I bought 800 sleeves of the Hyper Matte Blue. Not too happy with the coloring but it will do. It seems to have a slight hint of purple in the navy blue and isn't near as dark as the normal mattes.
What's the difference between the old matte and the new hyper matte?
It is a bit hard to describe. They have the rough pebbled surface similar to Ultra-pro matte, but it has a sheen on it too which makes them a dream to mash shuffle. They actually feel thinner on the whole (not in a bad way), but that could just be me. The surface is almost impossible to mark up or scratch with normal play and shuffling. Haven't had one split yet, but then I have only had a few UP matte's split and everyone seems to have a problem with that. I must just be gentle in my shuffling or something.
I'll try and get a picture later as well. However, I don't think I will have a camera good enough to truly capture the color. I'm sure each printing run is different. I'm at least fortunate enough that my 10 packs all are similar in color.
I personally find that they tear more than the normal mattes. However, I absolutely love how resilient to getting dirty these sleeves are.
Sheesh...I just don't know how you guys tear so many sleeves in normal play and shuffling. I can't remember the last time I tore a sleeve made by UP, KMC, or Dragon Shields.
What's the difference between the old matte and the new hyper matte?
It is a bit hard to describe. They have the rough pebbled surface similar to Ultra-pro matte, but it has a sheen on it too which makes them a dream to mash shuffle. They actually feel thinner on the whole (not in a bad way), but that could just be me. The surface is almost impossible to mark up or scratch with normal play and shuffling. Haven't had one split yet, but then I have only had a few UP matte's split and everyone seems to have a problem with that. I must just be gentle in my shuffling or something.
even better. i wouldn't recommend single sleeving in hyper mattes simply because they're shorter sleeves, meaning the top of your card is closer to the opening.
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I speak in sarcasm because calling people ******* ******** is not allowed.
What's the difference between the old matte and the new hyper matte?
It is a bit hard to describe. They have the rough pebbled surface similar to Ultra-pro matte, but it has a sheen on it too which makes them a dream to mash shuffle. They actually feel thinner on the whole (not in a bad way), but that could just be me. The surface is almost impossible to mark up or scratch with normal play and shuffling. Haven't had one split yet, but then I have only had a few UP matte's split and everyone seems to have a problem with that. I must just be gentle in my shuffling or something.
What's the difference between the old matte and the new hyper matte?
If you want some good side-by-side shots and to see them both single sleeved and double sleeved, you can check out this video here: http://youtu.be/46Z3-VK5R5A but the short of it is that one of the most impressive things about the HYPER MATs is the texture and feel of the sleeves, especially when shuffling. They have a premium stippled back and are just in a class of their own.
You can single sleeve with them, but they really stand out as the perfect outer-sleeve to use when double sleeving. KMC is also the make of the Perfect Size interior sleeves for double sleeving, so these were made with double sleeving in mind.
As others have said they aren't as tough Dragon Shields, but they are far from flimsy and fast become my favorite sleeve.
I actually find they are fine both double sleeved and not as long as you are concious of the tops of your deck when shuffling.
RE Shuffling: I am wondering what you are all doing to tear through your sleeves so often. Here is my shuffling method (all direction and locations on the card are based on looking at the card face as you would normally read it and from the viewer's perspective- so shuffler handedness):
take the deck in my left hand with the deck rotated onto it's right side- so the cards are facing to my right, making sure that all cards are flush.
take roughly half of the deck in my right hand, holding it by the top and bottom of the card with my thumb and two middle fingers.
allow the cards in my left hand to fan (seperate) ever so slightly so that there is about a mm between each card. I do this by keeping the right side of the card tight in my fingers while loosening my hold briefly on the left side of the card.
do the same with the card in my right hand only it is the right side of the card that a fan slightly.
rotate my right hand upward (counter clockwise) towards my body so that the cards in my right hand are rotated up slightly.
bring the two halves of the deck together by bringing the cards in my right hand down, bottom right corner first, into the left side of the cards in my left hand and then rotating my right hand again back (clockwise) so the two are rotated the same way (at this point the two halves are only partially merged).
fully merge the two deck, with my right hand holding the top and bottom of the merged deck, and my left hand holding the right and left side of the deck.
repeat.
