I've gotta say, I've never disagreed with the results of a contest more than I do with the the results of the current CCL round. I feel like this round was a bit of a trap round for me. I honestly feel my entries would be by far the most likely to actually see print in the cycles they are meant for, but since everyone here weighs uniqueness above all else, I didn't even make the top 3 in two out of the four results.
Honestly, even though I did give you first place in my bracket, I gave you it based on the average between your two cards. I feel individual cards from other players were stronger but usually their second card flopped. Honestly the only card that I think is print worthy/ready from the round(excluding my own Starling) is doomfish's modular card.
I knew I took a huge risk in making my modular card an enchantment, which had two of you treat me as a disqualification. I understand the decision, but am frustrated as I feel my morphling entry was the most printable one submitted while likewise being unique.
I think a lot of the disagreement in this round comes from how narrow it is. Both in what fits inside the rules for the round and how minimal variation there is overall between entries. This lead to a lot of close top 3 decisions where it didnt feel like anyone was clearly doing much of a better job. My top three might as well been a coin flip. A lot of it was splinting hairs between keywords.
As I've said, not really pleased with this month's challenges as whole. Not that there were not good ideas, but things got too restrictive. Slight adjustments on several of the rounds would of opened up a lot.
Oops, that made me realize I had a mixup about the third place in my top 3. The third place was meant to go to Flatline. Sorry about that. I've edited my post. Not that that changes too much, but I guess ranking in this challenge came down to what was most important to each of us individually. To me that was following the pattern of "ready", "attack" and "protect" for the 'ling and agressive and destructive vibes for the choose card, with a bit of fixing being a possibility as per the blue card. Also I was more interested in the 'ling. The CCL scoring really often comes down to what people like and not what would be objectively be the best thing for the game.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
—Eli Shiffrin, Rules Manager, on a design stacking lifelink instances
It's fine. I shouldn't vent my frustration like that. I've never claimed to be an expert on Magic card design, so who am I to argue? That said, these contests have become more frustrating than fun to me lately, so I think it's time to step away for a while. Keep up the good work Rocco, and good luck to the finalists.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
(22 Total) - October 2014; December 2014; January 2015; April 2015; June 2015; August 2015; September 2015; November 2015; December 2015(T); January 2016; March 2016(T); April 2016; June 2016; October 2016; December 2016(T); February 2017; April 2017; December 2017; November 2018(T); January 2019; April 2019; June 2019
(8 Total) - May 2015; May 2016; June 2016; August 2016; October 2016; December 2016; October 2017; May 2019
(7 Total) - September 2015; October 2015; January 2016; March 2016; April 2016; July 2016(T); March 2019(T)
It's fine. I shouldn't vent my frustration like that.
Of course you should. We regulars do it month to month because we care. Feedback, positive or negative, aimed at the challenges or each other is needed otherwise things don't improve.
I look to get better so I can be called an "expert" on card design. I studied game development and have degree to be an expert after all. And call me arrogant if you like, but if I hadn't shown it before, my results in these contest this year has me as a consistent front-runner. So I don't think it's delusional to say my opinion holds weight. I'm not the only one who routinely does well either.
Not everyones goal in these contests will be the same. But despite at times being harsh I will make a point of speaking my mind because I care about these things and doing better. An environment where I can't improve isn't worth competing in.
1. Is the CCL host permitted to vote in the finals?
2. Do we allow ties in the final poll?
3. Should the voting stay open until the last possible second, or close now out of courtesy to this month's host?
1. Yeah.
2. Sure.
3. You coulddddd keep it open until the 14th when the crits period ends, because that's the earliest the host can actually fill out the score sheet anyway.
I thought it was like.. bringing har..m ? I had no clue
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
—Eli Shiffrin, Rules Manager, on a design stacking lifelink instances
So I am going to do my best to calculate scores tomorrow after work. I hope I am able to do math properly. (Seriously please also double check the scores) That said, I can't see who voted in the finals poll. Also I have an issue where some people doing critiques did not "blank out" non-submissions, and instead shifted down the line. How do I account for this in scoring?
It's typical to remove non-participators from the crit queue but tbh it's been so long since I scored a CCL I dunno how the spreadsheet calculates it these days
Well, only a poll creator can see the votes on this site. Which is... well, it's stupid, but ultimately the previous month's host can just tell you who voted.
Well, congratulations RaikouRider. Very interesting finals indeed.
