I've only been in 1 game store that didn't sell at least drinks. Usually it was just the manager's personal stash in a mini fridge to make some extra $$ for the weekend. Most players don't want drinks on the tables where they play, so the stores accomidate, but there are other stores that have people ordering pizza before the late night draft.
It's just something you deal with. I was in a big store not too long ago that had a "lounge area" where food/drinks were allowed. Only thing over there was a TV with college football or whatever playing to give people downtime between rounds.
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People knock over bottled drinks all the time. There goes your carpet. Or now you have a nice big spill on a vinyl floor that some kid can slip on and sue you for. Or a kid doesn't follow your rules and knocks over a drink that gets on your single or books you have to sell? All for 75 cents?
Do you know just how bad I could flame you for making such a rediculas statement like that? lol Most every store has food and drinks for sale.
it seems the original poster has abandoned the thread.
shame really, there was some genuinely good advise, in amongst the usual pointless commentary from MTGSalvation members. (ironically, this comment included)
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Do you know just how bad I could flame you for making such a rediculas statement like that? lol Most every store has food and drinks for sale.
Add to that that Snacks and drinks have a much much higher mark-up than say boosters... one of my local store-guy once told me that he makes the majority of his Tournament revenue from Snacks and Drinks, the tournament itself is usually a break even scenario
Do you know just how bad I could flame you for making such a rediculas statement like that? lol Most every store has food and drinks for sale.
Oh no, I'm so scared! An anonyous person on the internet claimed he can flame me! What do I do?
I've seen 3 LGS's close in my area, and all of them had a soda machine, and all of them had big nasty stains on the carpet, and all of them had merchandise ruined by 12 year olds ignoring the rules and carrying thier sodas around the books and stuff and spilling them. They all had candy bars that no one ever bought.
The one LGS in my area still open has a soda machine, but you aren't allowed to drink in the store, so all he does is push paying customers out the door. He sold those little mini microwave pizzas and hot pockets, that lasted about a week until some kid bought one and left a half eaten hot pocket behind a display and got the place infested with ants.
Making crazy $$ selling food and drinks in a gaming store is one of those "conventional wisdom" ideas that is wrong. its more trouble than its worth and will cost you more money than it brings in. But most people need to learn these things by themselves.
Add to that that Snacks and drinks have a much much higher mark-up than say boosters... one of my local store-guy once told me that he makes the majority of his Tournament revenue from Snacks and Drinks, the tournament itself is usually a break even scenario
Add to that that $1 in profit is going to cost you a few hundred in damages. It's a gaming/hobby store. Most of your clientele is kids/teenagers. Cleanliness and respect for others usually doesn't rank that high on the list for a lot of them.
Add to that that $1 in profit is going to cost you a few hundred in damages. It's a gaming/hobby store. Most of your clientele is kids/teenagers. Cleanliness and respect for others usually doesn't rank that high on the list for a lot of them.
It's obvious you would make a horrid store owner, so instead of rejecting everything everyone says, why not just not saying anything. Ive been in a LOT of stores, everyone of them sold snacks and drinks and none of them were going out of business due to snack and drink damage.
I've seen 3 LGS's close in my area, and all of them had a soda machine, and all of them had big nasty stains on the carpet, and all of them had merchandise ruined by 12 year olds ignoring the rules and carrying thier sodas around the books and stuff and spilling them. They all had candy bars that no one ever bought.
Maybe your area is just a bunch of filthy people going to those stores.
It's obvious you would make a horrid store owner, so instead of rejecting everything everyone says, why not just not saying anything. Ive been in a LOT of stores, everyone of them sold snacks and drinks and none of them were going out of business due to snack and drink damage.
Maybe your area is just a bunch of filthy people going to those stores.
There is a pristine example of this at a local store here. The owner is very, very strict about food and drinks. She sells them, but she has two policies to combat spillage.
If you make a mess that's a five dollar fine. If you make a mess and don't fess up to it and you get caught, you get banned permanently from the store and the witnesses that ratted you out get a free booster pack of their choice. It's pretty much been turned into a game around here where people are on the prowl for others who leave their trash behind or spill anything that's not water. Needless to say there hasn't been a single Cheetos bag left behind on any table or any spilled soda for over two years.
