2. When I have both Gratuitous VIolence and the Hellbent ability from Anthem of Rakdos, do they stack? For instance I ping someone for 1 which is doubled to 2, does it double again to 4?
Thanks!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
He is the only one who sees the patterns in the overlapping maps and conflicting reports.
1) Yes. Note that Anthem of Rakdos says that the "source" deals additional damage and Gratuitous Violence says the creature deals double damage so Pain Magnification will see it as coming from the same source.
2) Yes. They are both replacement effects trying to replace the same event. For example, let's say you activate Prodigal Pyromancer targeting your opponent. Since your opponent is the affected player, they can choose which to apply first. In this case, they are the same, so it doesn't really matter which is applied first. So, Anthem applies to double the damage to 2 damage and then GV applies to double it again to 4.
1) Yes. The doubling effects you mentioned are replacement effects, so they modify what event actually happens, before that event happens. The event that happens is then the modified event, which has the damage source deal twice as much damage. If that modified damage is 3 or more, PM triggers.
2) Yes, those effects are cummulative even with other instances of the same card. Replacement effects are applied one after the other to the event. After one effect has been applied, another one is chosen from among all then (still or now) applicable effects. You continue this until no more effects are applicable. Then the modified event happens. In the case of damage doubling, the modified event of one doubling effect is still dealing damage, so other effects of that kind still apply, doubling the double. So you go from double to quadruple to 8x to 16x etc.
I'm assuming that Wound Reflection would also count as a new and separate source since it is dealing the damage to an opponent.
Speaking of Prodigal Pyromancer I do have another question about pingers and the stack.
If I tap my Goblin Sharpshooter to deal lethal damage and then my opponents responds by killing Goblin Sharpshooter does the original tapping of still trigger? And if so I assume the replacement effects wouldn't be interrupted.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
He is the only one who sees the patterns in the overlapping maps and conflicting reports.
You are correct that Wound Reflection is a new source, but it doesn't deal damage (it makes players lose life) so it doesn't interact with Pain Magnification in any way.
If you activate Goblin Sharpshooter to deal damage to a target, that will still resolve no matter what happens to Goblin Sharpshooter. It will deal 1(or 2 or 4) damage as expected. However, it won't untap (if you killed a creature with it) since it is no longer on the battlefield to untap so you won't be able to continue using its ability since it is dead.
Speaking of Prodigal Pyromancer I do have another question about pingers and the stack.
If I tap my Goblin Sharpshooter to deal lethal damage and then my opponents responds by killing Goblin Sharpshooter does the original tapping of still trigger? And if so I assume the replacement effects wouldn't be interrupted.
The only triggered ability on Goblin Sharpshooter is "Whenever a creature dies, untap Goblin Sharpshooter.", and that can't trigger (or do anything) if Goblin Sharpshooter is no longer on the battlefield The activated ability "T: Goblin Sharpshooter deals 1 damage to target creature or player." will resolve just fine regardless of whether Goblin Sharpshooter is still on the battlefield.
112.7a Once activated or triggered, an ability exists on the stack independently of its source.
Destruction or removal of the source after that time won’t affect the ability. Note that some
abilities cause a source to do something (for example, “Prodigal Pyromancer deals 1 damage to
target creature or player”) rather than the ability doing anything directly. In these cases, any
activated or triggered ability that references information about the source because the effect
needs to be divided checks that information when the ability is put onto the stack. Otherwise, it
will check that information when it resolves. In both instances, if the source is no longer in the
zone it’s expected to be in at that time, its last known information is used. The source can still
perform the action even though it no longer exists.
The replacement effect of Anthem of Rakdos or Gratuitous Violence will still recognize the source of damage as a creature you control.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Why bother with mere rulings when so many answers can be found in the Rules?
I'm assuming that Wound Reflection would also count as a new and separate source since it is dealing the damage to an opponent.
Speaking of Prodigal Pyromancer I do have another question about pingers and the stack.
If I tap my Goblin Sharpshooter to deal lethal damage and then my opponents responds by killing Goblin Sharpshooter does the original tapping of still trigger? And if so I assume the replacement effects wouldn't be interrupted.
