Yes!!! I don't think could actually do it but it would be funny. No, I feel I should but I know I wouldn't. I'd ninja that box run home add up the value and figure out how to start selling.
The seller's getting exactly what he's asking for, it's his fault he didn't take the time to look up the value of the cards, and for all we know the cards could be fake. It's not like taking advantage of a financially rewarding situation is a crime anyway. Situations like this are a dream for Magic players, why unnecessarily jeopardise such an opportunity?
You are at a random person's garage sale and you find out that the seller had kids who moved out who played magic in the early 1990s. He hands you the box of cards and you find a bunch of moxen, maybe some lotuses, and other cards worth at least tens of thousands of dollars. The seller does not know any of the cards are worth anything and is mostly selling all his stuff so he can have room for an indoor gym so he offers you all the cards for 10 dollars. Would you buy them off him for 10 dollars or tell him their true value?
Saving for an indoor gym? I'll take the box for 10 bucks.
Car broke down and they're losing the house? Sir, let's get these cards appraised.
To those that want to tell the seller something other than yes, I'll buy that. What do you guys think of shows like storage wars where they buy a storage locker for a few hundred bucks and find thousands of dollars worth of good inside?
Apples and oranges.
Walking into a garage sale, seeing a box of Magic cards the buyer (you) knows the worth and the seller doesnt, is one thing. Buying a storage locker in an auction style sale against others doing the exact same thing you are is very different.
The garage sale issue for me is more about, is the parent selling their kids stuff off? Is the owner of the cards an old player just emptying his attic and has not kept up with the game? Before I would buy the cards for that price I would ask some questions. I would probably mention they check a local Magic store to find the true value.
By the way, I am 'that' guy who looks through the dollar bin and shows the owner the high dollar cards his employees have put in there by mistake. Garnering trust like that gets you more in the long run then an occasional short term profit. Yeah, I am that guy.
Why am I like this? I would not want it to happen to me. I treat others as I wish to be treated.
On a smaller scale, like say maybe it was a box filled with a hundred dollars worth of cards, I wouldn't have an issue with it. But if the guy's literally handing over thousands of dollars in cards for nothing, I'm not gonna take them.
Part of that is that, yeah, I have a hard time ripping someone off for thousands of dollars. But part of it is also that, well, as someone said, NOBODY doesn't do their homework on this stuff anymore (if they truly thought they weren't worth anything, they wouldn't even be at the sale. They'd be tossed). Any time anyone offers you something for that much less than what it's really worth, your brain should have alarm bells ringing.
On the other hand, the situation proposed says $10 for what ought to be thousands of dollars worth of cards. Even if they are fake... it's $10. That's a dinner out for one, and a pretty cheap dinner at that. Just eat in instead of going to a restaurant one day, or skip your triple mocha latte frappuccino grande the next day.
To those that want to tell the seller something other than yes, I'll buy that. What do you guys think of shows like storage wars where they buy a storage locker for a few hundred bucks and find thousands of dollars worth of good inside?
Not the same. Not by a long shot. For one thing, when I bid on that locker, I don't know what's in there myself.
On the other hand, the situation proposed says $10 for what ought to be thousands of dollars worth of cards. Even if they are fake... it's $10. That's a dinner out for one, and a pretty cheap dinner at that. Just eat in instead of going to a restaurant one day, or skip your triple mocha latte frappuccino grande the next day.
It's not about the money. I'm okay with taking a chance. It's more about me and my conscience and my desire not to get screwed over at all, or screw someone else. I mean, best case scenario here, I helped a guy screw his kid out of thousands of bucks. Worst case, I get to the card shop and get told, "You know, we're actually on the lookout for a bunch of Alpha cards that got stolen, and these were some of the cards named..."
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If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
Worst case, I get to the card shop and get told, "You know, we're actually on the lookout for a bunch of Alpha cards that got stolen, and these were some of the cards named..."
This wouldn't actually work. Garage sales have to be a matter of public record (as most cities require the homeowner to apply for a permit). You tell the authorities that this was purchased, legally, at a price specified by the former owner on *insert day and time* per the permit records. This is all despite the fact that anyone can prove beyond reasonable doubt that they were stolen and not bought.
Long story short, the garage seller is s.o.l. Do your research ahead of time.
Absolutely I'd hand him $10. The reason people go to yard sales is to find treasure. Whether its magic cards, comic books, or some rare antique punch bowl.
My wife has cleared out the garage/attic before, and had yard sales. Things she wasn't sure of, she went online and tried to figure out what it was/what the value was.
