So we got tom, WF, Bur and Anak as the majority of players calls for scum. Add in Seppel as a 5th nontown and I think in a game this size we have it solved. So I say we pick the first one to swing. See how they how they flip and night goes then if we were wrong we can reevaluate. If we aren't we go to the next living player on that list. Rinse and repeat as needed to win.
Tordeck goes in the scumpile for this post. Like, Jesus. "Majority players calls for scum"? Yes hi, I am sheep, watch me baa.
I'm pretty sure that's just Tordeck (Hi <3) being himself. Have you read any other of Tordeck's games?
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Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
How has he escaped this noose? Because TIM the tool man town hunter made a push on me for not caring which of my scum reads went first? Get real you bunch of softies, you.
I hope whatever I have can be sent hrough the interwebz. Except shadow. He is cool.
So we got tom, WF, Bur and Anak as the majority of players calls for scum. Add in Seppel as a 5th nontown and I think in a game this size we have it solved. So I say we pick the first one to swing. See how they how they flip and night goes then if we were wrong we can reevaluate. If we aren't we go to the next living player on that list. Rinse and repeat as needed to win.
Tordeck goes in the scumpile for this post. Like, Jesus. "Majority players calls for scum"? Yes hi, I am sheep, watch me baa.
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Okay, could you please kinda elaborate? I'm having hard time seeing what you see in tom's "What?" reaction to "You don't see the town motivation to you all"...
after chris answers, I want you to tell me about the timing of his switch on me
I want your perspective
Okay, could you please kinda elaborate? I'm having hard time seeing what you see in tom's "What?" reaction to "You don't see the town motivation to you all"...
after chris answers, I want you to tell me about the timing of his switch on me
I want your perspective
Uuuugh. Chris doing something that's beyond my comprehension?
You should probably ask someone who's good in this game and not me.
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Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
I think the thread grinding to a halt is another bad sign for Tom. His buddies probably aren't willing to make a huge racket because it's unclear what's going to happen. They don't want to bus him over the edge, but they also don't want to defend him too vociferously.
The analysis of Tom's behavior gets complicated quite quickly and it's tough to make a really airtight case there. I also accept that Tom approaches the game differently to me. That being said, I still don't view his interactions with D_V as townie, and the more I think about it the more I find myself organically retracing my own logic in #943. Plus I don't think Tom has looked great all game. Unvote. Vote tomsloger.
As for the other players, Anak, Sir Chris, and Axelrod stand out to me. I think Anak showed too much conviction in his/her defense of Tom in #940. I'll admit that this does have me worried. Sir Chris is bouncing around, and I'm only following his logic in fits and spurts. Axelrod also seems to have changed his mind in #982, but there's quite a lot going on so some level of reevaluation is probably natural.
Finally, there's Bur. I still don't get what the big deal is and I'm waiting to be convinced (I'll admit that a quick re-read is in order). Sure, he/she made a few scummy posts very early on. But I don't think the post-claim defeatism is alignment indicative given that he/she wasn't invested enough in the game at that point to care about getting lynched, and that seems to be the cornerstone of most people's cases right now.
I think the thread grinding to a halt is another bad sign for Tom. His buddies probably aren't willing to make a huge racket because it's unclear what's going to happen. They don't want to bus him over the edge, but they also don't want to defend him too vociferously.
The analysis of Tom's behavior gets complicated quite quickly and it's tough to make a really airtight case there. I also accept that Tom approaches the game differently to me. That being said, I still don't view his interactions with D_V as townie, and the more I think about it the more I find myself organically retracing my own logic in #943. Plus I don't think Tom has looked great all game. Unvote. Vote tomsloger.
As for the other players, Anak, Sir Chris, and Axelrod stand out to me. I think Anak showed too much conviction in his/her defense of Tom in #940. I'll admit that this does have me worried. Sir Chris is bouncing around, and I'm only following his logic in fits and spurts. Axelrod also seems to have changed his mind in #982, but there's quite a lot going on so some level of reevaluation is probably natural.
