It doesn't matter if you're being paid or not. If you elect to be a judge for Wizards events, you're agreeing to represent the company and uphold its image. If you're doing something counterproductive to their designs, they have every right in the world to disassociate themselves from you. It doesn't matter if leaks hurt sales or not- its THEIR call, not any of ours when this information gets released. And it doesn't matter if these are the only judges in an area or not- exclusivity doesn't give you an excuse to break the rules. If you want to be mad at someone for all the judges in a region being suspended, be mad at the judges for being selfish and foolish in their decision making, and creating this quandry. It's no different than when a star player gets a conduct-related suspension from his sports team- you blame the player for acting up, not the administration for doing what they had to do.
No offense, but that's remarkably short-sighted, and as it seems is par for the course with anyone rallying around a corporate banner, oversimplifies the issue to a point where it doesn't seem like you understand what's wrong with this scandal. 'All the judges that did that are bad' is plain stupid. Some of the judges banned have clearly stated they had not even logged into the group or participated during the time of the leaks. Another was complicit in assisting Wizards to figure out what happened and got banned anyway. That's not good faith, trust, or respect. Taking it as 'well they said it hurt them and I believe it and they can do what they want' is basically a hall pass you're giving them that ignores any extenuating circumstances, and the published facts about what's happened since. Unless you genuinely haven't read the whole story (in which case you shouldn't be vocalizing your opinion anyway, you're ill-informed), there's no frame on this that makes WotC look sparkling white and clean - there's a huge gulf between appropriate response and what they did, which is why so many are up in arms. If it was all conspiracy theories and conjecture, you might be right in your blind trust. There's enough to this story, though, that just makes an opinion like yours sound painfully like the knee-jerk reactions with half the information that WotC is being accused of.
(I'm sorry if I come off a little abrupt, but even someone wholeheartedly agreeing with Wizards' stance on this would have to admit there was overkill in here. The fact that you don't sounds like you don't know enough about the issue to have an opinion, let alone voice it publicly.)
Your half-hearted, backhanded apology is not accepted. You have no right to tell me, or anyone else on these boards whether they have a right to post on any topic here or not, and how dare you for even entertaining the thought that you do. The fact that I have not read every single little post on reddit concerning the matter does not disqualify me from having my two cents. I have read this thread, I have read several articles on the matter, and I have read both of Wizards' official statements concerning the matter. And it's clear as day to me that WotC is in the right.
See, what you fail to realize is that WotC isn't some grandfatherly benefactor entity who exists to make us happy. They are a business first, as they should be, and any business worth its salt would go through any measures it can to preserve its intellectual property. Furthermore, this was clearly not a one time deal- let's stop pretending that one morning Oath of the Gatewatch Spoilers showed up on Facebook, and then the next suspensions were handed down. This was ongoing over multiple sets, for months, even years, and to make things worse, this was being done by individuals that had earned some measure of trust from WotC in getting their judging certification. Whether or not their status as judges helped them obtain this information is irrelevant- they betrayed WotC's trust by gaining the information and then spreading it.
"But... but... they didn't know!" Spare me. These aren't weekend casual players we're talking about here. These are hardened magic players, immersed in the game and culture enough to take a test to gain a leadership role within it. And part of that leadership role is knowing when something's wrong, and when to do the right thing. They clearly failed on this, and failed for several months, and now they're paying the consequences.
"But... but... one even helped with the investigation!" I always take this with a grain of salt, especially when it concerns something that had been going on a long time. What were that person's motives? Were they legitimately upset over property being stolen (unlikely, or else they'd have reported this sooner). Likely it was an individual who was either about to be busted, and thus trying to save his hide, or was otherwise hoping his cooperation would get him ahead somewhere.
This was never about WOTC looking "sparkling white and clean". WOTC was put in a situation where they had to be the bad guy, and they did what they had to do. You can't pull weeds and not expect to get a little muddy. Now some of these people will get appeals, and I'm sure a few will be overturned. That's fair. But in the end, this is their game, and their property. Protecting that is, and should be, the number one priority.
It doesn't matter if you're being paid or not. If you elect to be a judge for Wizards events, you're agreeing to represent the company and uphold its image. If you're doing something counterproductive to their designs, they have every right in the world to disassociate themselves from you. It doesn't matter if leaks hurt sales or not- its THEIR call, not any of ours when this information gets released. And it doesn't matter if these are the only judges in an area or not- exclusivity doesn't give you an excuse to break the rules. If you want to be mad at someone for all the judges in a region being suspended, be mad at the judges for being selfish and foolish in their decision making, and creating this quandry. It's no different than when a star player gets a conduct-related suspension from his sports team- you blame the player for acting up, not the administration for doing what they had to do.
No offense, but that's remarkably short-sighted, and as it seems is par for the course with anyone rallying around a corporate banner, oversimplifies the issue to a point where it doesn't seem like you understand what's wrong with this scandal. 'All the judges that did that are bad' is plain stupid. Some of the judges banned have clearly stated they had not even logged into the group or participated during the time of the leaks. Another was complicit in assisting Wizards to figure out what happened and got banned anyway. That's not good faith, trust, or respect. Taking it as 'well they said it hurt them and I believe it and they can do what they want' is basically a hall pass you're giving them that ignores any extenuating circumstances, and the published facts about what's happened since. Unless you genuinely haven't read the whole story (in which case you shouldn't be vocalizing your opinion anyway, you're ill-informed), there's no frame on this that makes WotC look sparkling white and clean - there's a huge gulf between appropriate response and what they did, which is why so many are up in arms. If it was all conspiracy theories and conjecture, you might be right in your blind trust. There's enough to this story, though, that just makes an opinion like yours sound painfully like the knee-jerk reactions with half the information that WotC is being accused of.
(I'm sorry if I come off a little abrupt, but even someone wholeheartedly agreeing with Wizards' stance on this would have to admit there was overkill in here. The fact that you don't sounds like you don't know enough about the issue to have an opinion, let alone voice it publicly.)
Your half-hearted, backhanded apology is not accepted. You have no right to tell me, or anyone else on these boards whether they have a right to post on any topic here or not, and how dare you for even entertaining the thought that you do. The fact that I have not read every single little post on reddit concerning the matter does not disqualify me from having my two cents. I have read this thread, I have read several articles on the matter, and I have read both of Wizards' official statements concerning the matter. And it's clear as day to me that WotC is in the right.
See, what you fail to realize is that WotC isn't some grandfatherly benefactor entity who exists to make us happy. They are a business first, as they should be, and any business worth its salt would go through any measures it can to preserve its intellectual property. Furthermore, this was clearly not a one time deal- let's stop pretending that one morning Oath of the Gatewatch Spoilers showed up on Facebook, and then the next suspensions were handed down. This was ongoing over multiple sets, for months, even years, and to make things worse, this was being done by individuals that had earned some measure of trust from WotC in getting their judging certification. Whether or not their status as judges helped them obtain this information is irrelevant- they betrayed WotC's trust by gaining the information and then spreading it.
