First off hiya! Posted on many forums but my first post here and hoping to get a solid answer on this issue.
I have a few questions that pretty much all roll into one big question which is: If I have a Mother of Runes on the battlefield and I cast/play Planar Guide then my opponent casts Counterspell against Planar Guide then I activate Mother of Runes ability giving Planar Guide protection from blue will this prevent Planar Guide from being countered?
According to rule 110.1 "A card or token becomes a permanent as it enters the battlefield"
However, according to rule 111.1 "A spell is a card on the stack. As the first step of being cast (see rule 601, “Casting Spells”), the
card becomes a spell and is moved to the top of the stack from the zone it was in, which is usually
its owner’s hand. (See rule 405, “Stack.”) A spell remains on the stack as a spell until it resolves
(see rule 608, “Resolving Spells and Abilities”), is countered (see rule 701.5), or otherwise leaves
the stack."
So what I am trying to figure out from all of this is......If I play Planar Guide does the creature first on onto the stack then need to resolve through the stack in order to "enter the battlefield" thus not allowing him to recieve Mother of Runes activated ability to give him protection from blue thus allowing Planar Guide to be countered......or does Planar Guide simultaniously "enter the battlefield" as a permanent and go on "the stack" thus allowing Mother of Runes activated ability to give Planar Guide protection from blue thus negating the Counter Spell after resolve.
The 2 rules seem very vauge. After reading the rules over and over many times it would seem to me that a creature, enchantment, land, artifact or planeswalker (all permantents) would, according to the official rules, simultaniously enter the battlefield and go on the stack at the same time thus immediatly allowing an activated ability a permanent I control to be able to affect the newly laid permanent.
Any insight into this issue would be much appreciated.
Also, if this could get moved to the correct forum if this is the wrong place for this thread that would be great.
You can't target Planar Guide with Mother of Runes while he's on the stack. He is indeed a creature card, but as far as the rules are concerned, while he's on the stack, he's a spell, not yet a creature. In short, yes, he will be countered. You can't use Mother of Runes ability to target him, and so you should untap the land you used to pay for the Mother's ability.
I have a few questions that pretty much all roll into one big question which is: If I have a Mother of Runes on the battlefield and I cast/play Planar Guide then my opponent casts Counterspell against Planar Guide then I activate Mother of Runes ability giving Planar Guide protection from blue will this prevent Planar Guide from being countered?
Mother of Rune's ability targets creatures, which means it can only target permanents. A spell on the stack is not a permanent.
However, according to rule 111.1 "A spell is a card on the stack. As the first step of being cast (see rule 601, “Casting Spells”), the
card becomes a spell and is moved to the top of the stack from the zone it was in, which is usually
its owner’s hand. (See rule 405, “Stack.”) A spell remains on the stack as a spell until it resolves
(see rule 608, “Resolving Spells and Abilities”), is countered (see rule 701.5), or otherwise leaves
the stack."
Spells do not resolve immediately after being placed on the stack. The stack is a queue where spells wait to resolve and is a mechanic used to give players a chance to respond. There is never a point in time where a player has priority to take actions and the creature is in both zones.
In addition protection only functions on the battlefield.
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You can't target Planar Guide with Mother of Runes while he's on the stack. He is indeed a creature card, but as far as the rules are concerned, while he's on the stack, he's a spell, not yet a creature. In short, yes, he will be countered. You can't use Mother of Runes ability to target him, and so you should untap the land you used to pay for the Mother's ability.
Hello! This does sound correct, however in the rules it does not specify that a permanent enters tha battlefield from the stack it simply states that a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the batlefield. So I guess I would like to know where in the rules it actually states that a permanent has to goes through the stack before it enters the battlefield. The 2 rules seem to contradict each other a bit. I understand that all cards are spells but the hang up I am having is where it says a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the battlefield then never states how it gets there.
Not trying to say your wrong, I just want to know the 100% correct answer.
it says a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the battlefield then never states how it gets there.
302.1. A player who has priority may cast a creature card from his or her hand during a main phase of his or her turn when the stack is empty. Casting a creature as a spell uses the stack.
302.2. When a creature spell resolves, its controller puts it onto the battlefield under his or her control.
Glossary:
Permanent = A card or token on the battlefield.
Hello! This does sound correct, however in the rules it does not specify that a permanent enters tha battlefield from the stack it simply states that a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the batlefield. So I guess I would like to know where in the rules it actually states that a permanent has to goes through the stack before it enters the battlefield. The 2 rules seem to contradict each other a bit. I understand that all cards are spells but the hang up I am having is where it says a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the battlefield then never states how it gets there.
Not trying to say your wrong, I just want to know the 100% correct answer.
