Three reasons why I do not play against total strangers.
1. There might be someone who might harass me.
2. There might be someone who easily feels that they get harassed.
3. Why pay to play at a LGS when I could play at home for free?
I'd rather not play the game at all than play with someone whom I do not personally know.
Three reasons why I do not play against total strangers.
1. There might be someone who might harass me.
2. There might be someone who easily feels that they get harassed.
3. Why pay to play at a LGS when I could play at home for free?
I'd rather not play the game at all than play with someone whom I do not personally know.
Please tell me that you work Human Resources for the government so I can win a bet. Thank you.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Just looked into that situation that happened to Christine. I'm not even going to step into that giant mess fueled by cultural taboos brought about by historical events going back to the 13 colonies. And technically if we want to go further back probably the reformation and Emperor Constantine. Needless to say, the MtG youtube community never stops surprising me in their complete lack of tact and understanding when it comes to cultural and political ramifications. Well, unless that happens to be their black and white view of SJW vs everyone else or something.
Please keep all discussion of the Sprankle incident into the thread designated for it. Do note that blanket use of "SJW" is likely to be infracted
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My Moderator Helpdesk
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Maybe the game should go back to its 2005 roots. Rules, set structure, released products, etc. Oh they've tried but they can't bottle that same lightning twice that Ravnica had. Return to Ravnica tried to do that but it lacked many of the things in the set structure and rules of its era much better. Like when was the last time Birds of Paradise was reprinted for standard play? Lightning Bolt? Counterspell? Stone Rain? All these and many more classics considered "too strong for standard" and it really does comes across as the overprotective parent who deems certain things too dangerous for the children when they are just over worrying too much.
Oh lets not forget their major screw-up with core sets, namely the lack of them. Oh now they are returning them, only after the blunder has sat on the table for a couple years now. Like how do they forget to implement the necessary core cards into their future sets in order to make sure they have a home. As I could of sworn people were expecting at least that level of competence out of them.
Like just look in Ixalan, have you noticed a returning pattern? Like the lack of meaningful and cheap artifact removal yet again? Like Slice in Twain and Demolish. Why do I get the feeling they would say Naturalize is also "too powerful for standard".
Like the quality of card material is of a lower grade and has a higher chance of bending. Oh and WotC is aware, they are panicking, they are trying to perform damage control. Problem is that their products are technically faulty and people are not as fond of making a purchase of American versions of the cards which also hurts brick and mortar stores.
Man there is also the matter that they canned invitationals a decade ago. It was honestly one of the cool factors of MTG in that if you could win an invitational you could create a card with your likeness and that would get put in a set. Without this, its just one less reason to be competitive.
And who could forget NWO, one of the worst moves they made. Sure it sounds all nice on paper, simplifying the complexity of commons and uncommons, but its just hurt the game. Older decks used to need the backbone be commons and uncommons and a few rares, now its different. Decks are more likely to have a higher amount of rares and mythics in the maindeck and sideboard. Even limited doesn't benefit from NWO. Oh and just because Fatal Push is an uncommon, doesn't mean it has the quantity of one, more like a pseudo-rare, seriously $30+ for an uncommon playset is absolutely insane.
With all I said, its no wonder why attendance might be shaky to say the least.
I wouldn't be surprised if 2018 has less product releases than 2017. The fact that my Explorers of Ixalan cards are of a much better quality than my Aether Revolt/MM3/Amonkhet/Hour of Devastation/C17/Ixalan cards makes me think the product oversaturation happened because they bought lower-quality stock and needed to spend as much of it as possible before cutting their loses.
I wouldn't be surprised if 2018 has less product releases than 2017. The fact that my Explorers of Ixalan cards are of a much better quality than my Aether Revolt/MM3/Amonkhet/Hour of Devastation/C17/Ixalan cards makes me think the product oversaturation happened because they bought lower-quality stock and needed to spend as much of it as possible before cutting their loses.
I don't think that's the case. I mean, I don't think the card stock would expire or something.