"But... but... they didn't know!" Spare me. These aren't weekend casual players we're talking about here. These are hardened magic players, immersed in the game and culture enough to take a test to gain a leadership role within it. And part of that leadership role is knowing when something's wrong, and when to do the right thing. They clearly failed on this, and failed for several months, and now they're paying the consequences.
"But... but... one even helped with the investigation!" I always take this with a grain of salt, especially when it concerns something that had been going on a long time. What were that person's motives? Were they legitimately upset over property being stolen (unlikely, or else they'd have reported this sooner). Likely it was an individual who was either about to be busted, and thus trying to save his hide, or was otherwise hoping his cooperation would get him ahead somewhere.
This was never about WOTC looking "sparkling white and clean". WOTC was put in a situation where they had to be the bad guy, and they did what they had to do. You can't pull weeds and not expect to get a little muddy. Now some of these people will get appeals, and I'm sure a few will be overturned. That's fair. But in the end, this is their game, and their property. Protecting that is, and should be, the number one priority.
You sound like a shill for the company at this point. WotC is without a doubt in the right...despite the horrible PR this created for them, this was the best solution...that's your take? Oh, and 'I take this part of the argument with a grain of salt' is not remotely objective, it's a complete bias. So, yeah, forgive me if entertaining commentaries such as these makes me sincerely doubt that you're informed. Quite the opposite, if your two cents is to completely doubt one half of the argument and accept WotC playing 'the bad guy' was their only viable solution to the issue, you either came into the issue with a bias or developed one from what you've read. Either way, it's not objective enough and zealotry on this board runs deep enough to leave you to your peace and not bother arguing the point further - your opinion can't be swayed.
It doesn't matter if you're being paid or not. If you elect to be a judge for Wizards events, you're agreeing to represent the company and uphold its image. If you're doing something counterproductive to their designs, they have every right in the world to disassociate themselves from you. It doesn't matter if leaks hurt sales or not- its THEIR call, not any of ours when this information gets released. And it doesn't matter if these are the only judges in an area or not- exclusivity doesn't give you an excuse to break the rules. If you want to be mad at someone for all the judges in a region being suspended, be mad at the judges for being selfish and foolish in their decision making, and creating this quandry. It's no different than when a star player gets a conduct-related suspension from his sports team- you blame the player for acting up, not the administration for doing what they had to do.
No offense, but that's remarkably short-sighted, and as it seems is par for the course with anyone rallying around a corporate banner, oversimplifies the issue to a point where it doesn't seem like you understand what's wrong with this scandal. 'All the judges that did that are bad' is plain stupid. Some of the judges banned have clearly stated they had not even logged into the group or participated during the time of the leaks. Another was complicit in assisting Wizards to figure out what happened and got banned anyway. That's not good faith, trust, or respect. Taking it as 'well they said it hurt them and I believe it and they can do what they want' is basically a hall pass you're giving them that ignores any extenuating circumstances, and the published facts about what's happened since. Unless you genuinely haven't read the whole story (in which case you shouldn't be vocalizing your opinion anyway, you're ill-informed), there's no frame on this that makes WotC look sparkling white and clean - there's a huge gulf between appropriate response and what they did, which is why so many are up in arms. If it was all conspiracy theories and conjecture, you might be right in your blind trust. There's enough to this story, though, that just makes an opinion like yours sound painfully like the knee-jerk reactions with half the information that WotC is being accused of.
(I'm sorry if I come off a little abrupt, but even someone wholeheartedly agreeing with Wizards' stance on this would have to admit there was overkill in here. The fact that you don't sounds like you don't know enough about the issue to have an opinion, let alone voice it publicly.)
Your half-hearted, backhanded apology is not accepted. You have no right to tell me, or anyone else on these boards whether they have a right to post on any topic here or not, and how dare you for even entertaining the thought that you do. The fact that I have not read every single little post on reddit concerning the matter does not disqualify me from having my two cents. I have read this thread, I have read several articles on the matter, and I have read both of Wizards' official statements concerning the matter. And it's clear as day to me that WotC is in the right.
See, what you fail to realize is that WotC isn't some grandfatherly benefactor entity who exists to make us happy. They are a business first, as they should be, and any business worth its salt would go through any measures it can to preserve its intellectual property. Furthermore, this was clearly not a one time deal- let's stop pretending that one morning Oath of the Gatewatch Spoilers showed up on Facebook, and then the next suspensions were handed down. This was ongoing over multiple sets, for months, even years, and to make things worse, this was being done by individuals that had earned some measure of trust from WotC in getting their judging certification. Whether or not their status as judges helped them obtain this information is irrelevant- they betrayed WotC's trust by gaining the information and then spreading it.
"But... but... they didn't know!" Spare me. These aren't weekend casual players we're talking about here. These are hardened magic players, immersed in the game and culture enough to take a test to gain a leadership role within it. And part of that leadership role is knowing when something's wrong, and when to do the right thing. They clearly failed on this, and failed for several months, and now they're paying the consequences.
"But... but... one even helped with the investigation!" I always take this with a grain of salt, especially when it concerns something that had been going on a long time. What were that person's motives? Were they legitimately upset over property being stolen (unlikely, or else they'd have reported this sooner). Likely it was an individual who was either about to be busted, and thus trying to save his hide, or was otherwise hoping his cooperation would get him ahead somewhere.
This was never about WOTC looking "sparkling white and clean". WOTC was put in a situation where they had to be the bad guy, and they did what they had to do. You can't pull weeds and not expect to get a little muddy. Now some of these people will get appeals, and I'm sure a few will be overturned. That's fair. But in the end, this is their game, and their property. Protecting that is, and should be, the number one priority.
You sound like a shill for the company at this point. WotC is without a doubt in the right...despite the horrible PR this created for them, this was the best solution...that's your take? Oh, and 'I take this part of the argument with a grain of salt' is not remotely objective, it's a complete bias. So, yeah, forgive me if entertaining commentaries such as these makes me sincerely doubt that you're informed. Quite the opposite, if your two cents is to completely doubt one half of the argument and accept WotC playing 'the bad guy' was their only viable solution to the issue, you either came into the issue with a bias or developed one from what you've read. Either way, it's not objective enough and zealotry on this board runs deep enough to leave you to your peace and not bother arguing the point further - your opinion can't be swayed.
I'm not a shill, just someone who understands how the real world works, and ultimately, when push comes to shove, who's game this really is. Wizards was forced to make a decision on the issue, and that they went for what was right instead of what was PR friendly gained my respect.
