I've always enjoyed the combination of deathtouch and trample, and it makes me sad that WotC considers that too unintuitive to print on a card.
So, since we've found out that Core Sets are going to be a thing still, I thought that just making a 'french vanilla' deathtouch trampler would be neat, since it would still have space for unique reminder text...
Perilous Hybrid 3BG
Creature - Scorpion Rhino (R)
Trample, Deathtouch
(This creature needs only assign 1 damage to each blocker, and can assign the rest to the defending player or planeswalker)
5/4
"In more civilized circles, such combinations are forbidden."
I put it up in the Daily Card Contest, but they don't really offer a lot of feedback other than a simple vote.
I haven't been participating in the DCC, but I would have voted for this had I posted in that day. The unique reminder text makes this a cool rare and might even be a candidate for moving it up to mythic if there were Limited concerns about it - it's certainly seemingly one of the best combos of abilities you could come up with for a beater like this. Would be especially potent if there were a theme or mechanic that forced blocks.
I would have voted for this had I posted in that day.
Appreciated!
But I'm more curious to know if people think that would be a good card for a core set. Is it too complicated to be in core? Is the ability too unintuitive even with reminder text? Is this simple enough that it could be uncommon instead of rare at 6 CMC? Is this unusual enough or strong enough that it needs to be mythic? Would it be balanced in a 'typical' standard environment (this last one especially because I don't have a lot of experience with standard)?
I figured rare was fine since it's bomb-y in drafts but it's CMC 5, dies to removal, and nothing about it is forcing you to block (unless maybe you have low life), all of which works against it in constructed. I also feel that the reminder text removes any concerns about complexity, but I've been playing Magic for a long time now and maybe my perception of complexity is skewed.
Reminder text shouldn't do this. Reminder text is (mostly) predictably derived from rules text. It's remindery, not explanatory. This is like putting "Don't put everything you like in one pile," in the reminder text of Truth or Tale.
It's remindery, not explanatory. This is like putting "Don't put everything you like in one pile," in the reminder text of Truth or Tale.
That's not really a fair comparison; your example is gameplay advice, whereas this is explaining the interaction between deathtouch and trample. The use of suggestive language ("needs only" and "can") is used merely to describe what your options even are, similar to how Garruk's Companion uses the word 'can' to explain how trample works (or, in the printed text, 'may').
A more apt example is if Truth or Tale had reminder text which said "(A pile may contain 0 cards)", which is entirely appropriate to the card.
It's remindery, not explanatory. This is like putting "Don't put everything you like in one pile," in the reminder text of Truth or Tale.
That's not really a fair comparison; your example is gameplay advice, whereas this is explaining the interaction between deathtouch and trample. The use of suggestive language ("needs only" and "can") is used merely to describe what your options even are, similar to how Garruk's Companion uses the word 'can' to explain how trample works (or, in the printed text, 'may').
A more apt example is if Truth or Tale had reminder text which said "(A pile may contain 0 cards)", which is entirely appropriate to the card.
A more apt analogy would be a creature capable of gaining multiple instances of prowess (or old lifelink and deathtouch, or one of the many triggered ability keywords suggested on the UB keyword thread) with reminder text that only tells players that the ability stacks in multiples and nothing else.
The real issue here is that your means of educating player through reminder text, while successfully telling players how these two keywords work together, fails to tell players how these keywords actually work. If the point of core set reminder text is to act as if these are the first cards a new player ever sees, this would fail because it assumes that players already know how these mechanics work. You still have the issue of this interaction being for players more familiar with the game.
IMO, this card works good as is. It could even be uncommon, probably, depending on environment. I don't think this card is bomb-level powerful, it can be easily doubleblocked .In core set, both trample and deathtouch would be explained on common cards, so a combination of them can be explained on a card of higher rarity. Even in core, not all abilities are explained on each card, especially on higher rarities. I wish Wizards used reminder text in similar way.
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So, since we've found out that Core Sets are going to be a thing still, I thought that just making a 'french vanilla' deathtouch trampler would be neat, since it would still have space for unique reminder text...
I put it up in the Daily Card Contest, but they don't really offer a lot of feedback other than a simple vote.
- Rabid Wombat
I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
Appreciated!
But I'm more curious to know if people think that would be a good card for a core set. Is it too complicated to be in core? Is the ability too unintuitive even with reminder text? Is this simple enough that it could be uncommon instead of rare at 6 CMC? Is this unusual enough or strong enough that it needs to be mythic? Would it be balanced in a 'typical' standard environment (this last one especially because I don't have a lot of experience with standard)?
I figured rare was fine since it's bomb-y in drafts but it's CMC 5, dies to removal, and nothing about it is forcing you to block (unless maybe you have low life), all of which works against it in constructed. I also feel that the reminder text removes any concerns about complexity, but I've been playing Magic for a long time now and maybe my perception of complexity is skewed.
- Rabid Wombat
That's not really a fair comparison; your example is gameplay advice, whereas this is explaining the interaction between deathtouch and trample. The use of suggestive language ("needs only" and "can") is used merely to describe what your options even are, similar to how Garruk's Companion uses the word 'can' to explain how trample works (or, in the printed text, 'may').
A more apt example is if Truth or Tale had reminder text which said "(A pile may contain 0 cards)", which is entirely appropriate to the card.
- Rabid Wombat
A more apt analogy would be a creature capable of gaining multiple instances of prowess (or old lifelink and deathtouch, or one of the many triggered ability keywords suggested on the UB keyword thread) with reminder text that only tells players that the ability stacks in multiples and nothing else.
The real issue here is that your means of educating player through reminder text, while successfully telling players how these two keywords work together, fails to tell players how these keywords actually work. If the point of core set reminder text is to act as if these are the first cards a new player ever sees, this would fail because it assumes that players already know how these mechanics work. You still have the issue of this interaction being for players more familiar with the game.