Last FNM i played an opponent who would gytaxian probe me and then write down on a piece of paper all the cards in my hand.
this seems like cheating to me and im pretty sure there is a rule against doing this
Depends on how long he takes writing them. If he writes them in a timely manner, that's fine, and he can reference those notes throughout the rest of the current game. He has to put them away, however, before the next game begins.
If he takes his sweet time doing it, then that's a Warning for Slow Play at the competitive level, or a stern but friendly talking-to at the FNM level.
Rules citation - MTR 2.11: "Players are allowed to take written notes during a match and may refer to those notes while that match is in progress. At the beginning of a match, each player's note sheet must be empty and must remain visible throughout the match... Players may not refer to other notes, including notes from previous matches, during games."
You are allowed to write things down during a game, but cannot bring things written down to a game.
Yes, however, you can reference notes made prior to the game as long as a game is not in progress. For example, you can made sideboarding notes before the event and stick them in deckbox to look at between games of the match to help you sideboard out. You cannot, however, look at any such outside notes during a game in progress. ONLY notes you have made during your current match may be referenced in a game in progress.
The penalty for outside notes during a game in progress at the competitive level is severe - a match loss.
Citation - MTR 2.11: "Between games, players may refer to a brief set of notes made before the match. They are not required to reveal these notes to their opponents. These notes must be removed from the play area before the beginning of the next game."
ONLY notes you have made during that specific game.
This is not correct. You can reference any notes made during the match during any game in that match. You can references notes made outside the match(such as sideboarding notes) in-between games.
Quote from MTR »
2.11 Taking Notes Players are allowed to take written notes during a match and may refer to those notes while that match is in progress. At the beginning of a match, each player’s note sheet must be empty and must remain visible throughout the match. Players do not have to explain or reveal notes to other players. Judges may ask to see a player’s notes and/or request that the player explain his or her notes.
Players may not refer to other notes, including notes from previous matches, during games.
Between games, players may refer to a brief set of notes made before the match. They are not required to reveal these notes to their opponents. These notes must be removed from the play area before the beginning of the next game. Excessive quantities of notes (more than a sheet or two) are not allowed and may be penalized as slow play.
Players and spectators (exception: authorized press) may not make notes while drafting. Players may not reference any outside notes during drafting, card pool registration, or deckbuilding.
Players may refer to Oracle text, either electronically or in paper form, at any time. They must do so publicly and in a format (such as gatherer.wizards.com, other official Wizards of the Coast sources, or printouts of their sources) which contains no other strategic information. If a player wishes to view Oracle text in private, he or she must ask a judge.
Artistic modifications to cards that indirectly provide minor strategic information are acceptable. The Head Judge is the final arbiter on what cards and notes are acceptable for a tournament.
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"To face death, that's nothing much. But to feel really stupid when you die, well, that would be insufferable." -Nafai, The Ships of Earth
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
When someone probes me, i put my cards down and leave them there so they can keep track, it seems to me the correct thing to do and all my friends do the same.
While that can be faster than having your opponent write everything down you are by no means required to do so.
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"To face death, that's nothing much. But to feel really stupid when you die, well, that would be insufferable." -Nafai, The Ships of Earth
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
This is not correct. You can reference any notes made during the match during any game in that match. You can references notes made outside the match(such as sideboarding notes) in-between games.
Oops. I didn't finish my sentence correctly before going into the next thought. That should have said "ONLY notes you have made during that specific game may be referenced during a game in progress.
I will edit my post to reflect this correction to avoid later confusion.
Oops. I didn't finish my sentence correctly before going into the next thought. That should have said "ONLY notes you have made during that specific game may be referenced during a game in progress.
I will edit my post to reflect this correction to avoid later confusion.
That is still not correct. You may reference any notes made during the match at any point during that match. Including notes from a previous game in that match. The Rules I quoted above do not make a distinction between games in a match nor should they.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"To face death, that's nothing much. But to feel really stupid when you die, well, that would be insufferable." -Nafai, The Ships of Earth
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
When someone probes me, i put my cards down and leave them there so they can keep track, it seems to me the correct thing to do and all my friends do the same.
