at least, Zendikar has more. And then sparsely populated, there are a lot of dangerous areas and creatures on Zendikar. I think Sparsely populated is quite accurate for Zendikar. Tarkir, not so much. There were dragons everywhere at that time and eventually those dragons were hunted to extinction which to me says that there were a lot more people there too. So if we take the spirit dragon at his word, Tarkir did not fit the qualifications of a 'suitable' plane to trap the Eldrazi.
Of course, he could have just been lying because he didn't want to risk his home plane. I don't think that is the case, but I guess there is no real proof one way or the other.
I personally believe Ugin was only half-lying about Tarkir not being suitable.
Tarkir would have likely worked, though not as great as Zendikar, which was also on the table. I think Ugin's main motivation was to not sacrifice Tarkir and he knew Innistrad was near useless for the task. So he told Nahiri that only Zendikar was suitable, which is not really true. It was, however, more suitable than Tarkir, and Ugin needed/wanted to "lie" about Tarkir not being suitable in order to convince Nahiri.
Well, that's what I think at least, which is why I also don't buy into the "Ugin is a good Bolas" theory. To me Ugin appears as true neutral all the way.
I wonder if this "Alternate Present" thing that the Temur believe in is like Agyrem from original Ravnica. I mean, I understand that it's involved with the weird time travel the plot involves, but it does have an odd similarity.
I believe it is an Agyrem of a more sinister nature...that being to draw in the Eldrazi Titans with the presence of all those high-mana dragonstorms, then trap them within the pocket plane. The constantly spawning storms would keep them busy. Leaving Ugin to send Sorin and whomever else on wild goosechases across the multiverse while he does whatever potentially devious spirit dragons do.
The question becomes why Ugin didn't volunteer Tarkir for the Eldrazi in the first place.
Because he specifically avoided it altogether and chose Zendikar to throw under the bus, strong-arming Nahiri into sacrificing her own world. http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/ur/lithomancer-2014-10-29
Well he did list some criteria for the plane to trap the Eldrazi on: It should be 1. large, 2. rich in magic, and 3. sparsely populted. As for being large, how do we really know which planes are large or small? We only see what the story tellers tell us and then we have to frame of reference to compare them to each other. A story that only visits a handful of locations may seem small but be happening on a plane that is much larger and unexplored.
For point 2, again we don't really know how magical most planes are, but some do get a description as such and I seem to remember Zendikar being called a plane full of wild magic. (At one point Chandra actually had trouble controlling her magic because of it.) While Tarkir may have a lot of magic, based on the stories I'm not sure it would qualifiy as 'rich' or at least, Zendikar has more. And then sparsely populated, there are a lot of dangerous areas and creatures on Zendikar. I think Sparsely populated is quite accurate for Zendikar. Tarkir, not so much. There were dragons everywhere at that time and eventually those dragons were hunted to extinction which to me says that there were a lot more people there too. So if we take the spirit dragon at his word, Tarkir did not fit the qualifications of a 'suitable' plane to trap the Eldrazi.
Of course, he could have just been lying because he didn't want to risk his home plane. I don't think that is the case, but I guess there is no real proof one way or the other.
Zendikar sure looks big. The plane has seven continents (Akoum, Bala Ged, Guul Draz, Murasa, Ondu, Sejiri, and Tazeem), and all of them were present in the block. As far as I can tell, the only other plane we have seen more than one continent of is Dominaria itself (and maybe Alara, post-merging?).
Tarkir, like most planes, shows only the are of one continent or so. Could the whole world be as big as Zendikar or Dominaria? Maybe, but it sure looks like everything relevant only happens in that relatively small area.
Uhhh what? Tarkir has five continents named after the plane's wedge elder dragons: Abzan, Sultai, Jeskai, Mardu and Temur. What we've seen in the URs all take place on the ghost continent that shifts into the Agyrem-like region that figures into the Temur's mythology about the Unwritten stuff/things. Ancillary to this topic, but the Unwritten is where the dead dragons and the dead khans of the past like the new Dragonclaw are reincarnated and go about life in a slow-time bubble on a massive scale that is being maintained by Intet.
