Not really. I find it really odd what they choose to make rare and not mythic and vice versa. Tasigur, the golden fang could easily be a mythic it's at least more mythic than brutal hordechief. Same is true of monastery mentor, soulfire grand master, and some others but especially soulfire grand master, which is a 2/2 for 2 with some meaningless text on it the buyback ability on it makes it feel a little mythic but buyback was keyworded on a lot of cards that weren't rare or even uncommon granted capsize was a huge mistake at common for limited and is up there with jitte and pack rat in terms of how balanced it was in its respective environment but still. Only scary thought is that buyback was a keyword before some current magic players were born.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
Not really. I find it really odd what they choose to make rare and not mythic and vice versa. Tasigur, the golden fang could easily be a mythic it's at least more mythic than brutal hordechief. Same is true of monastery mentor, soulfire grand master, and some others but especially soulfire grand master, which is a 2/2 for 2 with some meaningless text on it the buyback ability on it makes it feel a little mythic but buyback was keyworded on a lot of cards that weren't rare or even uncommon granted capsize was a huge mistake at common for limited and is up there with jitte and pack rat in terms of how balanced it was in its respective environment but still. Only scary thought is that buyback was a keyword before some current magic players were born.
Didn't Wizards say they made the Fate Reforged Khans rare so that players would get to open them and play with them more often in the prerelease? I know I read that somewhere...but I agree Tasigur could easily have been mythic. Same for Alesha and Yasova. Every time I see a Yasova come out of a pack, for a split second I think it's a mythich. I'm really glad they aren't, though. Mythic Tasigur would make Monastery Mentor look cheap.
FRF's mythics mostly seem to be about either "what's the most interesting thing we can do with the mechanics?" or Future-Sight-esque callbacks to well-known/beloved cards (fitting given the time-travel theme). Or both in some cases.
Ugin: planeswalker (auto-mythic) call back to Nicol Bolas, who he fights
Monastery Mentor: push prowess to the limit + call back to Young Pyromancer
Soulfire Grand Master: push prowess from a different angle
Temporal Trespass: call back to Time Walk, in the vein of KTK's delve call back to Ancestral Recall
Torrent Elemental: push delve from a different angle, possible call back to casual-beloved and Food Chain's best buddy Misthollow Griffin
Brutal Hordechief: call back to Hellrider
Ghastly Conscription: different angle on manifest + call back to Living Death
Shaman of the Great Hunt: "what if we made a thing with a ferocious ability that also makes your stuff ferocious?"
Warden of the First Tree: straight call back to Figure of Destiny
Whisperwood Elemental: push manifest as hard as is humanly possible
Soulfire should be mythic. Bear body for 2 is fair and limited playable as is. Turns bolt into Helix? If you asked someone during original Ravnica they would probably ask if Wizards had been smoking something funny to print that powerlevel.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
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EDH BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern: RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
Mythic creatures tend to be just creatures with more upsides for less mana, so especially in Khans the mythic slot is full of super strong creatures, theres pretty much nothing you would take over a mythic creature in a booster, simply because they are "that" busted.
A strange thing in the last bunch of sets is that effects that give "extra turns" are just upgraded to mythic for no appearent reason, just because extra turns are supposed to be "mythic" level ; quite random.
Chance that a mythic creature isnt just a pile of abilities and undercosted is low. There are some, but you will notice fairly easily.
But for non-creature mythics .... (Planeswalkers beside)
Well, they tend to be just random and not really good in Limited at all. (unless they are mass-removal)
I don't know if they're getting weaker per-se, because many times the mythic tag is really about flavor and not necessarily power level. As a strictly EDH player, I don't mind that the power level of mythics fluctuate and I LOVE the flavor that many come attached to.
Soulfire should be mythic. Bear body for 2 is fair and limited playable as is. Turns bolt into Helix? If you asked someone during original Ravnica they would probably ask if Wizards had been smoking something funny to print that powerlevel.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Soulfire should be mythic. Bear body for 2 is fair and limited playable as is. Turns bolt into Helix? If you asked someone during original Ravnica they would probably ask if Wizards had been smoking something funny to print that powerlevel.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
Soulfire should be mythic. Bear body for 2 is fair and limited playable as is. Turns bolt into Helix? If you asked someone during original Ravnica they would probably ask if Wizards had been smoking something funny to print that powerlevel.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
Beating someone in limited while using Descent into Madness would be pretty much the coolest thing.