I was simply making a point to Captain Negative up there. Every store is not the same, so his area has a bunch of people who are sloppy, nasty and careless. Every area isn't like that lol and as I said, EVERY store I have been in, 100% of them sold drinks and snacks and I never saw people biting there nails worrying about someone spilling drinks. It'll happen, clean it up.
Not reaping the profits of food and beverage in a gaming shop would almost be moronic. No, it is. Thats a legitimate amount of revenue that comes effortlessly to any business that simply exists. Pay attention when your out and about, youll be amazed at the places that reap the income of candy bars and bottled water alone, especially in America.
The posters arguing about spilled beverages need to consider this; would you rather have a spilled beverage purchased from next door or one from your own shop? If your banning food and beverage from your store your way off the kook radar and thats a whole nother' ballgame.
Basically, any income that can come as easily as food and beverage should be reaped by any business opening up shop, especially social hangouts like game stores. Otherwise it will be spent next door.
As far as opening your own business or doing anything really, if you want it, go get it. It might take you a year to reach success or it might take you twenty. If you go after it and don't stop until you get it, how can you fail?
Add to that that $1 in profit is going to cost you a few hundred in damages. It's a gaming/hobby store. Most of your clientele is kids/teenagers. Cleanliness and respect for others usually doesn't rank that high on the list for a lot of them.
Exaggerate much? Essentially every customer who buys a drink will spill it over 100s worth of merchandise?
If so then your clientell is the issue not the drinks, I can understand Pizza and Hotpockets, as greasy fingers is a real danger to merchandise... but drinks?
Exaggerate much? Essentially every customer who buys a drink will spill it over 100s worth of merchandise?
If so then your clientell is the issue not the drinks, I can understand Pizza and Hotpockets, as greasy fingers is a real danger to merchandise... but drinks?
The real problem is that he is not understanding when most of these shops actually sell the pop and candy/chips. It is during the tourney time when the store is basically not open other than for the tourney. The food items are confined to the tourney area and that is actually very easy to control. Believe me, I have organized tourneys in the past, so I know how this works and it is not hard to avoid causing damage to the merchandise :p.
I think this whole oh no don't have drinks in the store is sorta way over played haha I mean every store I have been to has this and I don't see horrid spills anywhere.
I've heard alot of food and drink talk, video games and general tourney advice, but I would tell a new store owner to take serious consideration about inventory. Not only the cost of storage, which can build up over time given how bulk singles, lands, and even singles in the case if you consider square footage taken up by a card that may move at 1-2 copies a week.
I work with a few novelties stores and I love the efficiency of a comic book rack, either the old stand style or the book case style. I would love to see a card shop use either where the cards where displayed in oversize sleeve or like how CD's are in hard cases. Let the consumer browse and seek what they like. Unfortunately existing clients have not wanted to experiment with this idea.
Before obvious objections come out, yes security considerations have been accounted for in the model I thought of.
- multiple product lines and opportunities are things I look for and see businesses thriving because of
i.e.: as a "nerd store" you ought to cater to your clientel: have DnD, Pathfinder, White Wolf, puzzle games, board games and tables available
- an online presence is a must:
-Google Sites are free
-Google Calendar is free
-Google Mail is free
there are three easy communication avenues that I feel are mandatory.
Events almost every day, or a reason to go, are good for the store. They invite people to come.
Your clientel isn't going to know that DnD is on Tuesday, and it's Draft Wednesday and Board game Thursday unless you tell them so on your website, through a calendar, and have something to that effect along with your hours on your telephone answering machine.
Drinks and snacks seem like a good idea to me. Video games do not. Arcade machines seem good.
Again, nerds love the things they love. A lot of them loved arcade machines and a pinball machine. Quarters can be found and I'm sure that that space will pay for itself eventually.
The size of the store matters though, and you should have more places available for gaming to occur. As a consumer, I go to a proper store to see people and support the local store by buying cards and stuff. Otherwise, I'd just purchase everything online. And so you need lots of gaming tables so that you can have multiple people gaming in your store.
But that's just some stuff that I notice and respect out of game stores. Facilities are also a necessary, and the floor needs to be not sticky so do whatever you need to for that.
Play to win. If you don't, you're disrespecting everyone you're playing with by wasting their time. The Douchbag check is at the level of deck construction.
