This is terrible news. Over $20k worth of cards were stolen from Neutral Grounds today. If Chang and Orlove quit magic over this, it will have negative effects on the entire Vintage community. A quote by Chang himself:
Quote from Roland Chang »
Dear Vintage and Magic Communities,
I, Roland Chang, come to you today not to ask for your pity, but rather your help. My White Rook Case of 8 deck boxes was stolen today at Neutral Ground in New York City. Inside those boxes contained most importantly my fully Beta Powered/Foiled Stax deck, Grim Long minus Power, Slaver minus Power, another set of my teammate’s Beta Power and other very valuable cards. These cards may exceed a total of 15,000-20,000 dollars in cards. I am completely devastated by the events that took place around 2:30pm earlier today…
At approximately 2:25 pm, I met with a person I know by the name of Ici Li, to meet and test decks. After I got there and sat, I had taken out my trade binder as well as Rook Case of decks to set up for the testing session. Ici wanted to check out my binder for cards he could possibly purchase from me, so I handed my binder over to him. While he did that, I took out the 3 deck boxes of Stax, Grim Long, and Slaver out from my Rook Case.
After doing so, I mentioned to him I was going to leave briefly to grab a drink. I asked him if he needed a drink, but he declined, so I went to pick up a drink for myself at the main register about 25-30 feet away from the table we sat at. From the main register, I could not see my cards because of the drink refrigerators stood blocking my view. I waited for about 2 minutes in line to purchase my drink, then I saw Ici walking up to the other side of the counter to ask for a pen.
Assuming my cards were unprotected, I rushed back to the table with drink in hand only to find my Rook Case missing and my binder still there. Ici had gotten up to ask for a pen, so he could write down what cards he wanted from me. Before he left the table, he said to a couple of players at the same table to guard over the cards for a second. They complied and somehow when both of us returned, my Rook Case had completely vanished.
I looked for about an hour around the store and asking people to open their bags before leaving shocked, in disbelief, and enraged. “How could this have happened to me?” I asked. Within a time frame of 2 or less minutes, while I was up at the register to purchase my drink, my cards had been stolen right off of the table.
Upon leaving Neutral Ground, I had called many people I know and trust and alerted everyone I knew in the area regarding my stolen property. Within the boxes included Jacob Orlove’s (my teammate) Power he was lending out for another teammate at the upcoming Gencon. Now his Power and mine are missing.
I have played this game for well over 10 years and have not once dealt with theft from my collection until today. I strongly believe that the malicious person(s) involved in this want to cash out my cards either through e-bay, local card shops, or some online dealing.
FYI: A police report has been filed and I will be looking over security video footage from the building tomorrow.
My decks contained very unique cards with particular alterations, signatures, and versions.
If any of you have information on the cards listed below, please let me know through IM, PM, or e-mail ASAP. A hefty reward will be given out to the people who help me get my cards back. I would greatly appreciate any help I receive from anyone in the following weeks/months/years regarding the stolen items.
Here is the list:
First and Foremost… Jacob’s List of Cards:
Underground Sea (revised)
4 Force of Will (2 english, 1 portuguese, 1 french)
1 Tinker (normal)
1 Yagwmoth's Bargain (japanese, signed)
1 Memory Jar (normal)
1 Mana Vault (korean bb)
1 Mana Crypt (english bb)
1 Lotus Petal (japanese, signed in gold along the side)
1 Lion's Eye Diamond (normal)
1 Vampiric Tutor (french)
5 Moxes (all bb, emerald and ruby def. beta, the rest could be alpha, sapphire in great condition)
1 Black Lotus (bb)
1 Ancestral Recall (bb, beta, signed, has "The Book" written on it, AND an art alteration showing a book. Unique)
1 Time Walk (bb, pretty bad condition)
1 Timetwister (unlimited)
My Main Cards in that box:
4 x Workshop (nm-mint)
1 x Time Walk (unlimited, nm)
1 x Black Lotus (beta, good)
1 x Ancestral Recall (beta, good, signed in black marker by Mark Poole)
1 x Mox Emerald (beta, good)
1 x Mox Jet (alpha, miscut to one side, mint)
1 x Mox Pearl (alpha, played cond.)
1 x Mox Ruby (beta, played cond.)