This isn't 15 years ago when you needed an InQuest or a trip to the shop to find the value. A 2 minute google search will reveal the true value. Maybe they don't know the difference between an unlimited or alpha Black Lotus, but they can see its worth a hell of a lot regardless. It's the sellers job to price their items accordingly.
At the very least, I'm paying $10, taking some power , and giving the rest back. Both parties profit.
Worst case, I get to the card shop and get told, "You know, we're actually on the lookout for a bunch of Alpha cards that got stolen, and these were some of the cards named..."
If I gave him ten bucks and then this happened ^^ I would probably give them to whoever they were stolen from. But if the seller sold to me for ten bucks then realized what they sold and reported as stolen, then **** that he isnt getting **** back.
Of course I'd give him $10. People who let their conscious cripple them at opportunities like this are not people who get ahead in life. These types of moments are few and far between and you have to suspend your convictions and take advantage of the situation. We're talking about enough cards to sell and buy a car, etc. I'm not responsible for the man's ignorance, so I shouldn't feel guilty taking him up on his offer.
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It's like antiques, except the average person is suspicious that any given piece of old furniture may be a valuable antique. Many antique dealers include making the rounds at garage sales, estate sales, and so forth and acquiring such antiques part of their business model.
I've thought about this a lot, and I used to think buying those cards would have been wrong. However, now I've got a new line.
1. Making a profit is not a priori a bad thing.
2. Any given transaction can, however, be detrimental to various parties involved (or not involved), for example if one party is deceived, coerced, or a third party is damaged (a con, robbery, or environmental damage are examples of these).
Now if I buy a set of Power 9 at a yard sale for $10, I have not solicited the sale. As long as I make no statements as to the value of the cards, my ability to determine their approximate value, or any related question, I am not deceiving the seller. The value of the cards is only a few clicks away on the Internet. Obviously there is no coercion, and no environmental damage results from the transaction. No third party is damaged.
However, the moment the buyer answered the question What do you think these cards are worth? with I don't know instead of I'd prefer not to comment on that, that's deceptive: and it may be a crime.
This a good point regarding the difference between deception and accepting the offer outright. It's debatable whether saying you don't know the price versus not disclosing the price. I'm more of a consequentalist, so the scenario that the man sells the cards either way means, in my perspective, that there's no difference in what you say. It also certainly is not a legal crime.
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Currently playing:
Standard: N/A
Modern: AffinityWR, Delver WUR
Legacy: High TideU, ZombiesWBRG, 12post UG, Delver UR
You are at a random person's garage sale and you find out that the seller had kids who moved out who played magic in the early 1990s. He hands you the box of cards and you find a bunch of moxen, maybe some lotuses, and other cards worth at least tens of thousands of dollars. The seller does not know any of the cards are worth anything and is mostly selling all his stuff so he can have room for an indoor gym so he offers you all the cards for 10 dollars. Would you buy them off him for 10 dollars or tell him their true value?
I've actually had a situation like this come with someone that used to play at my LGS, an ex-Yugioh player's father was at a garage sale in the area, came home and told this guy that he saw an old grandmother was selling her grandson's old collection for like $60-75 bucks. He want and ended up getting her down to $50, for well over 10K with of stuff, think it was more like 15 after all the calculations (Original duels, playsets of Force, almost every Modern staple etc) were done. Needless to say he made a lot of local player's enemy list when he sold the majority of the collection to another shop in the area and not ours. That being said if I had the opportunity, I would take it and never look back, give the guy the cash and walk away. He would never know, because it's not my job to tell someone what the value of there item is. People take opportunities everyday, some end up with million dollar paintings, I'd end up with a nice payday and maybe buy my way into Legacy in the process.
The cards are worth what someone is willing to pay for them. At the moment, that's ten dollars. Will it be ten dollars tomorrow? Probably not. But it could get close. It could drop rapidly if WotC hit some strange corporate legal scandal, or abolished the reserve list unexpectedly, or perhaps Hearthstone turns out to be so incredibly well designed everyone quits MtG. You don't know.
But yeah, I think lots of people recognize that it is not actually immoral to accept a trade that someone has offered you.
That said, my conscience would feel super guilty, and after buying the cards (and driving them home, and putting them in a safe) I would come back and buy everything he had at asking price.
Everyone knows that good luck and good game are such insincere terms that any man who does not connect his right hook with the offender's jaw on the very utterance of such a phrase is no man I would consider as such.
I don't understand why people would willingly take such a lopsided offer, but there are still threads popping up about sharking being immoral.