I think this whole oh no don't have drinks in the store is sorta way over played haha I mean every store I have been to has this and I don't see horrid spills anywhere.
The way we handle things at our shop is that you are allowed to bring in cans or bottles with lids, but not fast-food type containers. If a can of soda get spilled, or even a bottle if the cap wasnt all the way on, will only make a small spill before someone can grab it. In the case of fast food cups, if they get knocked over, the entire thing is then on the floor. Small spills are one thing, huge spills are another. And if you have ever had to pay to have your carpet cleaned, youll know its not cheap. I think the last time the owner had to clean the carpets before banning the fast-food cups, was about $200. In the end people can still get their meals if they want, they just have to leave the soda cups right outside the door on the windowsill. People in general seem understanding to it and after the many previous spills that occured by careless customers, people certainly became a lot more understanding :p.
Of course, if you dont have carpeted floors, then its not an issue :).
Having started a MTG/Games Workshop store with friends, I think I can help with some advice:
*edit*
0.) The most important thing: Location, location, location.
1.) Facebook. Facebook is free, and allows you to connect with your customers easily. We use it to post up events like Pre-releases and Launch Parties, and even collect orders for Commander boxes.
2.) Sell drinks/snacks. The threat of spillage is very overrated. We've never had a bad spill in the 1.5 years of operation, and there is a small but steady profit from drinks.
3.) Watch your cashflow very carefully. It's too easy to have hundreds of dollars tied up in crappy products like intro packs and event decks that dont sell well. If you see stuff that hasnt moved in months, it might be better selling it at cost or even at a small loss to shift it.
4.) Diversify. If you're in a small town Magic might not be enough to keep your store profitable. My shop is in a small town and without selling Games Workshop stuff we'd never be able to break even.
I can't believe anyone is excited about this card. It is absolutely unplayable. I wouldn't even play her in LIMITED. Easily the worst walker printed since the green elf one. Absolutely terrible.
A good way to fund some money for the store is host magic tournys with cash prizes equal to the prize pool -10% from each player, this allows people to put cash in there pocket, and it it will leave people coming back to your store and you can rake in from these tournaments. I knew a dealer at a warehouse who opened up a shop and they have $50 magic tournaments weekly and he takes 5 bucks from each buy in and pays out the top depending on who lives there. Also, since he has a very good assortment of cards to sell it is really competative there so peopple are willing to play high stakes magic =]
Having played at 2 different shops in the last year I can say for certain that most shops can't make profit without selling something besides magic. The original store I want to for a few years also sells video games and other card games as well as some kind of drink. The second one I want to after I moved doubled as a comic shop and had drinks as well. Neither sold food, but both were located in places that had some type of restaurant / food court within walking distance. Sadly I don't think the shop where I got my start will be around much longer, due in most part to the economy which saddens me quite a bit as it was a real proving ground place for me.
I honestly buy all my singles from the internet, even though one store in my town sells singles and actually has a good selection.
However, I do try to go to tournaments when I can which makes them a bit of money, and pretty much whenever I go into a game store, I buy a booster pack, so they get my $4 everytime I visit, even if I never buy singles from them.
Wow, there is so much I could say in this thread. I certainly want to encourage our community's entrepreneurs, and yet I want to make sure I am accurately warning them of what they are in for.
Even a cheap arcade cabinet is going to cost mulitiple hundreds of dollars. Repair of a machine can get even pricier... electronics fail.
Actually, they're pretty robust. They were built to take abuse on a daily basis. When I was a pro dealer with a shop, we had three cabinets, and they paid the entire rent payment by themselves, leaving us free to allocate retail revenue elsewhere. They were Street Fighter Alpha 2, a six-slot Neo Geo, and Marvel vs Capcom. Granted, this was over ten years ago, but a quick look at Craigslist and eBay suggests that such games are still quite affordable. Plus, repairs are usually of the pliers-and-wire-and-tape variety. You don't usually have to yank out the motherboards... 99% of the time when something goes wrong it's because a wire came loose after months of incremental pressure on the side of a button or what have you, and all you have to do is crimp on a new contact.
Someone further up the thread mentioned some of these same games, and another guy mentioned classic retros. I think both are good ideas. The big benefit of an arcade upright is that you're not really competing with your other revenue lines, and it can be a reliable and consistent earner. If I were getting back into the biz, I would not open a store without at least two or three machines.