1 x Mox Sapphire (beta, good, signed in black marker by Mark Poole)
1 x Crucible of Worlds (Foil, altered art of Deathstar, signed by Ron Spencer)
1 x Mana Crypt (English, bb, altered art of golden Wurm from Star Wars chasing Mill. Falcon, signed)
1 x Mana Vault (Alpha, nm, altered art of Rubix Cube, signed)
1 x Imperial Seal (Japanese)
1 x Sol Ring (Beta, nm, altered art of LOTR Eye of Sauron in metallic blue marker, signed)
2 x Crucible of Worlds (Foil, Japanese)
1 x Sunderin Titan (Foil, Japanese)
1 x Tinker (Foil, Japanese)
1 x Memory Jar (Foil, Japanese)
1 x Triskelion (Foil, Japanese)
1 x Trinisphere (Foil, Japanese)
4 x Smokestack (Japanese)
4 x Duress (Foil, Japanese)
4 x Tanglewire (Foil, 3 Japanese, 1 Chinese)
4 x Polluted Delta (Foil)
3 x Grim Tutor
3 x Demonic Tutor (Beta, condition varied, one signed and played cond.)
4 x Sinkhole (1 alpha, 3 beta)
8 x Wasteland (Foil)
That was most of it that was most valuable, but the list goes on…
I have lost not only my cards, but cards of my teammate as well. Today’s double blow has seriously made me reconsider playing this game again. I have lost a great deal and only hope to find the perpetrators in time. With your help, that may/may not happen, but I thank you all in advance for any help.
Sincerely,
Roland Chang
Be on the lookout for these cards. Alert local card dealers and keep an eye on ebay.
mtgthesource thread - here
themanadrain thread - here
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Brandon "Emidln" Adams - The true Legacy Strategist of the Year
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I've never heard of either of those people, but my god, does that suck. All the cards I've either lost or had stolen in my life probably add up to less than $100. I think I'd probably sell off the rest of my cards and get out of the game for good if that happened to me
Although if I had $15,000 - $20,000 worth of cards in my deck case, I'd never let it leave my sight.
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"...because without beer, things do not seem to go as well."
The lack of response on this thread only proves that Type 2 players (MTGS members) don't give a **** about their fellow magic players.
People not caring is one of the main reasons why thieves are so bold. If you guys would actually give a damn, maybe thieves would think twice before stealing $20k worth of cardboard.
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Brandon "Emidln" Adams - The true Legacy Strategist of the Year
Member of Team Lucksack Voting for Ron Paul in 2008 Learn how to get better at Magic
Considering I am not in the new york area I won't see any action from this BUTI like to pass on my hopes that Roland nails the Bastarded ass that did this and gets everything back. If I do run into the bastard by miracle of nature I'll steal that crap back and mail it to him.:) Very slime chances but its something a fellow vintage player has to do.:)
The lack of response on this thread only proves that Type 2 players (MTGS members) don't give a **** about their fellow magic players.
People not caring is one of the main reasons why thieves are so bold. If you guys would actually give a damn, maybe thieves would think twice before stealing $20k worth of cardboard.
Well some people care more than others. I've never heard of those guys and even if I did, I'm not going to feel sorry for them. It was his own fault, first that's too much money(cards) to be carrying around and it doesn't matter if he looked away for 2 minutes or 2 hours, you got that much money(cards) you are asking for trouble. And the way your talking, it's like you want people to make post after post and say that they're sorry that your friend got ripped off. Not to sound like an ass but get over it.
I hate to say it But as much as your right in some ways there is a level of respect most vintage players have for each other and trust where in my own experiance that Type 2 and limited players lack. His statement on Type 2 players not caring isn't too far off. Also We shouldn't feel sorry BUT that doesn't mean we shouldn't keep an eye open. And also get over it is a little hard when you have to get over 20,000 loss. You get over 500 loss, you get over flat tires, you don't get over a large envestment that disappears like enron.:p
It's true people should care and althought I don't live around New York, I live in Houston, I noticed the Enron reference, if I were I would be on the look out even thought I'm more a Type 2 player. I think because we all play Magic that we should be looking after each other but as we know that doesn't always happen. I do however hope they catch the guy or girl who did it.
Roland said he doesn't want pity. He just wants people to keep an eye open for his cards. He is the reigning Vintage World Champion, and Orlove is the admin for the biggest Vintage site on the net. These guys aren't just random kids who left their shiny cards sitting somewhere.
And yes, I posted this to raise awareness of this crime. Not to get pity for Roland. He actually isn't even my friend. He is friends with some of my friends, but I don't think I've actually met him. The more people know about this, the better chances Roland and Orlove have of getting their stuff back.
