I was reading some guys story, and it just seemed wrong; so I want to check:
I attack with pristine angel and my opponent casts boomerang on it. In response I cast Mortify targetting my angel to untap it and make the instants fizzle.
--> In reality, I think his angel will be in the GY from mortify since you can legally target it while the untap ability is on the stack. If mortify targetted something else, I think the angel will be in your hand because when it was targetted by the boomerang it was a legal target.
I was reading some guys story, and it just seemed wrong; so I want to check:
I attack with pristine angel and my opponent casts boomerang on it. In response I cast Mortify targetting my angel to untap it and make the instants fizzle.
This works. When you cast the Mortify, the Angel's untap ability triggers. Assuming no further responses, the untap trigger will resolve, then Mortify and Boomerang will be countered as they attempt to resolve.
--> In reality, I think his angel will be in the GY from mortify since you can legally target it while the untap ability is on the stack. If mortify targetted something else, I think the angel will be in your hand because when it was targetted by the boomerang it was a legal target.
Is this correct?
Thanks.
I have no idea what you mean here.
EDIT: I see now! Targets are checked at *two* times: Once, when you attempt to play a spell or ability. At this time, if you can't make legal choices for all required targets, the game state reverses. Then they are checked again when the spell or ability begins to resolve. At that time, if *none* of the spell or ability's targets are legal, it is countered.
In this instance, after the mortify is cast, the stack is:
Two things: The legality of a spells target is checked twice, once when the spell is initially cast and the second time when it comes to resolve. If the spell is no longer pointing at a legal target when it comes to resolve it will then get countered by the game rules "fizzle".
Second if something triggers during or as a result of the activation of an ability/casting of a spell it waits until you have completed all the relevant actions needed to put them on the stack before it fires and puts the triggered ability on the stack. This will mean that the untap ability on pristine angel will be on the stack on top of the mortify and as the stack resolves top -> bottom (last in first out) it will be untapped when mortify comes to resolve so the Pristine angel will have protection at that point and all spells that only target it will be countered.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and start slitting throats.
- H.L Mencken
I Became insane with long Intervals of horrible Sanity
All Religion, my friend is simply evolved out of fraud, fear, greed, imagination and poetry.
- Edgar Allan Poe
Okay, I guess I'm a little lost on protection. I thought that once something was targetted if it later gained protection, it wouldn't matter (unless the effect was to destroy it).
EDIT: Ah I see. I didn't recall/think that protection checked twice.
The story is correct. Boomerang targets the tapped and attacking Pristine Angel. The angels controller casts Mortify, triggering the angel's triggered ability. The triggered ability goes onto the stack. Next, we assume that all players pass priority until the stack is empty. The trigger resolves, untapping the angel. Then Mortify tries to resolve, but is countered by the game for lack of a legal target (due to the target being protected from it). Then Boomerang tries to resolve, but is countered by the game for lack of a legal target (due to the target being protected from it).
The end result is that the angel is an untapped and attacking creature.
Okay, I guess I'm a little lost on protection. I thought that once something was targetted if it later gained protection, it wouldn't matter (unless the effect was to destroy it).
This isn't specific to protection. Consider Advanced Hoverguard. If someone targets it with, say, Terror, and *then* the ability is activated, Terror's target becomes illegal. Since spells and abilities check target legality a second time just as they begin to resolve, the Terror will be countered on resolution. (This is colloquially referred to as "fizzling".)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
DCI Certified Level 1 Judge
Remember, kids: Never fight with Flashback, 'cause Flashback always wins.
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
E: enchanted
B: blocked
T: targetted
I was reading some guys story, and it just seemed wrong; so I want to check:
I attack with pristine angel and my opponent casts boomerang on it. In response I cast Mortify targetting my angel to untap it and make the instants fizzle.
--> In reality, I think his angel will be in the GY from mortify since you can legally target it while the untap ability is on the stack. If mortify targetted something else, I think the angel will be in your hand because when it was targetted by the boomerang it was a legal target.
Is this correct?
Thanks.
My Trade Thread!
This works. When you cast the Mortify, the Angel's untap ability triggers. Assuming no further responses, the untap trigger will resolve, then Mortify and Boomerang will be countered as they attempt to resolve.
I have no idea what you mean here.
EDIT: I see now! Targets are checked at *two* times: Once, when you attempt to play a spell or ability. At this time, if you can't make legal choices for all required targets, the game state reverses. Then they are checked again when the spell or ability begins to resolve. At that time, if *none* of the spell or ability's targets are legal, it is countered.
In this instance, after the mortify is cast, the stack is:
top
Pristine Angel "untap" ability
Mortify (targeting Pristine Angel)
Boomerang (targeting Pristine Angel)
bottom
Assuming no responses, the top object on the stack resolves and you get:
top
Mortify (illegally targeting Pristine Angel)
Boomerang (illegally targeting Pristine Angel)
bottom
Mortify begins to resolve. When it checks its only target, it sees that it is illegal. Since all of its targets are illegal, it is countered.
Then the same happens with Boomerang.
Remember, kids: Never fight with Flashback, 'cause Flashback always wins.
Second if something triggers during or as a result of the activation of an ability/casting of a spell it waits until you have completed all the relevant actions needed to put them on the stack before it fires and puts the triggered ability on the stack. This will mean that the untap ability on pristine angel will be on the stack on top of the mortify and as the stack resolves top -> bottom (last in first out) it will be untapped when mortify comes to resolve so the Pristine angel will have protection at that point and all spells that only target it will be countered.
- H.L Mencken
I Became insane with long Intervals of horrible Sanity
All Religion, my friend is simply evolved out of fraud, fear, greed, imagination and poetry.
- Edgar Allan Poe
The Crafters' Rules Guru
EDIT: Ah I see. I didn't recall/think that protection checked twice.
Thanks.
My Trade Thread!
The end result is that the angel is an untapped and attacking creature.
This isn't specific to protection. Consider Advanced Hoverguard. If someone targets it with, say, Terror, and *then* the ability is activated, Terror's target becomes illegal. Since spells and abilities check target legality a second time just as they begin to resolve, the Terror will be countered on resolution. (This is colloquially referred to as "fizzling".)
Remember, kids: Never fight with Flashback, 'cause Flashback always wins.