EDIT: Oh, also. Sell drinks. The profit margins on drinks speak for themselves. You'd have to be riding the short bus not to find a way to make this work, usually by configuring your store so that concessions are nowhere near primary retail inventory. Soda fountains are even more profitable, even with the added mess and maintenance. If you can do it, you should. Srsly.
My number one rule: Be polite...and make sure your regulars are as well
Since i am of a very bad venting, i will share something.
In springfield VA. there is a place called Curio Caverns. And there is a regular in there that has to travel far to get there when there was a large community where he lived. Now why does he go there...oh thats simple, he is a troll(Ill call him Guy A). The most famous story of him, is that he called a guy a pedophile because a 14ish year old girl was using her "assets" to make a guy get her stuff. Now Guy A, does this for fun. If you bring a deck that gets beaten by him, he will go over how much better he is than you, take your cards and toss them, hoping you go after him, so he can get sue you for money. If you beat him, he calls you lucky and tells you it wont happen again.
Now, Curio Caverns hosts this guy, gives him the lowest prices, first dibs and lets him do this crap. Basically, if you arent there buddy buddy, you better hope that you go in there during a non-busy time. The only saving grace is that the owner does have very good backstock, but in my 2 times going there, i have not come back with a pleasent experience.
So my key points to a good store are:
Respectful to all customers, which means make sure you treat your regulars well, but also make sure that you dont only cater to them.
Make sure your customers treat each other well
SELL SODA AND SNACKS.....
oh, and while im at it....if your down in woodbridge, Va. go check out a place called painted visions comics (not monday or thursday...although the staff then is phenominal, they cant sell cards out of the binders). Look for a guy named Tommy. He is argueably one of the best examples on how customers should be treated. If you wait long enough, he will make sure that, even if his regulars are in, you will be served well and good. Also, the owner of the shop is a very good man. I dont know his name, but i call him the bossman.
It's just something you deal with. I was in a big store not too long ago that had a "lounge area" where food/drinks were allowed. Only thing over there was a TV with college football or whatever playing to give people downtime between rounds.
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shame really, there was some genuinely good advise, in amongst the usual pointless commentary from MTGSalvation members. (ironically, this comment included)
Add to that that Snacks and drinks have a much much higher mark-up than say boosters... one of my local store-guy once told me that he makes the majority of his Tournament revenue from Snacks and Drinks, the tournament itself is usually a break even scenario
Oh no, I'm so scared! An anonyous person on the internet claimed he can flame me! What do I do?
I've seen 3 LGS's close in my area, and all of them had a soda machine, and all of them had big nasty stains on the carpet, and all of them had merchandise ruined by 12 year olds ignoring the rules and carrying thier sodas around the books and stuff and spilling them. They all had candy bars that no one ever bought.
The one LGS in my area still open has a soda machine, but you aren't allowed to drink in the store, so all he does is push paying customers out the door. He sold those little mini microwave pizzas and hot pockets, that lasted about a week until some kid bought one and left a half eaten hot pocket behind a display and got the place infested with ants.
Making crazy $$ selling food and drinks in a gaming store is one of those "conventional wisdom" ideas that is wrong. its more trouble than its worth and will cost you more money than it brings in. But most people need to learn these things by themselves.
Add to that that $1 in profit is going to cost you a few hundred in damages. It's a gaming/hobby store. Most of your clientele is kids/teenagers. Cleanliness and respect for others usually doesn't rank that high on the list for a lot of them.
It's obvious you would make a horrid store owner, so instead of rejecting everything everyone says, why not just not saying anything. Ive been in a LOT of stores, everyone of them sold snacks and drinks and none of them were going out of business due to snack and drink damage.
Maybe your area is just a bunch of filthy people going to those stores.
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https://twitter.com/JamesFullard
To Counter a Spell Jon Finkel Simply Taps Two Islands and Says No!
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My Youtube Channel
:symw::symu::symb::symr::symg:
•●«It's Pronounced Duh Mah Juh»●•
There is a pristine example of this at a local store here. The owner is very, very strict about food and drinks. She sells them, but she has two policies to combat spillage.