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Can you name all of the creature types with at least 20 cards? Try my Sporcle Quiz! Last Updated: 6/29/20 (Core Set 2021).
I wouldn't be surprised if 2018 has less product releases than 2017. The fact that my Explorers of Ixalan cards are of a much better quality than my Aether Revolt/MM3/Amonkhet/Hour of Devastation/C17/Ixalan cards makes me think the product oversaturation happened because they bought lower-quality stock and needed to spend as much of it as possible before cutting their loses.
I don't think that's the case. I mean, I don't think the card stock would expire or something.
You buy pallets, tons or sometimes even whole shipping containers of your stock when you require non-standard/non-propietary paper from a printing company. It's the printer's insurance against stupid executives trying to cut costs and repenting immediately.
So Wizards of the Coast recently released a Product Replacement Program for Magic players and collectors who'd like to have their faulty cards replaced. My main concern is that with more people using this program to convince Wizards of the Coast to improve the print and card stock quality of Magic products, the more it could likely increase the risk of them being forced to discontinue the game through a class action lawsuit.
As long as they don't publicly acknowledge the problem then they're in the clear, don't get the wrong idea we all love Magic and we all want Wizards of the Coast to do a great job but it doesn't help when they continue to allow this type of mismanagement of the game to occur without trying to correct it as soon as possible. Treating the company as If they're scam artists who care little about the game itself only hurts the Magic Community in the long run.
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America Bless Christ Jesus
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
While my LGS has had a noticeable drop in attendance, I would attribute that more to the opening of two other stores (And another store that didn't run tournaments now running them) than it is to do with anything involving the game itself. I feel this may be the case in larger metro areas, particularly in the states, as more and more people want to open a game store.
While my LGS has had a noticeable drop in attendance, I would attribute that more to the opening of two other stores (And another store that didn't run tournaments now running them) than it is to do with anything involving the game itself. I feel this may be the case in larger metro areas, particularly in the states, as more and more people want to open a game store.
There's been an explosive growth of new LGS over the last few months due to various factors. I'm pretty sure a lot of them are going to go under and only the more established ones are going to survive, though.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
There's been an explosive growth of new LGS over the last few months due to various factors. I'm pretty sure a lot of them are going to go under and only the more established ones are going to survive, though.
I think it tends to vary based on ease of access, transportation, as well as store hours. You also have to factor in peoples work schedules If they have a full or part time job as most usually show up during the weekends to play when they're off work. Some people have to work during the weekends which makes it hard for them to go to a local game store at their own convenience. It's easy when you're living off your parents before graduating from high school but after getting a job it can be hard unless you're lucky enough to secure a job where you have the weekends off.
In the case with more people opening up their own local game stores, quantity doesn't always equal quality. Most people don't realize how much work goes into operating a local game store 24/7 but it's worth it for those who are passionate about Trading Card Games / Collectible Card Games as well as RPG's and Table Top Games. You also have to factor in scheduled events being held which depending on the size of the local game store could take away valuable table space in order for your playgroups to play in let alone having to go to a different local game store to attend said event.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
Maybe the game should go back to its 2005 roots. Rules, set structure, released products, etc. Oh they've tried but they can't bottle that same lightning twice that Ravnica had. Return to Ravnica tried to do that but it lacked many of the things in the set structure and rules of its era much better. Like when was the last time Birds of Paradise was reprinted for standard play? Lightning Bolt? Counterspell? Stone Rain? All these and many more classics considered "too strong for standard" and it really does comes across as the overprotective parent who deems certain things too dangerous for the children when they are just over worrying too much.
Oh lets not forget their major screw-up with core sets, namely the lack of them. Oh now they are returning them, only after the blunder has sat on the table for a couple years now. Like how do they forget to implement the necessary core cards into their future sets in order to make sure they have a home. As I could of sworn people were expecting at least that level of competence out of them.