I would guess it has something to do with setting. Someone tossing all those cards for 10.00 doesn't care much, certainly isn't in the game, and likely isn't even a gamer. You don't have to spend much time in the RPG/CCG/Wargame scene to hear something along the lines of "Magic cards be worth tons of money" or "Ever hear of Black Lotus? That card is worth tons"
Even that said, most people know cards, coins, and comics are the things likely to have value.
New Magic players on the other hand, are taken by someone who knows the value of cards, asks to trade, and then uses that to take advantage, sometimes even causing them to quit playing if they lost their one valuable card, say, a Foil Fetch, in trade for some big dumb mythic like Blightsteel.
Another big difference is people don't often shark themselves. If they don't know a cards worth, they normally keep quiet and don't offer it for trade. It is the shark that says "That? yeah, you don't want that. It's a LAND that costs LIFE for God's sake."
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Legacy: Pox
EDH: Chainer Reanimation and The Dragon Show, with Zirilan of the Claw
There is absolutely no way I would feel bad for giving someone ten dollars and walking. These are grown-ass adults who I'm sure have internet and a computer that could've done homework on their own. We aren't talking about stealing cards from a seven year old who doesn't know better (Hey look! You have to sacrifice that Lotus to get use out of it. Take this Craw Wurm! It's HUGE!).
And if they don't have internet and a computer then they probably need the ten bucks more than me.
I would guess it has something to do with setting. Someone tossing all those cards for 10.00 doesn't care much, certainly isn't in the game, and likely isn't even a gamer. You don't have to spend much time in the RPG/CCG/Wargame scene to hear something along the lines of "Magic cards be worth tons of money" or "Ever hear of Black Lotus? That card is worth tons"
Even that said, most people know cards, coins, and comics are the things likely to have value.
New Magic players on the other hand, are taken by someone who knows the value of cards, asks to trade, and then uses that to take advantage, sometimes even causing them to quit playing if they lost their one valuable card, say, a Foil Fetch, in trade for some big dumb mythic like Blightsteel.
Another big difference is people don't often shark themselves. If they don't know a cards worth, they normally keep quiet and don't offer it for trade. It is the shark that says "That? yeah, you don't want that. It's a LAND that costs LIFE for God's sake."
Pretty much.
Bad sharking can hurt the Magic playing community by turning off new players and/or making them not want to trade. Given that this is very much a social game, protecting that community is important for all long time Magic players.
Protecting "random stranger", who clearly doesn't know/care about the game, from giving away a mall fortune in cards isn't meaningful to me. I would happily take them.
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Yes!!! I don't think could actually do it but it would be funny. No, I feel I should but I know I wouldn't. I'd ninja that box run home add up the value and figure out how to start selling.
The seller's getting exactly what he's asking for, it's his fault he didn't take the time to look up the value of the cards, and for all we know the cards could be fake. It's not like taking advantage of a financially rewarding situation is a crime anyway. Situations like this are a dream for Magic players, why unnecessarily jeopardise such an opportunity?
UBG Reanimator
RUB Delver
R Burn
UR Delver
UBW Tin Fins
UBGR ANT
Saving for an indoor gym? I'll take the box for 10 bucks.
Car broke down and they're losing the house? Sir, let's get these cards appraised.
Apples and oranges.
Walking into a garage sale, seeing a box of Magic cards the buyer (you) knows the worth and the seller doesnt, is one thing. Buying a storage locker in an auction style sale against others doing the exact same thing you are is very different.
The garage sale issue for me is more about, is the parent selling their kids stuff off? Is the owner of the cards an old player just emptying his attic and has not kept up with the game? Before I would buy the cards for that price I would ask some questions. I would probably mention they check a local Magic store to find the true value.
By the way, I am 'that' guy who looks through the dollar bin and shows the owner the high dollar cards his employees have put in there by mistake. Garnering trust like that gets you more in the long run then an occasional short term profit. Yeah, I am that guy.
Why am I like this? I would not want it to happen to me. I treat others as I wish to be treated.
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
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Not the same. Not by a long shot. For one thing, when I bid on that locker, I don't know what's in there myself.
It's not about the money. I'm okay with taking a chance. It's more about me and my conscience and my desire not to get screwed over at all, or screw someone else. I mean, best case scenario here, I helped a guy screw his kid out of thousands of bucks. Worst case, I get to the card shop and get told, "You know, we're actually on the lookout for a bunch of Alpha cards that got stolen, and these were some of the cards named..."
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M'saion ulé hraka vair.
This wouldn't actually work. Garage sales have to be a matter of public record (as most cities require the homeowner to apply for a permit). You tell the authorities that this was purchased, legally, at a price specified by the former owner on *insert day and time* per the permit records. This is all despite the fact that anyone can prove beyond reasonable doubt that they were stolen and not bought.