It takes about 2 seconds each shuffle. I do this at least 20 times before a game (probably more than 30 since I am often shuffling for more than a minute), and at least seven times when I have to shuffle in the game. One of my decks in hyper matte sleeves that sits by my laptop has probably been shuffled a thousand times at least since I tend to shuffle it while I watch a movie or show on my computer. So far no splits of hyper matte (owned since they came out), only maybe half a dozen with UP mattes (about 30 months old), and about the same number with Dragon Shields (about 4 years old).
I have other sleeves too that have split more, but with the three above kinds I have had very few splits.
Double sleeved my EDH deck with Hyper Matte and KMC perfects. Whoa. What a difference!
The nicest thing is, even though it's newly sleeved, the deck didn't fall over the way they will with Upper Decks or other sleeves. Great sleeves and highly recommended.
I like the idea of seeing the actual backs of cards and using clear sleeves, but consensus seems to be that it's just not worth it if you're going to a competitive event, right?
I like the idea of seeing the actual backs of cards and using clear sleeves, but consensus seems to be that it's just not worth it if you're going to a competitive event, right?
It's generally much better to prevent getting accused of marked cards by using dark sleeves.
Does anyone happen to know which colors of Ultra Pro Matte have completely opaque backs?
I have found that Red, Orange, and Yellow all have slightly transparent backs making it possible to notice double faced cards through them. Light Blue is surprisingly very opaque and I have had no problems with them so far.
I've heard that both White and Green are bad, but I can't confirm from personal experience. Black is apparently opaque, but its such a dreadfully boring color.
The other colors include: Pink, Purple, Aqua, Peach (not to be confused with Orange), Lime Green, and Blue. Has anyone here tried these?
Does anyone happen to know which colors of Ultra Pro Matte have completely opaque backs?
I have found that Red, Orange, and Yellow all have slightly transparent backs making it possible to notice double faced cards through them. Light Blue is surprisingly very opaque and I have had no problems with them so far.
I've heard that both White and Green are bad, but I can't confirm from personal experience. Black is apparently opaque, but its such a dreadfully boring color.
The other colors include: Pink, Purple, Aqua, Peach (not to be confused with Orange), Lime Green, and Blue. Has anyone here tried these?
I have never noticed any opacity with black or blue (dark).
I'm here to express my disappointment in the KMC Perfect Fits, since I heard you guys talking so high about them and the video of Tolarian Comunity College showed how easy and retard-proof was double sleeving I decided to stick to double sleeving my decks with KMC Hyper Mat, which are awesome, I doubt that I'll ever go back to Ultra Pro, maybe I'll even drop the Dragonshields once they wear out, and the damn Perfect Fits, so I decided to buy a 30 Pack box (30x100=3000 Sleeves) of the Perfect Fits with some other stuff (commander decks, Ultra Pro clear sleeves for storage, ect.)
So as soon as the package arrives I crack open a commander deck and start sleeving some lands...well these are the results.
(sorry took pics on the pizza, still have to eat, I'm in a hurry too, have to go play soon :P)
That is not the original land that I tried to sleeve, I think I threw it away cause it was bent beyond belief, after trying about 7-8 other sleeves I got one that was Close fit, yes close since the card was still slightly bent but still better that that abomination. I have cracked about half of those 3000 original and yeah its a constant, I have thrown of those away also from frustration but I have kept some.
To sum it up in those 3000 sleeves I find one in every 10 that I deem worthy to sleve a land in, I basically have to try to fit each card at least 3-4 times before I find a decent sleeve to fit it in.
Yeah that leaves me with about 5-600 usable sleeves, I will not sleeve a Karn Liberated or a Fetch in one of those, I have to find the "perfect" one that will slide in real easy and from my experience there are very few of those in the buch I bough, althou the pics are kind of extreme since that is one of the worse ones I found still the bending is noticeable in most of the other ones.
Its kind of sad because the ones that fit are awesome but still, one every 10?