Like just look in Ixalan, have you noticed a returning pattern? Like the lack of meaningful and cheap artifact removal yet again? Like Slice in Twain and Demolish. Why do I get the feeling they would say Naturalize is also "too powerful for standard".
Like the quality of card material is of a lower grade and has a higher chance of bending. Oh and WotC is aware, they are panicking, they are trying to perform damage control. Problem is that their products are technically faulty and people are not as fond of making a purchase of American versions of the cards which also hurts brick and mortar stores.
Man there is also the matter that they canned invitationals a decade ago. It was honestly one of the cool factors of MTG in that if you could win an invitational you could create a card with your likeness and that would get put in a set. Without this, its just one less reason to be competitive.
And who could forget NWO, one of the worst moves they made. Sure it sounds all nice on paper, simplifying the complexity of commons and uncommons, but its just hurt the game. Older decks used to need the backbone be commons and uncommons and a few rares, now its different. Decks are more likely to have a higher amount of rares and mythics in the maindeck and sideboard. Even limited doesn't benefit from NWO. Oh and just because Fatal Push is an uncommon, doesn't mean it has the quantity of one, more like a pseudo-rare, seriously $30+ for an uncommon playset is absolutely insane.
With all I said, its no wonder why attendance might be shaky to say the least.
This. ALL OF THIS. I’m so sick of hearing how integral parts of the game I LITERALLY grew up loving are “TOOOO POWERFUL!!” Bull. Magic just needs to go back to the 2001-2007 era.
It's been moving towards what we are seeing now for ages at this point. Wizards probably focus tested and found more people like to play creatures than spells, so they decided to make spells weaker and creatures just stronger and stronger. That's why modern is so nuts at the moment: They shifted to strong creatures and Modern still has the strong spells of yesteryear.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
While my LGS has had a noticeable drop in attendance, I would attribute that more to the opening of two other stores (And another store that didn't run tournaments now running them) than it is to do with anything involving the game itself. I feel this may be the case in larger metro areas, particularly in the states, as more and more people want to open a game store.
There's been an explosive growth of new LGS over the last few months due to various factors. I'm pretty sure a lot of them are going to go under and only the more established ones are going to survive, though.
I feel this is a large reason as to why WotC sale figures keep going uo, even thougb it seems like to some that their scene is going down in attendance. If you have 100 people split amongst 4 game stores, it will seem like fewer people than 50 people in one.
Couple this with online sales being a much larger part od the market than it was even 5 years ago, and you have the appearance of a game that is declining, even though the reality is more nuanced.
Sometimes I wonder If EDH/Commander is having as much negative impact on the game as Standard and Modern right now even though it's much more affordable to get into depending on who you ask. While it may seem like aggressive reprints are a boon for casual players it only makes it harder for local game stores to make money off product that usually ends up having little to no resale value at all. It would only increase the risk of formats like EDH/Commander no longer being supported with new cards regardless of how big the card pool is for building decks.
So then the question becomes, "Is the desire to optimize EDH/Commander decks increasing?" when you take into account demand for Reserved List cards that will continue to climb in price as any amount of aggressive reprints won't be enough to drive the price down for these type of cards due to their age and scarcity. How long will it be before EDH/Commander becomes the next Legacy and Vintage where you have to drop a grand or more for the most consistent mana base? 5 color decks are expensive enough as it is.
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America Bless Christ Jesus
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
I thought there was an article about how profits were up, or was that more of Hasbro losing money elsewhere?
But if the player base is contracting that much it means they are becoming more reliant on a core of high spenders, reminds me of Warhammer, not the healthiest place for a company to be.
Whatever issues are the cause in loss of players I doubt any change will happen untill Hasbro sees profits dipping.
I thought there was an article about how profits were up, or was that more of Hasbro losing money elsewhere?
But if the player base is contracting that much it means they are becoming more reliant on a core of high spenders, reminds me of Warhammer, not the healthiest place for a company to be.
Whatever issues are the cause in loss of players I doubt any change will happen untill Hasbro sees profits dipping.
