Situation: Glissa, the Traitor attacks. Opponent blocks with 4 3/3 Beast tokens.
Attacking player announces he will do 1 damage to 3 of the Beasts during the first strike step, to kill 3 of them, leaving the 4th remaining alone to kill Glissa.
I was under the impression that regardless of Deathtouch, one had to assign lethal damage to a creature before dealing damage to another creature. Granted, Deathtouch makes 1 damage lethal, but the creature's toughness is 3.
What is correct? Thanks.
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Quote from Magikeeper »
Mr. Fu, your leaving of MTGnews' humor forum killed it. KILLLED IT!
Any non-zero amount of combat damage assigned to a creature by a creature with deathtouch is considered lethal damage, which makes this play legal.
702.2b Any nonzero amount of combat damage assigned to a creature by a source with deathtouch is considered to be lethal damage, regardless of that creature's toughness. See rules 510.1c-d.
I guess I had a mental impression of that rule or something. Now my answer is just redundant.
510.1c A blocked creature assigns its combat damage to the creatures blocking it. If no creatures are currently blocking it (if, for example, they were destroyed or removed from combat), it assigns no combat damage. If exactly one creature is blocking it, it assigns all its combat damage to that creature. If two or more creatures are blocking it, it assigns its combat damage to those creatures according to the damage assignment order announced for it. This may allow the blocked creature to divide its combat damage. However, it can’t assign combat damage to a creature that’s blocking it unless each creature that precedes that blocking creature in its order is assigned lethal damage. When checking for assigned lethal damage, take into account damage already marked on the creature and damage from other creatures that’s being assigned during the same combat damage step, but not any abilities or effects that might change the amount of damage that’s actually dealt. An amount of damage that’s greater than a creature’s lethal damage may be assigned to it.
Example: The damage assignment order of an attacking Craw Wurm (a 6/4 creature) is Wall of Wood (a 0/3 creature) then Eager Cadet (a 1/1 creature). Craw Wurm can assign 3 damage to the Wall and 3 damage to the Cadet, 4 damage to the Wall and 2 damage to the Cadet, 5 damage to the Wall and 1 damage to the Cadet, or 6 damage to the Wall.
Example: The damage assignment order of an attacking Craw Wurm (a 6/4 creature) is Wall of Wood (a 0/3 creature) then Eager Cadet (a 1/1 creature). During the declare blockers step, the defending player casts Giant Growth targeting Wall of Wood, which gives it +3/+3 until end of turn. Craw Wurm must assign its 6 damage to the Wall.
Example: The damage assignment order of an attacking Craw Wurm (a 6/4 creature) is Wall of Wood (a 0/3 creature) then Eager Cadet (a 1/1 creature). During the declare blockers step, the defending player casts Mending Hands targeting Wall of Wood, which prevents the next 4 damage that would be dealt to it. Craw Wurm can assign 3 damage to the Wall and 3 damage to the Cadet, 4 damage to the Wall and 2 damage to the Cadet, 5 damage to the Wall and 1 damage to the Cadet, or 6 damage to the Wall.
Example: The damage assignment order of an attacking Enormous Baloth (a 7/7 creature) is Trained Armodon (a 3/3 creature) that already has 2 damage marked on it, then Foriysian Brigade (a 2/4 creature that can block an additional creature), then Silverback Ape (a 5/5 creature). The damage assignment order of an attacking Durkwood Boars (a 4/4 creature) is the same Foriysian Brigade, then Goblin Piker (a 2/1 creature). Among other possibilities, the active player may have the Baloth assign 1 damage to the Armodon, 1 damage to the Brigade, and 5 damage to the Ape, and have the Boars assign 3 damage to the Brigade and 1 damage to the Piker.
As 1 point of deathtouch damage is considered lethal Glissa and any other deathtouch creature may destroy a number of creatures up to its power.
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Thank you, even though this proves me wrong! I'd rather become right than stay wrong, heh...
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Quote from Magikeeper »
Mr. Fu, your leaving of MTGnews' humor forum killed it. KILLLED IT!
They changed this with the M11 rules update (I think it was the only change) so this time a year ago you would have been correct. 702.2b was an addition since the new deathtouch/trample interaction didn't make much sense.
They changed this with the M11 rules update (I think it was the only change) so this time a year ago you would have been correct. 702.2b was an addition since the new deathtouch/trample interaction didn't make much sense.
Actually, even with M10 rules, he still would have been wrong. Though it worked slightly differently, it would have ended up with the same result. M10 rules basically allowed deathtouch to work around ordering blockers and allowed you to deal damage to creatures however you wanted. (Though at the time 1 damage was not considered lethal damage, but it still destroyed the creature, so you're right in that the M11 changes did change the deathtouch/trample interaction.)
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Glissa, the Traitor attacks. Opponent blocks with 4 3/3 Beast tokens.
Attacking player announces he will do 1 damage to 3 of the Beasts during the first strike step, to kill 3 of them, leaving the 4th remaining alone to kill Glissa.
I was under the impression that regardless of Deathtouch, one had to assign lethal damage to a creature before dealing damage to another creature. Granted, Deathtouch makes 1 damage lethal, but the creature's toughness is 3.
What is correct? Thanks.
~In the beginning, there was nothing, which exploded.~
Fu's Cab - Retired! ||| Trade thread dead for now; returning soon!
One day I will alt. art my Jace, The Mind Sculptors into 'Mentok! The Mind Takers!'
Quotes
I guess I had a mental impression of that rule or something. Now my answer is just redundant.
As 1 point of deathtouch damage is considered lethal Glissa and any other deathtouch creature may destroy a number of creatures up to its power.
- H.L Mencken
I Became insane with long Intervals of horrible Sanity
All Religion, my friend is simply evolved out of fraud, fear, greed, imagination and poetry.
- Edgar Allan Poe
The Crafters' Rules Guru
~In the beginning, there was nothing, which exploded.~
Fu's Cab - Retired! ||| Trade thread dead for now; returning soon!
One day I will alt. art my Jace, The Mind Sculptors into 'Mentok! The Mind Takers!'
Quotes
Actually, even with M10 rules, he still would have been wrong. Though it worked slightly differently, it would have ended up with the same result. M10 rules basically allowed deathtouch to work around ordering blockers and allowed you to deal damage to creatures however you wanted. (Though at the time 1 damage was not considered lethal damage, but it still destroyed the creature, so you're right in that the M11 changes did change the deathtouch/trample interaction.)