But I agree, there's good and bad mythics. Many of the "bad" mythics just have a specialized narrow purpose. A good example of this is Ugin's Nexus.
When I opened my second one I just thought "This could have been a sarkhan."
Soulfire should be mythic. Bear body for 2 is fair and limited playable as is. Turns bolt into Helix? If you asked someone during original Ravnica they would probably ask if Wizards had been smoking something funny to print that powerlevel.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
I dunno, I might consider Sage of Hours pack 3 if I already had a good Heroic targeting package.
Perhaps, but given that the topic was Pack 1 Pick 1, I'd say that point is moot.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I think that in general mythics should be niche. But what we're getting a lot of the time is either a mythic that is just pushed to the limit with abilities and mana cost that make it the exact opposite of niche, or something that fits a niche that doesn't exist.
Ive noticed what the OP says. They do seem to be getting less useful. And harder to work with.
For instance, Torrent Elemental.
Its a 5 cost for a 3/5 flyer. Im sorry but thats nothing to be amazed about. So already we have 1 strike against it.
Now if it was a 3 or 2 cost, you would definitely catch my attention, and it would definitel make it seem mythic, legendary, powerful etc. Isnt that the essence of mythic, omnipotent, etc?
Next whenever you attack, tap all opponents creatures, hey thats not bad. Sounds good. But for 5 mana, and can easily be burned, or bounced....that 5 mana is kinda hurting me now. Maybe if it was again 2 or 3 mana, I would mind as much.
And then not only can I play it as a 3/5 flyer for 5 mana, i can play it tapped at any time as a 3/5 flyer for 5 mana.Eh somewhat good but somewhat bad. Yea its gonna be played as an instant alot during the opponents turn, but I just feel that the main problem with this card is its high mana cost. since mana ramp for blue is nearly non existant, I dont see this card ever becoming very good. It might do ok in some late game scenarios, but the high mana cost has me saying why the hell is this mythic and not a rare?
ok how about Whisperwood Elemental?
again 5 cost for a 4/4. what is with these high mana costs. I can get a 1/1 for 1 mana. a 2/2 for 1 or 2 mana. a 3/3 for 3 mana....etc... maybe not in standard necessarily, but shouldnt a MYTHIC rare stand the tests of time? and go down in history as something MYTHIC? LEGENDARY? something that makes me go yea, that was a good card. Everyone knows JTMS, but will everyone know Whisperwood Elemental in 5 years? I highly doubt that.
Lets break this card down outsite of the high mana cost.
We get to first manifest the top card of our library. I say nay. So i can potentially abuse lands and instants and sorceries as creatures. Great. That does me no good, as I might really need those cards to not be creatures. Or I can basically morph my 2/2 creatures for their mana cost, which might be worse than a 2/2. Manifest has some potential, but Im just not seeing it, unless you run creature heavy conditions for winning.
worh the 5 mana? maybe at this point, but is it worth the 5 mana in a whole? Im just not seeing it, unless again im running creatures heavily.
Or I can sack it and give all my creatures, basically regeneration with 2/2s. Wonderful, you better be hoping you play this in a lame game, with a creature heavy win con, or you just possibly wasted another 3rd or half of your deck as creatures...
worth the 5 mana? im only seeing it for creature heavy win con decks. Truly mythic? No, at best this is a Rare.
Next look at Warden of the First Tree.
All this is is a level up creature. With ok abilities. Nothing Id wanna brag about. Easily burned. Worth the mythic rating? Hell no.
Ghastly Consciption next.
7 mana to abuse your opponents graveyard. Not bad. Heres a card thats more or less worth the mana. but thats 1 card thats faily good out of 4 already.
late in the game, this manifest is one thats actually not a letdown as I dont have to potentially waste my deck, and it helps defeat delve.
Brutal Hordchief next.
here we go again. 4 for a 3/3. ugh. ok so what are the effects, are they worth the extra mana?
