KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
"There are times when destiny calls forth a people and demands an action. Now is the time. We are the people. This is our action. Charge!" Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
Vote Osie
The detailed dispatch could be summarized in four words: "Time is running out."
Like, he never even responded to the case.
How is this not obvious?
What benefit is there for me as town in focusing on defending myself against a bad case rather than focusing on finding scum? Like, kpaca has D_V tagged, and it looks like D_V has you well in their pocket. You're not worth my time unless D_V manages to brainwash more people.
"There are times when destiny calls forth a people and demands an action. Now is the time. We are the people. This is our action. Charge!" Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
Vote Osie
The detailed dispatch could be summarized in four words: "Time is running out."
I'm Cantripmancer (Town).
"Cool & calculative, scarily good as scum, genius set-up designer."
"There are times when destiny calls forth a people and demands an action. Now is the time. We are the people. This is our action. Charge!" Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
Vote Osie
The detailed dispatch could be summarized in four words: "Time is running out."
I'm Cantripmancer (Town).
"Cool & calculative, scarily good as scum, genius set-up designer."
I don't have any abilities.
Tell me why I claim Cantrip as scum?
I imagine it's your safe claim. How good or bad your flavor claim is at a certain alignment has zero bearing here.
"There are times when destiny calls forth a people and demands an action. Now is the time. We are the people. This is our action. Charge!" Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
Vote Osie
The detailed dispatch could be summarized in four words: "Time is running out."
I'm Cantripmancer (Town).
"Cool & calculative, scarily good as scum, genius set-up designer."
I don't have any abilities.
Tell me why I claim Cantrip as scum?
Mimics don't need perfect disguises. They need only the perfect victims: the naive, the young, or the poor of sight.
Like, he never even responded to the case.
How is this not obvious?
What benefit is there for me as town in focusing on defending myself against a bad case rather than focusing on finding scum? Like, kpaca has D_V tagged, and it looks like D_V has you well in their pocket. You're not worth my time unless D_V manages to brainwash more people.
You'd flavor claim whatever your fake claim is because there's no chance you'd accidently get cc'd by town.
You'd consider everyone might be scum because ignoring your buddies in that is scummy.
I do agree that sitting there defending yourself exclusively is scummy but you can do that AND hunt for scum. And ignoring cases on you is scummy.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@Kpaca - DV's commonly a lunatic, the trick is figuring out whose lunatic he is. I'm not feeling this as townie DV, not with the way he casually dismissed those reads without any public information to justify that attitude. That's inside knowledge. Town DV wouldn't leap to dismiss unexplained Azrael reads that quickly, unless he had good reason to do so.
Quote from dv »
Also I know Tom is town for the simple reason he called hunt scum.
Why would scum tom use patented Hunt Reader Technology to help town?
Why indeed.
It almost seems you think that maybe putting your scum-buddy on everyone's map for the first time, and then driving a stake straight through their heart, defying any and all reasonable objections that they should be given another night to survive and prove their fake-claim, might be a really counter-productive strategy as scum.
@Kpaca - DV's commonly a lunatic, the trick is figuring out whose lunatic he is. I'm not feeling this as townie DV, not with the way he casually dismissed those reads without any public information to justify that attitude. That's inside knowledge. Town DV wouldn't leap to dismiss unexplained Azrael reads that quickly, unless he had good reason to do so.
Quote from dv »
Also I know Tom is town for the simple reason he called hunt scum.
Why would scum tom use patented Hunt Reader Technology to help town?
Why indeed.
It almost seems you think that maybe putting your scum-buddy on everyone's map for the first time, and then driving a stake straight through their heart, defying any and all reasonable objections that they should be given another night to survive and prove their fake-claim, might be a really counter-productive strategy as scum.
That's a good point, DV. Glad you raised that.
Yeah but he didn't have hunt pushing back on him which I feel is something scum hunt would do a lot.