If you make a mess that's a five dollar fine. If you make a mess and don't fess up to it and you get caught, you get banned permanently from the store and the witnesses that ratted you out get a free booster pack of their choice. It's pretty much been turned into a game around here where people are on the prowl for others who leave their trash behind or spill anything that's not water. Needless to say there hasn't been a single Cheetos bag left behind on any table or any spilled soda for over two years.
Ruin's Trading Post
Lets move on.
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To Counter a Spell Jon Finkel Simply Taps Two Islands and Says No!
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:symw::symu::symb::symr::symg:
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The posters arguing about spilled beverages need to consider this; would you rather have a spilled beverage purchased from next door or one from your own shop? If your banning food and beverage from your store your way off the kook radar and thats a whole nother' ballgame.
Basically, any income that can come as easily as food and beverage should be reaped by any business opening up shop, especially social hangouts like game stores. Otherwise it will be spent next door.
As far as opening your own business or doing anything really, if you want it, go get it. It might take you a year to reach success or it might take you twenty. If you go after it and don't stop until you get it, how can you fail?
Exaggerate much? Essentially every customer who buys a drink will spill it over 100s worth of merchandise?
If so then your clientell is the issue not the drinks, I can understand Pizza and Hotpockets, as greasy fingers is a real danger to merchandise... but drinks?
The real problem is that he is not understanding when most of these shops actually sell the pop and candy/chips. It is during the tourney time when the store is basically not open other than for the tourney. The food items are confined to the tourney area and that is actually very easy to control. Believe me, I have organized tourneys in the past, so I know how this works and it is not hard to avoid causing damage to the merchandise :p.
New to Commander? Read the Above article.
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To Counter a Spell Jon Finkel Simply Taps Two Islands and Says No!
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My Youtube Channel
:symw::symu::symb::symr::symg:
•●«It's Pronounced Duh Mah Juh»●•
I work with a few novelties stores and I love the efficiency of a comic book rack, either the old stand style or the book case style. I would love to see a card shop use either where the cards where displayed in oversize sleeve or like how CD's are in hard cases. Let the consumer browse and seek what they like. Unfortunately existing clients have not wanted to experiment with this idea.
Before obvious objections come out, yes security considerations have been accounted for in the model I thought of.
PM me if you like.
Objectives Achieved
- multiple product lines and opportunities are things I look for and see businesses thriving because of
i.e.: as a "nerd store" you ought to cater to your clientel: have DnD, Pathfinder, White Wolf, puzzle games, board games and tables available
- an online presence is a must:
-Google Sites are free
-Google Calendar is free
-Google Mail is free
there are three easy communication avenues that I feel are mandatory.
Events almost every day, or a reason to go, are good for the store. They invite people to come.
Your clientel isn't going to know that DnD is on Tuesday, and it's Draft Wednesday and Board game Thursday unless you tell them so on your website, through a calendar, and have something to that effect along with your hours on your telephone answering machine.
Drinks and snacks seem like a good idea to me. Video games do not. Arcade machines seem good.
Again, nerds love the things they love. A lot of them loved arcade machines and a pinball machine. Quarters can be found and I'm sure that that space will pay for itself eventually.
The size of the store matters though, and you should have more places available for gaming to occur. As a consumer, I go to a proper store to see people and support the local store by buying cards and stuff. Otherwise, I'd just purchase everything online. And so you need lots of gaming tables so that you can have multiple people gaming in your store.
But that's just some stuff that I notice and respect out of game stores. Facilities are also a necessary, and the floor needs to be not sticky so do whatever you need to for that.
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The way we handle things at our shop is that you are allowed to bring in cans or bottles with lids, but not fast-food type containers. If a can of soda get spilled, or even a bottle if the cap wasnt all the way on, will only make a small spill before someone can grab it. In the case of fast food cups, if they get knocked over, the entire thing is then on the floor. Small spills are one thing, huge spills are another. And if you have ever had to pay to have your carpet cleaned, youll know its not cheap. I think the last time the owner had to clean the carpets before banning the fast-food cups, was about $200. In the end people can still get their meals if they want, they just have to leave the soda cups right outside the door on the windowsill. People in general seem understanding to it and after the many previous spills that occured by careless customers, people certainly became a lot more understanding :p.
Of course, if you dont have carpeted floors, then its not an issue :).