Goblin Sharpshooter's last ability will still get to resolve even if Goblin Sharpshooter leaves the battlefield in the meantime, since the ability, "[o]nce activated", "exists ... independently" of Goblin Sharpshooter (C.R. 112.7a, 608.2g), and even so, Goblin Sharpshooter would still be a "creature" and a "source" for the purpose of Gratuitous Violence and Anthem of Rakdos, as well as Pain Magnification provided the damage reaches 3 or greater due to replacement effects.
Note, however, that Wound Reflection doesn't deal damage, but only causes loss of life, so it won't count as a "source of damage" if its ability resolves.
1. For Pain Magnification if I deal 2 damage to a player which is then doubled by either Anthem of Rakdos or Gratuitous Violence to become 4 damage will it trigger as being 3+ damage from a single source?
2. When I have both Gratuitous VIolence and the Hellbent ability from Anthem of Rakdos, do they stack? For instance I ping someone for 1 which is doubled to 2, does it double again to 4?
Thanks!
He is the only one who sees the patterns in the overlapping maps and conflicting reports.
2) Yes. They are both replacement effects trying to replace the same event. For example, let's say you activate Prodigal Pyromancer targeting your opponent. Since your opponent is the affected player, they can choose which to apply first. In this case, they are the same, so it doesn't really matter which is applied first. So, Anthem applies to double the damage to 2 damage and then GV applies to double it again to 4.
2) Yes, those effects are cummulative even with other instances of the same card. Replacement effects are applied one after the other to the event. After one effect has been applied, another one is chosen from among all then (still or now) applicable effects. You continue this until no more effects are applicable. Then the modified event happens. In the case of damage doubling, the modified event of one doubling effect is still dealing damage, so other effects of that kind still apply, doubling the double. So you go from double to quadruple to 8x to 16x etc.
Former Rules Advisor
"Everything's better with pirates." - Lodge
(The Gamers: Dorkness Rising)
"Any sufficiently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science."
(Girl Genius - Fairy Tale Theater Break - Cinderella, end of volume 8)
Speaking of Prodigal Pyromancer I do have another question about pingers and the stack.
If I tap my Goblin Sharpshooter to deal lethal damage and then my opponents responds by killing Goblin Sharpshooter does the original tapping of still trigger? And if so I assume the replacement effects wouldn't be interrupted.
He is the only one who sees the patterns in the overlapping maps and conflicting reports.
If you activate Goblin Sharpshooter to deal damage to a target, that will still resolve no matter what happens to Goblin Sharpshooter. It will deal 1(or 2 or 4) damage as expected. However, it won't untap (if you killed a creature with it) since it is no longer on the battlefield to untap so you won't be able to continue using its ability since it is dead.
Wound Reflection doesn't deal damage.
The only triggered ability on Goblin Sharpshooter is "Whenever a creature dies, untap Goblin Sharpshooter.", and that can't trigger (or do anything) if Goblin Sharpshooter is no longer on the battlefield The activated ability "T: Goblin Sharpshooter deals 1 damage to target creature or player." will resolve just fine regardless of whether Goblin Sharpshooter is still on the battlefield.
The replacement effect of Anthem of Rakdos or Gratuitous Violence will still recognize the source of damage as a creature you control.
Goblin Sharpshooter's last ability will still get to resolve even if Goblin Sharpshooter leaves the battlefield in the meantime, since the ability, "[o]nce activated", "exists ... independently" of Goblin Sharpshooter (C.R. 112.7a, 608.2g), and even so, Goblin Sharpshooter would still be a "creature" and a "source" for the purpose of Gratuitous Violence and Anthem of Rakdos, as well as Pain Magnification provided the damage reaches 3 or greater due to replacement effects.
Note, however, that Wound Reflection doesn't deal damage, but only causes loss of life, so it won't count as a "source of damage" if its ability resolves.
EDIT (Feb. 15, 2018): Correctness edit.
EDIT (Sep. 29, 2018): Correct quotation.