Is it just me that had the "bad batch" if you could call it that? or is it common to have to pick one or two sleeves to use in every 10? what about quality control? should I write to the company?
The most important question, I think, with regards to Hyper MATs is how do they degrade compared to other KMC products.
My biggest gripe with previous KMC MAT products was that while they shuffle better than most other sleeves fresh out of the package, in short time they degrade and generate build up that makes them virtually un-shufflable. I have long since swithced to standard ultra-pro sleeves and dragonshields since, and am very reluctant to go back to pricier sleeves that seem better "at first".
Also, i'm sure it's been said, but any reviews of dragonshields more than a year old should not be taken into account, as their manufacturing process is clearly different. not just the multiple boxes of turquoise sleeves i've purchased, but all the other colours i've purchased have been nothing short of ideal and have had 100+ identical sleeves, and the turquoise are the best cut sleeves i've ever seen.
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Standard:
Nothing Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
Ultra Pro has Ultra Pro Slayers coming down the pipe. Anyone have info on this? I have been to their website but am not sure if they are competing with KMC Matte Sleeves or Dragon Shields or both. I am thinking about switching from KMC Matte (they are fantastic) to Hyper-Matte for the textured backs. UP Slayers have this black cherry color that looks insane.
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That which nourishes me, destroys me
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I mean, hell, we're all on a forum for something that most people would describe as a "children's card game"...do what makes you happy. You are never too old to enjoy yourself.
The most important question, I think, with regards to Hyper MATs is how do they degrade compared to other KMC products.
My biggest gripe with previous KMC MAT products was that while they shuffle better than most other sleeves fresh out of the package, in short time they degrade and generate build up that makes them virtually un-shufflable. I have long since swithced to standard ultra-pro sleeves and dragonshields since, and am very reluctant to go back to pricier sleeves that seem better "at first".
Also, i'm sure it's been said, but any reviews of dragonshields more than a year old should not be taken into account, as their manufacturing process is clearly different. not just the multiple boxes of turquoise sleeves i've purchased, but all the other colours i've purchased have been nothing short of ideal and have had 100+ identical sleeves, and the turquoise are the best cut sleeves i've ever seen.
Are you saying the new dragon shields come in colors other than turquoise? Is there any way to tell on the box if they are the old ones or new ones?
The most important question, I think, with regards to Hyper MATs is how do they degrade compared to other KMC products.
Black Ultra mat sleeves seem almost un-markable with normal use. I have shuffled one deck well over a thousand times and played with it on a table without a mat several times, and they look great. I also have my sideboard which has only been shuffled into the deck a couple dozen times and they look exactly the same. I think that you could easily play-test with them a hundred times and still take the deck to a tournament and not fear accusations of marked sleeves.
Hello!
Is it just me that had the "bad batch" if you could call it that? or is it common to have to pick one or two sleeves to use in every 10? what about quality control? should I write to the company?
They are normally quite tight to the point that there is a slight bowing, though those seem a bit more than usual. The thing is that the cards normally will stretch the sleeve over time rather than the sleeve warping the card permanently. I'm not sure what's going on with yours.
I bought a ton of KMC hyper mat black and I can notice fingerprints on the back. Is this something to do with lighting, could I get in trouble at a higher level event for this? etc.
The most important question, I think, with regards to Hyper MATs is how do they degrade compared to other KMC products.
My biggest gripe with previous KMC MAT products was that while they shuffle better than most other sleeves fresh out of the package, in short time they degrade and generate build up that makes them virtually un-shufflable. I have long since swithced to standard ultra-pro sleeves and dragonshields since, and am very reluctant to go back to pricier sleeves that seem better "at first".
Also, i'm sure it's been said, but any reviews of dragonshields more than a year old should not be taken into account, as their manufacturing process is clearly different. not just the multiple boxes of turquoise sleeves i've purchased, but all the other colours i've purchased have been nothing short of ideal and have had 100+ identical sleeves, and the turquoise are the best cut sleeves i've ever seen.
Are you saying the new dragon shields come in colors other than turquoise? Is there any way to tell on the box if they are the old ones or new ones?
