Notion Thief

  • #1
    If enemy casts Brainstorm, then I flash in Notion Thief to respond, then after Notion Thief resolves on the field...they respond Darkblast/remove Notion Thief, does Notion Thief make them skip their draw?

    Same scenario. But without Darkblast involved. Does Notion Thief make them whiff all 3 draws and then you only draw 1? Does Brainstorm still force them to place 2 cards from their hand on top of their deck?

    Is Notion Thief's ability a trigger? So it triggers x number of times equal to x times the number of cards opponent would draw? Or is it a static ability?
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  • #2
    Notion Thief has a static replacement effect that does not use the stack. If they kill the Thief before the draw spell resolves, it won't be in play for its replacement effect to apply, so they will get to draw.

    If it is still in play, all three of their draws will be replaced, but the rest of the card will be unchanged, so you will draw three and then they will put two cards back on top.
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  • #3
    Quote from gathraawn
    Notion Thief has a static replacement effect that does not use the stack. If they kill the Thief before the draw spell resolves, it won't be in play for its replacement effect to apply, so they will get to draw.

    If it is still in play, all three of their draws will be replaced, but the rest of the card will be unchanged, so you will draw three and then they will put two cards back on top.

    Hold on. So it blanks all 3 draws and you draw 3 cards? Some people told me that it was only one...
    And that last part is true too? They have to place 2 back on top?

    If that's the case, definitely gonna pick some up. Cool

    Also, what's the deal with the ruling on two Notion Thieves on both sides of the field? Why don't the replacement effects go on forever?

    And what happens if you control more than 1 Notion Thief on the field? Anything noteworthy?
    Quote from Shmanka
    SWAMP IN SIDEBOARD IS TECH!

    Quote from Azure
    Don't tell me you wouldn't tap that...

    Quote from ilovesaprolings
    maybe a sex tape of avacyn and griselbrand

    Quote from Maxinger87
    people really live out their dark side on these forums.

    Quote from JPoJohnson
    Actually... I think he really covered everything with this argument.

    Quote from necrogenesis
    I have heard vague rumors of a moustache-dispensing vending machine in a distant laundromat, across the street from a tattoo parlor. However, this information is shaky, and time is of the essence.

  • #4
    The Thief replaces all draw that an opponent would get (except for the one they normally get during their draw step). If I cast a Concentrate and you cast the Thief in response, the Thief will replace all three of the draws, so you'll draw three cards and I'll draw nothing.

    If I cast a Brainstorm instead, then you would draw three cards, then I would put two cards from my hand on top of my library (if I only have one card, then that card is put on top).

    A replacement effect can only replace an event once. So if we both have Thieves and I would draw a card, your Thief replaces that draw with you drawing, then my Thief replaces that draw with me drawing. Since your Thief has already applied to that draw, it doesn't get a chance to apply again, so we'll draw cards like normal.

    Nothing special happens if a player controls two or more Thieves. They both have replacement effects, so only one will get to apply to the draw. The other will do nothing.
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  • #5
    Quote from Titus0
    Why don't the replacement effects go on forever?
    A given replacement effect can only replace an event once.

    EVENT: Player A is going to draw an extra card
    REPLACEMENT: Notion Thief 1
    REPLACEMENT: Notion Thief 2

    NT1 replaces the event. Then, unless NT1 and NT2 are controlled by the same player, NT2's replacement is still valid, so NT2 replaces the event. The draw from NT2's controller is still the same event (despite the draw going to a different player), so NT1 can't replace it.

    Quote from Titus0
    And what happens if you control more than 1 Notion Thief on the field? Anything noteworthy?
    Your first thief replaces the event. Since you are not your own opponent (not matter how poorly you play), your second thief's replacement effect is invalidated, and does nothing.

    Note that even if NT didn't say "opponent", you would still only draw 1 card per draw replaced. NT1 would replace the draw, and NT2 would overwrite NT1.
  • #6
    As long as you control a Notion Thief when the brainstorm resolves and they don't, then yes. You will draw 3 and your opponent will put 2 cards back on the top of their library.

    As for both players having a Notion Thief: each ability can only modify an event once. Using the brainstorm example: Yours would modify it for you to draw 3, but then their's will modify it so they draw 3. The end result is that the person who would originally draw the card does.

    Having 2 Thieves on your side of the field has the same effect as having only 1.
  • #7
    How does Notion Thief interact with an opponent's Brainstorm/draw, when they intend to use Dredge instead?

    Like, opponent casts Brainstorm, then in response I drop Notion Thief. How does this interact with Dredge and say, Darkblast? Since opponent is control of Brainstorm, he can choose to replace his first? By replacing the first draw with Dredge 3, recurs Darkblast to hand (too bad he can't cast Darkblast right here to kill Thief. haha), then the next two draws, if not replaced by something, will be replaced by Notion Thief's effect? How do you know who gets to replace first?
    Quote from Shmanka
    SWAMP IN SIDEBOARD IS TECH!

    Quote from Azure
    Don't tell me you wouldn't tap that...

    Quote from ilovesaprolings
    maybe a sex tape of avacyn and griselbrand

    Quote from Maxinger87
    people really live out their dark side on these forums.

    Quote from JPoJohnson
    Actually... I think he really covered everything with this argument.

    Quote from necrogenesis
    I have heard vague rumors of a moustache-dispensing vending machine in a distant laundromat, across the street from a tattoo parlor. However, this information is shaky, and time is of the essence.

  • #8
    Quote from Titus0
    How does Notion Thief interact with an opponent's Brainstorm/draw, when they intend to use Dredge instead?

    Like, opponent casts Brainstorm, then in response I drop Notion Thief. How does this interact with Dredge and say, Darkblast? Since opponent is control of Brainstorm, he can choose to replace his first? By replacing the first draw with Dredge 3, recurs Darkblast to hand (too bad he can't cast Darkblast right here to kill Thief. haha), then the next two draws, if not replaced by something, will be replaced by Notion Thief's effect? How do you know who gets to replace first?


    The affected player, or the controller (or owner if it has no controller) of the affected permanent gets to decide which replacement effect to apply first.

    Your opponent can choose to replace the draws with dredging first. Since there will no longer be a draw event, the Notion Thief's replacement effect simply won't apply.
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  • #9
    What happens if my opponent and i both have a notion thief in play and i cast think twice ?
  • #10
    Quote from Solune
    What happens if my opponent and i both have a notion thief in play and i cast think twice ?

    You just draw normally. They cancel each other out, basically.

    You cast think twice. Opponent's Thief would try to replace think twice, and now, he's about to draw, then your thief replaces his draw with you drawing a card.

    Basically cancels out, as replacement effects can't apply more than once.
    Quote from Shmanka
    SWAMP IN SIDEBOARD IS TECH!

    Quote from Azure
    Don't tell me you wouldn't tap that...

    Quote from ilovesaprolings
    maybe a sex tape of avacyn and griselbrand

    Quote from Maxinger87
    people really live out their dark side on these forums.

    Quote from JPoJohnson
    Actually... I think he really covered everything with this argument.

    Quote from necrogenesis
    I have heard vague rumors of a moustache-dispensing vending machine in a distant laundromat, across the street from a tattoo parlor. However, this information is shaky, and time is of the essence.

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