Like I said, it is in no small part due to a large increase in Game Stores opening. My LGS had FNMS reaching 70 or so people about four years ago on average. Now we have about 40 or so show up. Are people quitting? Well, no, not at all. About 8-12 people go to the newer store that opened that caters specifically to casual, non-competitive crowds, about 15-20 people go to the new store in the sister city, in no small part due to proximity. We also have another shop that didn't run tournaments at all start running FNMs this year, with about 8-12 people showing up there.
All told, I'd say that the area FNM attendence has gone *up* by about 20-30% over the past four years or so, even though attendance at the specific LGS I attend has gone down significantly. A lot of people are opening stores lately, from what I've seen, and that stretches the fanbase significantly. Still, this is part of why WotC profits go up, even though LGS's seem to have a drop in attendence. We are opening stores faster than we gaining new players. Now, I can't speak for New Player acquisition or retention specifically, as I havne't seen said numbers.
It's not that WotC is lying about what is going on, it's that they very possibly may not know why this seemingly paradoxical situation has arisen. Hence why their explanations seem hollow and daft; they likely don't know why sales are up even though average attendance is down. Average attendance is likely down in no small part due to adding more stores that fracture game stores community more and more, driving down average attendance even though the total number of people either hasn't really changed or has increased.
To illustrate my point, if the number of Game Stores doubles, and nothing else changes, then that means that the average attendance drops by half per store. Even if the stores grow at a 25% rate every years (Which is a perfectly reasonable, if high, growth rate), that would take over three full years of growth at that rate to reach attendance levels at the original store that matched it.
This. ALL OF THIS. I’m so sick of hearing how integral parts of the game I LITERALLY grew up loving are “TOOOO POWERFUL!!” Bull. Magic just needs to go back to the 2001-2007 era.
Yes, Magic just needs to go back to the era it came closest to dying in. There are aspects of that era which could be brought back, but don't forget the era itself contains Mirrodin and Kamigawa alongside all the good.
This. ALL OF THIS. I’m so sick of hearing how integral parts of the game I LITERALLY grew up loving are “TOOOO POWERFUL!!” Bull. Magic just needs to go back to the 2001-2007 era.
Yes, Magic just needs to go back to the era it came closest to dying in. There are aspects of that era which could be brought back, but don't forget the era itself contains Mirrodin and Kamigawa alongside all the good.
I consider Mirrodin to be a GOOD part of that era.... The competitive deck of the time was both cheap $$ wise and easily portable to older formats. It also brought up loads of great staples for both legacy and EDH.
This. ALL OF THIS. I’m so sick of hearing how integral parts of the game I LITERALLY grew up loving are “TOOOO POWERFUL!!” Bull. Magic just needs to go back to the 2001-2007 era.
Yes, Magic just needs to go back to the era it came closest to dying in. There are aspects of that era which could be brought back, but don't forget the era itself contains Mirrodin and Kamigawa alongside all the good.
I consider Mirrodin to be a GOOD part of that era.... The competitive deck of the time was both cheap $$ wise and easily portable to older formats. It also brought up loads of great staples for both legacy and EDH.
That might be speculative, Mirridon was one of the most popular sets from my LGS. They went through cases on it weekly. No comment on Kami... Great set, soild draft and chock full of flavor, but to weak to compete competitively with Mirridon.
I thought there was an article about how profits were up, or was that more of Hasbro losing money elsewhere?
But if the player base is contracting that much it means they are becoming more reliant on a core of high spenders, reminds me of Warhammer, not the healthiest place for a company to be.
Whatever issues are the cause in loss of players I doubt any change will happen untill Hasbro sees profits dipping.
Like I said, it is in no small part due to a large increase in Game Stores opening. My LGS had FNMS reaching 70 or so people about four years ago on average. Now we have about 40 or so show up. Are people quitting? Well, no, not at all. About 8-12 people go to the newer store that opened that caters specifically to casual, non-competitive crowds, about 15-20 people go to the new store in the sister city, in no small part due to proximity. We also have another shop that didn't run tournaments at all start running FNMs this year, with about 8-12 people showing up there.
