GJ making stuff up to try to force through a bad WF lynch. Who knew!
This is the definition of flailing scum. GJ knows that he is getting lynched ultimately, and is just trying to pull through one more town mislynch first, by any means necessary. Especially since WF is basically the Vig.
Also, what were you guys saying about someone claiming Miller? It's a little hard to believe that a Miller would exist when the Cop is already kind of neutered.
Can we lynch GJ instead of Anak then? Anak is still scummy, but GJ is actively flailing.
Also, what were you guys saying about someone claiming Miller? It's a little hard to believe that a Miller would exist when the Cop is already kind of neutered.
D2 TIM claimed he was made a Miller overnight. He knew how it happened and said it wasn't a concern.
Publicly known info (Do not add to this list; claim to Cythare in private)
Seppel (2): 0-Destroy passives; 2-Move passives; bonus for all passives displaced.
Cyan (?): 2-Double Empowerment; 4-Give 4 permanent empowerment
Manders (?): 5-Permapacify, 1-Removes someones ability to empower and gains a second empower vote
Megiddo (5): No abilities.
TIM/ZOMG (?): Miller; ?-?
Axelrod (?): ?-?
Cythare (?): ?-?
Tom (?): ?-?
Shadow (?): 3-Coppish
WF (0): 2-Duel; 1-Sudden Death
GJ: (?): ?-?
GJ making stuff up to try to force through a bad WF lynch. Who knew!
This is the definition of flailing scum. GJ knows that he is getting lynched ultimately, and is just trying to pull through one more town mislynch first, by any means necessary. Especially since WF is basically the Vig.
Also, what were you guys saying about someone claiming Miller? It's a little hard to believe that a Miller would exist when the Cop is already kind of neutered.
Can we lynch GJ instead of Anak then? Anak is still scummy, but GJ is actively flailing.
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@Iso - What you call a mistake I call purposeful disinformation. WF made a claim that while I'm not the only one that could call him out on it I am the best to do so as I obviously know my own meta best. It is my theory that he was banking on me missing it or getting enough people behind it before I could call him on it that it wouldn't matter what I said in my defense. Unfortunately for him I am actually paying attention to what it is going on and he got caught. After tom, WF is the best candidate for a scum lynch toDay.
A scum role or a scum play? Roles are potentially randomized.
both
If you're town with that role you try to hit scum. Obviously.
Manders did think I was scum I guess. So if shes town that checks out.
I guess randomized roles is a thing though
Sigh
I didn't target you because I think you're Scum. (Though I do. That hasn't changed.) I targeted you because I think you empowered Scum Yesterday. Can't have that.
Also don't like wildfire's post - the first part of his post feels like fishing disguised as a question to "why tom", the second part feels like a smear attempt rather than an actual attempt at engaging Tordeck (who I'm coming to realize requires actual investigation into his motivation since his base play looks scummy in a vacuum), and the third part is wifom.
Since I will not be able to do this once I leave work (and it is a completely random list, anyway...)
Gentleman Johnny - No clue
Seppel - Neutral who should be ignored
Wildfire393 - Scum
Manders -
D_V - Town
Anaklusmos - Scum
Cythare - Leaning Scum
Tordeck - No clue
Axelrod - Heavily leaning Town
Iso - Leaning Town
Cyan - Leaning Town
shadowlancerx - Slightly leaning Scum
TheIceMan - Probably Town
tomsloger - Heavily leaning Scum
Shadow
DV
Axel
GJ
Cythare
Iceman
Iso
Manders
Tom
Anak
Tordeck
Cyan
Wildfire
Neutral
Seppel
When I made this list I totally forgot Wildfire said he was going to suicide, so that should be fun.
I dislike that most of my strong scum reads are also some of the lowest posters, but I feel like the higher posters have been pretty townie. I would not be at all surprised if there is a deep wolf in my greens, and another wolf in my yellows. Anything higher would surprise me at this point.
Anak's post about wagon analysis felt like him actually doing something for the first time this game, and while I initially had him lower down, I'm moving him to yellow for the time being.
Seppel, I want you to tilt me. No one is doing ***** anyway, maybe we can make a reaction. YOu know you want to do it.
Let me ask a question to anyone else: It feels very few people have town Wildfire/Anak over any other players (mixed on me, Iso, Tim, even someone had a wolf read on Axel, I think). I feel a bit worried that there is too much concensus going on, even before lists are done.
Why are we making these lists? Because DV asked for them?
I'm probably pretty close to where I was yesterday, in that I haven't really reviewed anything in light of Chris/Bur flips. What I want to do, and probably will when I have more time, is a full-on wagon analysis of Bur. Like I used to do, in the good old days...sigh.
Anyway, it's currently something like:
Strongly Leaning Town:
TheIceMan
Manders
DV
Leaning Town:
Shadow
GJ
Neutral:
Cyan
Wildfire
Cythare
Leaning Scum:
Iso
Seppel
Anak
Strongly Leaning Scum:
Tom
Tordeck
These are just a handful of posts of people posting reads between day 2 both before and after Wildfire shot Tordeck. Litterally TIM was the only person who even suggested WF could be lean town, and while tom made a single comment about it being a great ability, there was little trust to be gained. Wild wasn't being pushed as hard as I thought as I remembered, but I dare any ******* one of you with a straight face to tell me WF was not in the crosshairs for day 2 or going into TODAY. No one asked him about his empowerment requirement or tried to actually pump him up. You either think he is town and should want to pump him up to make sure we can't get two lynches, or you lynch him so he can't basically keep chain gunning townies. There is no inbetween. And since he is claiming he only needs one empowerment to fire, and tried to not even go for the big hero shot, not shooting into PoE, just a big "I THINK DV IS WOLF" shot, and you pretty much brush it off as "lolWF".
Whatever. Shadow, take a gamble on wildfire tonight. Manders, use your ******* brain. And start evaluating. Or, continue to sink yourself. If I get lynched over someone who shot two of the more obvious town players in this game, I don't want to actually win.
The funny part Cyan. I don't even think you are a wolf. I can't believe you would push me with a straight face as a wolf the way you are now. Like, it's inconceivable to me. You don't make plays like that, or tunnel that hard as a wolf. You just keep snapping the same traps over again, hoping this time will be the one.
Quote from Cyan »
This is the definition of flailing scum. GJ knows that he is getting lynched ultimately, and is just trying to pull through one more town mislynch first, by any means necessary. Especially since WF is basically the Vig.
Quote from Also Cyan »
People need to really read statements like this when they are made. GJ isn't really saying that he isn't scum, he's just saying 'but this game isn't part of my scum meta wahhhhh!'.
This is a great example of the Caught For The Wrong Reasons tell.
I kinda wonder if Iso is playing the same game as the rest of us. His scumteam (in addition to containing literally half the game) looks a lot like my townblock. Minus Seppel, of course.
GJ wagon seems iffy. Cyan wagon seems iffy. I still don't get why Anak was ever wagoned. Seppel wagon I can get behind but I'm probably just shooting that fool today anyways.
I'm back at home with normal internet access so I'll try to be more active toDay.
If DV votes for Wildfire first, Wildfire will die.
If Wildfire votes DV first, DV will die.
Be quick, or be dead.
Tell me Wildfire, why didn't you shoot at Manders/Seppel? Yes, DV was in your list, but you barely mention him at all, and went in today pretty much going "Shoot Seppel, Shoot Seppel"?
Setting aside my own read on him for now, you don't think that someone who can kill others but requires support from other players to do so can't be trusted to play as Vanilla? Reading him as scum is one thing, but your black and white interpretation of "have him kill or lynch him" ignores a third option. If he gets no empowerment toDay, then he shouldn't be able to quick draw. If he does still quick draw tomorrow despite receiving no empowerment, we definitely have a problem and he is insta-dead.
Setting aside my own read on him for now, you don't think that someone who can kill others but requires support from other players to do so can't be trusted to play as Vanilla? Reading him as scum is one thing, but your black and white interpretation of "have him kill or lynch him" ignores a third option. If he gets no empowerment toDay, then he shouldn't be able to quick draw. If he does still quick draw tomorrow despite receiving no empowerment, we definitely have a problem and he is insta-dead.
I'll respond to the rest of your stuff later.
We don't know how much empowerment he has, if he gets pumped by his buddies, or even if he started with 1. DV started with a negative number. It isn't impossible to imagine Wild probably started at 0 or 1.
Like litterally, the fact that you brush aside everything else I said to focus on the caveat, says everything I need to know about your approach today.
Like litterally, the fact that you brush aside everything else I said to focus on the caveat, says everything I need to know about your approach today.
What, where you rant and rave about how many people said he was Scum DAY 1 AND 2?
Yeah, I must have shut my brain completely off. You got me.
i guess not empowering wildfire and letting him live is ~ok
id rather just lynch him though.
even though he is more likely town than gj
If you truly believe this, then lynch GJ.
normally i would say this is dumb
you lynch the known kill power over an unknown role even if the kp is a little less likely
but empowerment and wf's kill being a day thing make that a little different
and it is technically possible wf kills himself
i guess not empowering wildfire and letting him live is ~ok
id rather just lynch him though.
even though he is more likely town than gj
If you truly believe this, then lynch GJ.
normally i would say this is dumb
you lynch the known kill power over an unknown role even if the kp is a little less likely
but empowerment and wf's kill being a day thing make that a little different
and it is technically possible wf kills himself
so
ok
vote gj
Anyone else still on the fence can use this logic to convince themselves. WF should not be a danger if no one empowers him.
Megiddo will connect to me and pipe that information to me. We will figure out the optimal use of empowerment and keep it secret from the scum using ciphers. (Az has said that we can't cipher role info, but we can cipher commands, etc.)
This way we can literally coordinate night actions and send along our night results without it being public who is doing what. With two points of failure (Megs and I), the mafia (hopefully) can't shut us both out in a single night, and thus everything stays secret and in the hands of the town.
Wow. Is everyone on board with this? If not, state why not. If you post without saying you're not on board, you are considered on board.
Two objections: 1) if you are not town GG
That was my only objection at the time of posting. But we since learned that it really won't work at all.
WF took a parting shot on the most powerful town role we had at the time knowing he was one of the most likely to die today. Of course he wouldn't have a better excuse than he has presented, it's because he is is straight lying.
@Cyan I don't believe for a second you would never activate that ability, and calling it bad play regardless of alignment is beyond disingenuous.
WF the game actions that you have performed do not align with my perceived best practices for a mafia game and I question your ability and integrity to continue with the game.
At least one of these things is pretty easy to check. Anak was Bur's counterwagon, with Tom arguably as a second counterwagon. Tordeck, Sir Chris, and Manders were the only people ever voting Wildfire on D1 vote counts.
The what now?
Counterwagon to a townie? That's not how that works.
At least one of these things is pretty easy to check. Anak was Bur's counterwagon, with Tom arguably as a second counterwagon. Tordeck, Sir Chris, and Manders were the only people ever voting Wildfire on D1 vote counts.
I'm only concerned with anything that happened on D3.
And I already know the answer. I'm trying to make GJ see that WF was under 0 pressure on D3. Because he wasn't. No one was looking his way, except to see who he was going to kill. If he WAS under pressure, he might have listened to the consensus in choosing his target. Because he felt confident in his gut and didn't feel as if he was in danger, he decided to trust his gut.
Of course that was the stupidest thing he could have done....but that doesn't make him Scum. It means he did a stupid thing.
That was meant as a response to GJ, but your post got there first. I didn't remember Wildfire being a D1 counterwagon to Bur, so I went and checked and surprise Wildfire was mildly wagoned before Bur, but was not a counterwagon. GJ is trying to paint Wildfire as scum for being the counterwagon to a town flip but isn't actually checking to make sure. It looks to me like he's desperately trying to gain traction on a wagon that's tempering. I still think Wildfire is the right lynch, but am becoming more convinced by a GJ lynch if enough people don't want to lynch Wildfire.
TLDR: Wildfire's actions are still scummy, and he should still be lynched, but GJ is grasping at the wrong straws to get there.
i guess not empowering wildfire and letting him live is ~ok
id rather just lynch him though.
even though he is more likely town than gj
If you truly believe this, then lynch GJ.
normally i would say this is dumb
you lynch the known kill power over an unknown role even if the kp is a little less likely
but empowerment and wf's kill being a day thing make that a little different
and it is technically possible wf kills himself
so
ok
vote gj
Anyone else still on the fence can use this logic to convince themselves. WF should not be a danger if no one empowers him.
IF he QDs tomorrow, he is dead. Period.
Manders did you forget that the scum can just... move empowerment around at any time in secret? If WF is scum you would have to make it so that NONE of the scum get ANY empowerment. And as we have seen from DV and me, it's possible to get empowerment without being given it. I reject this logic.
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i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
Did you ask him if he has any empowerment left, or did that bright idea escape you?
I've confirmed here that I do not. I was empowered three times - tom on day one, and Iso and GJ yesterday. I spent all three of these empowerments, one on my day 2 quickdraw, one on my day 3 quickdraw, and one on Sudden Death.
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Manders did you forget that the scum can just... move empowerment around at any time in secret? If WF is scum you would have to make it so that NONE of the scum get ANY empowerment. And as we have seen from DV and me, it's possible to get empowerment without being given it. I reject this logic.
No I didn't forget that.
IF we all empower in thread and he somehow still is able to kill tomorrow, then we deal with that Tomorrow.
The narrative of town wildfire just having godawful reads and killing townies so scumgj and scumiso empowered him to keep doing it is viable.
Theyd have probably kept calling him their honorary wolfbro in chat and laughed and laughed.
And now gj has turned on him.
It makes about as much sense as some antispew bull*****.
I'm like 99.9% on gj being scum
Wildfire could totally be town. I dont think he is, but its possible.
But letting him live is dangerous.
If ZOMG hasn't connected, he can connect to Cythare, and Cyan can claim to ZOMG and ZOMG can pass it to Cythare along with his own claim.
I think Manders and WF are fully claimed, so that's taken care of.
And lastly Axelrod needs to connect to Cythare and claim.
From there, Cythare can evaluate the roles and find the optimal Empowerment + Night Actions.
Unvote
Vote Gentleman Johnny
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I added my other one since it's already public.
As for who I'm connected to, I connected to stupid Iso D1 or D2.
Sure, I'll go for that.
Unvote Vote: Gentleman Johnny
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@Seppel: I'm actually not sure whether I connected to TIM or he to me. I think he sent the first message. I thought it was a 2 way street.
I I hear what you're saying and I think it's a good idea. You got me pocketed.
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Basically, if you've chatted with anyone at any time, you can't do so again. If they started the chat, you used yours automatically by replying to them. If they are dead, you do not get another shot to chat with someone else.
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I think we've been playing this wrong
Post time.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
FTFY
These are just a handful of posts of people posting reads between day 2 both before and after Wildfire shot Tordeck. Litterally TIM was the only person who even suggested WF could be lean town, and while tom made a single comment about it being a great ability, there was little trust to be gained. Wild wasn't being pushed as hard as I thought as I remembered, but I dare any ******* one of you with a straight face to tell me WF was not in the crosshairs for day 2 or going into TODAY. No one asked him about his empowerment requirement or tried to actually pump him up. You either think he is town and should want to pump him up to make sure we can't get two lynches, or you lynch him so he can't basically keep chain gunning townies. There is no inbetween. And since he is claiming he only needs one empowerment to fire, and tried to not even go for the big hero shot, not shooting into PoE, just a big "I THINK DV IS WOLF" shot, and you pretty much brush it off as "lolWF".
