forbid only sees play in edh and casual tables as it is. what the **** makes you think it would be different just because it was reprinted? no 3 mana counters see play in modern, and a buyback cost won't change that.
If a 3 mana counterspell that doesn't have to go to the graveyard isn't playable then Magic has enourmous problems. A really good sign we're at the end of the road for magic is when the powercreep is so bad that Forbid "Isn't playable".
Forbid can be solid, if situational, but if I remember correctly it only shone so brightly back in it's day due to the prevalence of instant card draw. In the right environment the stars could align and it could shine again, but in most situations, it is Cancel. In particular, the state of modern would have to change considerably for me to picture any deck willing to invest that heavy double blue for a counterspell, and be consistently willing and able to pitch 2 to buyback it (Keeping in mind that buying it back doesn't make the second cast free, and 1UU is really clunky). Maybe it could see niche use in a sideboard or as a 1/2-of. Still can't really see it.
How does Forbid stack up against RDW, Abzan, Grixis, and Tron?
Serious question. Can the -2 to cards in hand keep up with these decks considering what else would be run in a deck with forbid with the modern cardpool?
It is not that hard of a concept: you don't use the buyback if you think it is not worth it.
Actually it's a hard enough concept for you to specify an event where you would use the -2 to cards in hand.
It's a strong card, but I think it would have a rather narrow role in modern, if at all. Unless your deck is geared for making a forbid "lock" you'll end up losing very quickly if you buy it back too often. The flexibility to play it a second time would definitely make it the most powerful 3cc counterspell in modern; however, that is actually pretty slow. It would be a 1-2 of in some control or, possibly, combo decks, not a big revolution.
Actually, I think absorb would have a bigger impact--the three life would be very useful for a number of decks, even if the card is "less powerful" generally than forbid.
It's not going to matter though, WotC doesn't like buyback--we'd be more likely to see a cancel with flashback. Buyback is too hard to cost appropriately for most effects.
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Forbid requires some sort of card-advantage engine to really shine. Back in the day this was typically Ophidian or Whispers of the Muse. Modern doesn't much one-side card advantage, so it might only be good in Owling Mine or some such.
Remind me of the last time a three mana counterspell was good enough to play in Modern.
You: "Forbid your Tasigur that you paid one mana for, pitching two cards for buyback."
Opponent: "Stubborn Denial." (or Dispel, or Remand, or Spell Pierce, etc, etc.)
Alternatively:
Opponent: "Play Cavern of Souls, naming Eldrazi. Cast Reality Smasher."
You: ... *thinking about this Forbid rotting in your hand*
In a world of so many powerful one-mana plays, you couldn't pay me to 2-for-1 or 3-for-1 myself while casting a three-mana counterspell. That's assuming you even get to the point where you can cast it. On the play, any number of decks will have already played multiple high impact cards by the time your third turn rolls around.
I'm a die-hard blue mage and I love Forbid, but it wouldn't even be a blip on the radar in the Modern format unless some DRASTIC changes to said format were to occur. Not to mention, it is insanely difficult to generate sufficient card advantage in Modern to make up for the cost of paying buyback on the card that you REALLY have to want to have two "Cancels" to make throwing two cards away in addition to what is most likely the majority of your mana for the turn worth it.
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States '09: 14th place. Aiming for better next year.
States '10: 12th place. Aiming for better next year.
yeah, but blue still needs better counterspells, so why not talk about one of the best if not the best.
It's really good if you can get to it. Long lives politics in FFA lol. It's even more ape***** crazy there.
You wish to discuss Arcane denial, Force of will or Mana Drain. While I might be a fan of such spells I am not sure of modern could react well to such spells....
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If a 3 mana counterspell that doesn't have to go to the graveyard isn't playable then Magic has enourmous problems. A really good sign we're at the end of the road for magic is when the powercreep is so bad that Forbid "Isn't playable".
Actually it's a hard enough concept for you to specify an event where you would use the -2 to cards in hand.
Actually, I think absorb would have a bigger impact--the three life would be very useful for a number of decks, even if the card is "less powerful" generally than forbid.
It's not going to matter though, WotC doesn't like buyback--we'd be more likely to see a cancel with flashback. Buyback is too hard to cost appropriately for most effects.
in that deck it's almost a full lockdown.
everywhere else is not much more than a Cancel but it can be alright.
They're not going to reprint it, even if its too slow for modern.
Forbid
+
Prophet of Kruphix
+
Consecrated Sphinx
=
unbeatable edh
They should probably ban one of those cards in EDH. That combo seems really good.
Oh, and this is a two year old thread you necroed.
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It's really good if you can get to it. Long lives politics in FFA lol. It's even more ape***** crazy there.
Yeah, i can't see Forbid ever being allowed in Modern.
**Legacy**
Grixis Delver
16post
**Standard**
I'll let you know if/when i go back to Standard. I hate pulling cards i can't use.
You: "Forbid your Tasigur that you paid one mana for, pitching two cards for buyback."
Opponent: "Stubborn Denial." (or Dispel, or Remand, or Spell Pierce, etc, etc.)
Alternatively:
Opponent: "Play Cavern of Souls, naming Eldrazi. Cast Reality Smasher."
You: ... *thinking about this Forbid rotting in your hand*
In a world of so many powerful one-mana plays, you couldn't pay me to 2-for-1 or 3-for-1 myself while casting a three-mana counterspell. That's assuming you even get to the point where you can cast it. On the play, any number of decks will have already played multiple high impact cards by the time your third turn rolls around.
I'm a die-hard blue mage and I love Forbid, but it wouldn't even be a blip on the radar in the Modern format unless some DRASTIC changes to said format were to occur. Not to mention, it is insanely difficult to generate sufficient card advantage in Modern to make up for the cost of paying buyback on the card that you REALLY have to want to have two "Cancels" to make throwing two cards away in addition to what is most likely the majority of your mana for the turn worth it.
States '09: 14th place. Aiming for better next year.
States '10: 12th place. Aiming for better next year.
Idaho State Champ: 2011
States '12: 5th place.
You wish to discuss Arcane denial, Force of will or Mana Drain. While I might be a fan of such spells I am not sure of modern could react well to such spells....