All told, I'd say that the area FNM attendence has gone *up* by about 20-30% over the past four years or so, even though attendance at the specific LGS I attend has gone down significantly. A lot of people are opening stores lately, from what I've seen, and that stretches the fanbase significantly. Still, this is part of why WotC profits go up, even though LGS's seem to have a drop in attendence. We are opening stores faster than we gaining new players. Now, I can't speak for New Player acquisition or retention specifically, as I havne't seen said numbers.
It's not that WotC is lying about what is going on, it's that they very possibly may not know why this seemingly paradoxical situation has arisen. Hence why their explanations seem hollow and daft; they likely don't know why sales are up even though average attendance is down. Average attendance is likely down in no small part due to adding more stores that fracture game stores community more and more, driving down average attendance even though the total number of people either hasn't really changed or has increased.
To illustrate my point, if the number of Game Stores doubles, and nothing else changes, then that means that the average attendance drops by half per store. Even if the stores grow at a 25% rate every years (Which is a perfectly reasonable, if high, growth rate), that would take over three full years of growth at that rate to reach attendance levels at the original store that matched it.
And my ancedotal evidence says game stores have been shutting down even in prosperous places like Northern VA or South Eastern PA.
That might be speculative, Mirridon was one of the most popular sets from my LGS. They went through cases on it weekly. No comment on Kami... Great set, soild draft and chock full of flavor, but to weak to compete competitively with Mirridon.
Err as far as healthiest format IMO it was RAV-KAM and RAV-TSP.
My un-empyrical opinion is that it was because there was a lot of powerful cards but nothing was really that pushed and the most powerful card jitte was more of a mistake then a conscientious effort, it ended up in a pre-con after all.
Wizards has begun pushing cards particularly at rare and mythic a lot recently, which kind of makes the decline numbers yet rising profits makes sense.
That might be speculative, Mirridon was one of the most popular sets from my LGS. They went through cases on it weekly. No comment on Kami... Great set, soild draft and chock full of flavor, but to weak to compete competitively with Mirridon.
Err as far as healthiest format IMO it was RAV-KAM and RAV-TSP.
My un-empyrical opinion is that it was because there was a lot of powerful cards but nothing was really that pushed and the most powerful card jitte was more of a mistake then a conscientious effort, it ended up in a pre-con after all.
Wizards has begun pushing cards particularly at rare and mythic a lot recently, which kind of makes the decline numbers yet rising profits makes sense.
Healthesy ya... Time spiral did good things for standard despite poor sales.
I thought there was an article about how profits were up, or was that more of Hasbro losing money elsewhere?
But if the player base is contracting that much it means they are becoming more reliant on a core of high spenders, reminds me of Warhammer, not the healthiest place for a company to be.
Whatever issues are the cause in loss of players I doubt any change will happen untill Hasbro sees profits dipping.
Like I said, it is in no small part due to a large increase in Game Stores opening. My LGS had FNMS reaching 70 or so people about four years ago on average. Now we have about 40 or so show up. Are people quitting? Well, no, not at all. About 8-12 people go to the newer store that opened that caters specifically to casual, non-competitive crowds, about 15-20 people go to the new store in the sister city, in no small part due to proximity. We also have another shop that didn't run tournaments at all start running FNMs this year, with about 8-12 people showing up there.
All told, I'd say that the area FNM attendence has gone *up* by about 20-30% over the past four years or so, even though attendance at the specific LGS I attend has gone down significantly. A lot of people are opening stores lately, from what I've seen, and that stretches the fanbase significantly. Still, this is part of why WotC profits go up, even though LGS's seem to have a drop in attendence. We are opening stores faster than we gaining new players. Now, I can't speak for New Player acquisition or retention specifically, as I havne't seen said numbers.
