Before damage - I ping Sengir Vampire with Vithian Stinger.
Butcher of Malakir forces me to sac Vithian Stinger.
What order do those need to happen in IF I don't want Sengir Vampire to get a counter… or is that even possible? A friend and I were playing the Sorin vs Tibalt Duel Deck at lunch and were not sure about how these needed to stack in this scenario.
In the situation you describe, Sengir Vampire won't get a counter. First, the triggered ability of Ashmouth Hound and the activated ability of Vithian Stinger each deal 1 damage to Sengir Vampire in the declare blockers step. When you move to the combat damage step, Sengir Vampire will deal 4 damage to your Hound and the Hound will deal 2 damage to the vampire. When SBAs are checked just after that, they will see that both the Sengir and the Hound have lethal damage marked on them, and which will kill each creature. Sengir dying triggers Butcher, and when that ability resolves, you will have to sacrifice a creature.
I don't see a creature dying between step 4 and 5, so now sure how you reached step 5 at all. Before damage, Sengir Vampire has one damage marked on it from Ashmouth's ability, then you add 1 more damage from Vithian Stinger. That leaves a 4/4 with 2 damage marked on it, and no creatures have died.
One Ashmouth Hound and Sengir Vampire deal damage to each other, both die at the same moment from lethal damage (this triggers Sengir Vampire's ability because it died at the same moment as the Hound, though that trigger is irrelevant since it can't add a counter to a creature no longer on the battlefield). This triggers Butcher, and you sacrifice Stinger. Stinger's death doesn't trigger Sengir, because it's already been dead for a while now.
Hope this makes sense!
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Alright so you changed your post after I gave my earlier answer and now I see the confusion.
You are missing the fact that not all of these things are all triggering and happening at once. The Combat Phase is divided into different steps, and before you can move to the next step, each player has to pass priority with an empty stack. Before your Step 4 and 5, several things happen.
First, during Step 4 you are in the Declare Blockers Step. Before any Combat Damage can be dealt, you need to move to the Combat Damage Step. As a turn Based action, the first thing that happens during the Combat Damage Step is that Combat Damage is assigned. As I noted above, Sengir Deals 4 damage to your Hound and the Hound deals 2 damage to the Sengir. After that, State Based Actions will see each creature has been dealt lethal damage, and both creatures die. This action does not use the stack, and both creatures go to their owner's graveyards simultaneously. Sengir will not recieve any counters because it will already be dead.
It should also be noted that in Step 3, it is somewhat misleading to say the Hound is dealing "additional" damage. This 1 point of damage is the result of a triggered ability (albeit one that will only trigger during the Combat Phase). That damage is still considered non-combat damage and is marked on the Sengir Vampire before any Combat Damage is assigned or determined.
...This triggers Butcher, and you sacrifice Stinger. Stinger's death doesn't trigger Sengir, because it's already been dead for a while now.
Additionally, Sengir Vampire only triggers from a creature dying that the Sengir dealt damage to that turn. In the scenario given, the Stinger was never dealt damage by the Sengir, so it wouldn't trigger anyway.
My opponent has Sengir Vampire and Butcher of Malakir.
What order do those need to happen in IF I don't want Sengir Vampire to get a counter… or is that even possible? A friend and I were playing the Sorin vs Tibalt Duel Deck at lunch and were not sure about how these needed to stack in this scenario.
One Ashmouth Hound and Sengir Vampire deal damage to each other, both die at the same moment from lethal damage (this triggers Sengir Vampire's ability because it died at the same moment as the Hound, though that trigger is irrelevant since it can't add a counter to a creature no longer on the battlefield). This triggers Butcher, and you sacrifice Stinger. Stinger's death doesn't trigger Sengir, because it's already been dead for a while now.
Hope this makes sense!
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"Abstract concepts of perfect judging run headlong into the realities of how people play the game." - Toby Elliott (papa_funk)
My Type 4 Stack -- DCI Documents -- Comp Rules
You are missing the fact that not all of these things are all triggering and happening at once. The Combat Phase is divided into different steps, and before you can move to the next step, each player has to pass priority with an empty stack. Before your Step 4 and 5, several things happen.
First, during Step 4 you are in the Declare Blockers Step. Before any Combat Damage can be dealt, you need to move to the Combat Damage Step. As a turn Based action, the first thing that happens during the Combat Damage Step is that Combat Damage is assigned. As I noted above, Sengir Deals 4 damage to your Hound and the Hound deals 2 damage to the Sengir. After that, State Based Actions will see each creature has been dealt lethal damage, and both creatures die. This action does not use the stack, and both creatures go to their owner's graveyards simultaneously. Sengir will not recieve any counters because it will already be dead.
It should also be noted that in Step 3, it is somewhat misleading to say the Hound is dealing "additional" damage. This 1 point of damage is the result of a triggered ability (albeit one that will only trigger during the Combat Phase). That damage is still considered non-combat damage and is marked on the Sengir Vampire before any Combat Damage is assigned or determined.
Additionally, Sengir Vampire only triggers from a creature dying that the Sengir dealt damage to that turn. In the scenario given, the Stinger was never dealt damage by the Sengir, so it wouldn't trigger anyway.