Long story short, the garage seller is s.o.l. Do your research ahead of time.
Signature courtesy of Rivenor and Miraculous Recovery
EDH Altered Cards by Galspanic (Seriously, this guy's awesome.)
My Pauper Cube
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Commander:
GWR Rith, the Awakener RWG
U Kami of the Crescent Moon U (Flagship Deck)
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My wife has cleared out the garage/attic before, and had yard sales. Things she wasn't sure of, she went online and tried to figure out what it was/what the value was.
This isn't 15 years ago when you needed an InQuest or a trip to the shop to find the value. A 2 minute google search will reveal the true value. Maybe they don't know the difference between an unlimited or alpha Black Lotus, but they can see its worth a hell of a lot regardless. It's the sellers job to price their items accordingly.
At the very least, I'm paying $10, taking some power , and giving the rest back. Both parties profit.
If I gave him ten bucks and then this happened ^^ I would probably give them to whoever they were stolen from. But if the seller sold to me for ten bucks then realized what they sold and reported as stolen, then **** that he isnt getting **** back.
Do him a solid and hand over 100, both parties are very happy.
This a good point regarding the difference between deception and accepting the offer outright. It's debatable whether saying you don't know the price versus not disclosing the price. I'm more of a consequentalist, so the scenario that the man sells the cards either way means, in my perspective, that there's no difference in what you say. It also certainly is not a legal crime.
Standard: N/A
Modern: AffinityWR, Delver WUR
Legacy: High TideU, ZombiesWBRG, 12post UG, Delver UR
I've actually had a situation like this come with someone that used to play at my LGS, an ex-Yugioh player's father was at a garage sale in the area, came home and told this guy that he saw an old grandmother was selling her grandson's old collection for like $60-75 bucks. He want and ended up getting her down to $50, for well over 10K with of stuff, think it was more like 15 after all the calculations (Original duels, playsets of Force, almost every Modern staple etc) were done. Needless to say he made a lot of local player's enemy list when he sold the majority of the collection to another shop in the area and not ours. That being said if I had the opportunity, I would take it and never look back, give the guy the cash and walk away. He would never know, because it's not my job to tell someone what the value of there item is. People take opportunities everyday, some end up with million dollar paintings, I'd end up with a nice payday and maybe buy my way into Legacy in the process.
But yeah, I think lots of people recognize that it is not actually immoral to accept a trade that someone has offered you.
That said, my conscience would feel super guilty, and after buying the cards (and driving them home, and putting them in a safe) I would come back and buy everything he had at asking price.
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- To my youngest sister when she was 6.
Because clearly it's only immoral to rip someone off when it's not you doing it.
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I would guess it has something to do with setting. Someone tossing all those cards for 10.00 doesn't care much, certainly isn't in the game, and likely isn't even a gamer. You don't have to spend much time in the RPG/CCG/Wargame scene to hear something along the lines of "Magic cards be worth tons of money" or "Ever hear of Black Lotus? That card is worth tons"
Even that said, most people know cards, coins, and comics are the things likely to have value.
New Magic players on the other hand, are taken by someone who knows the value of cards, asks to trade, and then uses that to take advantage, sometimes even causing them to quit playing if they lost their one valuable card, say, a Foil Fetch, in trade for some big dumb mythic like Blightsteel.
Another big difference is people don't often shark themselves. If they don't know a cards worth, they normally keep quiet and don't offer it for trade. It is the shark that says "That? yeah, you don't want that. It's a LAND that costs LIFE for God's sake."
Modern: Jund
Legacy: Pox
EDH: Chainer Reanimation and The Dragon Show, with Zirilan of the Claw
XXXX
Modern
URTwinRU R.I.P.
EDH
WUGRoon of the Hidden RealmWUG
RUG Tempo Tresh RUG
BUG Team america, Shardless BUG, BUG control BUG
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WUGBRTESWUGBR
UBRSneak and ShowUBR
EDH:
GUExperiment Kraj - FOILEDGU
RUBGwendlyn Di CorciRUB
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This.
If they're just selling them off to clear space they should know better and use Google.
Trying to keep the house, "Sir, go put these inside. Here's my cell phone number, I'll help you get these appraised tomorrow."
And if they don't have internet and a computer then they probably need the ten bucks more than me.
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BWG Nic-Fit
BGR Punishing Nic-Fit
Pretty much.
Bad sharking can hurt the Magic playing community by turning off new players and/or making them not want to trade. Given that this is very much a social game, protecting that community is important for all long time Magic players.
Protecting "random stranger", who clearly doesn't know/care about the game, from giving away a mall fortune in cards isn't meaningful to me. I would happily take them.