It's not that WotC is lying about what is going on, it's that they very possibly may not know why this seemingly paradoxical situation has arisen. Hence why their explanations seem hollow and daft; they likely don't know why sales are up even though average attendance is down. Average attendance is likely down in no small part due to adding more stores that fracture game stores community more and more, driving down average attendance even though the total number of people either hasn't really changed or has increased.
To illustrate my point, if the number of Game Stores doubles, and nothing else changes, then that means that the average attendance drops by half per store. Even if the stores grow at a 25% rate every years (Which is a perfectly reasonable, if high, growth rate), that would take over three full years of growth at that rate to reach attendance levels at the original store that matched it.
And my ancedotal evidence says game stores have been shutting down even in prosperous places like Northern VA or South Eastern PA.
Is there any sort of data on this?
Short answer is no. The long answer is that it is going to vary significantly. One could extrapolate some inference if one could figure out historical data on number of WPN stores that are currently in operation, as well as how this number has changed over time, coupled with player data and tournament attendance data. I will say that pretty much everyone in the business will tell you that you would have to be stupid to open a store, however. Even the most successful stores tend to operate on razor-thin margins, and the amount and variety you need to remain successful is mountainous. Hobby stores shut down because they are not a particularly profitable entity, even under good circumstances, and many would shut down even if player population were increasing. It's a miserable market that too many people get into because they think it will be easy and fun, and they don't understand the costs of operating a store-front and don't appreciate the amount of merchandise they have to sell.
Rudy from Alpha Investments did a pretty good video series on opening a store and what it takes, as well as the costs involved. It should give you a very strong idea of how these shops fail.
A reasonable location storefront is going to have a rent cost of at least $2000/month. That is pretty rock bottom, honestly. If you have a reasonable mark-up of 30%, you are going to need to do $6,600 in sales just to cover rent after you cover cost of the product that you sold. To put that in Magic perspective, that is 45 boxes of magic cards, 110 Scalding Tarns, or 440 Khans fetchlands, every month, just to cover rent. Moving onto utilities, average cost of electricity per kwh is about 15 cents. If you have a modest energy consumption of about 3500 kwh of useage (which is low for a retail store), you are talking at least $40/month in electricity useage, which is on the rock-bottom low side. That's another Booster Box per month you need to sell to cover electricity after product cost is considered.
You also likely need to make a bunch of deposits. And you need to bankroll your product so you have something to sell your customers, which likely means debt of some sort which means payments every month. You also need to keep more product on your excess product to some degree, meaning you are tying up capital in product that is going unsold, meaning you need to sell even more product just to pay your bills and keep operating from month to month. We haven't even gotten into wages for workers. Even at minimum wage, you are talking about another $1000 or so in sales you need to do in order to just stay afloat.
And the laundry list keeps going on. When all is said and done, a store would need to sell the equivalent of about 60 booster boxes in order to just stay afloat, and that's on the low end.
The situation is very complicated, is what I'm getting at.
1. There might be someone who might harass me.
2. There might be someone who easily feels that they get harassed.
3. Why pay to play at a LGS when I could play at home for free?
I'd rather not play the game at all than play with someone whom I do not personally know.
Please tell me that you work Human Resources for the government so I can win a bet. Thank you.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Please keep all discussion of the Sprankle incident into the thread designated for it. Do note that blanket use of "SJW" is likely to be infracted
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Oh lets not forget their major screw-up with core sets, namely the lack of them. Oh now they are returning them, only after the blunder has sat on the table for a couple years now. Like how do they forget to implement the necessary core cards into their future sets in order to make sure they have a home. As I could of sworn people were expecting at least that level of competence out of them.
Like just look in Ixalan, have you noticed a returning pattern? Like the lack of meaningful and cheap artifact removal yet again? Like Slice in Twain and Demolish. Why do I get the feeling they would say Naturalize is also "too powerful for standard".
Like the quality of card material is of a lower grade and has a higher chance of bending. Oh and WotC is aware, they are panicking, they are trying to perform damage control. Problem is that their products are technically faulty and people are not as fond of making a purchase of American versions of the cards which also hurts brick and mortar stores.
