I just bought 2 red Matte Ultra Pro sleeve packs since they only run 50 sleeves a pack. I was sad to find out they are completely see through so flip cards are identifiable from the back. Also the front of the sleeves also have a stange matte finish so that the card looks like it has a foggy filter over it. Not to mention if u run ur fingernail over the front it leaves a streak that doesn't come off.
i would be happy to have anything other than these. Are the normal ultra pro sleeves not see through?
Black matte is not see through. Dragonshields usually are ok, but i just got a bad box of red sleeves. 40% of the sleeves split after only two weeks of play, damaging some valuable cards. I sent an email to the company, and they invited me to ship the sleeves back to them and they would ship me another box of sleeves after they received it. Trouble is they're in Europe and it costs as much as a box of Dragonshields to ship a box there. I just threw them away and buy Ultra-pros, although they tend to split as well.
I have recently switch from Dragon Shields (because I got 2 bad boxes in a row, the sleeves were all cut to different lengths) to KMC mattes, they are fantastic sleeves. The shop I go to does 80 for 9 or 10 bucks, so a little more expensive than dragon shields on Ultra Pros but far superior quality.
Dragon Shields are indeed a solid brand, although you will see the occasional bad batch, as indicated above.
Yet another great option are KMC matte sleeves. These come from Japan, and the matte sleeves come in black, blue, red, and brown. These fit the cards pretty snugly, and shuffle more smoothly than Dragon Shields, in my opinion. These are certainly worth the money, and something you should consider.
I've never had a problem with Ultra Pro sleeves, myself. I use the blue sleeves for most of my decks and I don't have any problems with cards showing through or sleeves ripping too soon. I don't know what kind they were, but I bought some more expensive sleeves for my one top tier legacy deck and I can't stand them, they already had small little rips on the sides. I wish I just left them in Ultra Pros
Dragon Shields are indeed a solid brand, although you will see the occasional bad batch, as indicated above.
Yet another great option are KMC matte sleeves. These come from Japan, and the matte sleeves come in black, blue, red, and brown. These fit the cards pretty snugly, and shuffle more smoothly than Dragon Shields, in my opinion. These are certainly worth the money, and something you should consider.
My one experience with KMCs is that they quickly get covered with weird gunk and become nearly impossible to shuffle. I recommend dragon shields (especially white dragon shields)
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Well, that "stange matte finish" on the front of the sleeves is intentional, and is in fact the Pro-matte's selling point. I gets rid of reflections off the card.
In any case, I'd say to go with KMC Supers. The darker colors aren't see-through enough for you to see flip cards, and they don't break.
I wouldn't recommend Dragon Shields, because they get covered in this grey-black gunk extremely quickly, and it makes them stick together.
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I used them to double sleeve my 450 card cube in KMC Matte Black sleeves. I think they are one of the best sleeves on the market. I would also buy Dragon Shields but they had a problem for a while with the sleeve tops being cut weird with some being longer than others.
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I recommend KMC Mattes. I've bought 3 packs over the last year and a half, and the only break in the sleeve was minimal (I didn't notice it for awhile).
As for the dirt issue, if you play on a mat, it's not bad, and if it really bugs you, you can wipe them clean with a coffee filter (took me an hour for a full 75).
so looks like KMC is good. Although I want to hear more about the gunk it gives off. So far I've heard dragonshield and kmc both give off gunk yet ultra pro's don't. I would be perfectly fine with normal ultra pro's that don't give off gunk. they also seem to last long. If their major drawbacks are they're too shiny than I don't care about that.
The "gunk" people are talking about is a combination of dirt and the oils present in your skin, not something generated by the sleeves. It's possible that Dragon Shields and KMCs are more prone to holding residual oils from standard usage, but I don't personally feel that it's enough to justify downgrading to ultra pros.
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so looks like KMC is good. Although I want to hear more about the gunk it gives off. So far I've heard dragonshield and kmc both give off gunk yet ultra pro's don't. I would be perfectly fine with normal ultra pro's that don't give off gunk. they also seem to last long. If their major drawbacks are they're too shiny than I don't care about that.
Ultra pros also bend easier. Dragon shield gunk is minimal (I sleeved my death and taxes up in them last october, and have never had to clean them off). KMC gunk comes in about 2 weeks (mats are too expensive for me). It could very well be that nay hands give off stuff that KMCs pick up more of, and dragon shields pick up very little. If you can, buy both
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I use Ultra Pros because they're cheap and a pack of 50 is perfect for a draft deck. I wait until they're on sale locally and then I pick up 10 packs @ 2.25 a pack. Yes, they're not as durable as the good dragon shields I have. But, they are consistent and they do shuffle well. For REL Competitive events it's also nice to able to use fresh sleeves just for the tournament. Much easier when you're dropping less than $5, as opposed to ~8 for some Dragonshields or KMCs.
The only issue I've ever had with KMC Matte is that I was told to switch my sleeves in a top 8 deck check, the sleeves lasted so long they became too dirty to play with according to the judge. Of course, those sleeves were months old and disgusting.
Ultra pro...regular solid color sleeves (without the matte finish).