You not only got the RVS vote of hunt but another push back as well.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
"There are times when destiny calls forth a people and demands an action. Now is the time. We are the people. This is our action. Charge!" Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
Vote Osie
The detailed dispatch could be summarized in four words: "Time is running out."
I'm Cantripmancer (Town).
"Cool & calculative, scarily good as scum, genius set-up designer."
I don't have any abilities.
Tell me why I claim Cantrip as scum?
I hate to be this guy, but this has to count as PM quoting.
@cyan: would you say that, in a az/hunt world, as would bus to the degree he would have had to here? You were scum with him in the invitational, so some insight would be nice.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
That's the only time I've been scum with him that I remember, and to be honest it was more 'rest of scum team busses AZ' than it was him bussing anyone else, IIRC.
Bussing Hunt is definitely within his wheelhouse, but I'm not sure he continues to do so after Hunt claims and the wagon starts to die off.
But I'm only like 60/40 on that. Az certainly could be scum.
Yeah, vicious bussing is not outside my wheelhouse, but if my buddy has a provable fake claim I'm not going to bus him THAT hard. I'd keep making all the same suspicious noises and grumblings, then grudgingly lower him on my reads list, snipe at him from time to time, and still look pretty good after he flipped.
That was less about me saying I couldn't possibly be bussing, and more about pointing out the hole in dv's reasoning as it relates to clearing Tom, but not someone who did what time did except even more vehemently.
Yes, hunt pushed back on me, but not until after I'd already kicked the barn door down. So why clear Tom for that? It's another thing in dv's history that doesn't tally well.
I don't always expect Dv to make perfect sense, but I expect his nonsense to make sense, to me. And it just isn't.
Riddle me this, Dv. What convinced you my first read list was terrible? Did it only contain a single scum, instead of 2/3?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Yeah, vicious bussing is not outside my wheelhouse, but if my buddy has a provable fake claim I'm not going to bus him THAT hard. I'd keep making all the same suspicious noises and grumblings, then grudgingly lower him on my reads list, snipe at him from time to time, and still look pretty good after he flipped.
That was less about me saying I couldn't possibly be bussing, and more about pointing out the hole in dv's reasoning as it relates to clearing Tom, but not someone who did what time did except even more vehemently.
Yes, hunt pushed back on me, but not until after I'd already kicked the barn door down. So why clear Tom for that? It's another thing in dv's history that doesn't tally well.
I don't always expect Dv to make perfect sense, but I expect his nonsense to make sense, to me. And it just isn't.
Riddle me this, Dv. What convinced you my first read list was terrible? Did it only contain a single scum, instead of 2/3?
You started off with a serious vote on taredas, which wasn't serious really. You posted a list with no explanation, I still say your list implied order and you claim it didn't what ever there I guess. You've been white knighting Osie even though any read through with Osie should tell you they are hella off this game at best or scum at worst. Oh and I think Hunt is just newb enough at scum to badly bus you. Specifically with that random vote at you.
You also have never really explained your Tom read and finally your Hunt attacks while decent, felt lacking. The wagon died off and you didn't really care.
You want to answer my question at you bae and I'll throw another one at you.
Town active scum lurking?
Like, I get not liking Osi's #335 and #341 in response to the huntz wagon. Trying to keep mine going while soft defending him.
I assume that's why y'all want to lynch him.
But, like, you think this was huntz talking to a buddy?:
Good answer. I was once you. I hated Meta, thought it was bull*****. Turns out it really is a helpful tool once you become familiar with folk. I understand where you are coming from though. Go on back and look my long rants about meta if you care.
[snip]
I am on the fence with Osie. It feels way to early to end the day, but using the excuse "I don't wanna rock the boat (aka hide)" screams noob scum to me. I would put my vote down hard if it wasn't so early in the day.
[snip]
Well sense he isn't L-2, I can go ahead with Unvote, Vote Osie
Nah. That's him joining in on a fast mislynch wagon. No reason to throw that little pocket in or pretend not to know the wagon size if they were buddies.