*edit*
0.) The most important thing: Location, location, location.
1.) Facebook. Facebook is free, and allows you to connect with your customers easily. We use it to post up events like Pre-releases and Launch Parties, and even collect orders for Commander boxes.
2.) Sell drinks/snacks. The threat of spillage is very overrated. We've never had a bad spill in the 1.5 years of operation, and there is a small but steady profit from drinks.
3.) Watch your cashflow very carefully. It's too easy to have hundreds of dollars tied up in crappy products like intro packs and event decks that dont sell well. If you see stuff that hasnt moved in months, it might be better selling it at cost or even at a small loss to shift it.
4.) Diversify. If you're in a small town Magic might not be enough to keep your store profitable. My shop is in a small town and without selling Games Workshop stuff we'd never be able to break even.
hope this helps.
UBRGWControlled from every angle WGRBU
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/blog.php?b=5886
Then, go back through the entire blog and read all of this guy's stuff. Probably some of the best advice you can ever be given.
That is a great article. I have new respect for my LGS.
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Goodbye Gutter!
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To Counter a Spell Jon Finkel Simply Taps Two Islands and Says No!
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:symw::symu::symb::symr::symg:
•●«It's Pronounced Duh Mah Juh»●•
However, I do try to go to tournaments when I can which makes them a bit of money, and pretty much whenever I go into a game store, I buy a booster pack, so they get my $4 everytime I visit, even if I never buy singles from them.
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One thing I will talk about right now is this:
Actually, they're pretty robust. They were built to take abuse on a daily basis. When I was a pro dealer with a shop, we had three cabinets, and they paid the entire rent payment by themselves, leaving us free to allocate retail revenue elsewhere. They were Street Fighter Alpha 2, a six-slot Neo Geo, and Marvel vs Capcom. Granted, this was over ten years ago, but a quick look at Craigslist and eBay suggests that such games are still quite affordable. Plus, repairs are usually of the pliers-and-wire-and-tape variety. You don't usually have to yank out the motherboards... 99% of the time when something goes wrong it's because a wire came loose after months of incremental pressure on the side of a button or what have you, and all you have to do is crimp on a new contact.
Someone further up the thread mentioned some of these same games, and another guy mentioned classic retros. I think both are good ideas. The big benefit of an arcade upright is that you're not really competing with your other revenue lines, and it can be a reliable and consistent earner. If I were getting back into the biz, I would not open a store without at least two or three machines.
EDIT: Oh, also. Sell drinks. The profit margins on drinks speak for themselves. You'd have to be riding the short bus not to find a way to make this work, usually by configuring your store so that concessions are nowhere near primary retail inventory. Soda fountains are even more profitable, even with the added mess and maintenance. If you can do it, you should. Srsly.
-RE
Since i am of a very bad venting, i will share something.
In springfield VA. there is a place called Curio Caverns. And there is a regular in there that has to travel far to get there when there was a large community where he lived. Now why does he go there...oh thats simple, he is a troll(Ill call him Guy A). The most famous story of him, is that he called a guy a pedophile because a 14ish year old girl was using her "assets" to make a guy get her stuff. Now Guy A, does this for fun. If you bring a deck that gets beaten by him, he will go over how much better he is than you, take your cards and toss them, hoping you go after him, so he can get sue you for money. If you beat him, he calls you lucky and tells you it wont happen again.
Now, Curio Caverns hosts this guy, gives him the lowest prices, first dibs and lets him do this crap. Basically, if you arent there buddy buddy, you better hope that you go in there during a non-busy time. The only saving grace is that the owner does have very good backstock, but in my 2 times going there, i have not come back with a pleasent experience.
So my key points to a good store are:
Respectful to all customers, which means make sure you treat your regulars well, but also make sure that you dont only cater to them.
Make sure your customers treat each other well
SELL SODA AND SNACKS.....
oh, and while im at it....if your down in woodbridge, Va. go check out a place called painted visions comics (not monday or thursday...although the staff then is phenominal, they cant sell cards out of the binders). Look for a guy named Tommy. He is argueably one of the best examples on how customers should be treated. If you wait long enough, he will make sure that, even if his regulars are in, you will be served well and good. Also, the owner of the shop is a very good man. I dont know his name, but i call him the bossman.
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething Spicy