And casting serious doubts on the true motives of the "whistleblower" is objectivity in its finest. The bias lies in the people who swallow immediately that "he helped Wizards, so he should get a pass". True objectivity is realizing there's something far deeper than the surface there. Obviously I made some conjecture with my hypothesis to the reason, but I wouldn't be surprised if I was at least somewhat right on that.
But look at where the true zealotry lies- the people bashing Wizards. If all parties were reinstated tomorrow, those who think wizards were in the right would simply shrug and move on. It's the other side that is in borderline conniptions on the matter.
It doesn't matter if you're being paid or not. If you elect to be a judge for Wizards events, you're agreeing to represent the company and uphold its image. If you're doing something counterproductive to their designs, they have every right in the world to disassociate themselves from you. It doesn't matter if leaks hurt sales or not- its THEIR call, not any of ours when this information gets released. And it doesn't matter if these are the only judges in an area or not- exclusivity doesn't give you an excuse to break the rules. If you want to be mad at someone for all the judges in a region being suspended, be mad at the judges for being selfish and foolish in their decision making, and creating this quandry. It's no different than when a star player gets a conduct-related suspension from his sports team- you blame the player for acting up, not the administration for doing what they had to do.
No offense, but that's remarkably short-sighted, and as it seems is par for the course with anyone rallying around a corporate banner, oversimplifies the issue to a point where it doesn't seem like you understand what's wrong with this scandal. 'All the judges that did that are bad' is plain stupid. Some of the judges banned have clearly stated they had not even logged into the group or participated during the time of the leaks. Another was complicit in assisting Wizards to figure out what happened and got banned anyway. That's not good faith, trust, or respect. Taking it as 'well they said it hurt them and I believe it and they can do what they want' is basically a hall pass you're giving them that ignores any extenuating circumstances, and the published facts about what's happened since. Unless you genuinely haven't read the whole story (in which case you shouldn't be vocalizing your opinion anyway, you're ill-informed), there's no frame on this that makes WotC look sparkling white and clean - there's a huge gulf between appropriate response and what they did, which is why so many are up in arms. If it was all conspiracy theories and conjecture, you might be right in your blind trust. There's enough to this story, though, that just makes an opinion like yours sound painfully like the knee-jerk reactions with half the information that WotC is being accused of.
(I'm sorry if I come off a little abrupt, but even someone wholeheartedly agreeing with Wizards' stance on this would have to admit there was overkill in here. The fact that you don't sounds like you don't know enough about the issue to have an opinion, let alone voice it publicly.)
Your half-hearted, backhanded apology is not accepted. You have no right to tell me, or anyone else on these boards whether they have a right to post on any topic here or not, and how dare you for even entertaining the thought that you do. The fact that I have not read every single little post on reddit concerning the matter does not disqualify me from having my two cents. I have read this thread, I have read several articles on the matter, and I have read both of Wizards' official statements concerning the matter. And it's clear as day to me that WotC is in the right.
See, what you fail to realize is that WotC isn't some grandfatherly benefactor entity who exists to make us happy. They are a business first, as they should be, and any business worth its salt would go through any measures it can to preserve its intellectual property. Furthermore, this was clearly not a one time deal- let's stop pretending that one morning Oath of the Gatewatch Spoilers showed up on Facebook, and then the next suspensions were handed down. This was ongoing over multiple sets, for months, even years, and to make things worse, this was being done by individuals that had earned some measure of trust from WotC in getting their judging certification. Whether or not their status as judges helped them obtain this information is irrelevant- they betrayed WotC's trust by gaining the information and then spreading it.
"But... but... they didn't know!" Spare me. These aren't weekend casual players we're talking about here. These are hardened magic players, immersed in the game and culture enough to take a test to gain a leadership role within it. And part of that leadership role is knowing when something's wrong, and when to do the right thing. They clearly failed on this, and failed for several months, and now they're paying the consequences.
"But... but... one even helped with the investigation!" I always take this with a grain of salt, especially when it concerns something that had been going on a long time. What were that person's motives? Were they legitimately upset over property being stolen (unlikely, or else they'd have reported this sooner). Likely it was an individual who was either about to be busted, and thus trying to save his hide, or was otherwise hoping his cooperation would get him ahead somewhere.
This was never about WOTC looking "sparkling white and clean". WOTC was put in a situation where they had to be the bad guy, and they did what they had to do. You can't pull weeds and not expect to get a little muddy. Now some of these people will get appeals, and I'm sure a few will be overturned. That's fair. But in the end, this is their game, and their property. Protecting that is, and should be, the number one priority.
You sound like a shill for the company at this point. WotC is without a doubt in the right...despite the horrible PR this created for them, this was the best solution...that's your take? Oh, and 'I take this part of the argument with a grain of salt' is not remotely objective, it's a complete bias. So, yeah, forgive me if entertaining commentaries such as these makes me sincerely doubt that you're informed. Quite the opposite, if your two cents is to completely doubt one half of the argument and accept WotC playing 'the bad guy' was their only viable solution to the issue, you either came into the issue with a bias or developed one from what you've read. Either way, it's not objective enough and zealotry on this board runs deep enough to leave you to your peace and not bother arguing the point further - your opinion can't be swayed.
I'm not a shill, just someone who understands how the real world works, and ultimately, when push comes to shove, who's game this really is. Wizards was forced to make a decision on the issue, and that they went for what was right instead of what was PR friendly gained my respect.
And casting serious doubts on the true motives of the "whistleblower" is objectivity in its finest. The bias lies in the people who swallow immediately that "he helped Wizards, so he should get a pass". True objectivity is realizing there's something far deeper than the surface there. Obviously I made some conjecture with my hypothesis to the reason, but I wouldn't be surprised if I was at least somewhat right on that.
But look at where the true zealotry lies- the people bashing Wizards. If all parties were reinstated tomorrow, those who think wizards were in the right would simply shrug and move on. It's the other side that is in borderline conniptions on the matter.
...or it's the 'us vs. them' mentality you're displaying that has us in this mess in the first place. That culture of thought Wizards has created, fostered, and/or catered to not just in this PR nightmare, but every one like it over the past year.
You're wrong. It isn't their game. They can't just take their ball and go home. It doesn't belong solely to the community, either. We can't enjoy the game if they're not making it. So how about a little respect for the fact that it's a symbiotic relationship where one can't live without the will of the other, and maybe this was a step in the wrong direction?
EDIT: Also...this is how the real world works? I'm sorry, but this literally could not have ever happened anywhere in the 'real world'. There have been at least two lawyers in this thread alone that have explained exactly why this couldn't have happened in any real, damning way if not for the fact that this was basically an at-will temporary termination of volunteers. If they were employees, WotC would be looking at a lawsuit for the ham-fisted way this was handled, even if ALL parties were guilty, the proof is tenuous at best. So, please, spare me the condescension.