This is in addition to Osi just being townie.
Az is taking way too much credit for huntz.
Here's everything he said about him before we started the wagon:
Tom's my lesser scum read by far, then hunt, then Tar. Tar and Hunt are both pretty blatant IMO. I'm borrowing a few points from Iso's recent techniques there, combined with my usual approach.
I'd be more specific, but as with Tom's request above, discussing the tells in exhaustive detail at this point really only helps shore up their play at a point in the game where they could very well sharply improve from here on out and fool others. So, I'd rather encourage others to examine their posts and reach similar conclusions independently, if they're able.
Yeah, so Kpaca is actually providing quite a bit of content this game IMO. Agree that it's mainly a stylistic issue. And I'm also hard town-reading him, inasmuch as I've ever hard town-read Kpaca.
Disliking that Tom's hardest town-read is the one I've already explained.
Mildly incredulous that Tare thought adding a vote on Osie as a gambit was a thing.
Oh, short deadline games. At the very least, D1 needs to be unusually long, or else you inevitably wind up with this kind of a cluster. Vote Tom
I wasn't that confident in my POE, still prefer last-minute fire drill to Huntzilla if it can be managed.
puts him in a list of 3 with me and tare
when asked to rank them, it goes me-huntz-tare t>s
proceeds to talk about me and tare but not actually give any reasons on huntz
JOINS MY WAGON
yes. az was the third vote on huntz to tie me/huntz at 3.
but he did not push it in any way.
all the things he did were after the momentum turned towards huntz.
its a great bus position. and they really argued. level looks and *****. its over the top.
but before the wagon, *crickets*
just making sure his huntz read is out there but pushing tare then me.
You've been white knighting Osie even though any read through with Osie should tell you they are hella off this game at best or scum at worst. Oh and I think Hunt is just newb enough at scum to badly bus you.
You think Hunt is newb at scum? I've played no more than one scum game at most that I can remember IRL, and zero on the forums... Do you think this game is me working out a scum game? Because that would suggest that I really suck at it, if there's nearly as many tells as you've described.
Tom mentioned posts 335 and 341.
Post 335 was just stating my reads. I guess if you want to read subterfuge into there you can. But that's on you.
Post 341 I said that I didn't feel there had been enough from Huntz to condemn him. This was after 340 posts, 8 of which were Huntzilla posts. The previous post from Huntzilla at that point was post 199, more than 2 pages before. I've already mentioned that my primary methods for reads are tone and interactions. 8 posts is really not that much for me to look at. And what were those posts?
Post 38: RVS against Az for seemingly no reason.
Post 94: Not liking Az, some ehh discussion, and voting me.
Post 107: Defending himself from Tom
Post 108: Prodding at Az for throwing shade.
Post 127: Explaining his vote on me.
Post 156: Responding to my questioning, and asking the same.
Post 186: Unvote from me, explaining Anak's position in response to my question.
Post 199: Prodding at Tom for being wishy-washy.
Is that enough for a definite scumread? No, and it certainly didn't feel more definite than other options.
------------------
@Tom, @Az: As of late, I'm thinking you might just both be town and be tunneling each other.
Like, I get not liking Osi's #335 and #341 in response to the huntz wagon. Trying to keep mine going while soft defending him.
I assume that's why y'all want to lynch him.
But, like, you think this was huntz talking to a buddy?:
Quote from Huntzilla »
Good answer. I was once you. I hated Meta, thought it was bull*****. Turns out it really is a helpful tool once you become familiar with folk. I understand where you are coming from though. Go on back and look my long rants about meta if you care.
[snip]
I am on the fence with Osie. It feels way to early to end the day, but using the excuse "I don't wanna rock the boat (aka hide)" screams noob scum to me. I would put my vote down hard if it wasn't so early in the day.
[snip]
Well sense he isn't L-2, I can go ahead with Unvote, Vote Osie
Nah. That's him joining in on a fast mislynch wagon. No reason to throw that little pocket in or pretend not to know the wagon size if they were buddies.