Man there is also the matter that they canned invitationals a decade ago. It was honestly one of the cool factors of MTG in that if you could win an invitational you could create a card with your likeness and that would get put in a set. Without this, its just one less reason to be competitive.
And who could forget NWO, one of the worst moves they made. Sure it sounds all nice on paper, simplifying the complexity of commons and uncommons, but its just hurt the game. Older decks used to need the backbone be commons and uncommons and a few rares, now its different. Decks are more likely to have a higher amount of rares and mythics in the maindeck and sideboard. Even limited doesn't benefit from NWO. Oh and just because Fatal Push is an uncommon, doesn't mean it has the quantity of one, more like a pseudo-rare, seriously $30+ for an uncommon playset is absolutely insane.
With all I said, its no wonder why attendance might be shaky to say the least.
I don't think that's the case. I mean, I don't think the card stock would expire or something.
My 720 Peasant Cube
As long as they don't publicly acknowledge the problem then they're in the clear, don't get the wrong idea we all love Magic and we all want Wizards of the Coast to do a great job but it doesn't help when they continue to allow this type of mismanagement of the game to occur without trying to correct it as soon as possible. Treating the company as If they're scam artists who care little about the game itself only hurts the Magic Community in the long run.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
There's been an explosive growth of new LGS over the last few months due to various factors. I'm pretty sure a lot of them are going to go under and only the more established ones are going to survive, though.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
In the case with more people opening up their own local game stores, quantity doesn't always equal quality. Most people don't realize how much work goes into operating a local game store 24/7 but it's worth it for those who are passionate about Trading Card Games / Collectible Card Games as well as RPG's and Table Top Games. You also have to factor in scheduled events being held which depending on the size of the local game store could take away valuable table space in order for your playgroups to play in let alone having to go to a different local game store to attend said event.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
This. ALL OF THIS. I’m so sick of hearing how integral parts of the game I LITERALLY grew up loving are “TOOOO POWERFUL!!” Bull. Magic just needs to go back to the 2001-2007 era.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I feel this is a large reason as to why WotC sale figures keep going uo, even thougb it seems like to some that their scene is going down in attendance. If you have 100 people split amongst 4 game stores, it will seem like fewer people than 50 people in one.
Couple this with online sales being a much larger part od the market than it was even 5 years ago, and you have the appearance of a game that is declining, even though the reality is more nuanced.
So then the question becomes, "Is the desire to optimize EDH/Commander decks increasing?" when you take into account demand for Reserved List cards that will continue to climb in price as any amount of aggressive reprints won't be enough to drive the price down for these type of cards due to their age and scarcity. How long will it be before EDH/Commander becomes the next Legacy and Vintage where you have to drop a grand or more for the most consistent mana base? 5 color decks are expensive enough as it is.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
I thought there was an article about how profits were up, or was that more of Hasbro losing money elsewhere?
But if the player base is contracting that much it means they are becoming more reliant on a core of high spenders, reminds me of Warhammer, not the healthiest place for a company to be.
Whatever issues are the cause in loss of players I doubt any change will happen untill Hasbro sees profits dipping.
Like I said, it is in no small part due to a large increase in Game Stores opening. My LGS had FNMS reaching 70 or so people about four years ago on average. Now we have about 40 or so show up. Are people quitting? Well, no, not at all. About 8-12 people go to the newer store that opened that caters specifically to casual, non-competitive crowds, about 15-20 people go to the new store in the sister city, in no small part due to proximity. We also have another shop that didn't run tournaments at all start running FNMs this year, with about 8-12 people showing up there.
All told, I'd say that the area FNM attendence has gone *up* by about 20-30% over the past four years or so, even though attendance at the specific LGS I attend has gone down significantly. A lot of people are opening stores lately, from what I've seen, and that stretches the fanbase significantly. Still, this is part of why WotC profits go up, even though LGS's seem to have a drop in attendence. We are opening stores faster than we gaining new players. Now, I can't speak for New Player acquisition or retention specifically, as I havne't seen said numbers.