Seconding these as being fairly good. Haven't really used KMCs or Dragon Shields that much, mostly because I use purple sleeves fairly commonly now and haven't had much luck tracking down KMC or Dragon Shield sleeves in purple. I think the only Ultra Pro sleeves I've had real problems with are the officially-licensed ones with artwork on the back. One of my Mox Diamond sleeves split completely down one side, and the other one frayed a little on the right side near the lower-right corner (when the card face is facing you)... which is just weird. Also, the image on my Admonition Angel sleeves wore away very readily. Hard to recommend, no matter how pretty they look.
In fact, most of my color-backed Ultra Pro sleeves have lasted a fairly long time -- one set of greens has lasted about a year without needing any maintenance.
I have recently switch from Dragon Shields (because I got 2 bad boxes in a row, the sleeves were all cut to different lengths) to KMC mattes, they are fantastic sleeves. The shop I go to does 80 for 9 or 10 bucks, so a little more expensive than dragon shields on Ultra Pros but far superior quality.
This. KMC Matte sleeves are the best sleeves I have ever played with, hands down. And I've played with practically every type of sleeves on the market.
I just bought 2 red Matte Ultra Pro sleeve packs since they only run 50 sleeves a pack. I was sad to find out they are completely see through so flip cards are identifiable from the back. Also the front of the sleeves also have a stange matte finish so that the card looks like it has a foggy filter over it. Not to mention if u run ur fingernail over the front it leaves a streak that doesn't come off.
i would be happy to have anything other than these. Are the normal ultra pro sleeves not see through?
A simple Google search shows that red matte is notorious for being transparent for flip cards, but the other ones are absolutely fine. As for your other complaints, I've never encountered those issues, and I use double sleeved KMC matte black religiously at high level events.
Dragon Sleeve Green sleeves. I use them on all my decks, and they don't reveal flip cards. I have foil flips in some decks, and none of them show.
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i would say dragonshields on my part. my first purple pack are still in use after purchasing them a few months ago. so far only one split sleeve from riffling.
i read somewhere that purple and pink dragonshields tend to hold their color better.
my first pack of KMC(they are still newer than my 1st dragonshields) are strictly being used for test decks and drafts since i did have a quite a bit split on me and a few ruined cards.
i would be happy to have anything other than these. Are the normal ultra pro sleeves not see through?
Good luck in finding a satisfactory set of sleeves!
Yet another great option are KMC matte sleeves. These come from Japan, and the matte sleeves come in black, blue, red, and brown. These fit the cards pretty snugly, and shuffle more smoothly than Dragon Shields, in my opinion. These are certainly worth the money, and something you should consider.
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My one experience with KMCs is that they quickly get covered with weird gunk and become nearly impossible to shuffle. I recommend dragon shields (especially white dragon shields)
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In any case, I'd say to go with KMC Supers. The darker colors aren't see-through enough for you to see flip cards, and they don't break.
I wouldn't recommend Dragon Shields, because they get covered in this grey-black gunk extremely quickly, and it makes them stick together.
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I used them to double sleeve my 450 card cube in KMC Matte Black sleeves. I think they are one of the best sleeves on the market. I would also buy Dragon Shields but they had a problem for a while with the sleeve tops being cut weird with some being longer than others.
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As for the dirt issue, if you play on a mat, it's not bad, and if it really bugs you, you can wipe them clean with a coffee filter (took me an hour for a full 75).
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Ultra pros also bend easier. Dragon shield gunk is minimal (I sleeved my death and taxes up in them last october, and have never had to clean them off). KMC gunk comes in about 2 weeks (mats are too expensive for me). It could very well be that nay hands give off stuff that KMCs pick up more of, and dragon shields pick up very little. If you can, buy both
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Dragonshields, max protection, and KMC are generally the only others that most people recommend.
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Seconding these as being fairly good. Haven't really used KMCs or Dragon Shields that much, mostly because I use purple sleeves fairly commonly now and haven't had much luck tracking down KMC or Dragon Shield sleeves in purple. I think the only Ultra Pro sleeves I've had real problems with are the officially-licensed ones with artwork on the back. One of my Mox Diamond sleeves split completely down one side, and the other one frayed a little on the right side near the lower-right corner (when the card face is facing you)... which is just weird. Also, the image on my Admonition Angel sleeves wore away very readily. Hard to recommend, no matter how pretty they look.
In fact, most of my color-backed Ultra Pro sleeves have lasted a fairly long time -- one set of greens has lasted about a year without needing any maintenance.
This. KMC Matte sleeves are the best sleeves I have ever played with, hands down. And I've played with practically every type of sleeves on the market.
A simple Google search shows that red matte is notorious for being transparent for flip cards, but the other ones are absolutely fine. As for your other complaints, I've never encountered those issues, and I use double sleeved KMC matte black religiously at high level events.
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i read somewhere that purple and pink dragonshields tend to hold their color better.
my first pack of KMC(they are still newer than my 1st dragonshields) are strictly being used for test decks and drafts since i did have a quite a bit split on me and a few ruined cards.
I wonder why it took me so long to switch.
WotC needs to switch their official brand. I think that's the only reason anyone uses Ultra Pros at all.
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