This is in addition to Osi just being townie.
Az is taking way too much credit for huntz.
Here's everything he said about him before we started the wagon:
@Tom: My problems with Osie were outlined. I don't think you have the support for Az, but your post does make sense. That IS a weird thing to say to a scumbuddy...
Fine. CFD to Az then. I still kinda think they're scum together anyhow, so.
Like, I get not liking Osi's #335 and #341 in response to the huntz wagon. Trying to keep mine going while soft defending him.
I assume that's why y'all want to lynch him.
But, like, you think this was huntz talking to a buddy?:
Quote from Huntzilla »
Good answer. I was once you. I hated Meta, thought it was bull*****. Turns out it really is a helpful tool once you become familiar with folk. I understand where you are coming from though. Go on back and look my long rants about meta if you care.
[snip]
I am on the fence with Osie. It feels way to early to end the day, but using the excuse "I don't wanna rock the boat (aka hide)" screams noob scum to me. I would put my vote down hard if it wasn't so early in the day.
[snip]
Well sense he isn't L-2, I can go ahead with Unvote, Vote Osie
Nah. That's him joining in on a fast mislynch wagon. No reason to throw that little pocket in or pretend not to know the wagon size if they were buddies.
This is in addition to Osi just being townie.
Az is taking way too much credit for huntz.
Here's everything he said about him before we started the wagon:
I agree with this 100%. Not voting Osie today.
Why is your vote on Tare where it's not doing anything but gathering dust?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
You also have never really explained your Tom read and finally your Hunt attacks while decent, felt lacking. The wagon died off and you didn't really care.
I really didn't care. Wow.
He's a brief tour of all the ways that I didn't care:
Taking lame position on flavor-claiming plus weak joke = scummy first post. Why you ask? Because I've seen that pattern like a dozen times. It just is a thing. Lame jokes and making boring posts about mechanics is a thing scum do.
Hate everything about this post. No conclusions based on the Tare wagon, just commenting that a thing happened.
Then he transitions to this extremely poorly reasoned Osie bandwagon vote. By which point, I already wanted to kill him.
I chopped off a bunch of the other things he said, but it was also an extremely long post, that simultaneously displayed very little in the way of a townie mindset or thoughts. He just comments on stuff, but he doesn't arrive at conclusions regarding town/scum. Even on Osie, the guy he eventually votes, he has a hard time articulating a firm sense of how he sees him.
Massive post also came on the heels of being identified by meas one of my top two scum. Probably a semi-subconscious overreaction on his part to try and defuse pressure.
Shortly afterwards, he disappears for a while, hopping to fly under the radar a bit while the Tar/Osie wagons play out.
This is his Osie unvote. Fails to explain what about that quote convinced him. Again, impossible to see a townie mindset in these posts, nothing is explained or charted out.
This I've already dealt with. He calls me scum because I was voting for Taredas while also attacking him. But I'd already explained, multiple times, that Tar was my top scum read, and Hunt was secondary. So why's he attacking me for that?
When called on that, he tries to retcon it here:
This here is some pretty classic scum obfuscation. When Hunt flips scum, take a hard look at this, because it pretty much 100% proves me town IMO. Scum Hunt isn't sneaky enough to try to post this kind of a takedown on a partner.
This is the kind of thing you post as scum to try to make someone look bad when the facts aren't on your side. You make them out to be doing something sneaky and underhanded, even when the actual facts don't support that interpretation at all if you stop to think about it for half a second. But hey, maybe the town won't stop to think about it and you'll get away with it.
If I need to explain again what's wrong here, the man is trying to say that I was being sneaky or subtle or underhanded in my attacks on him, to quietly, subliminally push his lynch as scum.
And again, my reply to that is that there's absolutely nothing subliminal about my attacks on him. I want him dead, and I've made that perfectly plain to anyone reading my posts.
