I've been playing Magic for a few years now and have recently shown an interest in competitive Magic. I've followed the last few SCG Opens and it's got me really excited about attending one in the future.
Well, it had until I looked at their event schedule for 2013. See, I live in Eugene, Oregon. The nearest Open is in either San Diego, Los Angeles or Las Vegas. That's upwards of a 16 hour drive.
That's just too long to drive to most likely scrub out Day 1. I would really like to get a feel for the tournament scene without having to bankrupt myself.
Is there a reason SCG avoids the Pacific Northwest like the plague? Has it always been this way or was there a trend of low attendance?
I believe Portland recently hosted a Grand Prix, which I hope means that Wizards doesn't share the same aversion to our little corner of the country (which makes sense for a Seattle-based company).
TL;DR
Is the Northwest a barren wasteland for competitive Magic tournaments?
This year there were GPs in Seattle and Vancouver.
The problem with the Northwest is that there just aren't a lot of large cities near each other. Someone living on the eastern seaboard can drive to umpteen major cities in just a few hours, its just basic geography.
edit: There was also an SCG open in Portland in September and another SCG open in Seattle in June.
Also I'm pretty sure that SCG has only released the schedule for the first three months? Im sure Seattle/Portland will be in the schedule at least once or twice in 2013
This year there were GPs in Seattle and Vancouver.
The problem with the Northwest is that there just aren't a lot of large cities near each other. Someone living on the eastern seaboard can drive to umpteen major cities in just a few hours, its just basic geography.
edit: There was also an SCG open in Portland in September and another SCG open in Seattle in June.
Also I'm pretty sure that SCG has only released the schedule for the first three months? Im sure Seattle/Portland will be in the schedule at least once or twice in 2013
Okay, thanks. Like I said, I'm new to the tournament scene. Having them later in the year works out better for me anyway because I don't think I'm quite ready yet.
Wasn't this year's Pro Player's Championship and Pro Tour Return to Ravnica held in Seattle? I realize that you have to be invited to play in those events but can't you still attend, have a blast and play in side events? I'd love to have a Pro Tour in upstate NY (Rochester, Buffalo or Syracuse) but I know it'll never happen when NYC and Toronto are larger cities that aren't too far away w/ alot more to offer.
I live near Phoenix and have the same issue. It just isn't near enough 'big' cities to draw major attention despite the face it typically is in the 70s here when most of the rest of the country is buried in sleet/snow/hail/nasty cold stuff.
SCG usually has an open or 3 in the north west every year. Along with others in the western US.
However, they are located in Virginia, so you will find that most of their opens are located east of the Mississippi. I imagine it is far cheaper for them to host an Open in Indy than Seattle, if just for travel costs for their crew, equipment and inventory.
The Northwest doesn't have that many people clustered together.
If anything, I feel like SCG has an unusual amount of tournaments in the heartland (midwest, nebraska, minnesota etc.) considering how many people live there, and not as many on the East coast considering the massive population clustered between virginia and new england.
The Northwest doesn't have that many people clustered together.
If anything, I feel like SCG has an unusual amount of tournaments in the heartland (midwest, nebraska, minnesota etc.) considering how many people live there, and not as many on the East coast considering the massive population clustered between virginia and new england.
They would be competing with a TON of TCGplayer.com events for the most part, which seemingly overpower NJ/NY area.
The Northwest doesn't have that many people clustered together.
If anything, I feel like SCG has an unusual amount of tournaments in the heartland (midwest, nebraska, minnesota etc.) considering how many people live there, and not as many on the East coast considering the massive population clustered between virginia and new england.
The Midwest might not seem like it has a large concentration of people, but it's got a really weird layout. Most people who live in rural areas are close to at least a couple cities. The town I live in (in Western Illinois) is 3 hours away from St. Louis, 4 from Chicago, 4.5 from Indianapolis, 4.5 from Kansas City, 6.5 from Minneapolis, 7 from Memphis, 6 from Cincinnati, 8 from Columbus, and 6.5 from Detroit. Most people in rural areas will travel to a decent number of these events, despite the fact there's relatively low population density per county.
Sadly, this thread could also be titled "Lack of people in the Great Northwest". I suggest seeing if you can find a group to roadtrip to a larger tournament a couple of times per year.
Ahh the great Northwest, site of the great Oregon Trail. And.. Rain. And Starbucks. And Rain. And Rain in your Starbucks. Wasn't Nirvana big there as well?
I would recommend moving to Los Angeles.
Why Los Angeles?
Lots of great reasons!
Traffic, rent and living expenses are huge, if you want to be in entertainment its the place to be! Hell if you want to see people struggling and eating crow in the form of traffic, rent, and living expenses and barely making it through life then you should definitely move to Los Angeles!