People read the mothership now don't they and WotC has released 2 statements there concerning this very subject so I'm inclined to say your argument is just pulling a random number out of your *** to attempt to prove your point. Let's say it's a 10% drop in sales as a result of this judge issue. That's millions of dollars lost/let's see how happy you are if you lost millions just because of a stupid decision as this judge issue is fracturing the community. Without a community/consumers WotC is in the *****ter real quick if people decide the game isn't worth their money anymore.
As for WotC looking like the bad guy or doing what they had to do/ban people, I disagree with that sentiment 100%. They simply do NOTHING and that makes them look different than the bad guy and the do what needed to be done guy they are simply the same as they were a month ago. All WotC looks like now is a ******* ass hole who goes on power trips because they can.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
People read the mothership now don't they and WotC has released 2 statements there concerning this very subject so I'm inclined to say your argument is just pulling a random number out of your *** to attempt to prove your point. Let's say it's a 10% drop in sales as a result of this judge issue. That's millions of dollars lost/let's see how happy you are if you lost millions just because of a stupid decision as this judge issue is fracturing the community. Without a community/consumers WotC is in the *****ter real quick if people decide the game isn't worth their money anymore.
As for WotC looking like the bad guy or doing what they had to do/ban people, I disagree with that sentiment 100%. They simply do NOTHING and that makes them look different than the bad guy and the do what needed to be done guy they are simply the same as they were a month ago. All WotC looks like now is a ******* ass hole who goes on power trips because they can.
I think if there is a dip in sales, they're going to blame spoilers again and say they've solved the problem with their community policing. When the next set doesn't do as well as they thought, they'll blame the spoilers from OGW for damaging their marketing permanently or some bull***** like that.
If numbers go up, they'll credit their heavy handed response and Trick's amazing article convincing us all that they wer 100% right. When in reality, it's probably because the playerbase is growing. Still.
The social justice warrior vibe is stupidly strong in here.
Everyone needs to take a step back, review ALL the information that has been coming out, and then form an opinion.
Also, to repeat a previous point I made, I am willing to bet that the string of 3 month bans are because these people have advanced knowledge of the cards, and that gives them an unfair advantage when it comes to competitive play.
Of course, if you want to the person that sits down across from someone that had set information weeks or months ahead of time and was able to build decks using those cards, dont be crying after saying that the game wasnt fair because they had more time to build with OGW
W may only be paid with white mana. U may only be paid with blue mana. B may only be paid with black mana. R may only be paid with red mana. G may only be paid with green mana. C may only be paid with colorless mana. 1 may be paid with white, blue, black, red, green, or clolorless mana.
I know some of you think this is a huge deal, but as someone rightly pointed out on the last page, it's likely that only a very small percentage of Magic's player base is even aware of this.
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Can you name all of the creature types with at least 20 cards? Try my Sporcle Quiz! Last Updated: 6/29/20 (Core Set 2021).
I know some of you think this is a huge deal, but as someone rightly pointed out on the last page, it's likely that only a very small percentage of Magic's player base is even aware of this.
That doesn't make it any more, or any less right (depending on your point of view). Just because we're assuming that many players are ignorant of the situation, doesn't mean it's not a situation worth discussion and attention.
I know some of you think this is a huge deal, but as someone rightly pointed out on the last page, it's likely that only a very small percentage of Magic's player base is even aware of this.
That doesn't make it any more, or any less right (depending on your point of view). Just because we're assuming that many players are ignorant of the situation, doesn't mean it's not a situation worth discussion and attention.
Ugh. Don't put words in my mouth. You're responding to a point that no one was making. There are some here who contend that it's WotC's action, not the leaks themselves, that will cause financial damage to WotC via poor sales of Oath. Such is not the case, because not enough people are aware, and even fewer care.
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():
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Can you name all of the creature types with at least 20 cards? Try my Sporcle Quiz! Last Updated: 6/29/20 (Core Set 2021).
People read the mothership now don't they and WotC has released 2 statements there concerning this very subject so I'm inclined to say your argument is just pulling a random number out of your *** to attempt to prove your point. Let's say it's a 10% drop in sales as a result of this judge issue. That's millions of dollars lost/let's see how happy you are if you lost millions just because of a stupid decision as this judge issue is fracturing the community. Without a community/consumers WotC is in the *****ter real quick if people decide the game isn't worth their money anymore.
As for WotC looking like the bad guy or doing what they had to do/ban people, I disagree with that sentiment 100%. They simply do NOTHING and that makes them look different than the bad guy and the do what needed to be done guy they are simply the same as they were a month ago. All WotC looks like now is a ******* ass hole who goes on power trips because they can.
Lol, there is NOT gonna be a 10% dip in sales from the banning a few judges most people have never heard of. It's just not gonna happen. Most people don't read the mothership either, and even if you did, you would only see wizards view of it and think that they had banned a long-running spoiler ring, which seems perfectly reasonable.
People read the mothership now don't they and WotC has released 2 statements there concerning this very subject so I'm inclined to say your argument is just pulling a random number out of your *** to attempt to prove your point. Let's say it's a 10% drop in sales as a result of this judge issue. That's millions of dollars lost/let's see how happy you are if you lost millions just because of a stupid decision as this judge issue is fracturing the community. Without a community/consumers WotC is in the *****ter real quick if people decide the game isn't worth their money anymore.
As for WotC looking like the bad guy or doing what they had to do/ban people, I disagree with that sentiment 100%. They simply do NOTHING and that makes them look different than the bad guy and the do what needed to be done guy they are simply the same as they were a month ago. All WotC looks like now is a ******* ass hole who goes on power trips because they can.
Lol, there is NOT gonna be a 10% dip in sales from the banning a few judges most people have never heard of. It's just not gonna happen. Most people don't read the mothership either, and even if you did, you would only see wizards view of it and think that they had banned a long-running spoiler ring, which seems perfectly reasonable.
So what that would suggest is an education campaign is in order
I am disappointed by the lack of critical thinking being displayed around this topic. While the people who received suspensions were mtg judges, their suspensions were received because of their actions. While these recent events may have a negative short term impact on the SE US Magic community, that isn't the fault of WoTC, its the fault of the pillars of that community for using poor judgement and engaging in nefarious activity. They are the ones that let their community down. If this was going on for several sets then they had to have known that the information about upcoming cards they were receiving was in fact real since they would be validated by the actual cards as they were released.
