So last night i played my second fnm round against a person who shuffled their every game from start to finish. Not quietly either, fairly loud and obnoxious slapping like sound. At one point he was down to 1 card in hand and switched to flicking it back and fourth. After the first game i asked if he could stop as it was quite distracting. He responded by saying that it wasnt against the rules and that it was something he did in order to annoy and frustrate his opponents in hopes of them making mistakes. I imagine it isnt against the rules but is there anything besides just scooping and giving up the match, that i can do in a situation like this?
If he's doing it loudly enough to cause a distraction, ask him to quiet down (even if only to say you did before escalating). If he doesn't, call a judge. There's nothing wrong with shuffling your hand, but there is something wrong with being excessively obnoxious, which can become Unsporting Conduct, especially if he admits to doing it as a distraction (although whether it counts or not is ultimately up to the judge).
I find myself doing it when I'm playing, it's more of like a tick or just a meditation thing for me where I let my mind focus on the strategy and don't really pay attention to what my hands are doing. I've never had anyone complain about it in tourney/FNM, though if I'm playing at home, my wife is likely to slap me when I do it. It's just something I think people do. If you've ever watched Brian Kibler play, he must have to re-sleeve several times a tourney.
As far as it being a distraction, I'd ask the player to stop. If they appear to be disingenuous and continue to do it, sure, call a judge over.
I was all supportive of your opponent until he said that he was doing it on purpose to distract. At that point, you should call a judge. I do it too, but not on purpose, it's mostly because I always have to be doing something with my hands. I'm also the guy who will constantly click his pen during class...
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I find myself doing it when I'm playing, it's more of like a tick or just a meditation thing for me where I let my mind focus on the strategy and don't really pay attention to what my hands are doing. I've never had anyone complain about it in tourney/FNM, though if I'm playing at home, my wife is likely to slap me when I do it. It's just something I think people do. If you've ever watched Brian Kibler play, he must have to re-sleeve several times a tourney.
As far as it being a distraction, I'd ask the player to stop. If they appear to be disingenuous and continue to do it, sure, call a judge over.
I understand that some people do it out of habit or for just something to do with their hands and ive never had a problem with anyone doing it until last night. This guy was just way over the top doing it, probably because like he said he was purposely trying to annoy and get under his opponents skin, which just happened to be me.
Various people at my LGS shuffle their cards in their hands while playing as well. I suspect they do it to emulate Brian Kibler. It's more annoying, than impressive, though.
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Focused on limited for now. Occasionally play some standard/modern as well.
I'm not going to lie I shuffle my cards in my hand sometimes. I try not to do it to much though. It helps me think to be honest and I enjoy the sound (mine isn't loud or anything). But if a player were to ask me to stop I would. I feel it it rather childish to try and distract your opponent in hopes that they misplay.
I don't care what anyone says about nervous tick or whatever bull****. I'm sure you guys know its annoying and yet you keep it up.
People do it to annoy their opponents in hopes their play will suffer. I'm sure if it was something that enhanced the play of your opponent you certainly would stop.
I don't care what anyone says about nervous tick or whatever bull****. I'm sure you guys know its annoying and yet you keep it up.
People do it to annoy their opponents in hopes their play will suffer. I'm sure if it was something that enhanced the play of your opponent you certainly would stop.
Oh, please. I'm sure you do things without realizing it all the time with your hands. What I try to do is make sure I realize I'm doing it, and then stop. But usually about 20 seconds later I'm just doing it again. It's just a habit, that's actually really hard to break. Like fingernail biting or something, I don't know, I'm not too concerned because literally no one has ever asked me to stop, I only know it annoys people because of people on this forum complaining about it.
But sometimes even when I do realize I'm doing it I keep doing it because I actually think it helps me think, moving the order of cards in my hand helps me see how they may interact with each other in different ways. Also, focusing on a mindless task can help clear the mind allowing to focus on strategy more.
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"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
I certainly shuffle my hand as obnoxiously as possible. I also flick the tops of my cards and try to be as irritating as possible for my opponents.