Why? If they didn't take the time to bring a piece of paper or can't remember what you showed them, why should you give them that extra knowledge?
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Current Decks
EDH: Captain Sisay Tokens
Standard: White Weenie :symw:, UW Control:symwu:
That is still not correct. You may reference any notes made during the match at any point during that match. Including notes from a previous game in that match. The Rules I quoted above do not make a distinction between games in a match nor should they.
Huh. So it seems. That is certainly good to know - it's not how my judge mentor interpreted it, and I've never really questioned it before.
I will make the corrections in previous posts so that I'm not leading even more people astray.
When someone probes me, i put my cards down and leave them there so they can keep track, it seems to me the correct thing to do and all my friends do the same.
You aren't required, or advised, to do that. It's your opponent's job to keep track of the cards they saw.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"If you don't wear your seatbelt, the police will shoot you in the head."
- To my youngest sister when she was 6.
Everyone knows that good luck and good game are such insincere terms that any man who does not connect his right hook with the offender's jaw on the very utterance of such a phrase is no man I would consider as such.
this seems like cheating to me and im pretty sure there is a rule against doing this
If he takes his sweet time doing it, then that's a Warning for Slow Play at the competitive level, or a stern but friendly talking-to at the FNM level.
Rules citation - MTR 2.11: "Players are allowed to take written notes during a match and may refer to those notes while that match is in progress. At the beginning of a match, each player's note sheet must be empty and must remain visible throughout the match... Players may not refer to other notes, including notes from previous matches, during games."
Check out my blog, updated regularly every Monday, and with bonus content whenever I feel like it!
Bands With Awesome: A Commander Blog
There is also a cool article about why this is as it is from wizards here- http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=judge/article/20070322a
Yes, however, you can reference notes made prior to the game as long as a game is not in progress. For example, you can made sideboarding notes before the event and stick them in deckbox to look at between games of the match to help you sideboard out. You cannot, however, look at any such outside notes during a game in progress. ONLY notes you have made during your current match may be referenced in a game in progress.
The penalty for outside notes during a game in progress at the competitive level is severe - a match loss.
Citation - MTR 2.11: "Between games, players may refer to a brief set of notes made before the match. They are not required to reveal these notes to their opponents. These notes must be removed from the play area before the beginning of the next game."
Alas, this article is a bit out of date. In July of 2007, the rules regarding outside notes were changed in the Magic Tournament Rules.
Check out my blog, updated regularly every Monday, and with bonus content whenever I feel like it!
Bands With Awesome: A Commander Blog
This is not correct. You can reference any notes made during the match during any game in that match. You can references notes made outside the match(such as sideboarding notes) in-between games.
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
Let me make one correction to your statement. You can refer to notes made during the current match, not that specific game, for a game in progress.
While that can be faster than having your opponent write everything down you are by no means required to do so.
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
Oops. I didn't finish my sentence correctly before going into the next thought. That should have said "ONLY notes you have made during that specific game may be referenced during a game in progress.
I will edit my post to reflect this correction to avoid later confusion.
Check out my blog, updated regularly every Monday, and with bonus content whenever I feel like it!
Bands With Awesome: A Commander Blog
That is still not correct. You may reference any notes made during the match at any point during that match. Including notes from a previous game in that match. The Rules I quoted above do not make a distinction between games in a match nor should they.
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
Why? If they didn't take the time to bring a piece of paper or can't remember what you showed them, why should you give them that extra knowledge?
EDH: Captain Sisay Tokens
Standard: White Weenie :symw:, UW Control:symwu:
Huh. So it seems. That is certainly good to know - it's not how my judge mentor interpreted it, and I've never really questioned it before.
I will make the corrections in previous posts so that I'm not leading even more people astray.
Check out my blog, updated regularly every Monday, and with bonus content whenever I feel like it!
Bands With Awesome: A Commander Blog
You aren't required, or advised, to do that. It's your opponent's job to keep track of the cards they saw.
- To my youngest sister when she was 6.