Finally, there's Bur. I still don't get what the big deal is and I'm waiting to be convinced (I'll admit that a quick re-read is in order). Sure, he/she made a few scummy posts very early on. But I don't think the post-claim defeatism is alignment indicative given that he/she wasn't invested enough in the game at that point to care about getting lynched, and that seems to be the cornerstone of most people's cases right now.
100% agree with all of this, couldn't have put it better myself.
@TIM: Based on your post there, can you answer my question to you? Do you believe that scum!Anak would come to scum!tom's defense like that? If anything, that post you link to would imply that scum!Anak knows that tom is town but is having a hard time coming up with a way to defend him without outing that he knows tom is town.
Also, @Meg, I understand if you want to wait, but am interested in chatting with either you or Proph. I understand if you want to wait first, but am not in a hurry.
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I've been following along, but I haven't posted because I didn't know what to say.
I don't see how this entire situation confirms nor condemns tom. There are so many ways it can be played and so many of them could be done by either alignment, it all reads like a bunch of null WIFOM to me and seems like a huge time waste.
That being said, I've thought tom was scummy all along and . Anak is still scummy. So is Bur. Tordeck I'm second guessing since he calmed down and is contributing (kind of), so I'll keep an eye on him. Nothing else has changed.
******* done, lynch me if you want. Figure out empowerment, make sure Axel/SC/DV have what they need, give me two empowerment. And then, move on. We are stagnating anyway, lets see what our friends can do.
Like, I suppose we could jack it for another week(s) or so, but I don't see a point. Bur has been under pressure, he has not been. When the pressure shifted to me and tom, he still hasn't done anything.
I find myself completely agreeing with Manders here, this whole Tom situation means nothing until we get some flips to compare behavior to anyway.
@GJ: You're distracting because your post about lynching you or not is just straight WIFOM and doesn't match the mood of the thread. Where is your head at currently?
Anyone who isn't voting to empower, now is the time.
Cythare, I don't believe Anak and Tom can be scum together.
I want to reiterate that Tom's interaction with D_V isn't slam-dunk scum. As Manders correctly points out, it's too complicated. But there's nothing townie about it either, and plenty of reason to believe it's scummy. It's just yet another reason to believe Tom is scum.
GJ, do remind me how "doing anything" is a scumtell.
I find myself completely agreeing with Manders here, this whole Tom situation means nothing until we get some flips to compare behavior to anyway.
@GJ: You're distracting because your post about lynching you or not is just straight WIFOM and doesn't match the mood of the thread. Where is your head at currently?
Anyone who isn't voting to empower, now is the time.
I don't like long day 1s. They annoy the ever lasting **** out of me. I am also kind of cranky. I am at my most vulerable to tilt, bUT EVEN NOW I WONT TILT.
At the cost of 2 empowerment, I can roleblock target player. If I successfully block an action, I gain an empowerment and my target gains their empowerment equal to the amount of empowerment it required for them to activate their ability plus one more.
At the cost of 4 empowerment, I can guard target player from all kills until the NEXT NIGHT (Yes, my ability specifies that it lasts the night and the following day). If I successfully protect my target, I die and they gain an empowerment. I can only use this ability once.
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
The thing that kind of stands out the most is that, in a game he's not participated much in, Anak appears hyper aware of votes cast on him. To the point of even responding to Shadow's random opening vote. He also respond to Cyan's vote, and GJ's vote. And in #857, he comments (briefly) on everyone who has voted for him and even ranks them in order of scumminess. This from someone who only has 15 posts total.
I point this out but I'm not even drawing a conclusion from it. I guess my gut feel is that scum tend to be more aware/sensitive to votes cast on them than town. At least the early, random votes and votes based on not much.