I had heard rumors of improved cut quality on DS products about 9 months ago and so I picked up a few boxes; brown for a UB tezzeret deck, and purple and green for some edh decks. compared to my first boxes of DS sleeves, these were way better. the cut was uniform, the front and backs of the sleeves were the same size, and the numbers were closer to 100. in each box i received 103 sleeves, and the brown box was the only one that had any defects, with 2 sleeves having taller fronts (clear) than backs.
fast-forward to 6 weeks ago in buying the first box of turquoise sleeves. these seem to be a second quality improvement. the cut on the turquoise sleeves is better than any UP, KMC, or Legion product i've had. hopefully this is the new cut quality for all DS sleeves, and the only reason others still exist is that they are from previous production that still needs to be cycled through.
The most important question, I think, with regards to Hyper MATs is how do they degrade compared to other KMC products.
Black Ultra mat sleeves seem almost un-markable with normal use. I have shuffled one deck well over a thousand times and played with it on a table without a mat several times, and they look great. I also have my sideboard which has only been shuffled into the deck a couple dozen times and they look exactly the same. I think that you could easily play-test with them a hundred times and still take the deck to a tournament and not fear accusations of marked sleeves.
this is not what i was referring too. every KMC MAT product i've had has had severe issues with gunk build up. the sleeves become sticky to a point where they're unusable. i have used all different types of sleeves and the only sleeves i've found to be worse are UP pro-mattes, due to their fragility. the KMC MAT products were always amazing fresh out of the package, but within a few weeks, had degraded to an unusable point.
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Standard:
Nothing Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
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Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
I personally find that they tear more than the normal mattes. However, I absolutely love how resilient to getting dirty these sleeves are.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
How are they when double sleeved?
If you want some good side-by-side shots and to see them both single sleeved and double sleeved, you can check out this video here: http://youtu.be/46Z3-VK5R5A but the short of it is that one of the most impressive things about the HYPER MATs is the texture and feel of the sleeves, especially when shuffling. They have a premium stippled back and are just in a class of their own.
You can single sleeve with them, but they really stand out as the perfect outer-sleeve to use when double sleeving. KMC is also the make of the Perfect Size interior sleeves for double sleeving, so these were made with double sleeving in mind.
As others have said they aren't as tough Dragon Shields, but they are far from flimsy and fast become my favorite sleeve.
How To Keep Your FOIL Cards From Curling: http://youtu.be/QTmubrS8VnI
The Best Deck Boxes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEwgLph_Pjk
The Best Binders: http://youtu.be/H5IauASYWjk
RE Shuffling: I am wondering what you are all doing to tear through your sleeves so often. Here is my shuffling method (all direction and locations on the card are based on looking at the card face as you would normally read it and from the viewer's perspective- so shuffler handedness):
It takes about 2 seconds each shuffle. I do this at least 20 times before a game (probably more than 30 since I am often shuffling for more than a minute), and at least seven times when I have to shuffle in the game. One of my decks in hyper matte sleeves that sits by my laptop has probably been shuffled a thousand times at least since I tend to shuffle it while I watch a movie or show on my computer. So far no splits of hyper matte (owned since they came out), only maybe half a dozen with UP mattes (about 30 months old), and about the same number with Dragon Shields (about 4 years old).
I have other sleeves too that have split more, but with the three above kinds I have had very few splits.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
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The nicest thing is, even though it's newly sleeved, the deck didn't fall over the way they will with Upper Decks or other sleeves. Great sleeves and highly recommended.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/legacy-type-1-5/661941-list-of-stores-that-support-legacy
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?28892-Compilation-Of-Legacy-Streams
It's generally much better to prevent getting accused of marked cards by using dark sleeves.
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I have found that Red, Orange, and Yellow all have slightly transparent backs making it possible to notice double faced cards through them. Light Blue is surprisingly very opaque and I have had no problems with them so far.
I've heard that both White and Green are bad, but I can't confirm from personal experience. Black is apparently opaque, but its such a dreadfully boring color.
The other colors include: Pink, Purple, Aqua, Peach (not to be confused with Orange), Lime Green, and Blue. Has anyone here tried these?