People talk about a whistleblower, which I'm pretty sure is just hearsay since the leaks happened, if the whistle was blown we can presume that WoTC would have been able to stop them from reaching the wider public. I'm pretty sure that when people refer to the "whistleblower" the are referring to Robert of the MTG Focus podcast, who in the most recent episode discusses his version of events and interviews Helene Bergeot. We learn that Robert tweeted the images of Kozilek and the wastes, I'm not clear as to whether he was a member of the private Facebook group or someone from the group sent him the images. Robert claims that he thought they were fake. A short time after the leaked images began to spread, Robert received a call from WoTC when he began cooperating with the investigation from his own admission to make the outcome better for him. WoTC does have the right to protects its work,
I think that WoTC's stance is clear and reasonable, they are just asking people to stop and think before they act. The definition of public and private is pretty clear in regards to internet and doesnt need to be defined specially by Wizards. A public forum is one like this, where anyone can read it or join and make posts, you can use an internet search engine and find results that lead to posts on this forum. A private forum is one the is not searchable by the public, you need an invitation or to apply to be a member of before you can access it. Luckily searching the internet is easy and documentable, if you are a member of a private forum and you see a leaked card which may or may not be real, all you have to do is a simple internet search using your favorite search engine if nothing comes up then you know the leaked information hasn't reached the wider public, you can then either keep quiet and risk punitive action or send WoTC an email saying hey I came across this in a private forum, thought you should know. I can't imagine the process taking more than 5 minutes.
I don't know how WotC's internal politics works, but they probably made the decision based on the insistence of the legal department or some higher-ups from Hasbro. Anybody who could say "hey, this is a bad decision and is going to rile some of our most dedicated customers" weren't in the decision-making process. Suspending a large swath of participants from the group was probably because they have no way to determine who was and wasn't involved in passing on leaks. What happened afterward was massively mishandled, however and their PR staff were not prepared to provide a sufficient justification for the decision. The public statement made it seem like an implicit threat to the community if they fail to report better leaks when better wording could have avoided a lot of misunderstanding and concern in the community.
The man who leaked the cards to the public did not so out of malicious intent, but still screwed up. Having access to leaks in private is one thing, but before reposting them you should be asking yourself things like "where did this come from". If it's on an Imgur post or a public venue, everybody's already seen it, the leak has already hit the wild, and the damage is already done. If you're getting it from a private source, you should be thinking about the consequences of making private information public.
The community reaction has probably been the worst part of this. Shutting down MagicJudge's system does more to hurt tournament organizers and local game stores more than it'll ever hurt WoTC. The complete vitriol and bile towards the company, especially towards staff who had no say in the suspensions, is unhelpful and is just going to make them less likely to compromise with the DCI and players if this ever happens again.
My sympathies are with any of the judges who were truly innocent of wrongdoing and were suspended regardless, any of the WotC staff who have to answer to the community at this time, and any of the players and judges who are just sick of this drama already.
Not really, and that scenario assumes that this is the first time. If you've received several leaks over the past few sets, and now you finally speak up, you shouldn't expect to get off scott free.
Tangential side note, the fact that these guys are judges is completely irrelevant. Saying otherwise implies that there are two sets of rules, one for judges and one for the rest of us.
People read the mothership now don't they and WotC has released 2 statements there concerning this very subject so I'm inclined to say your argument is just pulling a random number out of your *** to attempt to prove your point. Let's say it's a 10% drop in sales as a result of this judge issue. That's millions of dollars lost/let's see how happy you are if you lost millions just because of a stupid decision as this judge issue is fracturing the community. Without a community/consumers WotC is in the *****ter real quick if people decide the game isn't worth their money anymore.
As for WotC looking like the bad guy or doing what they had to do/ban people, I disagree with that sentiment 100%. They simply do NOTHING and that makes them look different than the bad guy and the do what needed to be done guy they are simply the same as they were a month ago. All WotC looks like now is a ******* ass hole who goes on power trips because they can.
I think if there is a dip in sales, they're going to blame spoilers again and say they've solved the problem with their community policing. When the next set doesn't do as well as they thought, they'll blame the spoilers from OGW for damaging their marketing permanently or some bull***** like that.
If numbers go up, they'll credit their heavy handed response and Trick's amazing article convincing us all that they wer 100% right. When in reality, it's probably because the playerbase is growing. Still.
If this trend continues, I could see them getting serious trouble with Hasbro and its shareholders.
Maybe another reason why their response was so overblown. BFZ probably didn't do that well compared to the latest fall sets, either, after the initial hype died down. They simply can't afford that many blunders in a row.
I HIGHLY doubt BFZ's poor sales were due to leaks, that set was really pretty terrible both power wise and value wise. Other than the expedition lands, there wasn't much in BFZ. Only Gideon is the only non expedition land card that had any power or value behind it.
Judges should probably just band together and demand they be made Hasbro employees at this point or not judge events. If they are going to be held to Hasbro's standards then they are no longer a volunteer group.
@HunterEste: BFZ didn't have any leaks of relevance. My point is that if BFZ did comparably poor for a fall set (which would be well-deserved, given how bad it is), they can't afford OGW to be a failure as well, hence overblown reactions because they're in PANIC mode.
Meh, they'll bounce back if they do a good job on Innistrad.
Judges should probably just band together and demand they be made Hasbro employees at this point or not judge events. If they are going to be held to Hasbro's standards then they are no longer a volunteer group.
The fact that they're judges is irrelevant. They are people who did something wrong, and must now deal with the consequences. They only happened to be judges, and they don't enjoy the luxury of leniency because of their title.
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I am disappointed by the lack of critical thinking being displayed around this topic.
The way I will always understand this line is "People who disagree with my PoV and cannot think like me can't think at all."
If you read through this whole thread, there were plenty of critical points brought up by many folks. Is that judge on his podcast making excuses, sure he is and who cares.
While you seem to think on the basis of parent/child where judges are children owing some loyalty to the parent company for making this product, this completely ignores the fact that all the cards' information are held by WotC first and foremost. You don't want your product info to leak? Protect it. Don't start hunting down people who have the pictures and throw empty legal threats at them and when they cooperate with you when you don't even have a shred of information, punish them. Consequently, this upsets the community of players that pay for your product and also makes holding tournaments harder; all because you were too lax with your own security?? And got upset because it wasn't spoiled he way you wanted it to? They aren't even employees! How in the world are they getting access to your cards?!
This isn't how you handle it. You handle it with tact and composure, not just rushing bans and scrambling with threats.
WotC has been having a huge string of bad PR moves and products for quite a bit and they have been hit hard. Why should I forgive and forget their poor decisions as if they are some sort of god entity (or parental figure in your case)?
Reminder:
MM2015 was completely wasted as expensive draft/sealed rather than reprinting staples that are in high demand. Not only that they failed to produce a good product with very high rates of mistakes (foiled rusted relics fiasco, empty boosters, boxes having the exact same cards everywhere, etc) and also used a product with high foil rates (1 in each booster) with a new packaging that damages these cards.
BfZ was printed solely for limited and somewhat standard with themes that proved to be unwanted, generating a degenerate standard with goodstuff.dec. The use of expeditions as a gimmick was the only redeeming point, if even considered that. No cards have made it in any other format with the exception of 2 because of how watered down that set was.