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Brandon "Emidln" Adams - The true Legacy Strategist of the Year
Member of Team Lucksack Voting for Ron Paul in 2008 Learn how to get better at Magic
The magic community surely have theives in the waiting, just for the chance to get a small windfall through stealing. The theif/thieves, deserve to be sent to jail for this. I hope the cards can be recovered.
Seriously saying about "The lack of response on this thread only proves that Type 2 players (MTGS members) don't give a **** about their fellow magic players." by MD, I'm sure everyone knows that most of the people do not give a damn if someone's cards have been stolen. Only when their cards has been stolen they ask for help, and everyone gives them a cold shoulder, then they will realise the feeling of having cards stolen and no one helps. Terrible for people to have such mindsets.
$20k of cards is a lot of money, no wonder theives will be attracted to stealing this lot.
There is a reward for returning these cards or information leading to the return of the cards. $1000 or 2 black bordered power I beilive, check the threads posted above for further details. This cards are going to be extremly hard to get rid of, considering how unique the are. You can return these cards anonymously, and still get the reward. Do the right thing and return them, however did this.
It is truely a sad event, especially with the scale involved. But with the distances involved it isn't like I can do anything. Plus, if these people have any bit of sense in them they would either just return it for the reward or sell the collection in back alley places since there is so much exposure on it in the Magic community that they would never really be able to slide it under the radar in an online auction site like ebay.
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yes, its a douchebag move on the part of the guys what stole the cards, but seriously, how difficult is it to keep an eye on your cards?
i keep an eye on my cards like a hawk, and my collection's not *that* impressive. and leaving your cards under the watchful eye of someone who's not within your circle of friends while you get up and get a soda isn't exactly the brightest thing in the world.
no offense to jacob & roland, as i have a good deal of respect for them for their contributions to the vintage community, but roland did everything shor of saying "Steal my cards" in the circumstance given.
thats sucks a year a go I got my ravfinnity deck stolen along with a whole trade binder worth 400 dollars I was so mad I quite magic untill rav came out but thats nothing compared to what that guy lost hope he stays in the game I could understand why he would quite though many of those cards are not replaceble.
I sympathize with his loss, but... if he really had 20,000$ of (apparently uninsured) cards in a single box, he really should have looked out for it... I don't let a 20 year old bike out of my sight without a lock, or my casual deck, for that matter. I could understand if he was playing a game and didn't want to ruin it, but... honestly, that's something you've gotta watch for.
Its both of thier faults really. First his for even bringing that much stuff, and for getting a soda while a guy he does not know 'watches' his cards. It's the other guys fault for getting up in the first place and not staying put, and for asking some one else to watch the stuff that he was asked to watch in the first place. the best part is he's a world champion(or the mod for a site, I forget which) and he should know better.
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it is pretty bad that things like this happen, when i get back from Turkey in about 6 weeks i will make sure to keep an eye open for any of these cards. However i can agree with some of the posters that leaving was a bad idea, i dont ever get up and leave my cards unless i can have my eyes on them at all times because i have been the victim of theft with this game and lemme tell you it sucks granted not as much money was stolen but it sucks nonetheless. still i feel for them and will definately keep my eye out for the perpetrator(s) invlolved and if by some small chance happen by these cards will gladly return them to the owners.
Its both of thier faults really. First his for even bringing that much stuff, and for getting a soda while a guy he does not know 'watches' his cards. It's the other guys fault for getting up in the first place and not staying put, and for asking some one else to watch the stuff that he was asked to watch in the first place. the best part is he's a world champion(or the mod for a site, I forget which) and he should know better.
Did it occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it's the fault of the person who consciously decided to commit a felony and steal the cards?
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Did it occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it's the fault of the person who consciously decided to commit a felony and steal the cards?
Seriously, I couldn't agree more. I'm sick of people talking crap about Chang and how he it was all his fault, when it's the other guy who actually commited the crime. It seems like people just want to blame everyone but the person who actually did it.
I know it seems weird to leave a 20,000 dollar collection around, but honestly you just can't expect someone to jack all of your cards when you turn around for two minutes.
I'm no expert, but assuming the cards were insured...might'nt the walking away (even to get a soda) be viewed as negligence and cause to not pay a claim?
Of course the thief is to blame, but given the theft's apparenetly easy prevention...
I feel terrible just reading that situation. That's a lot of $$$ in cards that got stolen. I hope they get returned to their rightful owner, as that's something to quit magic over.
That being said.....