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Uhhh what? Tarkir has five continents named after the plane's wedge elder dragons: Abzan, Sultai, Jeskai, Mardu and Temur. What we've seen in the URs all take place on the ghost continent that shifts into the Agyrem-like region that figures into the Temur's mythology about the Unwritten stuff/things. Ancillary to this topic, but the Unwritten is where the dead dragons and the dead khans of the past like the new Dragonclaw are reincarnated and go about life in a slow-time bubble on a massive scale that is being maintained by Intet.
The guides to Tarkir in the case of the five continents. The time travel theory is based on something Maro said on his tumbler about Tarkir's time travel being exclusive to Tarkir, and used in a way that does not act as a means of fixing storyline problems. The Unwritten comes straight from the Temur entry in the guide to Tarkir.
The guides to Tarkir in the case of the five continents. The time travel theory is based on something Maro said on his tumbler about Tarkir's time travel being exclusive to Tarkir, and used in a way that does not act as a means of fixing storyline problems. The Unwritten comes straight from the Temur entry in the guide to Tarkir.
Nowhere in the Planeswalker's Guide to Tarkir does it mention continents. It discusses the five different clans and how they interact. If anything, the wording of the stories makes it pretty explicit that there is one landmass that the five clans share because the various clans are easily able to cross paths when traveling.
Also, Intet is from an alternate Dominaria, not from Tarkir.
The guides to Tarkir in the case of the five continents. The time travel theory is based on something Maro said on his tumbler about Tarkir's time travel being exclusive to Tarkir, and used in a way that does not act as a means of fixing storyline problems. The Unwritten comes straight from the Temur entry in the guide to Tarkir.
I've never seen a reference to the fact that the story we're seeing takes place in more than one continent. Do you have a quote that can show otherwise? It's possible I simply missed it.
...spawned from elemental storms of five classes, each class unique to one of Tarkir's five continents...the first dragon spawned from each of the five storms provided the name for each of the continents...
This is not a real quote. This text does not appear in any of the official Planeswalkers' Guides on the Mothership. Please stop making things up and posting them as if they are fact.
Well, we are only on the first set. I expect that in Dragons of Tarkir we will have the clans' motives clarified. Fate Reforged will probably establish what it is that makes this sixth "ghost continent" a lodestone for the various khans.
We'll see about your choice of profanity once Fate Reforged is out. All we need to know is that our UR's are centered on the "ghost continent" or "Ugin Continent" if you prefer since it is where Ugin's Nexus is...and like I said, we don't know why the khans are drawn to this continent rather than try to improve things on their own...that is something to be hinted in FRF and unveiled, the motives, in DTK.
That's true. It always felt kind of awkward to call Europe and Asia two separate continents to me.
As far as the Intet theory I assumed it was a misunderstanding based on the fact that the Planar Chaos Dragons share colors with the clans. It doesn't make much sense but I can see how someone could get confused.
This. I scoured the Planeswalker's Guides (and the other Tarkir Uncharted Realms stories), and the quote TheIronCaptain provided is not present in any of the stories.
We'll see about your choice of profanity once Fate Reforged is out. All we need to know is that our UR's are centered on the "ghost continent" or "Ugin Continent" if you prefer since it is where Ugin's Nexus is...and like I said, we don't know why the khans are drawn to this continent rather than try to improve things on their own...that is something to be hinted in FRF and unveiled, the motives, in DTK.
<<snip>>
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...spawned from elemental storms of five classes, each class unique to one of Tarkir's five continents...the first dragon spawned from each of the five storms provided the name for each of the continents...
Do you do this with your university essays too ThelronCaptain? Deliberately misquote your references hoping to actually sound legit? You don't. Please desist in projecting your personal speculation as proof. There is a separate thread for that kind of stuff. Also there is a Wiki, consult it, often. I myself have mistakenly made claims that I realize requires a greater understanding of the source material, but this is beginning to be a personal habit for you. Please desist.Immediatley. Thank you
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I believe it is an Agyrem of a more sinister nature...that being to draw in the Eldrazi Titans with the presence of all those high-mana dragonstorms, then trap them within the pocket plane. The constantly spawning storms would keep them busy. Leaving Ugin to send Sorin and whomever else on wild goosechases across the multiverse while he does whatever potentially devious spirit dragons do.