Commander 2015 saw very poor sales in my area with the same complaint: very watered down set even though EDH includes many powerful cards and staples.
OGW so far shows mythics are aren't powerful yet again with even its main villain proving to be useless and the inclusion of a "new mana symbol".
I still hear complaints about their MTGO platform that hasn't gotten fixed. It's been what? A year of complaining?
Legacy was abandoned as a format due to their lack of support. But god forbid they reprint legacy staples...
Additionally, the fact that their key figure keeps making bad moves and gets away with it while still allowed to represent the company is beyond me. Reminder that MaRo spiked fetchland prices overnight with a statement he should never have mentioned. Was it beneficial for the company? No. It was beneficial for the secondary market only. Nobody else.
This is all besides the point that they keep following directives they think are great and are encouraged when they clearly aren't, such as their printing policies and lack of support for players. Case in point, they wanted to spoil Kozilek as part of the storyline because they wanted to turn their focus on storytelling more than the actual game; why the hell would the player community at whom this product is aimed at even care?! They want cards, good cards to play with, not a weekly teaser!
This is also besides the several other PR issues they have had concerning players such as unfair bannings, failures to ban in the past even when cheating was caught on tape, bannings for SJW reasons and now this debacle where several tournaments can't occur in the south east because they can't get their ***** together.
So if getting fed up with their lack of judgement, poor decisions and lack of responsibility is "lack of critical thinking", then you clearly you don't understand the customer/seller dynamic.
You can't do something wrong if you didn't do anything but see leaks. They are not employed by the company and therefore do not have a responsibility to protect the company's interests.
I don't think you actually have a firm understanding of how this went down.
¥I still hear complaints about their MTGO platform that hasn't gotten fixed. It's been what? A year of complaining?
In regards to Magic Online? It's been waaaaaaay over a year. But the complaining does seem to have increased in the past year, to be fair.
Legacy was abandoned as a format due to their lack of support. But god forbid they reprint legacy staples...
I often see the argument that they can just reprint cards not on the Reserved List, but the issue there is that this just causes a corresponding increase in the price of the cards that are on the Reserved List. Reprinting non-RL Legacy cards is really just a band-aid solution. To support Legacy they have to get rid of the list, and they seem unable/unwilling to do so.
Additionally, the fact that their key figure keeps making bad moves and gets away with it while still allowed to represent the company is beyond me. Reminder that MaRo spiked fetchland prices overnight with a statement he should never have mentioned. Was it beneficial for the company? No. It was beneficial for the secondary market only. Nobody else.
How exactly is this any different than when the set spoiler came out and there were no fetchlands? It would have had the exact same effect (and been the exact same thing functionally, someone from the company saying the fetchlands wouldn't be in the set), it just would've happened a few weeks later.
This is also besides the several other PR issues they have had concerning players such as unfair bannings, failures to ban in the past even when cheating was caught on tape, bannings for SJW reasons and now this debacle where several tournaments can't occur in the south east because they can't get their ***** together.
What failures to ban have there been when cheating was caught on tape? All of the tape-caught cheating (and I mean definite cheating, not something that could possibly be excused as a goof) I can think of did result in bans.
My bigger problem is that cheaters should be getting significantly longer bans than they've been getting. Guys like Trevor Humphreys, Steven Speck, and Alex Bertoncini should be banned for life, not for just a few years.
Wow, sure looks like 90% of the people posting in this thread don't have a clue with what happened even though a lot of the info is out there now.
If you want a ton more info (generalized and to the point) go check the most recent MTG Focus podcast where someone who was hit with a 3year ban tells you his side and then follows it all up with an interview with a WotC official.
It's really, really scary what WotC is doing. Basically, you CAN NOT post MTG cards that aren't already released in sets (yes, even no fake cards if they are anything close to resembling something that could be real) or risk ~3 YEAR bans. WotC want you to not only vet your sources of said image (no matter where you find it, facebook/twitter/instagram/etc.) BUT, you need to search the internet and research the info/image yourself to make sure it isn't a spoiler. And yeah, don't try posting it and then reporting it to WotC because you could easily still get hit with a 3year ban... *mind blown.
I thought we were in an age of getting rid of bullies? Because basically, WotC is bullying everyone and anything (especially a site like this) with huge bans for posting OR REPOSTING anything spoilish what-so-ever. Instead of taking responsibility themselves (for leaks), WotC is attempting to force anyone who wants to continue to play their game into being anti-spoiler backyard heroes. It's bullying at it's finest... and very naive in today's information age. I'm really surprised more peeps running this site haven't come out with statements.
It's an instant speed 5/5 trampler for 4. Wtf do you people want seriously? It has applications in populate/ above the curve beats decks, or in Bant control/ flash. I seriously think anyone mad at this card for any reason other than losing an attacker to instant speed wurm, should go home and make their own awesome card game and leave the rest of us alone.
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Your half-hearted, backhanded apology is not accepted. You have no right to tell me, or anyone else on these boards whether they have a right to post on any topic here or not, and how dare you for even entertaining the thought that you do. The fact that I have not read every single little post on reddit concerning the matter does not disqualify me from having my two cents. I have read this thread, I have read several articles on the matter, and I have read both of Wizards' official statements concerning the matter. And it's clear as day to me that WotC is in the right.
See, what you fail to realize is that WotC isn't some grandfatherly benefactor entity who exists to make us happy. They are a business first, as they should be, and any business worth its salt would go through any measures it can to preserve its intellectual property. Furthermore, this was clearly not a one time deal- let's stop pretending that one morning Oath of the Gatewatch Spoilers showed up on Facebook, and then the next suspensions were handed down. This was ongoing over multiple sets, for months, even years, and to make things worse, this was being done by individuals that had earned some measure of trust from WotC in getting their judging certification. Whether or not their status as judges helped them obtain this information is irrelevant- they betrayed WotC's trust by gaining the information and then spreading it.
"But... but... they didn't know!" Spare me. These aren't weekend casual players we're talking about here. These are hardened magic players, immersed in the game and culture enough to take a test to gain a leadership role within it. And part of that leadership role is knowing when something's wrong, and when to do the right thing. They clearly failed on this, and failed for several months, and now they're paying the consequences.
"But... but... one even helped with the investigation!" I always take this with a grain of salt, especially when it concerns something that had been going on a long time. What were that person's motives? Were they legitimately upset over property being stolen (unlikely, or else they'd have reported this sooner). Likely it was an individual who was either about to be busted, and thus trying to save his hide, or was otherwise hoping his cooperation would get him ahead somewhere.
This was never about WOTC looking "sparkling white and clean". WOTC was put in a situation where they had to be the bad guy, and they did what they had to do. You can't pull weeds and not expect to get a little muddy. Now some of these people will get appeals, and I'm sure a few will be overturned. That's fair. But in the end, this is their game, and their property. Protecting that is, and should be, the number one priority.