Quote from Azrael »
'cause a neighborizer is "proof" of your alignment, amirite
Quote from Azrael »
We're not talking about a mason, cop, or actual doctor here. We're talking about the town's scummitude member reaching for a claim that will get him through this day and throwing out a hail mary one shot ability that is neither likely to be proven OR strongly alignment indicative. In the unlikely eventuality that he doesn't say "sorry dudes, roleblock, lol", and does confirm his ability, I'd still kill him dead without batting an eye. He's still scum, with or without it.
We are way, way past the meta time period where putting substantial weight on mod-gaming assumptions is a good idea.
Quote from Azrael »
Why are you helping Tar try to split the town vote elsewhere again? You pointed out how gross Hunt's posts were. Do a better job of pretending to be town, dammit.
Quote from azrael »
Scenario #3, helpfully pointed out by Tom, is that they're scum trying to buy one more night to blow their burnouts vs. the town.
Given the behavior I'm seeing from hunt, there is no way I want to let him see another night.
Quote from azrael »
Shadow, my point is that even if he proves he has the ability, I'm not going to assume anything about his alignment based on that.
You're either gaming the mod or getting played by the scum. Neither is something you should permit to happen.
Quote from azrael »
I've seen a lot of crazy things wind up on scum over the years, and a one shot doc is the least of them. I don't pay much mind to role-claim anymore, not when I have that strong of a read.
Not that I can't be wrong, but I'd much rather out my faith in behavioral analysis than to get t-boned by another mod who thinks they're clever by putting funny abilities on the scum.
Quote from azrael »
And what about the scenario where hunt is just conning you to get to the night phase to burn out? Or to increase the risk of a town mislynch for today?
I like this read well enough to stand by it. We don't gain reliable info by waiting.
You're absolutely right, DV. I didn't care, at all, if Huntzilla was not going to be the lynch. I didn't push for that in the slightest after my primary preference was off the menu, just kinda let it slide, hoping everyone would just let him be. Good analysis. Very cogent.
Like, I get not liking Osi's [url=http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/forum-games/mafia/772633-revolution-mafia-day-1-deth-of-an-grammer-nazi?comment=335]#335[/url] and [url=http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/forum-games/mafia/772633-revolution-mafia-day-1-deth-of-an-grammer-nazi?comment=341]
Az is taking way too much credit for huntz.
Here's everything he said about him before we started the wagon:
puts him in a list of 3 with me and tare
when asked to rank them, it goes me-huntz-tare t>s
proceeds to talk about me and tare but not actually give any reasons on huntz
JOINS MY WAGON
yes. az was the third vote on huntz to tie me/huntz at 3.
but he did not push it in any way.
all the things he did were after the momentum turned towards huntz.
its a great bus position. and they really argued. level looks and *****. its over the top.
but before the wagon, *crickets*
just making sure his huntz read is out there but pushing tare then me.
get off osi. come back to az.
How many times is it going to have to be explained to you before it gets through that Tare was my primary target? When Tare died off, I latched onto Hunt's wagon. But when Hunt's wagon was dying off too, I refused to let both my top two reads scamper away, and as DV puts it, "Just didn't care at all", about whether or not Hunt survived to see another night.
Could your guys' be any more counter-factual? Most players' fantasy and imagination cases are at least based on things that actually happened, not on disregarding the evidence that's staring you in the face.
At the risk of being completely wrecked by the scum team, I don't think AZ is scum here.
I will hammer him if another lynch cannot be reached, but I would rather lynch in Osie/DV/tom.
At the risk of being completely wrecked by the scum team, I don't think AZ is scum here.
I will hammer him if another lynch cannot be reached, but I would rather lynch in Osie/DV/tom.
At the risk of being completely wrecked by the scum team, I don't think AZ is scum here.
I will hammer him if another lynch cannot be reached, but I would rather lynch in Osie/DV/tom.
At the risk of being completely wrecked by the scum team, I don't think AZ is scum here.
I will hammer him if another lynch cannot be reached, but I would rather lynch in Osie/DV/tom.