Whenever a creature you control attacks, defending player loses a life and you gain a life. Not bad, but your gonna need to have a few of these on the field, to really abuse this power.
Creatures your ooponents control block this turn and you choose how they block. Not bad again. Great though? Im not seeing it. So I can make your beasties block my deathouchers and and your weenies block my tramplers, etc.. or I can make you double or triple+ block my creatures to try and wipe the board.
Not bad. Again though, is it worth the 5 mana? maybe? thats in total a 9 cost affect. Late in the game this card would be good, again for creature heavy decks is what I make of it. Like Ghastly Consciption, this card is somewhat worth the Mythic rating. Though thats pushing it.
Temporal Tresspass
Hey for 3 mana, or 11 if you want, I can take an extra turn. Pretty damn good.
But where does this put us? 3 good mythics out of 6. Can you see why the OP feels the way they do, I sure can.
whats next?
Soulfire Grand Master.
2 mana for a 2/2. Now we are talking, though maybe for a 3/3 would be more mythic sounding. Lifelink, hey look at that. Not bad. lets continue.
Instant and socery spells you control have lifelink, dafuq? I have seen alot of talk and debate about this. If I manifest a instant or sorcery spell as a 2/2 does it have lifelink? but how would that be possible if i dont control an instant or sorcery spell, because I control a 2/2 creature instead?
Maybe I can burn you and get life out of it? Maybe this is a troll card. Hell if I know.
The next time you cast an instant or sorcery spell, when it resolved put it back in to your hand. Now we are talking. This reminds me of buyback, or the Unhinged card Stop That somewhat. But this effect cost 4 mana in addition to the mana of the spell we cast. Similar to buyback. But that will make this card a high target for removal or burn etc. So wouldnt we want to truly make this mythic by bumping it to a 2/4 at the very least, maybe a 2/5?
Good card but the low toughness given its abilities makes me see this card as a Rare, not mythic. Now we have 3 good mythics out of 7 cards.
Next we have Monastery Mentor, which theres been a lot of talk about.
3 mana for a 2/2 prowess. Ok not bad but you could have given me a 3/3 or a 2/3 to emphasize the mythic rarity.
Whenever you cast a noncreature spell, get a 1/1 prowess creature. Not bad.
Id say other than the 2/2 part for 3 mana, this card is deserving of the mythic rarity. now we are back to 4 decent mythics out of 8 reviewed cards. again 50%. again I can agree with the OP's feelings.
Next we have Ugin, the Spirit Dragon. The only dragon ive seen since ive heard about dragons being in F/R
8 for a 7 loyalty counter. Not bad. Lets continue though.
+2 and I get to burn for 3. ok ok.
-X I get to exile each permamanent for a converted mana cost thats 1 or more colors. Again not bad not bad.
-10 I get to buffer my game for the number of 7 cards drawn, 7 life, and 7 permanents onto the battlefield.
All of this last effect is great, other than the lifegain. 7 life? thats it? not 10? not 7 times the amount of cards in my hand?
Ok maybe that last suggestion is pushing it, but I just took 10 counters off and all I get is 7 life? But people say you get to draw 7 cards too!
Now I potentially get to have to discard cards I might need. Its a give and take situation. But you get to put 7 permanents out, and what if I dont have any? What if I just drew into 7 cards not creatures, lands, or artifacts, or the majority arent? Seems underpowered if you ask me.
So out of 9 reviewed cards we have 4 that are decent, not EYE POPPING AMAZING, but decent, and we have an ok planeswalker.
So we are looking at 50%+ cards that deserve the mythic rarity, and 4 that dont. WHY?
Why not all of them? I know that WOTC has to balance the game, and not all mythics have gone down in history, but I do notice a trend in mythic rares ever losing their mythic-ness.
Thanks for taken the time for the write up. I agree with your card assessments. Monastery Mentor as a 2/2 should be a regular rare. Mentor as a 2/4, which would get it out of Bile blight and Anger of the gods range that would be Mythic.
Completely broken =/= mythic. Also, I wouldn't put much stock in the writings of someone who is unsure of whether or not manifested sorceries would be granted lifelink from Soulfire Grand Master. That's an incredibly obvious interaction (or non-interaction, as it were).
