Drawing 7 cards for 3 mana should probably speak for itself. However, if you still don't see the value in that, consider the other cards available in Type 1. Many of those cards cost 0 - 2 mana. It isn't hard to start a T1 game with 7 cards, play 5 of them (including a Timetwister) and then play 2 - 4 more while keeping a few counters or other answers in your hand. It also has uses to mess up your opponent's strategy later in the game by forcing him to discard his hand at inopportune moment. It is a potent effect.
Having said that, I think Tolarian Academy or Yawgmoth's Will would replace Timetwister if the list were to be rewritten today.
I think that Timetwister was included in the original list because it was the only card of its kind. It had both the effect of recycling every card you had used so far and drawing you a new hand, and it was also in blue, the color that could make the most of having more answers in its hand.
For the time there was also wheel of fortune which would be fully capable of that spot had it not been non-blue. But now theres also windfall and maybe others that have a very similar affect to this so I would say that one guys right about tolarian academy or yawgmoths will. Personaly i'm rather partial to Avatar of Discord.
For the time there was also wheel of fortune which would be fully capable of that spot had it not been non-blue. But now theres also windfall and maybe others that have a very similar affect to this so I would say that one guys right about tolarian academy or yawgmoths will. Personaly i'm rather partial to Avatar of Discord.
Minor Corrections:
Wheel IS non-blue.
Avatar of Discord is in no way close to making it into the power nine. The Power Nine are what they are because they essentially always are worthy of being in a deck and always bring up the power level of a deck.
This arguement gets rehashed from time to time. Sure, the 'twister might not seem as powerful by comparison as the other 8 members of the P9, but that group was compiled over a decade ago. Back then, there was little else to compare with its power. Nowadays, sure, most people would add things like Yawgmoth's Will (along with "Power 10" member Library of Alexandria), etc. to the list, probably comprising as many as 15 cards or so.
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I have been playing for a while. I get the logic behind the Power 9, and I know I am probably being a noob for saying this.
But why is Timetwister a member of the Power 9? I mean, other than drawing you a new hand and cycling your graveyard for a low cost, what does it do?
In short, I know it is good, but the effect just does not seem drastic enough to merit such an elite status.
Then again, it's like a 3x Ancestral Recall.
I mean, Time Walk is a REALLY good effect for overly cheap cost, and it can be combo'd with Flame Fusillade (or something like that).
Eh...can someone put any logic behind it? Or am I just stubborn?
It's not any big mystery; it's just for historical reasons. Back in the early days of Magic when the term "Power Nine" was first coined, Timetwister was as good as the rest. Not anymore, but the name stuck anyway.
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It is just one of those things that gets grandfathered in. I think a new list would be nice to see, but then again the term has been used for so long that it would be confusing. So it will have to remain. Maybe someone can make a new list that will stick, but until then we just have the power nine...and it is static.
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As Magic has evolved, the graveyard has evolved greatly as a resource. In the past, the graveyard was generally a dead zone aside from Regrowth and Animate Dead. It isn't until recently that reanimation really became viable due to efficient self discard type effects. Recycling your graveyard suddenly matters little and actually in most decks would screw you over. Wheel of Fortune is better than Timetwister for modern magic but but is in a color which is awkward. Thanks to Force of Will and Misdirection to a lesser extent, being Blue matters alot in a cards worth. Windfall is not really worth mentioning because it is dependant on each players hand size, which most times means it wont draw you enough cards. Tolarian Accademy surprises me in the lack of play it seems to get.
Twister died effectively the day Yawgmoth's Will was printed. The two cards fill effectively the same roll while Will is much more Abusable. Twister was restricted back in a day where it was used with Tormod's Crypts and Millstones as part of a decking strategy...in that narrow format it was sick. Library is also sickeningly abusive, agreed...but only takes Will's potential inclusion due to its $ cost and rarity. Mana Crypt could almost fill this list as well, but is itself relatively easy to attain.
Back to the original question; To understand why Twister is on the P9 list, you need to understand the early days of Magic.
In vintage you could drop a lot of Moxen or low cost nonsense, then Twister, then get a whole new hand, drop more goodies, produce a million mana and end the game right there with storm XxX ( exaggerating, but ya ). It's a great card, the weakest of the the 9, but great.
Library of Alexandria? Meh. Circumstantial card, It's in the power 15.
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Also, consider that it doesn't remove itself from the game as Time Spiral does. That the Spiral untaps six land makes it even more broken, but at least you can't just keep it up forever. Timetwister lets you avoid decking forever, as well as completely restock your hand and reuse cards from your graveyard. With four or more in your deck (old days, before the four-of rule) you could easily go arbitrarily large with moxen and Ancestrall Recall.
That said, if Sol Ring were rare, it'd be a candidate. And I'd say that Yawgmoth's Will is beyond the level of Power 9. It's just that ridiculous.
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My anecdotal evidence disagrees with yours! EXPLAIN THAT!
You actually need more then Timetwister to keep your library going forever. Because you can't play two copies of Timetwister. So you need something like Regrowth+Timetwister in your deck and you will probably never be decked.
I have been playing for a while. I get the logic behind the Power 9, and I know I am probably being a noob for saying this.
But why is Timetwister a member of the Power 9? I mean, other than drawing you a new hand and cycling your graveyard for a low cost, what does it do?
In short, I know it is good, but the effect just does not seem drastic enough to merit such an elite status.
Then again, it's like a 3x Ancestral Recall.
I mean, Time Walk is a REALLY good effect for overly cheap cost, and it can be combo'd with Flame Fusillade (or something like that).
Eh...can someone put any logic behind it? Or am I just stubborn?
When you look at it that way, the Moxes just give you a mana, that's not a particularly powerful effect, right?
Having said that, I think Tolarian Academy or Yawgmoth's Will would replace Timetwister if the list were to be rewritten today.
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Minor Corrections:
Wheel IS non-blue.
Avatar of Discord is in no way close to making it into the power nine. The Power Nine are what they are because they essentially always are worthy of being in a deck and always bring up the power level of a deck.
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It has largely disappeared from Vintage because it fills most of the same space as Yawgmoth's Will.
It's not any big mystery; it's just for historical reasons. Back in the early days of Magic when the term "Power Nine" was first coined, Timetwister was as good as the rest. Not anymore, but the name stuck anyway.
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Especially since Mirrodin and lots of zero-cost artifacts out and about.
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Tolarian Accademy surprises me in the lack of play it seems to get.
Twister died effectively the day Yawgmoth's Will was printed. The two cards fill effectively the same roll while Will is much more Abusable. Twister was restricted back in a day where it was used with Tormod's Crypts and Millstones as part of a decking strategy...in that narrow format it was sick. Library is also sickeningly abusive, agreed...but only takes Will's potential inclusion due to its $ cost and rarity. Mana Crypt could almost fill this list as well, but is itself relatively easy to attain.
Back to the original question; To understand why Twister is on the P9 list, you need to understand the early days of Magic.
In vintage you could drop a lot of Moxen or low cost nonsense, then Twister, then get a whole new hand, drop more goodies, produce a million mana and end the game right there with storm XxX ( exaggerating, but ya ). It's a great card, the weakest of the the 9, but great.
Library of Alexandria? Meh. Circumstantial card, It's in the power 15.
And, it's Time Vault that combos with Flame Fussilade.
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Don't want to add to confusion. This combo is dead.
That said, if Sol Ring were rare, it'd be a candidate. And I'd say that Yawgmoth's Will is beyond the level of Power 9. It's just that ridiculous.
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