WTF EVEN IS THIS POST
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He's trying his hardest to take and CFD he can.
His reads are bouncing all over the place now.
They're buddies.
Unvote, Vote Osie
Hahahahahahahaha
Like, there's some extra stuff there but the way she handles Hunt is classic scum.
Also for postgame cred: Huntz/Az/Osie is the team.
How is this not obvious?
I refuse to lynch Tom.
Shadows being 100% worthless.
And then we have a bunch of lurkers.
Neat loss for the town.
Vote Osie
The detailed dispatch could be summarized in four words: "Time is running out."
If I was scum, why would I flavorclaim as someone with a known fantastic scum game? Why would I be steadily considering that anyone could be scum?
What benefit is there for me as town in focusing on defending myself against a bad case rather than focusing on finding scum? Like, kpaca has D_V tagged, and it looks like D_V has you well in their pocket. You're not worth my time unless D_V manages to brainwash more people.
Unvote, Vote Osie
I'm Cantripmancer (Town).
"Cool & calculative, scarily good as scum, genius set-up designer."
I don't have any abilities.
Tell me why I claim Cantrip as scum?
Mimics don't need perfect disguises. They need only the perfect victims: the naive, the young, or the poor of sight.
Please PM me whether you want it or not.
You'd consider everyone might be scum because ignoring your buddies in that is scummy.
I do agree that sitting there defending yourself exclusively is scummy but you can do that AND hunt for scum. And ignoring cases on you is scummy.
Dv is number 5 in the lynch line for me.
Unvote Vote Osie
(And this is the last extension guys.)
That is unforgivable.
And was right.
Why would scum tom use patented Hunt Reader Technology to help town?
Why indeed.
It almost seems you think that maybe putting your scum-buddy on everyone's map for the first time, and then driving a stake straight through their heart, defying any and all reasonable objections that they should be given another night to survive and prove their fake-claim, might be a really counter-productive strategy as scum.
That's a good point, DV. Glad you raised that.
osieorb18 (4) - Killjoy, Anaklusmos, shadowlancerx, D_V
Azrael (1) - tomsloger
Taredas (1) - Cyan
D_V (1) - Azrael
tomsloger (2) - osieorb18, kpaca
Not Voting (2): Atogaholic, Taredas
With 11 alive, it's 6 to lynch. Deadline is at Wednesday 29th of March, 9:59PM GMT.
Yeah but he didn't have hunt pushing back on him which I feel is something scum hunt would do a lot.
You not only got the RVS vote of hunt but another push back as well.
I can see hunt being like "I'm going to be scummy anyway, might as well give you town points for it. "in the pregame.
I hate to be this guy, but this has to count as PM quoting.
Bussing Hunt is definitely within his wheelhouse, but I'm not sure he continues to do so after Hunt claims and the wagon starts to die off.
But I'm only like 60/40 on that. Az certainly could be scum.
That was less about me saying I couldn't possibly be bussing, and more about pointing out the hole in dv's reasoning as it relates to clearing Tom, but not someone who did what time did except even more vehemently.
Yes, hunt pushed back on me, but not until after I'd already kicked the barn door down. So why clear Tom for that? It's another thing in dv's history that doesn't tally well.
I don't always expect Dv to make perfect sense, but I expect his nonsense to make sense, to me. And it just isn't.
Riddle me this, Dv. What convinced you my first read list was terrible? Did it only contain a single scum, instead of 2/3?
He was somehow convinced that Tom and Hunt were solid townreads by post 95...
You know what they say about coincidences...
Tare, atog where are you?
You started off with a serious vote on taredas, which wasn't serious really. You posted a list with no explanation, I still say your list implied order and you claim it didn't what ever there I guess. You've been white knighting Osie even though any read through with Osie should tell you they are hella off this game at best or scum at worst. Oh and I think Hunt is just newb enough at scum to badly bus you. Specifically with that random vote at you.
You also have never really explained your Tom read and finally your Hunt attacks while decent, felt lacking. The wagon died off and you didn't really care.
You want to answer my question at you bae and I'll throw another one at you.
Town active scum lurking?
I assume that's why y'all want to lynch him.
But, like, you think this was huntz talking to a buddy?:
Nah. That's him joining in on a fast mislynch wagon. No reason to throw that little pocket in or pretend not to know the wagon size if they were buddies.
This is in addition to Osi just being townie.
Az is taking way too much credit for huntz.
Here's everything he said about him before we started the wagon:
when asked to rank them, it goes me-huntz-tare t>s
proceeds to talk about me and tare but not actually give any reasons on huntz
JOINS MY WAGON
yes. az was the third vote on huntz to tie me/huntz at 3.
but he did not push it in any way.
all the things he did were after the momentum turned towards huntz.
its a great bus position. and they really argued. level looks and *****. its over the top.
but before the wagon, *crickets*
just making sure his huntz read is out there but pushing tare then me.
get off osi. come back to az.
You think Hunt is newb at scum? I've played no more than one scum game at most that I can remember IRL, and zero on the forums... Do you think this game is me working out a scum game? Because that would suggest that I really suck at it, if there's nearly as many tells as you've described.
Tom mentioned posts 335 and 341.
Post 335 was just stating my reads. I guess if you want to read subterfuge into there you can. But that's on you.
Post 341 I said that I didn't feel there had been enough from Huntz to condemn him. This was after 340 posts, 8 of which were Huntzilla posts. The previous post from Huntzilla at that point was post 199, more than 2 pages before. I've already mentioned that my primary methods for reads are tone and interactions. 8 posts is really not that much for me to look at. And what were those posts?
Post 38: RVS against Az for seemingly no reason.
Post 94: Not liking Az, some ehh discussion, and voting me.
Post 107: Defending himself from Tom
Post 108: Prodding at Az for throwing shade.
Post 127: Explaining his vote on me.
Post 156: Responding to my questioning, and asking the same.
Post 186: Unvote from me, explaining Anak's position in response to my question.
Post 199: Prodding at Tom for being wishy-washy.
Is that enough for a definite scumread? No, and it certainly didn't feel more definite than other options.
------------------
@Tom, @Az: As of late, I'm thinking you might just both be town and be tunneling each other.
I agree with this 100%. Not voting Osie today.
Fine. CFD to Az then. I still kinda think they're scum together anyhow, so.
Unvote, Vote Azrael
Why is your vote on Tare where it's not doing anything but gathering dust?
Unvote, Vote Az
I really didn't care. Wow.
He's a brief tour of all the ways that I didn't care:
You're absolutely right, DV. I didn't care, at all, if Huntzilla was not going to be the lynch. I didn't push for that in the slightest after my primary preference was off the menu, just kinda let it slide, hoping everyone would just let him be. Good analysis. Very cogent.
How many times is it going to have to be explained to you before it gets through that Tare was my primary target? When Tare died off, I latched onto Hunt's wagon. But when Hunt's wagon was dying off too, I refused to let both my top two reads scamper away, and as DV puts it, "Just didn't care at all", about whether or not Hunt survived to see another night.
Could your guys' be any more counter-factual? Most players' fantasy and imagination cases are at least based on things that actually happened, not on disregarding the evidence that's staring you in the face.
Evidence looks pretty mixed to me, but he's still a tree, and I doubt we'll have time to assemble better option before we're out of time again.
I will hammer him if another lynch cannot be reached, but I would rather lynch in Osie/DV/tom.
Well, right now we have an even split...
osieorb18 (3) - Anaklusmos, shadowlancerx, D_V
Azrael (3) - tomsloger, Killjoy, Cyan
tomsloger (3) - osieorb18, kpaca, Azrael
Not Voting (2): Atogaholic, Taredas
Also, you think I'm scumbuddies with D_V of all people? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Are we even in the same game rn?