It's all about the psychological warfare. Get your opponent pissed at you, and they won't be focused on the game. It's pretty easy to **** with other people's heads if you know the right ways to do it.
One of my favourite techniques is to act suggestively towards my opponents. Call them "big boy"; rub their knees against yours under the table; ask if they work out; and/or lick your lips frequently while staring at them.
Just learn to ignore the people who shuffle their hands. It's a psychological ploy, and the same players will usually be the ones who constantly ask you "Are you done?" to try and get you to make play mistakes. Just the same as when I'm playing anything with removal or Counters and I see my opponent is clearly thinking his options and I bluff by moving my hand over an Island or whatever to act like I'm getting ready to tap it. I know they'll see the gesture and signal and rethink they're strategy and hold off and give me another turn to draw into the answer I don't actually have.
As for the shuffling? I usually retaliate by playing at a snail's pace when players try to do this to me, although not at a slow enough pace to have a judge called over. Eventually they'll get the hint and magically stop shuffling their cards in their hand and just sit there quietly.
If the guy was doing it because he had ADHD or something I would be on his side. If he's just being a jerk then you should call a judge or get used to it, there are people who are annoying and its something everyone has to live with it.
One of my favourite techniques is to act suggestively towards my opponents. Call them "big boy"; rub their knees against yours under the table; ask if they work out; and/or lick your lips frequently while staring at them.
Works like a charm.
If I knew you were trying to do this to me I would call a judge on you. As Teia stated this can very easily fall under unsportsmanlike conduct and, while it ultimately remains up to judge discretion, it's a great way to get kicked out of your LGS or local play group.
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If I knew you were trying to do this to me I would call a judge on you. As Teia stated this can very easily fall under unsportsmanlike conduct and, while it ultimately remains up to judge discretion, it's a great way to get kicked out of your LGS or local play group.
I don't shuffle my cards a ton but when I do it's to hide information from my opponent. They don't need to know the card I just drew was the land I played this turn. It is annoying when someone is obnoxious about it but otherwise its just another noise I've become used to.
I don't shuffle my cards a ton but when I do it's to hide information from my opponent. They don't need to know the card I just drew was the land I played this turn. It is annoying when someone is obnoxious about it but otherwise its just another noise I've become used to.
When I shuffle my cards, it's to try and get a different view of the situation. As a way of helping me think. It is akin to looking at a chess board from different angles in the sense that it allows me to notice plays I wouldn't have noticed otherwise.
If I knew you were trying to do this to me I would call a judge on you. As Teia stated this can very easily fall under unsportsmanlike conduct and, while it ultimately remains up to judge discretion, it's a great way to get kicked out of your LGS or local play group.
As a judge, if I get this call, I'm telling him to stop, possibly issuing a Unsporting-Minor warning if he told his opponent he wasn't going to stop because he's trying to troll his opponent into a mistake (& not ADHD) & if it comes up again, Unsporting-Major because at that point he's disobeyed a judge's directions. The outcome of a match of Magic must be determined with games of Magic, not with childish mind games that have no place in a civilized game.
I absolutely hate it when opponents consistenly shuffle their hands, over the course of a match. I have asked people to stop several times too
I will do it every once and a while, but only to hide things from my opponent like if I cast faithless looting or something, I don't want them to know that I automatically ditched the only two cards I had in my hand before drawing two off of looting, because they will ultimately know that I have (or at least had) no plan. Alot of people do try to gleam information off of the cards in your hand like how long you held on to that removal spell etc... so shuffling the hand is important, but only do it once or twice.
Then stop,
seriously,
stop
:tongue:.
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As a judge, if I get this call, I'm telling him to stop, possibly issuing a Unsporting-Minor warning if he told his opponent he wasn't going to stop because he's trying to troll his opponent into a mistake (& not ADHD) & if it comes up again, Unsporting-Major because at that point he's disobeyed a judge's directions. The outcome of a match of Magic must be determined with games of Magic, not with childish mind games that have no place in a civilized game.