Perhaps, but given that the topic was Pack 1 Pick 1, I'd say that point is moot.
I P1P1'd a Sage of Hours, then was passed Prophetic Flamespeaker. Built a pretty sweet UR aggro Heroic deck out of it. Went 3-1.
And Sage of Hours is "still" a bad card, even if your deck is heroic.
Literally any other heroic is better, especially as its "mythic" ability is incredible bad too (if you ever get to use it, you win anyway, if not, you are just durdling around).
Prophetic Flamespeaker on the other hand, well thats a bomb and that will win just by the card advantage, or any form of interaction that gives it a boost ; be it +3/+1 or an Ordeal, anything is sick with this card.
I can't just say something even simple without someone having to get all technical and *****? Dude **** this forum. No one here sees just how ****ed up this place is. Half are trolls. Half are pompous ********s. With a sprinkling of nice people. Burn in hell.
You are my new hero. No, I'm not being sarcastic.
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Modern: U Merfolk GWUBR 5 Color Humans UBW Esper Gifts GW Bogles
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Didn't Wizards say they made the Fate Reforged Khans rare so that players would get to open them and play with them more often in the prerelease? I know I read that somewhere...but I agree Tasigur could easily have been mythic. Same for Alesha and Yasova. Every time I see a Yasova come out of a pack, for a split second I think it's a mythich. I'm really glad they aren't, though. Mythic Tasigur would make Monastery Mentor look cheap.
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Lightning Bolts don't kill creatures. State-based actions kill creatures.
I would instead suggest that no mythic is ever "bad" just more niche than usual. Bad rares are a thing but if you opened a mythic in your first pack in draft would you pass it? Probably not.
BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern:
RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
Mythic creatures tend to be just creatures with more upsides for less mana, so especially in Khans the mythic slot is full of super strong creatures, theres pretty much nothing you would take over a mythic creature in a booster, simply because they are "that" busted.
A strange thing in the last bunch of sets is that effects that give "extra turns" are just upgraded to mythic for no appearent reason, just because extra turns are supposed to be "mythic" level ; quite random.
Chance that a mythic creature isnt just a pile of abilities and undercosted is low. There are some, but you will notice fairly easily.
Just browse the standard mythic creatures : Mythic Creatures in Type 2
But for non-creature mythics .... (Planeswalkers beside)
Well, they tend to be just random and not really good in Limited at all. (unless they are mass-removal)
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You pulled an Archangel's Light. Will you keep it? Or how about Reap Intellect? Sage of Hours? Descent into Madness perhaps? There are BAD mythics even in draft.
Admittedly, when you use Draft as your metric, a lot of "bad" mythics become a lot less bad.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Let me just link to you all the the Shards of Alara block Mythic Rares
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?output=spoiler&method=visual&action=advanced&format= ["Shards of Alara Block"]&rarity= [M]
Nothing has changed except people's expectations.
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Beating someone in limited while using Descent into Madness would be pretty much the coolest thing.
But I agree, there's good and bad mythics. Many of the "bad" mythics just have a specialized narrow purpose. A good example of this is Ugin's Nexus.
When I opened my second one I just thought "This could have been a sarkhan."
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Perhaps, but given that the topic was Pack 1 Pick 1, I'd say that point is moot.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Completely broken =/= mythic. Also, I wouldn't put much stock in the writings of someone who is unsure of whether or not manifested sorceries would be granted lifelink from Soulfire Grand Master. That's an incredibly obvious interaction (or non-interaction, as it were).
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I P1P1'd a Sage of Hours, then was passed Prophetic Flamespeaker. Built a pretty sweet UR aggro Heroic deck out of it. Went 3-1.
And Sage of Hours is "still" a bad card, even if your deck is heroic.
Literally any other heroic is better, especially as its "mythic" ability is incredible bad too (if you ever get to use it, you win anyway, if not, you are just durdling around).
Prophetic Flamespeaker on the other hand, well thats a bomb and that will win just by the card advantage, or any form of interaction that gives it a boost ; be it +3/+1 or an Ordeal, anything is sick with this card.
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