It's really hard for a lot of people to feel sorry. I mean, yeah, cards getting stolen sucks. Doesn't matter the value really, as theiving is theiving. However, when you're toting such valuable cards around, I'd either have them by my side at all times, or keep them home. If they're well known, then anyone at the place would know that at least an ounce of the stuff he was toting around in his boxes/packs was worht a great deal, so I'm sure any theif was just waiting for him to leave them alone for even a moment.
Again, it sucks, but it's really hard to say that he was smart about the situation leading to the theivery.
EDIT: after glancing the above posts on this page, I'd like to point out that I don't think it's Chang's fault, but that he was very irresponsible with how he took care of such an expensive load.
Be on the lookout for these cards. Alert local card dealers and keep an eye on ebay.
mtgthesource thread - here
themanadrain thread - here
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Although if I had $15,000 - $20,000 worth of cards in my deck case, I'd never let it leave my sight.
People not caring is one of the main reasons why thieves are so bold. If you guys would actually give a damn, maybe thieves would think twice before stealing $20k worth of cardboard.
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I had a binder worth well over $600 stolen from me. Its the most horrible feeling in the world.
Even though I don't play Vintage I'll be keeping an eye out for Mr. Chang
Well some people care more than others. I've never heard of those guys and even if I did, I'm not going to feel sorry for them. It was his own fault, first that's too much money(cards) to be carrying around and it doesn't matter if he looked away for 2 minutes or 2 hours, you got that much money(cards) you are asking for trouble. And the way your talking, it's like you want people to make post after post and say that they're sorry that your friend got ripped off. Not to sound like an ass but get over it.
And yes, I posted this to raise awareness of this crime. Not to get pity for Roland. He actually isn't even my friend. He is friends with some of my friends, but I don't think I've actually met him. The more people know about this, the better chances Roland and Orlove have of getting their stuff back.
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Seriously saying about "The lack of response on this thread only proves that Type 2 players (MTGS members) don't give a **** about their fellow magic players." by MD, I'm sure everyone knows that most of the people do not give a damn if someone's cards have been stolen. Only when their cards has been stolen they ask for help, and everyone gives them a cold shoulder, then they will realise the feeling of having cards stolen and no one helps. Terrible for people to have such mindsets.
$20k of cards is a lot of money, no wonder theives will be attracted to stealing this lot.
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yes, its a douchebag move on the part of the guys what stole the cards, but seriously, how difficult is it to keep an eye on your cards?
i keep an eye on my cards like a hawk, and my collection's not *that* impressive. and leaving your cards under the watchful eye of someone who's not within your circle of friends while you get up and get a soda isn't exactly the brightest thing in the world.
no offense to jacob & roland, as i have a good deal of respect for them for their contributions to the vintage community, but roland did everything shor of saying "Steal my cards" in the circumstance given.
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Did it occur to you that maybe, just maybe, it's the fault of the person who consciously decided to commit a felony and steal the cards?
erm, he's not exonerating the douchebags what stole the cards.
however, it was a total bonehead move by mistah chang to leave his stuff with some guy he doesn't know all that well, according to the story.
Seriously, I couldn't agree more. I'm sick of people talking crap about Chang and how he it was all his fault, when it's the other guy who actually commited the crime. It seems like people just want to blame everyone but the person who actually did it.
I know it seems weird to leave a 20,000 dollar collection around, but honestly you just can't expect someone to jack all of your cards when you turn around for two minutes.
Of course the thief is to blame, but given the theft's apparenetly easy prevention...
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Really? He seemed pretty quick to pin blame on everyone except the person who actually stole the cards.
He may not be exonerating them, but he sure doesn't seen like he's jumping to point the finger at the right person or persons.
That being said.....
It's really hard for a lot of people to feel sorry. I mean, yeah, cards getting stolen sucks. Doesn't matter the value really, as theiving is theiving. However, when you're toting such valuable cards around, I'd either have them by my side at all times, or keep them home. If they're well known, then anyone at the place would know that at least an ounce of the stuff he was toting around in his boxes/packs was worht a great deal, so I'm sure any theif was just waiting for him to leave them alone for even a moment.
Again, it sucks, but it's really hard to say that he was smart about the situation leading to the theivery.
EDIT: after glancing the above posts on this page, I'd like to point out that I don't think it's Chang's fault, but that he was very irresponsible with how he took care of such an expensive load.
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I live a couple of hours from there, so will keep my eyes open.... even though i'm too poor to be anything but a T2/limited player...
twenty thousand dollars.... thats how much some people make in a year in a full-time job...