You sound like a shill for the company at this point. WotC is without a doubt in the right...despite the horrible PR this created for them, this was the best solution...that's your take? Oh, and 'I take this part of the argument with a grain of salt' is not remotely objective, it's a complete bias. So, yeah, forgive me if entertaining commentaries such as these makes me sincerely doubt that you're informed. Quite the opposite, if your two cents is to completely doubt one half of the argument and accept WotC playing 'the bad guy' was their only viable solution to the issue, you either came into the issue with a bias or developed one from what you've read. Either way, it's not objective enough and zealotry on this board runs deep enough to leave you to your peace and not bother arguing the point further - your opinion can't be swayed.
I'm not a shill, just someone who understands how the real world works, and ultimately, when push comes to shove, who's game this really is. Wizards was forced to make a decision on the issue, and that they went for what was right instead of what was PR friendly gained my respect.
And casting serious doubts on the true motives of the "whistleblower" is objectivity in its finest. The bias lies in the people who swallow immediately that "he helped Wizards, so he should get a pass". True objectivity is realizing there's something far deeper than the surface there. Obviously I made some conjecture with my hypothesis to the reason, but I wouldn't be surprised if I was at least somewhat right on that.
But look at where the true zealotry lies- the people bashing Wizards. If all parties were reinstated tomorrow, those who think wizards were in the right would simply shrug and move on. It's the other side that is in borderline conniptions on the matter.
...or it's the 'us vs. them' mentality you're displaying that has us in this mess in the first place. That culture of thought Wizards has created, fostered, and/or catered to not just in this PR nightmare, but every one like it over the past year.
You're wrong. It isn't their game. They can't just take their ball and go home. It doesn't belong solely to the community, either. We can't enjoy the game if they're not making it. So how about a little respect for the fact that it's a symbiotic relationship where one can't live without the will of the other, and maybe this was a step in the wrong direction?
EDIT: Also...this is how the real world works? I'm sorry, but this literally could not have ever happened anywhere in the 'real world'. There have been at least two lawyers in this thread alone that have explained exactly why this couldn't have happened in any real, damning way if not for the fact that this was basically an at-will temporary termination of volunteers. If they were employees, WotC would be looking at a lawsuit for the ham-fisted way this was handled, even if ALL parties were guilty, the proof is tenuous at best. So, please, spare me the condescension.
As for WotC looking like the bad guy or doing what they had to do/ban people, I disagree with that sentiment 100%. They simply do NOTHING and that makes them look different than the bad guy and the do what needed to be done guy they are simply the same as they were a month ago. All WotC looks like now is a ******* ass hole who goes on power trips because they can.
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I think if there is a dip in sales, they're going to blame spoilers again and say they've solved the problem with their community policing. When the next set doesn't do as well as they thought, they'll blame the spoilers from OGW for damaging their marketing permanently or some bull***** like that.
If numbers go up, they'll credit their heavy handed response and Trick's amazing article convincing us all that they wer 100% right. When in reality, it's probably because the playerbase is growing. Still.
Everyone needs to take a step back, review ALL the information that has been coming out, and then form an opinion.
Also, to repeat a previous point I made, I am willing to bet that the string of 3 month bans are because these people have advanced knowledge of the cards, and that gives them an unfair advantage when it comes to competitive play.
Of course, if you want to the person that sits down across from someone that had set information weeks or months ahead of time and was able to build decks using those cards, dont be crying after saying that the game wasnt fair because they had more time to build with OGW
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That doesn't make it any more, or any less right (depending on your point of view). Just because we're assuming that many players are ignorant of the situation, doesn't mean it's not a situation worth discussion and attention.
My current trade binder.
"People most likely to cry "troll" are those who can't fathom holding a position for reasons unrelated to how they want to be perceived"
Ugh. Don't put words in my mouth. You're responding to a point that no one was making. There are some here who contend that it's WotC's action, not the leaks themselves, that will cause financial damage to WotC via poor sales of Oath. Such is not the case, because not enough people are aware, and even fewer care.
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Lol, there is NOT gonna be a 10% dip in sales from the banning a few judges most people have never heard of. It's just not gonna happen. Most people don't read the mothership either, and even if you did, you would only see wizards view of it and think that they had banned a long-running spoiler ring, which seems perfectly reasonable.
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So what that would suggest is an education campaign is in order
My current trade binder.
"People most likely to cry "troll" are those who can't fathom holding a position for reasons unrelated to how they want to be perceived"
People talk about a whistleblower, which I'm pretty sure is just hearsay since the leaks happened, if the whistle was blown we can presume that WoTC would have been able to stop them from reaching the wider public. I'm pretty sure that when people refer to the "whistleblower" the are referring to Robert of the MTG Focus podcast, who in the most recent episode discusses his version of events and interviews Helene Bergeot. We learn that Robert tweeted the images of Kozilek and the wastes, I'm not clear as to whether he was a member of the private Facebook group or someone from the group sent him the images. Robert claims that he thought they were fake. A short time after the leaked images began to spread, Robert received a call from WoTC when he began cooperating with the investigation from his own admission to make the outcome better for him. WoTC does have the right to protects its work,
I think that WoTC's stance is clear and reasonable, they are just asking people to stop and think before they act. The definition of public and private is pretty clear in regards to internet and doesnt need to be defined specially by Wizards. A public forum is one like this, where anyone can read it or join and make posts, you can use an internet search engine and find results that lead to posts on this forum. A private forum is one the is not searchable by the public, you need an invitation or to apply to be a member of before you can access it. Luckily searching the internet is easy and documentable, if you are a member of a private forum and you see a leaked card which may or may not be real, all you have to do is a simple internet search using your favorite search engine if nothing comes up then you know the leaked information hasn't reached the wider public, you can then either keep quiet and risk punitive action or send WoTC an email saying hey I came across this in a private forum, thought you should know. I can't imagine the process taking more than 5 minutes.
I don't know how WotC's internal politics works, but they probably made the decision based on the insistence of the legal department or some higher-ups from Hasbro. Anybody who could say "hey, this is a bad decision and is going to rile some of our most dedicated customers" weren't in the decision-making process. Suspending a large swath of participants from the group was probably because they have no way to determine who was and wasn't involved in passing on leaks. What happened afterward was massively mishandled, however and their PR staff were not prepared to provide a sufficient justification for the decision. The public statement made it seem like an implicit threat to the community if they fail to report better leaks when better wording could have avoided a lot of misunderstanding and concern in the community.
The man who leaked the cards to the public did not so out of malicious intent, but still screwed up. Having access to leaks in private is one thing, but before reposting them you should be asking yourself things like "where did this come from". If it's on an Imgur post or a public venue, everybody's already seen it, the leak has already hit the wild, and the damage is already done. If you're getting it from a private source, you should be thinking about the consequences of making private information public.