Maybe this rule will help:
608. Resolving Spells and Abilities
608.3. If the object that's resolving is a permanent spell, its resolution involves a single step (unless it's an Aura). The spell card becomes a permanent and is put onto the battlefield under the control of the spell's controller.
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Please use card tags when you're asking a question about specific cards: [c]Serra Angel[/c] -> Serra Angel.
302.1. A player who has priority may cast a creature card from his or her hand during a main phase of his or her turn when the stack is empty. Casting a creature as a spell uses the stack.
302.2. When a creature spell resolves, its controller puts it onto the battlefield under his or her control.
BAAAM, I love you dude. Been looking for this for like last 4 hours. Thank a bunch!!
I don't think this is correct. Case in point: Seht's Tiger and Runed Halo give you protection, and players aren't considered to be on the battlefield.
In the context of the question that was asked, it was as correct as it needed to be, since the question was whether protection could be given to a spell on the stack. The fact that protection can also be given to a player has absolutely no relevance to that question.
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Please use card tags when you're asking a question about specific cards: [c]Serra Angel[/c] -> Serra Angel.
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First off hiya! Posted on many forums but my first post here and hoping to get a solid answer on this issue.
I have a few questions that pretty much all roll into one big question which is: If I have a Mother of Runes on the battlefield and I cast/play Planar Guide then my opponent casts Counterspell against Planar Guide then I activate Mother of Runes ability giving Planar Guide protection from blue will this prevent Planar Guide from being countered?
According to rule 110.1 "A card or token becomes a permanent as it enters the battlefield"
However, according to rule 111.1 "A spell is a card on the stack. As the first step of being cast (see rule 601, “Casting Spells”), the
card becomes a spell and is moved to the top of the stack from the zone it was in, which is usually
its owner’s hand. (See rule 405, “Stack.”) A spell remains on the stack as a spell until it resolves
(see rule 608, “Resolving Spells and Abilities”), is countered (see rule 701.5), or otherwise leaves
the stack."
So what I am trying to figure out from all of this is......If I play Planar Guide does the creature first on onto the stack then need to resolve through the stack in order to "enter the battlefield" thus not allowing him to recieve Mother of Runes activated ability to give him protection from blue thus allowing Planar Guide to be countered......or does Planar Guide simultaniously "enter the battlefield" as a permanent and go on "the stack" thus allowing Mother of Runes activated ability to give Planar Guide protection from blue thus negating the Counter Spell after resolve.
The 2 rules seem very vauge. After reading the rules over and over many times it would seem to me that a creature, enchantment, land, artifact or planeswalker (all permantents) would, according to the official rules, simultaniously enter the battlefield and go on the stack at the same time thus immediatly allowing an activated ability a permanent I control to be able to affect the newly laid permanent.
Any insight into this issue would be much appreciated.
Also, if this could get moved to the correct forum if this is the wrong place for this thread that would be great.
Sorry ahead of time for spelling!
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Can't be countered would be made redundant by Protection from coloured spells if the protection applied while he was on the stack.
Mother of Rune's ability targets creatures, which means it can only target permanents. A spell on the stack is not a permanent.
Spells do not resolve immediately after being placed on the stack. The stack is a queue where spells wait to resolve and is a mechanic used to give players a chance to respond. There is never a point in time where a player has priority to take actions and the creature is in both zones.
In addition protection only functions on the battlefield.
Ever wanted to know what guidelines Judges use to make rulings? Find out at the DCI Document Center.
You can also find the latest Comprehensive Rules here.
Hello! This does sound correct, however in the rules it does not specify that a permanent enters tha battlefield from the stack it simply states that a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the batlefield. So I guess I would like to know where in the rules it actually states that a permanent has to goes through the stack before it enters the battlefield. The 2 rules seem to contradict each other a bit. I understand that all cards are spells but the hang up I am having is where it says a permanent becomes a permanent when it enters the battlefield then never states how it gets there.
Not trying to say your wrong, I just want to know the 100% correct answer.
302.1. A player who has priority may cast a creature card from his or her hand during a main phase of his or her turn when the stack is empty. Casting a creature as a spell uses the stack.
302.2. When a creature spell resolves, its controller puts it onto the battlefield under his or her control.
Glossary:
Permanent = A card or token on the battlefield.
Maybe this rule will help:
Please use card tags when you're asking a question about specific cards: [c]Serra Angel[/c] -> Serra Angel.
BAAAM, I love you dude. Been looking for this for like last 4 hours. Thank a bunch!!
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In the context of the question that was asked, it was as correct as it needed to be, since the question was whether protection could be given to a spell on the stack. The fact that protection can also be given to a player has absolutely no relevance to that question.
Please use card tags when you're asking a question about specific cards: [c]Serra Angel[/c] -> Serra Angel.