Also I decided that in life I want more friends with cars.
It's not really any better in the Seattle area. SCG occasionally heads up here for Opens, but that only happens 1-2 times a year. There's usually a Grand Prix or something in Seattle, but again, usually once a year. I've also found that there's a surprising lack of stores that run any events that aren't booster drafts.
^This, I got stationed in WA about 2 years ago and was pretty pumped up to play FNM's and what not. And it seems like every store is Boosterdraft, I dont mind that, but every single Friday its annoying, especially when they rarley have sanctioned Constructed formats, sometimes once or twice a month and the numbers for those are quite small at least the Shops I've been to. And its not just Magic either that gets a lack of a decent bigger Magic tournies, WSOP Circuit and HPT never seem to come out to WA either.
That seems like a ripoff. Why would anyone play that when the next spell you cast will make your opponents draw a bunch of cards? It does not even look good for mill decks.
I live in Seattle right now (and for the pass 6 years) finding places to play legacy/draft/standard/sealed has been no problem. There are plenty of LGS that host all sorts of tournaments through the week. This statement covers the Seattle/Bellevue/Shoreline/Redmond areas.
In terms of major events in the pacific northwest I agree completely. We can expect only around 2-4 major events a year.
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I really like SCG and I'm a premium member. However, I have to totally agree about
the east coast bias. I just counted up the number of 2012 events and grouped them into two categories:
Events on eastern and central time zones vs events on mountain and west time zones. The results?
12 events on west/mountain time
32 events on east/central time
A few interesting things were found looking at the 2012 schedule and the upcoming schedule.
Some areas are heavily over-represented, namely places they can easily drive to from their HQ in VA.
Las Vegas gets visited often, at least twice a year. Presumably, because people like to party there.
Places that really get ignored:
Cities in Texas not named Dallas/ Ft. Worth
Bay Area, no San Francisco or Oakland events or even San Jose.
Smaller states that don't have a large or iconic capital city
Nothing in Canada (Don't have their passports perhaps? Dealing with customs?)
Anyway, I'm glad they're doing the open series and I'm planning on attending
my first SCG open in January in SD. They could certainly add a few more opens out
west and cut a few of the redundant Virginia ones.
I live North of Seattle and I can play legacy (my favorite format) three nights a week. I am sure that other formats can be played multiple times a week.
Cardhaus tried running a large monthly standard series. It failed after a couple of months. I heard they were getting about 80 people, which was unsustainable.
Mirkwood has run regular large legacy tournaments in the past. I talked to the owner recently and he said he is reluctant to host another because of the poor attendance recently.
Besides that we get our PTQs and the occassional GP. There was a PTQ in Seattle this month that had over 300 people and many many side events. And there is a PTQ in Vancouver, British Columbia this weekend, and the day after the PTQ there is a large standard tournament at the PTQ venue.
So, I think we have our fair share of larger tournaments. Although, it may be on a downward trend.
I mapped the SCG Opens one time. If you move to somewhere in Ohio you'll be withiin a reasonable driving distance of most Opens East of the Mississippi.
I'm in the Lakewood/Tacoma area so I dont really know places that have good turnouts. Any suggestions? And the seattle area sounds tech, but I cant afford that drive on a weekly basis you know. Olympia isn't that big of a problem though.
That seems like a ripoff. Why would anyone play that when the next spell you cast will make your opponents draw a bunch of cards? It does not even look good for mill decks.
I'm in the Lakewood/Tacoma area so I dont really know places that have good turnouts. Any suggestions? And the seattle area sounds tech, but I cant afford that drive on a weekly basis you know. Olympia isn't that big of a problem though.
Have you been to Northwest Sports Cards? I've only been there once but it seemed like a great place.
So I did a search on starcitygames.com with their event finder, and from the dates of DEC/19/2012 to AUG/11/2013, Tacoma, WA, in a 400 mile radius, There are exactly 2 SCG events, Feb 16th in Normandy Park WA and Feb 17th in Coos Bay OR. Quite a drag if you ask me personally.
I havn't been to Northwest Sports Cards, I'll have to look it up when I get back to the states.
That seems like a ripoff. Why would anyone play that when the next spell you cast will make your opponents draw a bunch of cards? It does not even look good for mill decks.
So I did a search on starcitygames.com with their event finder, and from the dates of DEC/19/2012 to AUG/11/2013, Tacoma, WA, in a 400 mile radius, There are exactly 2 SCG events, Feb 16th in Normandy Park WA and Feb 17th in Coos Bay OR. Quite a drag if you ask me personally.
I havn't been to Northwest Sports Cards, I'll have to look it up when I get back to the states.
They also haven't revealed the SCG Open schedule past early April (I think). Don't give up hope yet!
