Just found out there are a ton of Contamination threads locked waiting for an answer. I would still like to now how to handle this in a tournament, I don't want to get a debate about what does mean "being tapped for", I just want a clear answer from some of the head judge or something.
My Mountain is tapped for Red but will never produce Red. Caged Sun's wording is pretty clear about the fact that it wouldn't trigger. Gauntlet isn't that clear
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
The head judge of your tournament (if this somehow actually ever came up, which I've never seen) can make a final ruling that will stand for that event. My best understanding is that "tapped for mana of the chosen color" basically means "tapped for mana and produces that color of mana" so Gauntlet of Power wouldn't trigger. But in the absence of an official ruling that is not likely to be forthcoming any time soon, use your discretion.
EDIT: The [O] ruling is that "tapped for mana of the chosen color" means "tapped to activate a mana ability that would normally produce mana of the chosen color" so the Gauntlet would trigger and produce R when the Mountain itself produces B.
Assuming people are relying on me to rule this out in a tournament, I choose the way I prefer and make a player lose or not by doing so (let's assume he's playing mono-red). Correct?
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
Hopefully you will have made your decision about how it works in advance (e.g., now) so that your decision isn't biased based on the player. But essentially, yes. As I said, though, nobody has ever seen this happen in a sanctioned tournament to my knowledge, so I wouldn't spend too much time fretting about it.
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EDH isn't sanctioned but there are still big tournaments with hundreds of $$$ in cash prizes and that's why I am taking this rather seriously and isn't really satisfied about an interaction in the game where we rule is as we prefer.
From a judge perspective point, I don't see how you could like this either and why we still don't have the final oruling on this yet.
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
I never said I liked it, but I can't give you an answer that doesn't exist, nor can I force one into existence. If you are seriously concerned, announce how that ruling will work before the event for your tournaments, so nobody is surprised.
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This FAQ answers many of the common questions asked in the MTGS Rulings forum. Take a look!
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"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
There are more than 20k different cards. That means millions if different interactions. Do we have to take hours before each tournaments to cover every interaction not covered by the CR?
That's supposed to be WotC's job, isn't it? I can't really stand the fact that they create a game and can't tell us how to play with.
That's not even a complex situation, that's 2 cards that see a lot of EDH play and this situation happens every weeks and nobody wants to give up until we get a real ruling and that's to be expected.
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
We are going in circles here. No-one on here can give you the final ruling you want. If you are really that invested in getting an [o]-answer for a scenario that may come up more frequently for you than for the rest of the world, then you should take that interest to a place where you can actually be helped. The easiest way is to ask your question over at the wotc mothership forum. They have a representative who has the authority to give [o]-rulings.
Thank you for that last part, I didn't even know.
But you don't need to be rude, I don't see how this scenario could come up more frequently for me than anybody else who plays EDH often with tons of mono-colored decks. Almost all mono-black decks play Contamination and almost all mono-colored decks play Gauntlet of Power, Caged Sun and/or Extraplanar Lens. Either your meta is really competitive (not many mono-colored decks) or rich (easier to play 5c decks in this case), or you just never played EDH on a regular basis.
I guess this thread can be locked too, I will go answer my question on WotC forums.
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
The Gauntlet doesn't take replacement effects into account. The Gauntlet will see that you're tapping the Mountain for red mana and it will trigger. It doesn't care that Contamination's replacement effect made that mana black instead of red (and yes, that is an [O]fficial answer). So in this case, you would get BR (one red from the Gauntlet, and one black due to Contamination).
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Scientists have calculated that the chance of anything so patently absurd actually existing are millions to one. But magicians have calculated that million-to-one chances crop up nine times out of ten.
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
Good to know. Why is it written lvl 2 in his sig? Is this completely independant? Sorry for being a little bit noob about this but I thought there were like 4 "master" judges (or call it what you like, the highest level) and that those was providing O answers.