Funny how the header had the gods in it and I've come to realize we took the two possible approaches to the challenge that would have been unified in the god cards. I took the route of telling a story where you see one part and realize there must be four others, making it a cycle, like how each god is part of the panteon, while you, RaikouRider, took the approach of having the same flavor for each card, the same way as how each god is a top-down god on it's own.
That line suprised me, as I didn't see the difference between a cycle by same mechanics and a cycle by same flavor and thus same mechanics. I ruled out same mechanics from the beginning as that's how I understood the task.
Now I'm left to wonder what spoke against my cards, as no one bothered to write up a critique. Was it that erasing the names, it wasn't recognisable as a cycle anymore? That was how I understood the challenge. Was it because they are too strong? I struggle with power-level all the time. Then again, with only 10 people voting and the result being 4 against 6 it's likely that it comes down to many different personal opinions.
edit: Additionally, for the current top 8 round. The task is to be understood on a flavor basis, right? The card we make doesn't actually have to advantageous in the situation where you 'form synergy' with your first two cards, right?
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
—Eli Shiffrin, Rules Manager, on a design stacking lifelink instances
Honestly, even though I did give you first place in my bracket, I gave you it based on the average between your two cards. I feel individual cards from other players were stronger but usually their second card flopped. Honestly the only card that I think is print worthy/ready from the round(excluding my own Starling) is doomfish's modular card.
I knew I took a huge risk in making my modular card an enchantment, which had two of you treat me as a disqualification. I understand the decision, but am frustrated as I feel my morphling entry was the most printable one submitted while likewise being unique.
I think a lot of the disagreement in this round comes from how narrow it is. Both in what fits inside the rules for the round and how minimal variation there is overall between entries. This lead to a lot of close top 3 decisions where it didnt feel like anyone was clearly doing much of a better job. My top three might as well been a coin flip. A lot of it was splinting hairs between keywords.
As I've said, not really pleased with this month's challenges as whole. Not that there were not good ideas, but things got too restrictive. Slight adjustments on several of the rounds would of opened up a lot.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
—Eli Shiffrin, Rules Manager, on a design stacking lifelink instances
I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
I look to get better so I can be called an "expert" on card design. I studied game development and have degree to be an expert after all. And call me arrogant if you like, but if I hadn't shown it before, my results in these contest this year has me as a consistent front-runner. So I don't think it's delusional to say my opinion holds weight. I'm not the only one who routinely does well either.
Not everyones goal in these contests will be the same. But despite at times being harsh I will make a point of speaking my mind because I care about these things and doing better. An environment where I can't improve isn't worth competing in.
Good luck, doomfish and RaikouRider
LANK
1. Is the CCL host permitted to vote in the finals?
2. Do we allow ties in the final poll?
3. Should the voting stay open until the last possible second, or close now out of courtesy to this month's host?
2. Sure.
3. You coulddddd keep it open until the 14th when the crits period ends, because that's the earliest the host can actually fill out the score sheet anyway.
I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
—Eli Shiffrin, Rules Manager, on a design stacking lifelink instances
That's exactly what's done.
I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
Sub_Silentio, I'll PM you the list of voters.
Emille, Seven-Sting Dancer Shalin Nariya
TOP 8
1. Jimmy Groove
2. Doomfish
3. IcariiFA
4. Raptorchan
5. Void_nothing
6. BluesEclipse
7. Netn10
8. Legend
Top 8 Link
Best of luck to everyone in the Top 8 and for those who did not advance, thank you for your participation!
Funny how the header had the gods in it and I've come to realize we took the two possible approaches to the challenge that would have been unified in the god cards. I took the route of telling a story where you see one part and realize there must be four others, making it a cycle, like how each god is part of the panteon, while you, RaikouRider, took the approach of having the same flavor for each card, the same way as how each god is a top-down god on it's own.
That line suprised me, as I didn't see the difference between a cycle by same mechanics and a cycle by same flavor and thus same mechanics. I ruled out same mechanics from the beginning as that's how I understood the task.
Now I'm left to wonder what spoke against my cards, as no one bothered to write up a critique. Was it that erasing the names, it wasn't recognisable as a cycle anymore? That was how I understood the challenge. Was it because they are too strong? I struggle with power-level all the time. Then again, with only 10 people voting and the result being 4 against 6 it's likely that it comes down to many different personal opinions.
edit: Additionally, for the current top 8 round. The task is to be understood on a flavor basis, right? The card we make doesn't actually have to advantageous in the situation where you 'form synergy' with your first two cards, right?
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
Multiple instances of lifelink on the same creature are redundant.
—Eli Shiffrin, Rules Manager, on a design stacking lifelink instances