As a judge I'd do the complete opposite unless they were extremely loud. It's not unsporting to shuffle your hand at all, especially when L3s at Worlds and whatnot let it go on camera all the time. It's a pretty bad ruling to make to try to regulate a player's physical behavior. It's a part of the game, if some one shuffling their hand is taking you off yours, go back to working on it.
As far as it being a distraction, I'd ask the player to stop. If they appear to be disingenuous and continue to do it, sure, call a judge over.
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"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
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I understand that some people do it out of habit or for just something to do with their hands and ive never had a problem with anyone doing it until last night. This guy was just way over the top doing it, probably because like he said he was purposely trying to annoy and get under his opponents skin, which just happened to be me.
People do it to annoy their opponents in hopes their play will suffer. I'm sure if it was something that enhanced the play of your opponent you certainly would stop.
Oh, please. I'm sure you do things without realizing it all the time with your hands. What I try to do is make sure I realize I'm doing it, and then stop. But usually about 20 seconds later I'm just doing it again. It's just a habit, that's actually really hard to break. Like fingernail biting or something, I don't know, I'm not too concerned because literally no one has ever asked me to stop, I only know it annoys people because of people on this forum complaining about it.
But sometimes even when I do realize I'm doing it I keep doing it because I actually think it helps me think, moving the order of cards in my hand helps me see how they may interact with each other in different ways. Also, focusing on a mindless task can help clear the mind allowing to focus on strategy more.
"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
GPolukranos, Kill ALL the Things!G
I am guilty of shuffling my hand, but I don't go crazy with it and it's more for this stated reason than any other one.
It's all about the psychological warfare. Get your opponent pissed at you, and they won't be focused on the game. It's pretty easy to **** with other people's heads if you know the right ways to do it.
One of my favourite techniques is to act suggestively towards my opponents. Call them "big boy"; rub their knees against yours under the table; ask if they work out; and/or lick your lips frequently while staring at them.
Works like a charm.
As for the shuffling? I usually retaliate by playing at a snail's pace when players try to do this to me, although not at a slow enough pace to have a judge called over. Eventually they'll get the hint and magically stop shuffling their cards in their hand and just sit there quietly.
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Completely inappropriate. In some (most?) jurisdictions, that's sexual assault.
If I knew you were trying to do this to me I would call a judge on you. As Teia stated this can very easily fall under unsportsmanlike conduct and, while it ultimately remains up to judge discretion, it's a great way to get kicked out of your LGS or local play group.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
It sounds like sarcasm to me
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When I shuffle my cards, it's to try and get a different view of the situation. As a way of helping me think. It is akin to looking at a chess board from different angles in the sense that it allows me to notice plays I wouldn't have noticed otherwise.
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As a judge, if I get this call, I'm telling him to stop, possibly issuing a Unsporting-Minor warning if he told his opponent he wasn't going to stop because he's trying to troll his opponent into a mistake (& not ADHD) & if it comes up again, Unsporting-Major because at that point he's disobeyed a judge's directions. The outcome of a match of Magic must be determined with games of Magic, not with childish mind games that have no place in a civilized game.
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I will do it every once and a while, but only to hide things from my opponent like if I cast faithless looting or something, I don't want them to know that I automatically ditched the only two cards I had in my hand before drawing two off of looting, because they will ultimately know that I have (or at least had) no plan. Alot of people do try to gleam information off of the cards in your hand like how long you held on to that removal spell etc... so shuffling the hand is important, but only do it once or twice.
Then stop,
seriously,
stop
:tongue:.
Standard/Block = The on-again, off-again holiday fling
Modern/Vintage/Legacy = Stable, homely. A ***** after absence/misreading
Limited/Sealed = Heart breaking free spirit
Commander/Cube = Agreeable, needy and expensive
Pauper/Peasant = Sweet, kind, practical, but shy and boring
As a judge I'd do the complete opposite unless they were extremely loud. It's not unsporting to shuffle your hand at all, especially when L3s at Worlds and whatnot let it go on camera all the time. It's a pretty bad ruling to make to try to regulate a player's physical behavior. It's a part of the game, if some one shuffling their hand is taking you off yours, go back to working on it.