The question becomes why Ugin didn't volunteer Tarkir for the Eldrazi in the first place.
Because he specifically avoided it altogether and chose Zendikar to throw under the bus, strong-arming Nahiri into sacrificing her own world.
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/ur/lithomancer-2014-10-29
Because "Sparsely Populated" is not how I'd describe a world full of dragons.
Well he did list some criteria for the plane to trap the Eldrazi on: It should be 1. large, 2. rich in magic, and 3. sparsely populted. As for being large, how do we really know which planes are large or small? We only see what the story tellers tell us and then we have to frame of reference to compare them to each other. A story that only visits a handful of locations may seem small but be happening on a plane that is much larger and unexplored.
For point 2, again we don't really know how magical most planes are, but some do get a description as such and I seem to remember Zendikar being called a plane full of wild magic. (At one point Chandra actually had trouble controlling her magic because of it.) While Tarkir may have a lot of magic, based on the stories I'm not sure it would qualifiy as 'rich' or at least, Zendikar has more. And then sparsely populated, there are a lot of dangerous areas and creatures on Zendikar. I think Sparsely populated is quite accurate for Zendikar. Tarkir, not so much. There were dragons everywhere at that time and eventually those dragons were hunted to extinction which to me says that there were a lot more people there too. So if we take the spirit dragon at his word, Tarkir did not fit the qualifications of a 'suitable' plane to trap the Eldrazi.
Of course, he could have just been lying because he didn't want to risk his home plane. I don't think that is the case, but I guess there is no real proof one way or the other.
Tarkir would have likely worked, though not as great as Zendikar, which was also on the table. I think Ugin's main motivation was to not sacrifice Tarkir and he knew Innistrad was near useless for the task. So he told Nahiri that only Zendikar was suitable, which is not really true. It was, however, more suitable than Tarkir, and Ugin needed/wanted to "lie" about Tarkir not being suitable in order to convince Nahiri.
Well, that's what I think at least, which is why I also don't buy into the "Ugin is a good Bolas" theory. To me Ugin appears as true neutral all the way.
Zendikar sure looks big. The plane has seven continents (Akoum, Bala Ged, Guul Draz, Murasa, Ondu, Sejiri, and Tazeem), and all of them were present in the block. As far as I can tell, the only other plane we have seen more than one continent of is Dominaria itself (and maybe Alara, post-merging?).
Tarkir, like most planes, shows only the are of one continent or so. Could the whole world be as big as Zendikar or Dominaria? Maybe, but it sure looks like everything relevant only happens in that relatively small area.
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~kaburi
Can you explain how you came up with that idea?
Also, Intet is from an alternate Dominaria, not from Tarkir.
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I've never seen a reference to the fact that the story we're seeing takes place in more than one continent. Do you have a quote that can show otherwise? It's possible I simply missed it.
This is not a real quote. This text does not appear in any of the official Planeswalkers' Guides on the Mothership. Please stop making things up and posting them as if they are fact.
~kaburi
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/planeswalkers-guide-khans-tarkir-part-1-2014-09-03
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/planeswalkers-guide-khans-tarkir-part-2-2014-09-10
Also: http://magic.wizards.com/en/game-info/story/planes/tarkir
Continents can be linked by land.
I'm not sure where in the nine hells TheIronCaptain is getting his Intet nonsense theory though.
As far as the Intet theory I assumed it was a misunderstanding based on the fact that the Planar Chaos Dragons share colors with the clans. It doesn't make much sense but I can see how someone could get confused.
You should probably not base theories on that kind of stuff.
No. We will see right now, based on the fact you pulled a quote saying it comes from the Guide, when it doesn't.
The Nexus is on Temur lands.
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<<snip>>
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Do you do this with your university essays too ThelronCaptain? Deliberately misquote your references hoping to actually sound legit? You don't. Please desist in projecting your personal speculation as proof. There is a separate thread for that kind of stuff. Also there is a Wiki, consult it, often. I myself have mistakenly made claims that I realize requires a greater understanding of the source material, but this is beginning to be a personal habit for you. Please desist.Immediatley. Thank you
The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi