seems like its a pain in the ass, but people still want it
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Basically this: Your life total doesn't matter. The only life point that matters is the last one. Cards matter. Having an extra card is so much more important than the bit of life you lose.
Now, it's not the best card drawing engine for black, but it's still pretty strong.
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I'll hold myself to this. I'll get fancy dishes and everything.
well it's nowhere near as good as Dark Confidant or Phyrexian Arena, but i think the lure of those older cards is what makes it so popular for testing. Personally, i think only a balls-to the walls aggro deck can make good use of it, and they probably want to curve out at around 3.
well it's nowhere near as good as Dark Confidant or Phyrexian Arena, but i think the lure of those older cards is what makes it so popular for testing.
It's no Arena, sure, but I think the comparison to Dark Confidant is a bit trickier. It comes down a turn later, but it doesn't eat Bolts. On the other other hand, it doesn't swing for 2. Depending on the meta and the build of the particular deck, I think it can be better or worse than Bob.
bob is better in virtually all circumstances, tutelage is a card you want to be able to destroy on a whim, you can always kill your own confidant but in many cases, tutelage is going to kill you as curving as decks running tutelage are going to probably have higher curves than those running confidants.
I'm pretty sure it's because it is the only way to draw an extra card every turn for black in standard. Yeah, it's not in the same league as Bob and Arena, but neither are standard legal, and standard is the driving force behind singles prices.
It has its usefulness in decks that can scry on a regular basis (re: Crystal Ball), but I'd much rather run Sign in Blood for non-life threatening, black card advantage.
It's a little bit of an advanced concept, but think of it as giving up life totals to win a turn earlier. You net more card advantage, gain access to more spells quicker, and thus you are essentially winning earlier.
So, chucking away 4 life to win a turn earlier is actually a lot better looking than it may appear to be. It's the same as neglecting to chump block so you can get a little more advantage with your creature later in the game. Giving up life for advantage is black's specialty.
However, it's a very risky plan, which is why Dark Confidant is better, you can get rid of it, as well as attack and chump block with it. Dark Tutelage just kinda sits there doing it's awesome thing until you don't want it to anymore and then just keeps on doing it!
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"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
Rule #156: Always, when determining, if a card is good or not, ignore all "pay life" or "you lose life" effects unless they make you lose 17 or more life.
Chaosworm gave a good rule of thumb. Don't be afraid to pay or lose life unless it is going to kill you within 2 turns (and if you can kill your opponent before you die, go for it anyways).
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Card advantage at cost of life is really not a big deal unless you're extremely low. That's why Bob is so powerful, and why he was in basically every Extended deck that ran black.
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i don't know about 17 life, i think most spells stop being acceptable around paying 6+ life simply because your opponent has effectively gained a lot of tempo from that (potentially 2+ swings).
i don't know about 17 life, i think most spells stop being acceptable around paying 6+ life simply because your opponent has effectively gained a lot of tempo from that (potentially 2+ swings).
Yawgmoth's Bargain is a perfect example of life doesn't matter even if its 19 life. As long as I win in the end.
level up is absolute garbage. yes somebody feel free to quote me on this in their sig. NONE OF THE LEVEL UP CARDS SHOWN TODAY WILL SEE COMPETITIVE PLAY OUTSIDE OF LIKE ROE ONLY CONSTRUCTED OR SOME GARBAGE.
17 life because of lightning bolt :P. So, 16 or less is perfectly acceptable. :). In any case, I don't like Dark Tutelage. Black always has a way out of its own predicament, but not with this one. It doesn't fit the bill.
Yawgmoth's Bargain is a perfect example of life doesn't matter even if its 19 life. As long as I win in the end.
and most cards that would require a life cost would not have nearly as powerful of an effect as yawgmoth's bargain.
yes, we all know life is a resource that can be paid, however, there is a limit as to how good a spell's life cost is proportional to its effect.
yawgmoth's bargain will rarely, if ever, net you 19 cards, in fact, i would go so far as to say you will practically never draw 19 cards off the thing unless your deck is some sort of infinite combo/life gain deck (turbospaz variant or something).
consider a card that had the effect: "Draw 19 cards, you lose 19 life."
