KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
when this game started i was in the middle of trying to figure him out in jpa, so i just ignored him itt. but its over now.
im pretty sure kj is town here.
he came in very confident, "caught him in 15 posts", rah rah rah
and then when he unvoted, it was based on using meta which is something he just told me (and a few other people in this game between being in it and spec chat) that he doesnt use
and it convinced him that they were different
but then it was revealed that osi was town in that game
and hes still fine with having unvoted, so much so that he questioned why i didnt like huntz' unvote and said nothing about his
i just dont think hes comfortable enough as scum to ask me that question in 202 if he was scum that just [did something he claims not to do] [incorrectly].
he didn't even leave himself a backdoor back on to osi with his posting after that
i want to say this becomes ~moot if osi is scum, but i dont even know if thats true tbh.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@Osie: what about kpaca is town to you? I don't see it?
I think that this is kpaca's playstyle. He acts somewhat obnoxious (Sorry ) and laid back, with a little bit of prodding here and there, and lots of smarm, while sitting back and analyzing the game. While doing so, he logics out a town-scum list. Now, that in and of itself is giving a conclusion rather than the reasoning (another kpaca tactic of sorts, I suppose).
So instead we can go through his posts (at least some of those posts useful for tonereads), as I did, one of my main methods of analysis.
#49: I don't know if I can necessarily believe this, but if it's genuine, then this would be a town role.
#56: Putting the idea of scum!Azrael out there, trying to see what people think about it.
#58: Pressure on me for wording.
#61: Strategy comment. Not negative, maybe a little positive.
#63: Calling out Taredas for seeming to be trying to hard.
#69: Processing #68 with what he'd already seen of Taredas and leading into a Taredas vote.
#110: Emphasizing his scumreads.
#128: Calling out Tom for seemingly scummy post.
#136: Calling out Tom for content-low post.
#160: I didn't like this, but it's basically just telling me to go back and look at the post, which wasn't completely unreasonable.
#162: Ehh, this is kinda throwing shade on Az. But he's made his thoughts on Az clear by now, so it's not the worst.
#167: Trying to push Anak to post better if town.
#187: Similarly to #160, this gave me pause, but in context I'm thinking it's just fititing into his playstyle.
#200: This feels like standard townie frustration.
#203, #205: I think kpaca really thinks Killjoy may be scum and is doing the same thing he did early game with Azrael.
#207: Trying to push Killjoy to vote better if town.
#211: Trying to push Killjoy to post better if town.
#216: If you've already posited your scumreads in public, a readlist mostly just helps scum.
#231, #234: Recognizing the likelihood of town!shadow.
#235: Wants more information. I can relate to this wholeheartedly.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
oh right
Well, mostly because I was reading his posts and not yours
But it's the way he unvoted.
"I'm reading you wrong."
That's not a new thought convincing him otherwise. That's a decision that scumreading osi is no longer a thing he wants to be doing.
You're evolving your read. His unvote was pure backoff.
Or something
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
What do you think of Tare? I'm not sure what to make of his posts. There's a lot of stuff going on.
I sort of see tares posts as overly thorough, if you see what I mean. Like, if hes town some groupings he'd just naturally leave off from discounting them for some reason or whatever. But if scum he'd be careful about what teams he left off, what sort of things he didn't include, etc.
Probably the second most likely scum on the osi wagon after huntz. Idk about both.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Hm.
@Cyan: What do you think of Tare calling you town before you'd ever posted?
Then, assume he's talking about some hypothetical not-you player. Is his theory of "I think all the scum have posted" a sound one? Why do you think he thinks that?
Also, what do YOU think of Tare's groupings posts?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Ok. Assume scum!Tare: Who is the scumteam he's discounting that shouldn't be?
Who's he highlighting that he wouldn't as town!Tare?
I'm a ways away from worldbuilding mode, but if tare flipped scum I'd prolly look at iso and hardclear dv
Leaving cyan off is blatant, but mentioning Iso teams and then mostly only referring to the other people in them is much more noteworthy
Yeah, so Kpaca is actually providing quite a bit of content this game IMO. Agree that it's mainly a stylistic issue. And I'm also hard town-reading him, inasmuch as I've ever hard town-read Kpaca.
Disliking that Tom's hardest town-read is the one I've already explained.
Mildly incredulous that Tare thought adding a vote on Osie as a gambit was a thing.
Hm.
@Cyan: What do you think of Tare calling you town before you'd ever posted?