Here you go: http://legionsupplies.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_5&products_id=15
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
I'm here to express my disappointment in the KMC Perfect Fits, since I heard you guys talking so high about them and the video of Tolarian Comunity College showed how easy and retard-proof was double sleeving I decided to stick to double sleeving my decks with KMC Hyper Mat, which are awesome, I doubt that I'll ever go back to Ultra Pro, maybe I'll even drop the Dragonshields once they wear out, and the damn Perfect Fits, so I decided to buy a 30 Pack box (30x100=3000 Sleeves) of the Perfect Fits with some other stuff (commander decks, Ultra Pro clear sleeves for storage, ect.)
So as soon as the package arrives I crack open a commander deck and start sleeving some lands...well these are the results.
That is not the original land that I tried to sleeve, I think I threw it away cause it was bent beyond belief, after trying about 7-8 other sleeves I got one that was Close fit, yes close since the card was still slightly bent but still better that that abomination. I have cracked about half of those 3000 original and yeah its a constant, I have thrown of those away also from frustration but I have kept some.
To sum it up in those 3000 sleeves I find one in every 10 that I deem worthy to sleve a land in, I basically have to try to fit each card at least 3-4 times before I find a decent sleeve to fit it in.
Yeah that leaves me with about 5-600 usable sleeves, I will not sleeve a Karn Liberated or a Fetch in one of those, I have to find the "perfect" one that will slide in real easy and from my experience there are very few of those in the buch I bough, althou the pics are kind of extreme since that is one of the worse ones I found still the bending is noticeable in most of the other ones.
Its kind of sad because the ones that fit are awesome but still, one every 10?
Is it just me that had the "bad batch" if you could call it that? or is it common to have to pick one or two sleeves to use in every 10? what about quality control? should I write to the company?
Cheers!
My biggest gripe with previous KMC MAT products was that while they shuffle better than most other sleeves fresh out of the package, in short time they degrade and generate build up that makes them virtually un-shufflable. I have long since swithced to standard ultra-pro sleeves and dragonshields since, and am very reluctant to go back to pricier sleeves that seem better "at first".
Also, i'm sure it's been said, but any reviews of dragonshields more than a year old should not be taken into account, as their manufacturing process is clearly different. not just the multiple boxes of turquoise sleeves i've purchased, but all the other colours i've purchased have been nothing short of ideal and have had 100+ identical sleeves, and the turquoise are the best cut sleeves i've ever seen.
Nothing
Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial
EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
10th at SCG: Syracuse (2014), GP:NJ Last-Chance Grinder Winner (2014):: Former Legacy Mod
Are you saying the new dragon shields come in colors other than turquoise? Is there any way to tell on the box if they are the old ones or new ones?
They are normally quite tight to the point that there is a slight bowing, though those seem a bit more than usual. The thing is that the cards normally will stretch the sleeve over time rather than the sleeve warping the card permanently. I'm not sure what's going on with yours.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
I had heard rumors of improved cut quality on DS products about 9 months ago and so I picked up a few boxes; brown for a UB tezzeret deck, and purple and green for some edh decks. compared to my first boxes of DS sleeves, these were way better. the cut was uniform, the front and backs of the sleeves were the same size, and the numbers were closer to 100. in each box i received 103 sleeves, and the brown box was the only one that had any defects, with 2 sleeves having taller fronts (clear) than backs.
fast-forward to 6 weeks ago in buying the first box of turquoise sleeves. these seem to be a second quality improvement. the cut on the turquoise sleeves is better than any UP, KMC, or Legion product i've had. hopefully this is the new cut quality for all DS sleeves, and the only reason others still exist is that they are from previous production that still needs to be cycled through.
this is not what i was referring too. every KMC MAT product i've had has had severe issues with gunk build up. the sleeves become sticky to a point where they're unusable. i have used all different types of sleeves and the only sleeves i've found to be worse are UP pro-mattes, due to their fragility. the KMC MAT products were always amazing fresh out of the package, but within a few weeks, had degraded to an unusable point.
Nothing
Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial
EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar