If you want to do something about it, feel free to use words. Otherwise, or probably even if you do de-spiderfy yourself, I'm going to do my best to convince everyone not to keep ignoring your plain-sight lurking routine. And if you're town, I guess that's the price you'll pay for trying to shore up your scum game as town.
Even through using your gimmick routine, you could have been far more expressive and involved in the town than you've actually been.
you're just going to waste everyone's time, and then we'll have to scramble to collect enough votes for a scum lynch.
Maybe, maybe not. We've got seven days, a number of people scum-reading you, and you're not my exclusive target.
Here's another of the problems I've had with your play this game. You describe your town "electron cloud" theory as basically POE. Are you still comfortable clearing Mall's slot off that single interaction with Vox, and Vox too? And Tom, in spite of his spidery hijinks? I can barely recall your mentioning Tom all game. Two players that most everyone else is struggling to read or having to ignore, but they're not registering as possibilities for you in the slightest. Tom in particular.
I don't really get why people are townreading tom for his web picture in #522. It's like the perfect scum post: it's cool and creative so it looks like effort was put into it, but it's so vague and open to interpretation. Like you could read almost anything into it and Tom can just agree with you. It doesn't actually tell you what Tom is really thinking, or WHY anyone everyone is positioned the way they are. @Tom: I really want you to explain in as much detail as you can (and with as little using of spider-actions instead of words) why everyone is where they are, both in relation to yourself, and in relation to others.
This makes me feel a lot better about you actually, because you played in the cross-town invitational with Tom when he was scum hiding behind something similar to this. I hadn't seen much in the way of paranoia of you about him when I expected there to be some given he won, there, doing this bull*****.
I don't really get why people are townreading tom for his web picture in #522. It's like the perfect scum post: it's cool and creative so it looks like effort was put into it, but it's so vague and open to interpretation. Like you could read almost anything into it and Tom can just agree with you. It doesn't actually tell you what Tom is really thinking, or WHY anyone everyone is positioned the way they are. @Tom: I really want you to explain in as much detail as you can (and with as little using of spider-actions instead of words) why everyone is where they are, both in relation to yourself, and in relation to others.
My lock townread on tom isn't because of the image - wellll, it's kind of the image combined with one other thing.
I'm going to not share the reasoning there because I think it actually extends to tom's play in all of his games. Like, if I'm right, after this game I'm going to actually go look at some other tom games to verify this, then never tell tom about it ever, because I know it'll annoy him because he takes pride in changing up his outward appearance, staying in the middle of the pack, and being non-transparent.
But, let's say for the moment that none of that is true and I just townread him for the image because "oh look effort." So - what are you reading him for, then? His scintillating content?
Hey. So you, Vox. And Vaimes, and Newcomb, and everyone else who was afraid to bash in Tom's brains until some more time had passed. How about we move that up the priority chain, because there's a dwindling supply of people that are likely scum, and Tom's the spider in the center of that web, quietly pulling strings and blatantly denying us information.
I don't really get why people are townreading tom for his web picture in #522. It's like the perfect scum post: it's cool and creative so it looks like effort was put into it, but it's so vague and open to interpretation. Like you could read almost anything into it and Tom can just agree with you. It doesn't actually tell you what Tom is really thinking, or WHY anyone everyone is positioned the way they are. @Tom: I really want you to explain in as much detail as you can (and with as little using of spider-actions instead of words) why everyone is where they are, both in relation to yourself, and in relation to others.
My lock townread on tom isn't because of the image - wellll, it's kind of the image combined with one other thing.
I'm going to not share the reasoning there because I think it actually extends to tom's play in all of his games. Like, if I'm right, after this game I'm going to actually go look at some other tom games to verify this, then never tell tom about it ever, because I know it'll annoy him because he takes pride in changing up his outward appearance, staying in the middle of the pack, and being non-transparent.
But, let's say for the moment that none of that is true and I just townread him for the image because "oh look effort." So - what are you reading him for, then? His scintillating content?
Did you follow the cross-town game with Org/CTC?
I think we talked about it a little when it was happening but don't remember if you actually had been reading it.
But, let's say for the moment that none of that is true and I just townread him for the image because "oh look effort." So - what are you reading him for, then? His scintillating content?
He's putting effort into the wrong things, Newcomb. He's missing mason claims, coasting, putting effort into being amusing and innocuous and giving us a minimum of participatory reads and original thoughts. And he's hoping because he's doing it behind a gimmick, as he's done in the past as scum, we'll all just write him off as impossible to read, or misread him. As you're doing now.
As someone who's pulled a similar tactic before as scum, in the ancient past, I feel like tom's doing a significantly worse job of it than I did under similar, self-imposed constraints.
I'm kicking iso out of my town bloc atm in favor of you.
I could maybe lynch Iso? I wouldn't feel super great about it, but when I ~search my soul~ I come up pretty empty on reasons to townread him other than gut, so.
See above post re: tom. If he keeps trending on the line he's trending on, I'll happily vote him tomorrow or maybe D3 because unlike the rest of you, my game involves a lot of doubt and re-thinking and - oh wait I forgot I'm trying to do the MTGS playbook here.
*ahem*
Azrael you're just being silly, tom is quite, quite town and we should lynch scum today. What's more important - lynching scum... or silliness???
I don't really get why people are townreading tom for his web picture in #522. It's like the perfect scum post: it's cool and creative so it looks like effort was put into it, but it's so vague and open to interpretation. Like you could read almost anything into it and Tom can just agree with you. It doesn't actually tell you what Tom is really thinking, or WHY anyone everyone is positioned the way they are. @Tom: I really want you to explain in as much detail as you can (and with as little using of spider-actions instead of words) why everyone is where they are, both in relation to yourself, and in relation to others.
My lock townread on tom isn't because of the image - wellll, it's kind of the image combined with one other thing.
I'm going to not share the reasoning there because I think it actually extends to tom's play in all of his games. Like, if I'm right, after this game I'm going to actually go look at some other tom games to verify this, then never tell tom about it ever, because I know it'll annoy him because he takes pride in changing up his outward appearance, staying in the middle of the pack, and being non-transparent.
But, let's say for the moment that none of that is true and I just townread him for the image because "oh look effort." So - what are you reading him for, then? His scintillating content?
Did you follow the cross-town game with Org/CTC?
I think we talked about it a little when it was happening but don't remember if you actually had been reading it.
I read a little bit of it, when Proph was under the gun I think, but I didn't follow it.
I could maybe lynch Iso? I wouldn't feel super great about it, but when I ~search my soul~ I come up pretty empty on reasons to townread him other than gut, so.
See above post re: tom. If he keeps trending on the line he's trending on, I'll happily vote him tomorrow or maybe D3 because unlike the rest of you, my game involves a lot of doubt and re-thinking and - oh wait I forgot I'm trying to do the MTGS playbook here.
*ahem*
Azrael you're just being silly, tom is quite, quite town and we should lynch scum today. What's more important - lynching scum... or silliness???
Heh. Per the above though, I think he's given us as much info as we need to arrive at a scum-read on him though. His activity tomorrow is going to be more of the same. If you can't read him as he's posting now, the situation's not going to get any better.
Hey. So you, Vox. And Vaimes, and Newcomb, and everyone else who was afraid to bash in Tom's brains until some more time had passed. How about we move that up the priority chain, because there's a dwindling supply of people that are likely scum, and Tom's the spider in the center of that web, quietly pulling strings and blatantly denying us information.
Maybe? The problem is like. There's no question he's being anti-town, but it's not outside of the realm of his town play. Or scum play.
Like, he's trying to show some insight but it's all so very, very easily faked. If this was any other game I'd probably encourage a policy lynch out of hope that he'd stop doing this *****, but especially on D1 I just don't think it's informative enough because it's so easy to justify the lynch for scum. Like, if he flips town, you can't really /blame/ anyone for voting him because the logic for doing so is logically sound, so it's kind of a 'back to square one' kind of deal.
But, let's say for the moment that none of that is true and I just townread him for the image because "oh look effort." So - what are you reading him for, then? His scintillating content?
He's putting effort into the wrong things, Newcomb. He's missing mason claims, coasting, putting effort into being amusing and innocuous and giving us a minimum of participatory reads and original thoughts. And he's hoping because he's doing it behind a gimmick, as he's done in the past as scum, we'll all just write him off as impossible to read, or misread him. As you're doing now.
As someone who's pulled a similar tactic before as scum, in the ancient past, I feel like tom's doing a significantly worse job of it than I did under similar, self-imposed constraints.
He's doing a thing multiple people in this game know he's done as scum and just hoping people will outlevel themselves?
Maybe? The problem is like. There's no question he's being anti-town, but it's not outside of the realm of his town play. Or scum play.
Like, he's trying to show some insight but it's all so very, very easily faked. If this was any other game I'd probably encourage a policy lynch out of hope that he'd stop doing this *****, but especially on D1 I just don't think it's informative enough because it's so easy to justify the lynch for scum. Like, if he flips town, you can't really /blame/ anyone for voting him because the logic for doing so is logically sound, so it's kind of a 'back to square one' kind of deal.
I'd much rather lynch the scum, than lynch people for information. We've got plenty of info to work with already. Better just to maximize our hit-rate at this point. Don't need any flips to draw conclusions. Flips are much less helpful than people tend to believe for info.
He's doing a thing multiple people in this game know he's done as scum and just hoping people will outlevel themselves?
Yeah. And I imagine the reason he's done it as town is probably in preparation for a game just like this one, where there's a lot on the line.
And again, I don't like the way he's gone about it here. He's coasting, being inattentive, but he's completely happy to post GIFs and fun images to be endearing to people. He's yogsloth.
Like, if he flips town, you can't really /blame/ anyone for voting him because the logic for doing so is logically sound, so it's kind of a 'back to square one' kind of deal.
*sees voxx trying to be as far as possible from my hypothetical corpse*
Yeah. And I imagine the reason he's done it as town is probably in preparation for a game just like this one, where there's a lot on the line.
And again, I don't like the way he's gone about it here. He's coasting, being inattentive, but he's completely happy to post GIFs and fun images to be endearing to people. He's yogsloth.
I mean, I could kiiiinda see that. But in the world where tom's that invested in being impressive in this game, I feel like he'd... be more impressive in this game.
Hnnnn.
If you had sole control over the lynch, would you kill tom, or Iso? Or someone else?
And again, I don't like the way he's gone about it here. He's coasting, being inattentive, but he's completely happy to post GIFs and fun images to be endearing to people. He's yogsloth.
*wonders if azrael has ever seen me be town before*
Iso, because it will be harder to argue people into it and I might not live to do it.
I guess in the unlikely event he was town, I wouldn't cry if he lived long enough to revamp his reads. But he's been so inflexible and tunnel-y this game. It's more like playing with old-school Cyan than with actual townie Iso.
I'm happy to bring a flyswatter down on you, I just don't want to do it day one, as I've said repeatedly.
I'm trying to just ignore you and your bull***** because if I try to interact with you I'm just going to get pissed and probably replace out, because this is revolting display of disrepect to people trying to play the game.
No ******* spiders. No ******* asterisks. Just play the ******* game properly. Christ.
I definitely want/need to see Nacho's catchup here. I feel like a fresh perspective could be really key. It feels like there are several waxing and waning and at times competitive narratives, and strong ones at that.
I'm happy to bring a flyswatter down on you, I just don't want to do it day one, as I've said repeatedly.
I'm trying to just ignore you and your bull***** because if I try to interact with you I'm just going to get pissed and probably replace out, because this is revolting display of disrepect to people trying to play the game.
No ******* spiders. No ******* asterisks. Just play the ******* game properly. Christ.
*has given reads*
*asks questions*
*votes*
*is apparently unreadable and yet people have reads on him*
*is playing a game and having fun*
*doesn't really see the ******* problem*
I'm happy to bring a flyswatter down on you, I just don't want to do it day one, as I've said repeatedly.
I'm trying to just ignore you and your bull***** because if I try to interact with you I'm just going to get pissed and probably replace out, because this is revolting display of disrepect to people trying to play the game.
No ******* spiders. No ******* asterisks. Just play the ******* game properly. Christ.
*has given reads*
*asks questions*
*votes*
*is apparently unreadable and yet people have reads on him*
*is playing a game and having fun*
*doesn't really see the ******* problem*
The problem is that you're not willing to compromise your entertainment value to work with the rest of the players in a game which is not something we randomly signed up for, but that we were invited to play. A game, I'll remind you, that relies heavily upon cooperation, flexibility, and team goals at the expense of individual goals.
@Az: I think tom's utilizing his posting restriction in a clear way that indicates he's trying to solve the game, even if he's missed a couple of seemingly obvious things. Also, you must have missed the part where I said that if GJ wasn't scum, PoE basically points to the mal slot in that case?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
ok, I genuinely don't understand the problem though.
It's a fact I have and would do this as either alignment.
I'll usually make one or two real posts when I think they're warranted. See my big unalignment post in otg. Or the game winnin post in titanic ultimatum. Or even the analysis of how people responded to my gifs that I faked in the crossover.
But I really don't see how it's any different from when I don't do a gimmick and just post 95% fluff and bait reactions.
If you can read that, I know you could read this if you really wanted to.
So don't replace out. If you think I'm scum try to lynch me. I will keep doing the same.
*climbs back into spider costume*
*pretends that never happened*
ok, I genuinely don't understand the problem though.
That is the ******* problem.
When 50+% of the game says "hey tom this is super annoying stop doing it, we all came to play," and you keep doing it.
It shows a fundamental lack of respect for the people you're playing with.
The problem is that you're not willing to compromise your entertainment value to work with the rest of the players in a game which is not something we randomly signed up for, but that we were invited to play. A game, I'll remind you, that relies heavily upon cooperation, flexibility, and team goals at the expense of individual goals.
You're right that I don't take the game seriously, but that has nothing to do with respect for the players.
Sure, I'm making more work for myself to post this way and you guys to interpret it.
So, what, you have to read me based on who I'm voting and what I'm focusing on?
Oh no, what a terrible thing I've forced upon you.
But if I'm really gonna cause people to leave and/or have a bad time, well... ****.
That's not what this is meant to do. And I am actually failing in my objectives here.
C'mon, guys. We're all friends here, even though we murder each other for fun. Tensions can rise. Let's just remember that it's a game and that we're here to have fun, please.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
You're right that I don't take the game seriously, but that has nothing to do with respect for the players.
Sure, I'm making more work for myself to post this way and you guys to interpret it.
So, what, you have to read me based on who I'm voting and what I'm focusing on?
Oh no, what a terrible thing I've forced upon you.
But if I'm really gonna cause people to leave and/or have a bad time, well... ****.
That's not what this is meant to do. And I am actually failing in my objectives here.
Ima step away for a bit
It's the functional equivalent of intentionally lurking. We don't get big analysis posts out of you. We don't get complete, thorough sentences and complete thoughts. If somebody gave himself a self-imposed character limit per post, and/or just spent half their posts talking about their favorite movies instead of the game, it'd be the functional equivalent of what you're doing. Terse, not terribly informative, very limited quantities of information, and a good portion of it is off-topic.
And it's just absolutely terrible play as town. As town, it makes you less persuasive, less helpful to your teammates, and it makes you much more difficult to accurately read, which is going to lead the town to mislynch you more often. You don't read people off votes, you read people off what lies behind the votes. And as scum, it's pretty close to the moral equivalent of staying just barely above the mod-line for posting in all your games, putting in nothing but the bare minimum of effort.
It's not necessarily against the rules (yet), but I think it's quite reasonable for the town to respond to that by murdering your face until you decide that it's important as town to allow people to read you correctly, and to fully explain your reads and rationales, and contributing to the town's efforts to the best of your abilities.
How would you feel if someone you were trying to get a read on, every time you started a wagon against them, responded by making random farm animal noises or telling stand-up jokes instead of responding to the thread? I imagine that's about how Vox and Newcomb must feel right now.
Like, what do you think would happen, if other people started doing what you're doing? If there was an arms race in being terse, off-topic, and not posting a lot of content? How long do you think people would last playing in that type of environment?
@Az: I think tom's utilizing his posting restriction in a clear way that indicates he's trying to solve the game, even if he's missed a couple of seemingly obvious things. Also, you must have missed the part where I said that if GJ wasn't scum, PoE basically points to the mal slot in that case?
I'm here to tell you that the Mal slot was town and if you're trying to slot me into POE, you're going to have a very very bad time of it.
I feel sad that people are replacing out before I even have the chance to catch up this game; this is a game that I can tell from this page alone is probably going to culminate in a good number of townreads and probably a decently quick game.
I'll be around tomorrow; I might not be able to make a full catchup until Wednesday, but I'll begin catching up tomorrow. To Tom, sometimes you start an approach to a game and it's good fun for you but it seems to fragment the town and you don't understand why; this happened to me in Dante's Inferno with Whiskeyjack and it seems to be happening to you here. Make the smart move, take a step back, and drop the gimmick for a little while so you can rebuild some bridges. Do what I wasn't observant enough to do there.
And Azrael, don't play like an old person. We're in this business to lynch scum; we're not here to make lynches that make us feel good or that seem like they're righteous, we are here to lynch scum. Right now, you're using language that says that you're okay if Tom flips town which has the same problem that you're trying to sell to Tom; if everyone lynched playstyles that annoyed them over plays that were scummy, the game would suck a whole lot more than it does.
Also, I understand that it will take a while, but when everyone has healed from these events and is ready to lynch scum:
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
To Tom, sometimes you start an approach to a game and it's good fun for you but it seems to fragment the town and you don't understand why; this happened to me in Dante's Inferno with Whiskeyjack and it seems to be happening to you here. Make the smart move, take a step back, and drop the gimmick for a little while so you can rebuild some bridges. Do what I wasn't observant enough to do there.
Yeah, alright.
I will be merely vaguely spidery but primarily post in human sentences.
I am absolutely doing all my reads list this game in the form of webs though.
That I really dig.
I guess if I'm dropping it I'll go ahead and translate my spidering rather than doing the super easy catchup thing:
First page or two is pretty clear. Glares and inviting people closer as I felt good or bad about them. Don't think any of it is particularly meaningful except the thug townread, which ill get to when i get to where I actually explained it
First important post:
I can't believe no one is alarmed at the speed of this wagon or lack of counter wagon if eco is wolf.
*nods*
*considers wrapping eco in a cocoon to be consumed later*
*glares at azrael menacingly*
*looks at sir chris bemusedly*
*glances at seppel quizzically*
*is fine with vaimes and isos votes*
*realizes how expressive spiders apparently are*
This is just after I briefly joined the eco wagon.
I just wanted to join a wagon and apply some pressure, but taking someone to L-1 on post 92 is not something I'm actually interested in.
What I'm trying to say here is "let's put eco on the backburner and look at his wagon"
Azrael's looks the most opportunistic. Saying "RIP, RVS" is like saying "this vote is serious but i am not giving reasons"
which is just weird for 13 posts into the game
chris's confused me the most but not in a scummy way. makes more sense now if hes actually masons with AZ, which i at least half believe. might be the MU meta of claiming masons with your homies just for the **** of it.
seppel's vote just brought questions. maybe i would have asked them if i was a human being at that time, but seppel doesnt especially answer questions anyway, and he answered them eventually.
Imagining scumseppel making some dumb distancing attempt on his buddy eco and then peacing the **** out only to return to an actual wagon.
Id expect him to either keep seppeling at eco to just get credit for whatever catch or reverse that read as RVS bravado.
What i WOULDNT expect him to do is add layers of nuance to the read and really paint himself into having that read forever.
So seppel/eco are NKA
As for iso and vaimes, they were pretty clearly just joining a wagon which is a thing i understand.
Seppel explains his reasoning for initially voting Eco, which I find to be dubious at best.
then hops onto the most popular wagon around instead, with no meaningful explanation for his change of heart.
*rubs legs together*
*looks at cyan*
*jerks head at eco*
*raises 2 eyebrows quizzically*
This is the beginning of the cyan read
I dont like the way he talked about the eco wagon being bad without offering any kind of read on eco.
so i tried to ask him about eco
oh, i guess i never answered this
i liked eco's most recent posts at that time. not much more to it.
iso i was just tapping on the glass because he hadnt been talked about enough
try to figure out if you'd make that gibberish as town or scum is making me even more irritable.
*nods yes to both*
*drops down from the ceiling on a thread*
*looks around waiting for someone to swat at him*
so this is me answering that of course id post like a spider as either alignment.
ive roleplayed as my role flavor twice, been a mafia robot, played a game in rhyme, and spoke in alara flavor text as town
and i did the one gif game as scum
plus the three times ive claimed hard claimed jester and kept it up. which has gone poorly 2/3 times but man was the time it worked was awesome
the second part was just talking about the benefit i get from it readswise. which is waiting for opportunistic playstyle attacks
which is a benefit i also get from my nongimmick playstyle of heavy wifom and not seeming to give a *****, but i digress
*circles a strand of silk around eco, az, voxx, gj, iso, and cyan*
*wonders how many scum are in there*
*realizes he cant tell without an eco flip*
*doesnt actually want an eco flip*
this is just a lament that so many people are connected to eco's alignment
because eco's flip is pretty definitely the most informative one to this point in the game
but i didnt really want to lynch eco
still dont, though i cant say i would oppose it super hard
I get the distinct feeling that Cyan is annoyed by the Eco wagon, but is also scumreading Eco.
Villager rating: plummeting.
*nods*
*stretches silk between cyan and eco*
*plucks it like the jaws song*
*looks at eco*
*shows him vaimes' post*
*ponders*
this post from vaimes was pretty similar to my thoughts on eco/cyan, so im agreeing and ask vaimes if he thinks theyre scum together for it
second part was trying to make eco respond to vaimes
he didnt, but his next post was a vote for cyan so that sort of answers that question
Speaking of, Tom do you think I'm scum? If not, do you at least understand why people do?
*crawls through eco's iso*
*lays 4 blue eggs and 2 red ones*
*shrugs with 3 shoulders*
*thinks youve been avoiding reading him just because he is a spider*
*thought we were hydra bros*
*shakes fist*
i thought eco would explain this, but i guess i will
when eco and i were a hydra together, we used the MU colorcoded bookmark function to flag posts we got townie or scummy vibes from.
so i saw 4 posts i thought were townie and 2 that were scummy in ecos iso
if any of them were strong enough to have a solid read from individually, im sure i would have quoted and layed a larger egg, so im not gonna figure out what they were
I will say that I get a very mild wolf ping about the line about him having a terrible scumgame; lowering expecations early kind of feels like something scum!Mal would do in this game?
*disagrees strongly*
*points to his scumgame with thug on MU*
*sees thugs buddies talking about his weakass scumgame*
*sees random townies talking about his weakass scumgame*
*but not thug until much later*
*thinks about thug*
*liked his entrance*
*thought this post was pretty chippy*
You should know that the only time I've rolled scum in a game with both of them, Voxx caught me for making an awkward sounding RVS vote. I decided to emulate that this game to see what would happen.
*doesnt think scumthug would make this post outside of DLP, where this sort of thing is more commonplace*
this remains one of my strongest reads of the game
first part is meta from the two times ive been in games with scumthug. we got a win together, and a very impressive one if i do say so myself.
and he just let proph/me/whoever say it for him
and he really wouldnt need to bring it up in this game, because at minimum vaimes/newcomb/voxx/gj/me know that's not really his area of expertise and would eventually make sure the rest knew it too.
he knows his reputation and would rather others give it in that situation IMO
thought his early post hit a good note of confrontational thug which is a towntell in my estimation
but the important part here is even after our glorious victory in the crossover game, there is no way scumthug has the cajones to make that DLP/FS-style wifom post in THIS game.
maybe on those sites where someone does it every goddamn game, but not here. not with this list.
because thug is too practical. you make that as town for reactions and its great. but you make that post as scum for the story, and i just dont think thats ever gonna be scumthugs motivation.
(PS: between this thug read and nacho's advice to me at the top of this post, i am just going to townread the slot into oblivion
i hope he can see the DAZZLING TOWNINESS in me and we can form a circle in a way we havent in awhile
which, to be fair, is mostly because i keep being scum in games with nacho)
*wonders why newcomb thinks i got voted to be here*
*does he think it was for my ability to be town and solve games?*
this was sort of a throwaway line, but id like to talk about it
this is why i decided to do the spider thing.
listen. i have various levels of confidence in my reads as i have them, and i think im a decent mafia player
but i also keep stats, and im not actually that good at being town.
i get pocketed too easily, focus way too much on silly things, and just dont have that good a grasp on gameflow
my best townskills are charisma- which only does any good if im right- and clearing low hanging fruit - which there arent any of in this game.
i knew id get some votes for this game just because people seem to find me entertaining, but i certainly never expected "tied for second in voting"
so i assumed all those votes were either for sillytom or scumtom.
the revelation that voxx voted for me is a pretty insane revelation to me
because he was clearly voting for srsbsnsstom, who has appeared on westeros a couple times and [redacted] which...
actually i think half the players in this game already know about redacted. so...
perhaps he wanted Not_A_Gimmick
but frankly i feel faker being NAG than i ever could being a spider
i tried real hard, but its just not me
so i guess i just spend this game somewhere in the middle
moderately serious, but still vaguely spidery
Can you look at those unalignments and show me where I might be wrong?
*starts to construct a web*
*doesnt know where to put seppel on it*
*this (might) make sense to you later*
*will get back to you on this*
this should be pretty self explanatory now, but i just wanted to point out that it totally makes sense now
seppel is just factually hard to place on that web because besides the NKA with eco, seppel kind of fits in anywhere
at the risk of just saying an overcomplicated version of "seppel is seppel", i dont actually think hes town or scum yet and probably will not even try without flips.
And faking a PR for funsies is almost never something I would expect a player like Tom to try in a high-stakes invitational.
*rolls so many eyes*
this is a legit terrible read from az, as it clearly shows he doesnt know what kind of player im like
but since hes only ever been in a game with me once and we were scum and SK, i probably cant actually read azrael from that
@Tom: I really want you to explain in as much detail as you can (and with as little using of spider-actions instead of words) why everyone is where they are, both in relation to yourself, and in relation to others.
*keeps voxx, cyan, iso, and azrael as far from himself as possible*
*lets chris and thug close*
*puts eco near cyan, nudges towards voxx*
*puts gj between iso and cyan*
*puts seppel as far from eco as possible*
*keeps vaimes sort of far away*
*finds open space for newcomb near the center*
this was pretty clear even in the form of spider charades
but i guess i can explain some of it.
already talked about the eco/cyan connection. the nudge towards voxx was about voxx's treatment of the wagon
if iso is scum, he probably called a team of 3 with 2 townies and a buddy. in my estimation, gj is the most likely buddy (this is basically just based on the narrative iso is pushing, not a read on the individual players)
and if iso is town, i have enough respect for him to at least put his proposed team on the same quadrant of the web
Like, if he flips town, you can't really /blame/ anyone for voting him because the logic for doing so is logically sound, so it's kind of a 'back to square one' kind of deal.
*sees voxx trying to be as far as possible from my hypothetical corpse*
voxx looks like he was making sure not to get blamed for my death if i get mislynched
and thats all the posts i felt were important and/or in need of translation
if i skipped something youre interested in, ask me. ill answer in english.
Shoring up your past record is helpful in some ways, but it's also a defensively oriented move, and another example of how your game has been primarily focused upon repelling and blunting hostile intent. I'd much rather you had coupled your first major foray into English in this game with some actual concern about directing the town towards people you were concerned might not be lynched, and need to die. But again, your history is focused upon yourself, not the forces which are supposed to be trying to kill you.
Quote from Tomsloger »
this is a legit terrible read from az, as it clearly shows he doesnt know what kind of player im like
but since hes only ever been in a game with me once and we were scum and SK, i probably cant actually read azrael from that
A) Your scum-play indicates that you do care about playing the game, as scum, far more than the ordinary run of players. Also, caught for "wrong reasons".
B) MTGS Meta doesn't have fake mason claims this early in the game, particularly from people expected to die.
C) I'd expect the density surrounding "why is the town complaining about my choosing tactics which make life harder for them" is scum-motivated, coming from a place of "I've got this awesome technique as scum and it's sort of working for me. Isn't it just fair tactics? Why are they whining because I'm playing well? Do I really have to give up my shiny scum toy because they are throwing a tantrum?"
D) Are you telling me that your choice to use spider gimmick this game was 100% for fun, with no tactical considerations at all? Because you've already alluded to certain tactical reasons for why you felt this choice was ok. Not "good", but "ok". Again, defensively oriented.
My town circle at present is:
Azrael, Newcomb, Seppel, Sir Chris, and Vaimes. Seppel needs to get back in here and start posting again if he wants to maintain that status, but I'm pretty happy here.
Neutral reads are GJ, Cyan. Not null, not no reads, just straight up reading as non-pingers. Bored, and disinterested. Vox, I'm tempted to push into town category, was prior in my neutral pile. Mall/Nacho gets his own category, teetering on the precipice of falling into the scum pile if I'm wrong about someone.
Remaining people and scum reads Tom, Eco, Iso.
I don't buy Sir Chris' town-clear on Eco, at all. His response to pressure, his repeated pocket attempts, his unoriginality. When people post as much as he does and are under the microscope as much as I've put him, I almost always get an accurate town-ping if it's justified, and I'm not from him. I'm willing to stack my town-read skills up against Sir Chris's, here. I've got too many reliable town-pings elsewhere to anticipate a mistake on this slot, particularly with the scum-tells I'm seeing.
Iso's been a parody of himself, has been attacking the game's equivalent of lurkers for unjustified, counter-factual reasons that neither Newcomb or I can find any basis for after careful search.
Tom, as per above, has been exclusively self-focused.
We need to research and kill these three. I know there's a lot of differing opinions amongst the town at present. But Iso's reads aren't coming from a place of truth and curiosity, and I think Sir Chris hasn't had the time to be quite himself yet. Aside from those two, our next highest thorough analysis contributor thus far is Newcomb, who is mostly who I'm addressing here, and has been putting in a ton of time and effort, but at the end of it is still wavering and looking for someone to trust and bounce ideas to that. And I feel the answer to that conundrum, to resolving and understanding these differences of opinion, is that Chris is half-AWOL, and Iso is scum, which leaves mostly the two of us in a room by ourselves for trying to identify the scum and lead the town's charge.
Like, you just described one of your key strengths as "charisma". This is literally Yogsloth's MO all over again, Newcomb. He's concentrating on himself, not others. Only this time, we're not buried in an avalanche of scummy lurkers to keep us from prioritizing this kill.
Like, you just described one of your key strengths as "charisma". This is literally Yogsloth's MO all over again, Newcomb. He's concentrating on himself, not others. Only this time, we're not buried in an avalanche of scummy lurkers to keep us from prioritizing this kill.
Stop comparing him to yogsloth when the game Tom is playing here is lightyears away from Yog's typical game. If the name of the game is charisma, then you want to be likeable and you want to be able to get along with a large subsection of the game; can you explain to me why his spider roleplay was something he expected to be taken well in the context of the invitational of one of the most content-heavy metas period?
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If you want to do something about it, feel free to use words. Otherwise, or probably even if you do de-spiderfy yourself, I'm going to do my best to convince everyone not to keep ignoring your plain-sight lurking routine. And if you're town, I guess that's the price you'll pay for trying to shore up your scum game as town.
Even through using your gimmick routine, you could have been far more expressive and involved in the town than you've actually been.
Maybe, maybe not. We've got seven days, a number of people scum-reading you, and you're not my exclusive target.
Here's another of the problems I've had with your play this game. You describe your town "electron cloud" theory as basically POE. Are you still comfortable clearing Mall's slot off that single interaction with Vox, and Vox too? And Tom, in spite of his spidery hijinks? I can barely recall your mentioning Tom all game. Two players that most everyone else is struggling to read or having to ignore, but they're not registering as possibilities for you in the slightest. Tom in particular.
This makes me feel a lot better about you actually, because you played in the cross-town invitational with Tom when he was scum hiding behind something similar to this. I hadn't seen much in the way of paranoia of you about him when I expected there to be some given he won, there, doing this bull*****.
My lock townread on tom isn't because of the image - wellll, it's kind of the image combined with one other thing.
I'm going to not share the reasoning there because I think it actually extends to tom's play in all of his games. Like, if I'm right, after this game I'm going to actually go look at some other tom games to verify this, then never tell tom about it ever, because I know it'll annoy him because he takes pride in changing up his outward appearance, staying in the middle of the pack, and being non-transparent.
But, let's say for the moment that none of that is true and I just townread him for the image because "oh look effort." So - what are you reading him for, then? His scintillating content?
Did you follow the cross-town game with Org/CTC?
I think we talked about it a little when it was happening but don't remember if you actually had been reading it.
He's putting effort into the wrong things, Newcomb. He's missing mason claims, coasting, putting effort into being amusing and innocuous and giving us a minimum of participatory reads and original thoughts. And he's hoping because he's doing it behind a gimmick, as he's done in the past as scum, we'll all just write him off as impossible to read, or misread him. As you're doing now.
As someone who's pulled a similar tactic before as scum, in the ancient past, I feel like tom's doing a significantly worse job of it than I did under similar, self-imposed constraints.
I could maybe lynch Iso? I wouldn't feel super great about it, but when I ~search my soul~ I come up pretty empty on reasons to townread him other than gut, so.
See above post re: tom. If he keeps trending on the line he's trending on, I'll happily vote him tomorrow or maybe D3 because unlike the rest of you, my game involves a lot of doubt and re-thinking and - oh wait I forgot I'm trying to do the MTGS playbook here.
*ahem*
Azrael you're just being silly, tom is quite, quite town and we should lynch scum today. What's more important - lynching scum... or silliness???
Iso/Chris/Azrael team. Why or why not?
I read a little bit of it, when Proph was under the gun I think, but I didn't follow it.
Heh. Per the above though, I think he's given us as much info as we need to arrive at a scum-read on him though. His activity tomorrow is going to be more of the same. If you can't read him as he's posting now, the situation's not going to get any better.
Not, because NKs will disprove that in about 2 seconds flat.
Maybe? The problem is like. There's no question he's being anti-town, but it's not outside of the realm of his town play. Or scum play.
Like, he's trying to show some insight but it's all so very, very easily faked. If this was any other game I'd probably encourage a policy lynch out of hope that he'd stop doing this *****, but especially on D1 I just don't think it's informative enough because it's so easy to justify the lynch for scum. Like, if he flips town, you can't really /blame/ anyone for voting him because the logic for doing so is logically sound, so it's kind of a 'back to square one' kind of deal.
He's doing a thing multiple people in this game know he's done as scum and just hoping people will outlevel themselves?
As politely as possible, I asked Voxx specifically because getting input from the three people I named doesn't exactly do anything for me here.
I've thought about it, but it's kind of a paranoia world.
Talk to me about it again on ~Day Three if we're still alive, because <redacted>.
You mean, talk to you on the D3 when we'd be in LYLO to that team and I'm like 100% dead?
I'd much rather lynch the scum, than lynch people for information. We've got plenty of info to work with already. Better just to maximize our hit-rate at this point. Don't need any flips to draw conclusions. Flips are much less helpful than people tend to believe for info.
Yeah. And I imagine the reason he's done it as town is probably in preparation for a game just like this one, where there's a lot on the line.
And again, I don't like the way he's gone about it here. He's coasting, being inattentive, but he's completely happy to post GIFs and fun images to be endearing to people. He's yogsloth.
I mean, I could kiiiinda see that. But in the world where tom's that invested in being impressive in this game, I feel like he'd... be more impressive in this game.
Hnnnn.
If you had sole control over the lynch, would you kill tom, or Iso? Or someone else?
Oh yeah, I think this just clicked for me. Nevermind, carry on.
I guess in the unlikely event he was town, I wouldn't cry if he lived long enough to revamp his reads. But he's been so inflexible and tunnel-y this game. It's more like playing with old-school Cyan than with actual townie Iso.
I'm trying to just ignore you and your bull***** because if I try to interact with you I'm just going to get pissed and probably replace out, because this is revolting display of disrepect to people trying to play the game.
No ******* spiders. No ******* asterisks. Just play the ******* game properly. Christ.
Feeling caught for wrong reasons?
*asks questions*
*votes*
*is apparently unreadable and yet people have reads on him*
*is playing a game and having fun*
*doesn't really see the ******* problem*
The problem is that you're not willing to compromise your entertainment value to work with the rest of the players in a game which is not something we randomly signed up for, but that we were invited to play. A game, I'll remind you, that relies heavily upon cooperation, flexibility, and team goals at the expense of individual goals.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
It's a fact I have and would do this as either alignment.
I'll usually make one or two real posts when I think they're warranted. See my big unalignment post in otg. Or the game winnin post in titanic ultimatum. Or even the analysis of how people responded to my gifs that I faked in the crossover.
But I really don't see how it's any different from when I don't do a gimmick and just post 95% fluff and bait reactions.
If you can read that, I know you could read this if you really wanted to.
So don't replace out. If you think I'm scum try to lynch me. I will keep doing the same.
*climbs back into spider costume*
*pretends that never happened*
That is the ******* problem.
When 50+% of the game says "hey tom this is super annoying stop doing it, we all came to play," and you keep doing it.
It shows a fundamental lack of respect for the people you're playing with.
The problem is that you're not willing to compromise your entertainment value to work with the rest of the players in a game which is not something we randomly signed up for, but that we were invited to play. A game, I'll remind you, that relies heavily upon cooperation, flexibility, and team goals at the expense of individual goals.
how do you not get that
Az you can ******* have it.
One day we'll have a game free of drama.
You're right that I don't take the game seriously, but that has nothing to do with respect for the players.
Sure, I'm making more work for myself to post this way and you guys to interpret it.
So, what, you have to read me based on who I'm voting and what I'm focusing on?
Oh no, what a terrible thing I've forced upon you.
But if I'm really gonna cause people to leave and/or have a bad time, well... ****.
That's not what this is meant to do. And I am actually failing in my objectives here.
Ima step away for a bit
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
It's the functional equivalent of intentionally lurking. We don't get big analysis posts out of you. We don't get complete, thorough sentences and complete thoughts. If somebody gave himself a self-imposed character limit per post, and/or just spent half their posts talking about their favorite movies instead of the game, it'd be the functional equivalent of what you're doing. Terse, not terribly informative, very limited quantities of information, and a good portion of it is off-topic.
And it's just absolutely terrible play as town. As town, it makes you less persuasive, less helpful to your teammates, and it makes you much more difficult to accurately read, which is going to lead the town to mislynch you more often. You don't read people off votes, you read people off what lies behind the votes. And as scum, it's pretty close to the moral equivalent of staying just barely above the mod-line for posting in all your games, putting in nothing but the bare minimum of effort.
It's not necessarily against the rules (yet), but I think it's quite reasonable for the town to respond to that by murdering your face until you decide that it's important as town to allow people to read you correctly, and to fully explain your reads and rationales, and contributing to the town's efforts to the best of your abilities.
How would you feel if someone you were trying to get a read on, every time you started a wagon against them, responded by making random farm animal noises or telling stand-up jokes instead of responding to the thread? I imagine that's about how Vox and Newcomb must feel right now.
Like, what do you think would happen, if other people started doing what you're doing? If there was an arms race in being terse, off-topic, and not posting a lot of content? How long do you think people would last playing in that type of environment?
I'm here to tell you that the Mal slot was town and if you're trying to slot me into POE, you're going to have a very very bad time of it.
I feel sad that people are replacing out before I even have the chance to catch up this game; this is a game that I can tell from this page alone is probably going to culminate in a good number of townreads and probably a decently quick game.
I'll be around tomorrow; I might not be able to make a full catchup until Wednesday, but I'll begin catching up tomorrow. To Tom, sometimes you start an approach to a game and it's good fun for you but it seems to fragment the town and you don't understand why; this happened to me in Dante's Inferno with Whiskeyjack and it seems to be happening to you here. Make the smart move, take a step back, and drop the gimmick for a little while so you can rebuild some bridges. Do what I wasn't observant enough to do there.
Also, I understand that it will take a while, but when everyone has healed from these events and is ready to lynch scum:
Vote: Seppel
You're welcome.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I will be merely vaguely spidery but primarily post in human sentences.
I am absolutely doing all my reads list this game in the form of webs though.
That I really dig.
I guess if I'm dropping it I'll go ahead and translate my spidering rather than doing the super easy catchup thing:
First page or two is pretty clear. Glares and inviting people closer as I felt good or bad about them. Don't think any of it is particularly meaningful except the thug townread, which ill get to when i get to where I actually explained it
First important post: This is just after I briefly joined the eco wagon.
I just wanted to join a wagon and apply some pressure, but taking someone to L-1 on post 92 is not something I'm actually interested in.
What I'm trying to say here is "let's put eco on the backburner and look at his wagon"
Azrael's looks the most opportunistic. Saying "RIP, RVS" is like saying "this vote is serious but i am not giving reasons"
which is just weird for 13 posts into the game
chris's confused me the most but not in a scummy way. makes more sense now if hes actually masons with AZ, which i at least half believe. might be the MU meta of claiming masons with your homies just for the **** of it.
seppel's vote just brought questions. maybe i would have asked them if i was a human being at that time, but seppel doesnt especially answer questions anyway, and he answered them eventually.
Imagining scumseppel making some dumb distancing attempt on his buddy eco and then peacing the **** out only to return to an actual wagon.
Id expect him to either keep seppeling at eco to just get credit for whatever catch or reverse that read as RVS bravado.
What i WOULDNT expect him to do is add layers of nuance to the read and really paint himself into having that read forever.
So seppel/eco are NKA
As for iso and vaimes, they were pretty clearly just joining a wagon which is a thing i understand.
This is the beginning of the cyan read
I dont like the way he talked about the eco wagon being bad without offering any kind of read on eco.
so i tried to ask him about eco
oh, i guess i never answered this
i liked eco's most recent posts at that time. not much more to it.
iso i was just tapping on the glass because he hadnt been talked about enough
so this is me answering that of course id post like a spider as either alignment.
ive roleplayed as my role flavor twice, been a mafia robot, played a game in rhyme, and spoke in alara flavor text as town
and i did the one gif game as scum
plus the three times ive claimed hard claimed jester and kept it up. which has gone poorly 2/3 times but man was the time it worked was awesome
the second part was just talking about the benefit i get from it readswise. which is waiting for opportunistic playstyle attacks
which is a benefit i also get from my nongimmick playstyle of heavy wifom and not seeming to give a *****, but i digress
this is just a lament that so many people are connected to eco's alignment
because eco's flip is pretty definitely the most informative one to this point in the game
but i didnt really want to lynch eco
still dont, though i cant say i would oppose it super hard
this post from vaimes was pretty similar to my thoughts on eco/cyan, so im agreeing and ask vaimes if he thinks theyre scum together for it
second part was trying to make eco respond to vaimes
he didnt, but his next post was a vote for cyan so that sort of answers that question
i thought eco would explain this, but i guess i will
when eco and i were a hydra together, we used the MU colorcoded bookmark function to flag posts we got townie or scummy vibes from.
so i saw 4 posts i thought were townie and 2 that were scummy in ecos iso
if any of them were strong enough to have a solid read from individually, im sure i would have quoted and layed a larger egg, so im not gonna figure out what they were
this remains one of my strongest reads of the game
first part is meta from the two times ive been in games with scumthug. we got a win together, and a very impressive one if i do say so myself.
and he just let proph/me/whoever say it for him
and he really wouldnt need to bring it up in this game, because at minimum vaimes/newcomb/voxx/gj/me know that's not really his area of expertise and would eventually make sure the rest knew it too.
he knows his reputation and would rather others give it in that situation IMO
thought his early post hit a good note of confrontational thug which is a towntell in my estimation
but the important part here is even after our glorious victory in the crossover game, there is no way scumthug has the cajones to make that DLP/FS-style wifom post in THIS game.
maybe on those sites where someone does it every goddamn game, but not here. not with this list.
because thug is too practical. you make that as town for reactions and its great. but you make that post as scum for the story, and i just dont think thats ever gonna be scumthugs motivation.
(PS: between this thug read and nacho's advice to me at the top of this post, i am just going to townread the slot into oblivion
i hope he can see the DAZZLING TOWNINESS in me and we can form a circle in a way we havent in awhile
which, to be fair, is mostly because i keep being scum in games with nacho)
this was sort of a throwaway line, but id like to talk about it
this is why i decided to do the spider thing.
listen. i have various levels of confidence in my reads as i have them, and i think im a decent mafia player
but i also keep stats, and im not actually that good at being town.
i get pocketed too easily, focus way too much on silly things, and just dont have that good a grasp on gameflow
my best townskills are charisma- which only does any good if im right- and clearing low hanging fruit - which there arent any of in this game.
i knew id get some votes for this game just because people seem to find me entertaining, but i certainly never expected "tied for second in voting"
so i assumed all those votes were either for sillytom or scumtom.
the revelation that voxx voted for me is a pretty insane revelation to me
because he was clearly voting for srsbsnsstom, who has appeared on westeros a couple times and [redacted] which...
actually i think half the players in this game already know about redacted. so...
perhaps he wanted Not_A_Gimmick
but frankly i feel faker being NAG than i ever could being a spider
i tried real hard, but its just not me
so i guess i just spend this game somewhere in the middle
moderately serious, but still vaguely spidery
this should be pretty self explanatory now, but i just wanted to point out that it totally makes sense now
seppel is just factually hard to place on that web because besides the NKA with eco, seppel kind of fits in anywhere
at the risk of just saying an overcomplicated version of "seppel is seppel", i dont actually think hes town or scum yet and probably will not even try without flips.
this is a legit terrible read from az, as it clearly shows he doesnt know what kind of player im like
but since hes only ever been in a game with me once and we were scum and SK, i probably cant actually read azrael from that
this was pretty clear even in the form of spider charades
but i guess i can explain some of it.
already talked about the eco/cyan connection. the nudge towards voxx was about voxx's treatment of the wagon
if iso is scum, he probably called a team of 3 with 2 townies and a buddy. in my estimation, gj is the most likely buddy (this is basically just based on the narrative iso is pushing, not a read on the individual players)
and if iso is town, i have enough respect for him to at least put his proposed team on the same quadrant of the web
voxx looks like he was making sure not to get blamed for my death if i get mislynched
and thats all the posts i felt were important and/or in need of translation
if i skipped something youre interested in, ask me. ill answer in english.
new content to come at a later time
A) Your scum-play indicates that you do care about playing the game, as scum, far more than the ordinary run of players. Also, caught for "wrong reasons".
B) MTGS Meta doesn't have fake mason claims this early in the game, particularly from people expected to die.
C) I'd expect the density surrounding "why is the town complaining about my choosing tactics which make life harder for them" is scum-motivated, coming from a place of "I've got this awesome technique as scum and it's sort of working for me. Isn't it just fair tactics? Why are they whining because I'm playing well? Do I really have to give up my shiny scum toy because they are throwing a tantrum?"
D) Are you telling me that your choice to use spider gimmick this game was 100% for fun, with no tactical considerations at all? Because you've already alluded to certain tactical reasons for why you felt this choice was ok. Not "good", but "ok". Again, defensively oriented.
My town circle at present is:
Azrael, Newcomb, Seppel, Sir Chris, and Vaimes. Seppel needs to get back in here and start posting again if he wants to maintain that status, but I'm pretty happy here.
Neutral reads are GJ, Cyan. Not null, not no reads, just straight up reading as non-pingers. Bored, and disinterested. Vox, I'm tempted to push into town category, was prior in my neutral pile. Mall/Nacho gets his own category, teetering on the precipice of falling into the scum pile if I'm wrong about someone.
Remaining people and scum reads Tom, Eco, Iso.
I don't buy Sir Chris' town-clear on Eco, at all. His response to pressure, his repeated pocket attempts, his unoriginality. When people post as much as he does and are under the microscope as much as I've put him, I almost always get an accurate town-ping if it's justified, and I'm not from him. I'm willing to stack my town-read skills up against Sir Chris's, here. I've got too many reliable town-pings elsewhere to anticipate a mistake on this slot, particularly with the scum-tells I'm seeing.
Iso's been a parody of himself, has been attacking the game's equivalent of lurkers for unjustified, counter-factual reasons that neither Newcomb or I can find any basis for after careful search.
Tom, as per above, has been exclusively self-focused.
We need to research and kill these three. I know there's a lot of differing opinions amongst the town at present. But Iso's reads aren't coming from a place of truth and curiosity, and I think Sir Chris hasn't had the time to be quite himself yet. Aside from those two, our next highest thorough analysis contributor thus far is Newcomb, who is mostly who I'm addressing here, and has been putting in a ton of time and effort, but at the end of it is still wavering and looking for someone to trust and bounce ideas to that. And I feel the answer to that conundrum, to resolving and understanding these differences of opinion, is that Chris is half-AWOL, and Iso is scum, which leaves mostly the two of us in a room by ourselves for trying to identify the scum and lead the town's charge.
So, let's do this.
tom, never change. Don't let the haters, hate. Maybe just be a touch more specific in character.
As wrong as Iso can be, I can't believe he guess the masons correct. I thought that was insane.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Stop comparing him to yogsloth when the game Tom is playing here is lightyears away from Yog's typical game. If the name of the game is charisma, then you want to be likeable and you want to be able to get along with a large subsection of the game; can you explain to me why his spider roleplay was something he expected to be taken well in the context of the invitational of one of the most content-heavy metas period?