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I really like SCG and I'm a premium member. However, I have to totally agree about
the east coast bias. I just counted up the number of 2012 events and grouped them into two categories:
Events on eastern and central time zones vs events on mountain and west time zones. The results?
12 events on west/mountain time
32 events on east/central time
A few interesting things were found looking at the 2012 schedule and the upcoming schedule.
Some areas are heavily over-represented, namely places they can easily drive to from their HQ in VA.
Las Vegas gets visited often, at least twice a year. Presumably, because people like to party there.
Places that really get ignored:
Cities in Texas not named Dallas/ Ft. Worth
Bay Area, no San Francisco or Oakland events or even San Jose.
Smaller states that don't have a large or iconic capital city
Nothing in Canada (Don't have their passports perhaps? Dealing with customs?)
Anyway, I'm glad they're doing the open series and I'm planning on attending
my first SCG open in January in SD. They could certainly add a few more opens out
west and cut a few of the redundant Virginia ones.
Pretty much all of these can be answered with "why would SCG host a less profitable event?" They host things on the east coast because that's where people are. They don't host things in smaller states because nobody lives there. Calling it 'bias' is just dumb - this isn't some government agency that's supposed to perfectly equally distribute Magic opportunities to the masses.
... Why the heck are they holding an event in Coos Bay? They got a real hunkering to go play golf at Bandon Dunes or something? Holding an event 5 hours ever from Portland makes no sense.
It cannot be denied that the population areas play a role in where tourney's are placed, how would you feel about living in Northern Montana or Western Wyoming, that would be even harder to go to, the closest would be what, Denver, something in the Dakotas, maybe Salt Lake city or something in Idaho?
As far as the Pacific Northwest goes, we got lucky this year, we had 2 Seattles & a Portland in a 5 month time frame! I think last year there was one Seattle total as well as the previous year before that.
I am hoping their April/May/June Schedule includes another hit to the Pacific Northwest, & another back 2 back weekend for the SouthWest, 2 events for 1 round trip ticket is very nice, if you're lucky enough to be able to do some traveling.
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Well, it had until I looked at their event schedule for 2013. See, I live in Eugene, Oregon. The nearest Open is in either San Diego, Los Angeles or Las Vegas. That's upwards of a 16 hour drive.
That's just too long to drive to most likely scrub out Day 1. I would really like to get a feel for the tournament scene without having to bankrupt myself.
Is there a reason SCG avoids the Pacific Northwest like the plague? Has it always been this way or was there a trend of low attendance?
I believe Portland recently hosted a Grand Prix, which I hope means that Wizards doesn't share the same aversion to our little corner of the country (which makes sense for a Seattle-based company).
TL;DR
Is the Northwest a barren wasteland for competitive Magic tournaments?
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This year there were GPs in Seattle and Vancouver.
The problem with the Northwest is that there just aren't a lot of large cities near each other. Someone living on the eastern seaboard can drive to umpteen major cities in just a few hours, its just basic geography.
edit: There was also an SCG open in Portland in September and another SCG open in Seattle in June.
Also I'm pretty sure that SCG has only released the schedule for the first three months? Im sure Seattle/Portland will be in the schedule at least once or twice in 2013
Okay, thanks. Like I said, I'm new to the tournament scene. Having them later in the year works out better for me anyway because I don't think I'm quite ready yet.
Back to the grind.
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However, they are located in Virginia, so you will find that most of their opens are located east of the Mississippi. I imagine it is far cheaper for them to host an Open in Indy than Seattle, if just for travel costs for their crew, equipment and inventory.
If anything, I feel like SCG has an unusual amount of tournaments in the heartland (midwest, nebraska, minnesota etc.) considering how many people live there, and not as many on the East coast considering the massive population clustered between virginia and new england.
0 Karn
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U Arcanis
B Geth
R Norin
G Yeva
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RB Olivia
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UR Melek
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WR Aurelia
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They would be competing with a TON of TCGplayer.com events for the most part, which seemingly overpower NJ/NY area.
The Midwest might not seem like it has a large concentration of people, but it's got a really weird layout. Most people who live in rural areas are close to at least a couple cities. The town I live in (in Western Illinois) is 3 hours away from St. Louis, 4 from Chicago, 4.5 from Indianapolis, 4.5 from Kansas City, 6.5 from Minneapolis, 7 from Memphis, 6 from Cincinnati, 8 from Columbus, and 6.5 from Detroit. Most people in rural areas will travel to a decent number of these events, despite the fact there's relatively low population density per county.
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I would recommend moving to Los Angeles.
Why Los Angeles?
Lots of great reasons!