Nobody would ever run this card unless it cost a single black mana as you would never be able to use it without killing yourself in any format this would be threatening in.
It would be absolute garbage in standard because 19 cards will rarely instantly win you the game even off a single B. the new extended fares little better off the effect as it suffers the same problems. in legacy, you remove any ability to use sac lands which means you pretty much need to have a nuts draw in order to win. and using this card would effectively throw away the aggro matchup which is the only reason you would be using that deck.
the same problem occurs in vintage, the inability to use cracklands and force of will means TES would probably shy away from the card.
simply put, there are limitations on how much life any card can make you pay to use it before it goes into "suckage" category. obviously things like "1 life=1 card" has to have some other sort of investment or else it becomes broken (ala necro and bargain); but for the most part, large life loss is too large a tempo loss to be worth it for many decks. the life loss has to be reasonable or the effect immensely powerful/broken to merit such a large payment.
that having been said, you should almost always evaluate life lower than other resources, it is the thing you have the most of and so can usually afford to spend some to obtain a poweful effect. just don't think ridiculously large life requirements are always attached to effects powerful enough to warrant the payment.
Now, it's not the best card drawing engine for black, but it's still pretty strong.
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So, chucking away 4 life to win a turn earlier is actually a lot better looking than it may appear to be. It's the same as neglecting to chump block so you can get a little more advantage with your creature later in the game. Giving up life for advantage is black's specialty.
However, it's a very risky plan, which is why Dark Confidant is better, you can get rid of it, as well as attack and chump block with it. Dark Tutelage just kinda sits there doing it's awesome thing until you don't want it to anymore and then just keeps on doing it!
"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
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Chaosworm gave a good rule of thumb. Don't be afraid to pay or lose life unless it is going to kill you within 2 turns (and if you can kill your opponent before you die, go for it anyways).
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
Thanks to DNC @ Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sig.
Casual
Midblight
Yawgmoth's Bargain is a perfect example of life doesn't matter even if its 19 life. As long as I win in the end.
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Stratgan
and most cards that would require a life cost would not have nearly as powerful of an effect as yawgmoth's bargain.
yes, we all know life is a resource that can be paid, however, there is a limit as to how good a spell's life cost is proportional to its effect.
yawgmoth's bargain will rarely, if ever, net you 19 cards, in fact, i would go so far as to say you will practically never draw 19 cards off the thing unless your deck is some sort of infinite combo/life gain deck (turbospaz variant or something).
consider a card that had the effect: "Draw 19 cards, you lose 19 life."
Nobody would ever run this card unless it cost a single black mana as you would never be able to use it without killing yourself in any format this would be threatening in.
It would be absolute garbage in standard because 19 cards will rarely instantly win you the game even off a single B. the new extended fares little better off the effect as it suffers the same problems. in legacy, you remove any ability to use sac lands which means you pretty much need to have a nuts draw in order to win. and using this card would effectively throw away the aggro matchup which is the only reason you would be using that deck.
the same problem occurs in vintage, the inability to use cracklands and force of will means TES would probably shy away from the card.
simply put, there are limitations on how much life any card can make you pay to use it before it goes into "suckage" category. obviously things like "1 life=1 card" has to have some other sort of investment or else it becomes broken (ala necro and bargain); but for the most part, large life loss is too large a tempo loss to be worth it for many decks. the life loss has to be reasonable or the effect immensely powerful/broken to merit such a large payment.
that having been said, you should almost always evaluate life lower than other resources, it is the thing you have the most of and so can usually afford to spend some to obtain a poweful effect. just don't think ridiculously large life requirements are always attached to effects powerful enough to warrant the payment.