If you take a foreign language shimmering grotto and just say it's a cavern of souls, your opponent might not look too closely and they look very similar.
Disclaimer: Obviously you should never actually do this.
It's the "poor man's Cavern" the same way that wood is the "poor man's gold."
You lose a mana and it can be countered. Honestly, a basic land is the best Cavern replacement in most cases (obv. Ancient Zig is better in a nearly all creature deck).
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
On the subject of Cavern Of Souls, can "artifact creature" be claimed as the creature type?
No a "Creature type" refers to any subtype of creature. Artifact and Creature are both types. It's like in biology you have Kingdoms and phylum and families. In Type Artifact you have certain subtypes (Equipment, Fortification, for example) and in Type Creature you have certain subtypes (humans, elves, goblins, ect). When you choose a Creature Type, your choice HAS to be from a legal sub-type of a creature. Tragically this means you can't name "Bunnies"
A year ago, before the shocklands rotated into standard, I was able to utilize Shimmering Groto pretty well in my Grixis deck as a one of. I imagine it might pop up in some other future control list if the Theros duals really suck.
On point, though, the main reason to play Cavern IMHO is for the "cant be countered" clause, so its nothing like Cavern.
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"Until you have lived as a statue, do not talk to me of pigeons."
—Karn, silver golem
If you take a foreign language shimmering grotto and just say it's a cavern of souls, your opponent might not look too closely and they look very similar.
Disclaimer: Obviously you should never actually do this.
I played with Korean Grottos in a grixis deck once right after Cavern came out.
I was asked multiple times, once by a judge, what I was naming when it came into play. The first time it happened it took me quite a while to figure out what they were talking about, until they asked again "what is your cavern naming" that I realized they thought I had played a cavern.
I played with Korean Grottos in a grixis deck once right after Cavern came out.
I was asked multiple times, once by a judge, what I was naming when it came into play. The first time it happened it took me quite a while to figure out what they were talking about, until they asked again "what is your cavern naming" that I realized they thought I had played a cavern.
Lol - nice!
Yeah, it's never happened to me but sometimes when I'm flipping through random cards I have to do a double take if I pass a Shimmering Grotto.
I've never seen a more lopsided poll. Currently:
1 yes
1 maybe
44 no
So true. I didn't even know Ancient Ziggeraut even existed. It looks like no card can match the power of Cavern of Souls. Personally I bought Shimmering Grotto only due to the Cavern of Souls about to get removed from the standard rotation; however, I am considering getting Cavern just for MTGO since I think its going to be a long term staple.
I am considering getting Cavern just for MTGO since I think its going to be a long term staple.
Any opinions???
I think so too. It's already played in Legacy Goblins and fits in so many other decks as well. As soon as we get some good tribal decks in Modern, I think Cavern will be a solid staple.
That doesn't even begin to figure in the demand for EDH.
"Tribal" themed EDH decks exist, and tribal support is often too good to ignore in the format. If nothing else, Cavern makes your general uncounterable.
Disclaimer: Obviously you should never actually do this.
You lose a mana and it can be countered. Honestly, a basic land is the best Cavern replacement in most cases (obv. Ancient Zig is better in a nearly all creature deck).
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Niv-Mizzet Ramp 'n' Wheel
Godo: Strap him up and turn him sideways!
https://fieldmarshalshandbook.wordpress.com/
RUGLegacy Lands.dec
RUGBLegacy Lands.dec
RGLegacy Lands.dec
WUBRG EDH Lands.dec
UBR EDH Artificer Prodigy
B EDH Relentless Rats
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
-Retired Decks-
UBLazav, Dimir Mastermind (Competitive, UB Voltron/Control)UB
"Knowledge is such a burden. Release it. Release all your fears to me."
—Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
Artifact and Creature are types. Creature types are subtypes.
No a "Creature type" refers to any subtype of creature. Artifact and Creature are both types. It's like in biology you have Kingdoms and phylum and families. In Type Artifact you have certain subtypes (Equipment, Fortification, for example) and in Type Creature you have certain subtypes (humans, elves, goblins, ect). When you choose a Creature Type, your choice HAS to be from a legal sub-type of a creature. Tragically this means you can't name "Bunnies"
Yes!
Modern Junk Primer
Legacy ANT Primer
L1 Judge
I can see running one or two in a constructed deck if my mana base is very demanding, and like 4-5 colours?
On point, though, the main reason to play Cavern IMHO is for the "cant be countered" clause, so its nothing like Cavern.
—Karn, silver golem
1 yes
1 maybe
44 no
I played with Korean Grottos in a grixis deck once right after Cavern came out.
I was asked multiple times, once by a judge, what I was naming when it came into play. The first time it happened it took me quite a while to figure out what they were talking about, until they asked again "what is your cavern naming" that I realized they thought I had played a cavern.
Lol - nice!
Yeah, it's never happened to me but sometimes when I'm flipping through random cards I have to do a double take if I pass a Shimmering Grotto.
So true. I didn't even know Ancient Ziggeraut even existed. It looks like no card can match the power of Cavern of Souls. Personally I bought Shimmering Grotto only due to the Cavern of Souls about to get removed from the standard rotation; however, I am considering getting Cavern just for MTGO since I think its going to be a long term staple.
Any opinions???
Evolving wilds or teramorphic expanse is probably a better choice.
EDIT: Oops, I thought you were talking about Grotto.
I think so too. It's already played in Legacy Goblins and fits in so many other decks as well. As soon as we get some good tribal decks in Modern, I think Cavern will be a solid staple.
"Tribal" themed EDH decks exist, and tribal support is often too good to ignore in the format. If nothing else, Cavern makes your general uncounterable.
Losing your second turn to a land is much better than being one turn behind most of the game.