Whatever. Shadow, take a gamble on wildfire tonight. Manders, use your ******* brain. And start evaluating. Or, continue to sink yourself. If I get lynched over someone who shot two of the more obvious town players in this game, I don't want to actually win.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Nicky, I wish you had half the skill in mafia you used to have. I want GooCyan, not ******* AACyan.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Why did you empower Wildfire yesterday?
If he isn't going to die, might as well use him. Him shooting outside of the PoE is a death sentence anyway.
Oh look he shot out of the PoE on one of the townies players in the game.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Tell me Wildfire, why didn't you shoot at Manders/Seppel? Yes, DV was in your list, but you barely mention him at all, and went in today pretty much going "Shoot Seppel, Shoot Seppel"?
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I'll respond to the rest of your stuff later.
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We don't know how much empowerment he has, if he gets pumped by his buddies, or even if he started with 1. DV started with a negative number. It isn't impossible to imagine Wild probably started at 0 or 1.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Get over yourself.
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You ******* aren't if you think I am a better lynch than WF.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Yeah, I must have shut my brain completely off. You got me.
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still need to lynch wildfire
massclaim is terrible
im pretty clear and have a lot of info via private chat
plus im pushing two scum...
im ok with this
id rather just lynch him though.
even though he is more likely town than gj
We need to make sure everyone's got the empowerment votes cast before we lynch anyone, though.
I've got mine on Axel, but does anyone else need it?
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you lynch the known kill power over an unknown role even if the kp is a little less likely
but empowerment and wf's kill being a day thing make that a little different
and it is technically possible wf kills himself
so
ok
vote gj
Anyone else still on the fence can use this logic to convince themselves. WF should not be a danger if no one empowers him.
IF he QDs tomorrow, he is dead. Period.
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The GJ way path to no lynching:
That was my only objection at the time of posting. But we since learned that it really won't work at all.
This guy is lock scum.
MAFIA MEMES
The what now?
Counterwagon to a townie? That's not how that works.
This post makes me +town Cythare.
If I had known that it was possible for me to enter the game I would have been less eager to crack off my chat.
Manders did you forget that the scum can just... move empowerment around at any time in secret? If WF is scum you would have to make it so that NONE of the scum get ANY empowerment. And as we have seen from DV and me, it's possible to get empowerment without being given it. I reject this logic.
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I've confirmed here that I do not. I was empowered three times - tom on day one, and Iso and GJ yesterday. I spent all three of these empowerments, one on my day 2 quickdraw, one on my day 3 quickdraw, and one on Sudden Death.
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IF we all empower in thread and he somehow still is able to kill tomorrow, then we deal with that Tomorrow.
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Official Vote Count:
Wildfire- GJ, Anak
GJ- Cyth, MH, Cyan, Tom
With 12 alive, 7 to lynch
Official Empowerment Count:
Seppel - Cyth
Cyth- Shadow, Seppel
MH- Axelrod
Axel- MH
Shadow - Tom, GJ
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Theyd have probably kept calling him their honorary wolfbro in chat and laughed and laughed.
And now gj has turned on him.
It makes about as much sense as some antispew bull*****.
I'm like 99.9% on gj being scum
Wildfire could totally be town. I dont think he is, but its possible.
But letting him live is dangerous.
Idk.
but then later if he does it would be really bad for us.
he so completely clammed up after the shot too, which is weird.
bah
:shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug:
But not to the point of not killing dv (or anyone else) last night.
tom is pretty much confirmed. Or decided not to let his buddies know to shoot DV. There is a < 100% chance DV dies last night if tom was wolf.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Your endorsement means a lot :eyeroll:
Where's your fire, bro?
Growl at someone. Stir ***** up.
We'll ignore whatever you say anyway because antispew, but it will be cathartic
Sometimes I really like you tomsloger.