Traffic, rent and living expenses are huge, if you want to be in entertainment its the place to be! Hell if you want to see people struggling and eating crow in the form of traffic, rent, and living expenses and barely making it through life then you should definitely move to Los Angeles!
Also I decided that in life I want more friends with cars.
You should move to LA.
Standard - :symb::symg: Aggro
Modern -:symr::symu: - Storm / :symb::symg::symr: - Dredgevine / :symw::symu: - Eggs / :symw::symu::symb::symr::symg: - Doman Zoo / - Soul Sisters
Legacy - :symr::symw::symg: - Zoo / :symr::symg: - Belcher
On the Standstill Promo
In terms of major events in the pacific northwest I agree completely. We can expect only around 2-4 major events a year.
360 Powered Cube
400 Common/Uncommon Cube
Edh Decks:
Uril, The Miststalker RGW
Molimo, Maro-Sorcerer G
Norin, The Wary R
Retired Generals
Kamahl, Fist of Krosa G
Maaga, Traitor To Mortals B
Eight-and-a-Half-Tails W
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs R
Savra, Queen of the Golgari BG
Stonebrow, Krosan Hero RG
Kemba, Kha Regent W
Captain Sisay GW
Darien, King of Kheldor W
Geth, Lord of the Vault B
the east coast bias. I just counted up the number of 2012 events and grouped them into two categories:
Events on eastern and central time zones vs events on mountain and west time zones. The results?
12 events on west/mountain time
32 events on east/central time
A few interesting things were found looking at the 2012 schedule and the upcoming schedule.
Some areas are heavily over-represented, namely places they can easily drive to from their HQ in VA.
Las Vegas gets visited often, at least twice a year. Presumably, because people like to party there.
Places that really get ignored:
Cities in Texas not named Dallas/ Ft. Worth
Bay Area, no San Francisco or Oakland events or even San Jose.
Smaller states that don't have a large or iconic capital city
Nothing in Canada (Don't have their passports perhaps? Dealing with customs?)
Anyway, I'm glad they're doing the open series and I'm planning on attending
my first SCG open in January in SD. They could certainly add a few more opens out
west and cut a few of the redundant Virginia ones.
EDH Decks
RGMarhault Elsdragon (A Touch of Rampage)RG
GWTrostani, Early Bird (Wurm Tribal)GW
RWAgrus Kos, Bumbat Drinkin' BadassRW
RDiaochan, Hateful BeautyR
Cardhaus tried running a large monthly standard series. It failed after a couple of months. I heard they were getting about 80 people, which was unsustainable.
Mirkwood has run regular large legacy tournaments in the past. I talked to the owner recently and he said he is reluctant to host another because of the poor attendance recently.
Besides that we get our PTQs and the occassional GP. There was a PTQ in Seattle this month that had over 300 people and many many side events. And there is a PTQ in Vancouver, British Columbia this weekend, and the day after the PTQ there is a large standard tournament at the PTQ venue.
So, I think we have our fair share of larger tournaments. Although, it may be on a downward trend.
I mapped the SCG Opens one time. If you move to somewhere in Ohio you'll be withiin a reasonable driving distance of most Opens East of the Mississippi.
Standard - :symb::symg: Aggro
Modern -:symr::symu: - Storm / :symb::symg::symr: - Dredgevine / :symw::symu: - Eggs / :symw::symu::symb::symr::symg: - Doman Zoo / - Soul Sisters
Legacy - :symr::symw::symg: - Zoo / :symr::symg: - Belcher
On the Standstill Promo
Have you been to Northwest Sports Cards? I've only been there once but it seemed like a great place.
I havn't been to Northwest Sports Cards, I'll have to look it up when I get back to the states.
Standard - :symb::symg: Aggro
Modern -:symr::symu: - Storm / :symb::symg::symr: - Dredgevine / :symw::symu: - Eggs / :symw::symu::symb::symr::symg: - Doman Zoo / - Soul Sisters
Legacy - :symr::symw::symg: - Zoo / :symr::symg: - Belcher
On the Standstill Promo
They also haven't revealed the SCG Open schedule past early April (I think). Don't give up hope yet!
Pretty much all of these can be answered with "why would SCG host a less profitable event?" They host things on the east coast because that's where people are. They don't host things in smaller states because nobody lives there. Calling it 'bias' is just dumb - this isn't some government agency that's supposed to perfectly equally distribute Magic opportunities to the masses.
As far as the Pacific Northwest goes, we got lucky this year, we had 2 Seattles & a Portland in a 5 month time frame! I think last year there was one Seattle total as well as the previous year before that.
I am hoping their April/May/June Schedule includes another hit to the Pacific Northwest, & another back 2 back weekend for the SouthWest, 2 events for 1 round trip ticket is very nice, if you're lucky enough to be able to do some traveling.