The community reaction has probably been the worst part of this. Shutting down MagicJudge's system does more to hurt tournament organizers and local game stores more than it'll ever hurt WoTC. The complete vitriol and bile towards the company, especially towards staff who had no say in the suspensions, is unhelpful and is just going to make them less likely to compromise with the DCI and players if this ever happens again.
My sympathies are with any of the judges who were truly innocent of wrongdoing and were suspended regardless, any of the WotC staff who have to answer to the community at this time, and any of the players and judges who are just sick of this drama already.
Tangential side note, the fact that these guys are judges is completely irrelevant. Saying otherwise implies that there are two sets of rules, one for judges and one for the rest of us.
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I HIGHLY doubt BFZ's poor sales were due to leaks, that set was really pretty terrible both power wise and value wise. Other than the expedition lands, there wasn't much in BFZ. Only Gideon is the only non expedition land card that had any power or value behind it.
My current trade binder.
"People most likely to cry "troll" are those who can't fathom holding a position for reasons unrelated to how they want to be perceived"
Meh, they'll bounce back if they do a good job on Innistrad.
My current trade binder.
"People most likely to cry "troll" are those who can't fathom holding a position for reasons unrelated to how they want to be perceived"
The fact that they're judges is irrelevant. They are people who did something wrong, and must now deal with the consequences. They only happened to be judges, and they don't enjoy the luxury of leniency because of their title.
My 720 Peasant Cube
The way I will always understand this line is "People who disagree with my PoV and cannot think like me can't think at all."
If you read through this whole thread, there were plenty of critical points brought up by many folks. Is that judge on his podcast making excuses, sure he is and who cares.
While you seem to think on the basis of parent/child where judges are children owing some loyalty to the parent company for making this product, this completely ignores the fact that all the cards' information are held by WotC first and foremost. You don't want your product info to leak? Protect it. Don't start hunting down people who have the pictures and throw empty legal threats at them and when they cooperate with you when you don't even have a shred of information, punish them. Consequently, this upsets the community of players that pay for your product and also makes holding tournaments harder; all because you were too lax with your own security?? And got upset because it wasn't spoiled he way you wanted it to? They aren't even employees! How in the world are they getting access to your cards?!
This isn't how you handle it. You handle it with tact and composure, not just rushing bans and scrambling with threats.
WotC has been having a huge string of bad PR moves and products for quite a bit and they have been hit hard. Why should I forgive and forget their poor decisions as if they are some sort of god entity (or parental figure in your case)?
Reminder:
MM2015 was completely wasted as expensive draft/sealed rather than reprinting staples that are in high demand. Not only that they failed to produce a good product with very high rates of mistakes (foiled rusted relics fiasco, empty boosters, boxes having the exact same cards everywhere, etc) and also used a product with high foil rates (1 in each booster) with a new packaging that damages these cards.
BfZ was printed solely for limited and somewhat standard with themes that proved to be unwanted, generating a degenerate standard with goodstuff.dec. The use of expeditions as a gimmick was the only redeeming point, if even considered that. No cards have made it in any other format with the exception of 2 because of how watered down that set was.
Commander 2015 saw very poor sales in my area with the same complaint: very watered down set even though EDH includes many powerful cards and staples.
OGW so far shows mythics are aren't powerful yet again with even its main villain proving to be useless and the inclusion of a "new mana symbol".
I still hear complaints about their MTGO platform that hasn't gotten fixed. It's been what? A year of complaining?
Legacy was abandoned as a format due to their lack of support. But god forbid they reprint legacy staples...
Additionally, the fact that their key figure keeps making bad moves and gets away with it while still allowed to represent the company is beyond me. Reminder that MaRo spiked fetchland prices overnight with a statement he should never have mentioned. Was it beneficial for the company? No. It was beneficial for the secondary market only. Nobody else.
This is all besides the point that they keep following directives they think are great and are encouraged when they clearly aren't, such as their printing policies and lack of support for players. Case in point, they wanted to spoil Kozilek as part of the storyline because they wanted to turn their focus on storytelling more than the actual game; why the hell would the player community at whom this product is aimed at even care?! They want cards, good cards to play with, not a weekly teaser!
This is also besides the several other PR issues they have had concerning players such as unfair bannings, failures to ban in the past even when cheating was caught on tape, bannings for SJW reasons and now this debacle where several tournaments can't occur in the south east because they can't get their ***** together.
So if getting fed up with their lack of judgement, poor decisions and lack of responsibility is "lack of critical thinking", then you clearly you don't understand the customer/seller dynamic.
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I don't think you actually have a firm understanding of how this went down.
I often see the argument that they can just reprint cards not on the Reserved List, but the issue there is that this just causes a corresponding increase in the price of the cards that are on the Reserved List. Reprinting non-RL Legacy cards is really just a band-aid solution. To support Legacy they have to get rid of the list, and they seem unable/unwilling to do so.
How exactly is this any different than when the set spoiler came out and there were no fetchlands? It would have had the exact same effect (and been the exact same thing functionally, someone from the company saying the fetchlands wouldn't be in the set), it just would've happened a few weeks later.
What failures to ban have there been when cheating was caught on tape? All of the tape-caught cheating (and I mean definite cheating, not something that could possibly be excused as a goof) I can think of did result in bans.
My bigger problem is that cheaters should be getting significantly longer bans than they've been getting. Guys like Trevor Humphreys, Steven Speck, and Alex Bertoncini should be banned for life, not for just a few years.
Hear me out. If they broke a law, then it would be a legal issue and not a DCI issue. Legal action wasn't taken, so no law was broken.
So, it's a DCI issue because they were banned. So, which printed DCI rule did they break? Please tell me where in the rules it says you can't do this.
If you want a ton more info (generalized and to the point) go check the most recent MTG Focus podcast where someone who was hit with a 3year ban tells you his side and then follows it all up with an interview with a WotC official.
It's really, really scary what WotC is doing. Basically, you CAN NOT post MTG cards that aren't already released in sets (yes, even no fake cards if they are anything close to resembling something that could be real) or risk ~3 YEAR bans. WotC want you to not only vet your sources of said image (no matter where you find it, facebook/twitter/instagram/etc.) BUT, you need to search the internet and research the info/image yourself to make sure it isn't a spoiler. And yeah, don't try posting it and then reporting it to WotC because you could easily still get hit with a 3year ban... *mind blown.
I thought we were in an age of getting rid of bullies? Because basically, WotC is bullying everyone and anything (especially a site like this) with huge bans for posting OR REPOSTING anything spoilish what-so-ever. Instead of taking responsibility themselves (for leaks), WotC is attempting to force anyone who wants to continue to play their game into being anti-spoiler backyard heroes. It's bullying at it's finest... and very naive in today's information age. I'm really surprised more peeps running this site haven't come out with statements.