Then, assume he's talking about some hypothetical not-you player. Is his theory of "I think all the scum have posted" a sound one? Why do you think he thinks that?
This doesn't really seem like a big deal to me, regardless of which player is being discussed. Like in some other game I was in recently, Iso made the same post calling me scum and was correct, so, certainly these kind of analysis can be done. Plus, if Taredas were scum, it doesn't seem like it would make sense to just exclude the possibility of lynching a townie before that townie has ever posted. This seems like an honest assessment on his part, one which I paid more attention to before instead of just reading it and only seeing, 'Oh cool someone declared me town.'
Anyway. Taredas claimed role is fully verifiable and seems far more likely to be town than scum, so, Unvote
Hm.
@Cyan: What do you think of Tare calling you town before you'd ever posted?
Then, assume he's talking about some hypothetical not-you player. Is his theory of "I think all the scum have posted" a sound one? Why do you think he thinks that?
This doesn't really seem like a big deal to me, regardless of which player is being discussed. Like in some other game I was in recently, Iso made the same post calling me scum and was correct, so, certainly these kind of analysis can be done. Plus, if Taredas were scum, it doesn't seem like it would make sense to just exclude the possibility of lynching a townie before that townie has ever posted. This seems like an honest assessment on his part, one which I paid more attention to before instead of just reading it and only seeing, 'Oh cool someone declared me town.'
Anyway. Taredas claimed role is fully verifiable and seems far more likely to be town than scum, so, Unvote
Expand on the bolded. Before when?
Also, opinion on Az?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I am really having a difficult time with these games with short deadlines.
Anyway I think Az is scum, but I don't know how I'm going to relay that and convince people etc in 26 hours. :/ I'll come up with something shortly here.
So Tom successfully pocketed Anak, which in and of itself is NAI; however, go through his iso, tell me what Tom's motivation has been for what he's done. He's played a bit soft, keeping some things open. His early town read on me didn't seem too founded, but what really stuck out to me was his little spoiler where he called kpaca a PR and me vanilla. I don't see a reason for town!tom to make that post, however, it's a great post for scum!tom to get reactions from and see how right that assessment was. Scum!tom is always looking for PRs.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I'm not sure I believe you here.
when this game started i was in the middle of trying to figure him out in jpa, so i just ignored him itt. but its over now.
im pretty sure kj is town here.
he came in very confident, "caught him in 15 posts", rah rah rah
and then when he unvoted, it was based on using meta which is something he just told me (and a few other people in this game between being in it and spec chat) that he doesnt use
and it convinced him that they were different
but then it was revealed that osi was town in that game
and hes still fine with having unvoted, so much so that he questioned why i didnt like huntz' unvote and said nothing about his
i just dont think hes comfortable enough as scum to ask me that question in 202 if he was scum that just [did something he claims not to do] [incorrectly].
he didn't even leave himself a backdoor back on to osi with his posting after that
i want to say this becomes ~moot if osi is scum, but i dont even know if thats true tbh.
You didn't actually answer my question.
I think that this is kpaca's playstyle. He acts somewhat obnoxious (Sorry ) and laid back, with a little bit of prodding here and there, and lots of smarm, while sitting back and analyzing the game. While doing so, he logics out a town-scum list. Now, that in and of itself is giving a conclusion rather than the reasoning (another kpaca tactic of sorts, I suppose).
So instead we can go through his posts (at least some of those posts useful for tonereads), as I did, one of my main methods of analysis.
#56: Putting the idea of scum!Azrael out there, trying to see what people think about it.
#58: Pressure on me for wording.
#61: Strategy comment. Not negative, maybe a little positive.
#63: Calling out Taredas for seeming to be trying to hard.
#69: Processing #68 with what he'd already seen of Taredas and leading into a Taredas vote.
#110: Emphasizing his scumreads.
#128: Calling out Tom for seemingly scummy post.
#136: Calling out Tom for content-low post.
#160: I didn't like this, but it's basically just telling me to go back and look at the post, which wasn't completely unreasonable.
#162: Ehh, this is kinda throwing shade on Az. But he's made his thoughts on Az clear by now, so it's not the worst.
#167: Trying to push Anak to post better if town.
#187: Similarly to #160, this gave me pause, but in context I'm thinking it's just fititing into his playstyle.
#200: This feels like standard townie frustration.
#203, #205: I think kpaca really thinks Killjoy may be scum and is doing the same thing he did early game with Azrael.