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
There are 4 Level 5 judges, but they don't generally concern themselves with making [O] rulings about comprehensive rule issues. Nathan Long is an official Wizards NetRep, and as such is authorized to make [O]fficial rulings (usually after he consults with the rules team in the case of unclear rulings). This has nothing to do with his judge level.
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Level 3 Judge
This FAQ answers many of the common questions asked in the MTGS Rulings forum. Take a look!
I'm the editor/content manager of the Magic Rules Tips Blog - Bookmark this site for daily tips about game and tournament rules.
"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
Contamination
Gauntlet of Power naming Red
Mountain tapped for Red
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-rulings/magic-rulings-archives/493364-gauntlet-of-power-contamination
Just found out there are a ton of Contamination threads locked waiting for an answer. I would still like to now how to handle this in a tournament, I don't want to get a debate about what does mean "being tapped for", I just want a clear answer from some of the head judge or something.
My Mountain is tapped for Red but will never produce Red. Caged Sun's wording is pretty clear about the fact that it wouldn't trigger. Gauntlet isn't that clear
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
My best understanding is that "tapped for mana of the chosen color" basically means "tapped for mana and produces that color of mana" so Gauntlet of Power wouldn't trigger. But in the absence of an official ruling that is not likely to be forthcoming any time soon, use your discretion.EDIT: The [O] ruling is that "tapped for mana of the chosen color" means "tapped to activate a mana ability that would normally produce mana of the chosen color" so the Gauntlet would trigger and produce R when the Mountain itself produces B.
This FAQ answers many of the common questions asked in the MTGS Rulings forum. Take a look!
I'm the editor/content manager of the Magic Rules Tips Blog - Bookmark this site for daily tips about game and tournament rules.
"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
My Type 4 Stack -- DCI Documents -- Comp Rules
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
This FAQ answers many of the common questions asked in the MTGS Rulings forum. Take a look!
I'm the editor/content manager of the Magic Rules Tips Blog - Bookmark this site for daily tips about game and tournament rules.
"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
My Type 4 Stack -- DCI Documents -- Comp Rules
From a judge perspective point, I don't see how you could like this either and why we still don't have the final oruling on this yet.
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
This FAQ answers many of the common questions asked in the MTGS Rulings forum. Take a look!
I'm the editor/content manager of the Magic Rules Tips Blog - Bookmark this site for daily tips about game and tournament rules.
"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
My Type 4 Stack -- DCI Documents -- Comp Rules
That's supposed to be WotC's job, isn't it? I can't really stand the fact that they create a game and can't tell us how to play with.
That's not even a complex situation, that's 2 cards that see a lot of EDH play and this situation happens every weeks and nobody wants to give up until we get a real ruling and that's to be expected.
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
Thank you for that last part, I didn't even know.
But you don't need to be rude, I don't see how this scenario could come up more frequently for me than anybody else who plays EDH often with tons of mono-colored decks. Almost all mono-black decks play Contamination and almost all mono-colored decks play Gauntlet of Power, Caged Sun and/or Extraplanar Lens. Either your meta is really competitive (not many mono-colored decks) or rich (easier to play 5c decks in this case), or you just never played EDH on a regular basis.
I guess this thread can be locked too, I will go answer my question on WotC forums.
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
Scientists have calculated that the chance of anything so patently absurd actually existing are millions to one. But magicians have calculated that million-to-one chances crop up nine times out of ten.
This question has been asked multiple times and all threads are just locked up, waiting for the O answer. Would be nice to update those threads.
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
Natedog _IS_ an [O].
You can treat his answer as original.
Good to know. Why is it written lvl 2 in his sig? Is this completely independant? Sorry for being a little bit noob about this but I thought there were like 4 "master" judges (or call it what you like, the highest level) and that those was providing O answers.
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
This FAQ answers many of the common questions asked in the MTGS Rulings forum. Take a look!
I'm the editor/content manager of the Magic Rules Tips Blog - Bookmark this site for daily tips about game and tournament rules.
"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
My Type 4 Stack -- DCI Documents -- Comp Rules