It's not that WotC is lying about what is going on, it's that they very possibly may not know why this seemingly paradoxical situation has arisen. Hence why their explanations seem hollow and daft; they likely don't know why sales are up even though average attendance is down. Average attendance is likely down in no small part due to adding more stores that fracture game stores community more and more, driving down average attendance even though the total number of people either hasn't really changed or has increased.
To illustrate my point, if the number of Game Stores doubles, and nothing else changes, then that means that the average attendance drops by half per store. Even if the stores grow at a 25% rate every years (Which is a perfectly reasonable, if high, growth rate), that would take over three full years of growth at that rate to reach attendance levels at the original store that matched it.
Yes, Magic just needs to go back to the era it came closest to dying in. There are aspects of that era which could be brought back, but don't forget the era itself contains Mirrodin and Kamigawa alongside all the good.
I consider Mirrodin to be a GOOD part of that era.... The competitive deck of the time was both cheap $$ wise and easily portable to older formats. It also brought up loads of great staples for both legacy and EDH.
And it nearly killed the game in the process.
And my ancedotal evidence says game stores have been shutting down even in prosperous places like Northern VA or South Eastern PA.
Is there any sort of data on this?
Err as far as healthiest format IMO it was RAV-KAM and RAV-TSP.
My un-empyrical opinion is that it was because there was a lot of powerful cards but nothing was really that pushed and the most powerful card jitte was more of a mistake then a conscientious effort, it ended up in a pre-con after all.
Wizards has begun pushing cards particularly at rare and mythic a lot recently, which kind of makes the decline numbers yet rising profits makes sense.
Healthesy ya... Time spiral did good things for standard despite poor sales.
Short answer is no. The long answer is that it is going to vary significantly. One could extrapolate some inference if one could figure out historical data on number of WPN stores that are currently in operation, as well as how this number has changed over time, coupled with player data and tournament attendance data. I will say that pretty much everyone in the business will tell you that you would have to be stupid to open a store, however. Even the most successful stores tend to operate on razor-thin margins, and the amount and variety you need to remain successful is mountainous. Hobby stores shut down because they are not a particularly profitable entity, even under good circumstances, and many would shut down even if player population were increasing. It's a miserable market that too many people get into because they think it will be easy and fun, and they don't understand the costs of operating a store-front and don't appreciate the amount of merchandise they have to sell.
Rudy from Alpha Investments did a pretty good video series on opening a store and what it takes, as well as the costs involved. It should give you a very strong idea of how these shops fail.
A reasonable location storefront is going to have a rent cost of at least $2000/month. That is pretty rock bottom, honestly. If you have a reasonable mark-up of 30%, you are going to need to do $6,600 in sales just to cover rent after you cover cost of the product that you sold. To put that in Magic perspective, that is 45 boxes of magic cards, 110 Scalding Tarns, or 440 Khans fetchlands, every month, just to cover rent. Moving onto utilities, average cost of electricity per kwh is about 15 cents. If you have a modest energy consumption of about 3500 kwh of useage (which is low for a retail store), you are talking at least $40/month in electricity useage, which is on the rock-bottom low side. That's another Booster Box per month you need to sell to cover electricity after product cost is considered.
You also likely need to make a bunch of deposits. And you need to bankroll your product so you have something to sell your customers, which likely means debt of some sort which means payments every month. You also need to keep more product on your excess product to some degree, meaning you are tying up capital in product that is going unsold, meaning you need to sell even more product just to pay your bills and keep operating from month to month. We haven't even gotten into wages for workers. Even at minimum wage, you are talking about another $1000 or so in sales you need to do in order to just stay afloat.
And the laundry list keeps going on. When all is said and done, a store would need to sell the equivalent of about 60 booster boxes in order to just stay afloat, and that's on the low end.
The situation is very complicated, is what I'm getting at.