#207: Trying to push Killjoy to vote better if town.
#211: Trying to push Killjoy to post better if town.
#216: If you've already posited your scumreads in public, a readlist mostly just helps scum.
#231, #234: Recognizing the likelihood of town!shadow.
#235: Wants more information. I can relate to this wholeheartedly.
#240: Pushing Cyan to post more.
#244: Pushing his scumread.
Okay, back to IRL stuff.
I did like his "There must be scum on the wagon? Trying hard much" comment to Tare. And yeah, I do see what you're seeing here, I think. Hm.
Ok. Lean town on kpaca. It is entirely possible this is the first town read I have ever had on kpaca.
So, towncircle is [Killjoy,shadowlancerx,osie,kpaca]
Cool. 8 more to go.
Well, mostly because I was reading his posts and not yours
But it's the way he unvoted.
"I'm reading you wrong."
That's not a new thought convincing him otherwise. That's a decision that scumreading osi is no longer a thing he wants to be doing.
You're evolving your read. His unvote was pure backoff.
Or something
What do you think of Tare? I'm not sure what to make of his posts. There's a lot of stuff going on.
Probably the second most likely scum on the osi wagon after huntz. Idk about both.
Who's he highlighting that he wouldn't as town!Tare?
@Cyan: What do you think of Tare calling you town before you'd ever posted?
Then, assume he's talking about some hypothetical not-you player. Is his theory of "I think all the scum have posted" a sound one? Why do you think he thinks that?
Also, what do YOU think of Tare's groupings posts?
I'm a ways away from worldbuilding mode, but if tare flipped scum I'd prolly look at iso and hardclear dv
Leaving cyan off is blatant, but mentioning Iso teams and then mostly only referring to the other people in them is much more noteworthy
"What is mana but possibility, an idea not yet given form?" - Jhoira, master artificer
Disliking that Tom's hardest town-read is the one I've already explained.
Mildly incredulous that Tare thought adding a vote on Osie as a gambit was a thing.
Still despise Hunt.
Tare being provable and having a town useful ability is something I'm willing to shelf and figure out later.
Gonna skim the thread and drop a vote.
This doesn't really seem like a big deal to me, regardless of which player is being discussed. Like in some other game I was in recently, Iso made the same post calling me scum and was correct, so, certainly these kind of analysis can be done. Plus, if Taredas were scum, it doesn't seem like it would make sense to just exclude the possibility of lynching a townie before that townie has ever posted. This seems like an honest assessment on his part, one which I paid more attention to before instead of just reading it and only seeing, 'Oh cool someone declared me town.'
Anyway. Taredas claimed role is fully verifiable and seems far more likely to be town than scum, so, Unvote
Taredas (2) - Azrael, kpaca
D_V (2) - Iso, osieorb18
tomsloger (2) - Taredas, shadowlancerx
osieorb18 (1) - Anaklusmos
Azrael (1) - D_V
Huntzilla (1) - tomsloger
Not Voting (3): Huntzilla, Killjoy, Cyan
With 12 alive, it's 7 to lynch. Deadline is at Thursday 23rd of March, 9:59PM GMT. (~26½ hours from this post)
D_V, Iso and Huntzilla have been prodded.
Also, opinion on Az?
@shadow: Why tom? You see something?
I'm very annoyed. We have several people either not doing things or barely doing things.
"Catch!"
Vote Shadow
I am really having a difficult time with these games with short deadlines.
Anyway I think Az is scum, but I don't know how I'm going to relay that and convince people etc in 26 hours. :/ I'll come up with something shortly here.
So Tom successfully pocketed Anak, which in and of itself is NAI; however, go through his iso, tell me what Tom's motivation has been for what he's done. He's played a bit soft, keeping some things open. His early town read on me didn't seem too founded, but what really stuck out to me was his little spoiler where he called kpaca a PR and me vanilla. I don't see a reason for town!tom to make that post, however, it's a great post for scum!tom to get reactions from and see how right that assessment was. Scum!tom is always looking for PRs.
Vote tom
im lock town now
I wasn't that confident in my POE, still prefer last-minute fire drill to Huntzilla if it can be managed.
I'd like hunt to answer my questions first at least.
again: why?
Tom: Why aren't you claiming?
short of maybe tare i think my wagon is likely to be town right now
if youre lynching me someone else needs to make sure anak's approach actually evolves.
huntzilla still scum. less sure about az. very torn on tare.