A lot of the rest of his stuff is non-committal or obvious. His votes have been for Tordeck - for his "OMGUS" reaction to Cyan, and for Bur, which was basically a wagon vote for the (and he himself recognized the irony) fact that Bur was "doing nothing."
His "analysis" is fairly weak, consisting of insights like:
Tom looks to be very Tom at this point
DVs response above feels like normal DV
He had a couple of slightly better opinions on some other people, but none of this strikes me as particularly Townie. So my professional opinion is that Anak is scum or just lazy.
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Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Cythare, I don't believe Anak and Tom can be scum together.
I want to reiterate that Tom's interaction with D_V isn't slam-dunk scum. As Manders correctly points out, it's too complicated. But there's nothing townie about it either, and plenty of reason to believe it's scummy. It's just yet another reason to believe Tom is scum.
GJ, do remind me how "doing anything" is a scumtell.
I don't know in what you are referencing that too.
I also didn't notice this post before because lols mtgs refresher.
I don't see how this entire situation confirms nor condemns tom. There are so many ways it can be played and so many of them could be done by either alignment, it all reads like a bunch of null WIFOM to me and seems like a huge time waste.
the fact you said this while scumreading me is approximately the towniest possible thing you could have done
I'm fine with scumreading my behavior. I invite that.
Here's a town read
The timing on chris switching was a bit worrisome, but he doesn't seem to actually want to lynch me.
Ask again later.
Fwiw, I asked bur about it because of a conversation we once had about IRL mafia and the importance of timing
I expected him to have something, but I think IRL timing reads are more a micro/hesitations thing than a macro/gameflow thing and it's not like bur has his finger on the pulse of the game regardless of his alignment
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Still support a Bur lynch, nothing has changed there. Still think Tom's town and people were bored when looking at him, making something from nothing. Like I just can't get past why he should care about anything DV said as either alignment.
Hey look Tordeck is still not paying attention to the game, why is he town again?
@Iso Seeing how difficult it is for people to meaningfully get information from your large posts, why continue down that route?
I'm pretty sure that's just Tordeck (Hi <3) being himself. Have you read any other of Tordeck's games?
How has he escaped this noose? Because TIM the tool man town hunter made a push on me for not caring which of my scum reads went first? Get real you bunch of softies, you.
I hope whatever I have can be sent hrough the interwebz. Except shadow. He is cool.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
The Family
##vote: WF
Okay seriously.
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No.
Bur today, WF tomorrow.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I want your perspective
Uuuugh. Chris doing something that's beyond my comprehension?
You should probably ask someone who's good in this game and not me.
You want to elaborate on this one, Chris?
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I see no reason to be paranoid
The analysis of Tom's behavior gets complicated quite quickly and it's tough to make a really airtight case there. I also accept that Tom approaches the game differently to me. That being said, I still don't view his interactions with D_V as townie, and the more I think about it the more I find myself organically retracing my own logic in #943. Plus I don't think Tom has looked great all game. Unvote. Vote tomsloger.
As for the other players, Anak, Sir Chris, and Axelrod stand out to me. I think Anak showed too much conviction in his/her defense of Tom in #940. I'll admit that this does have me worried. Sir Chris is bouncing around, and I'm only following his logic in fits and spurts. Axelrod also seems to have changed his mind in #982, but there's quite a lot going on so some level of reevaluation is probably natural.
Finally, there's Bur. I still don't get what the big deal is and I'm waiting to be convinced (I'll admit that a quick re-read is in order). Sure, he/she made a few scummy posts very early on. But I don't think the post-claim defeatism is alignment indicative given that he/she wasn't invested enough in the game at that point to care about getting lynched, and that seems to be the cornerstone of most people's cases right now.
100% agree with all of this, couldn't have put it better myself.
Unvote, Vote Tom
yes, that is the play i made as town.
maybe it was wrong
id even believe that many of you would do it differently
i apparently wouldnt
im done talking about it
either ask me questions or just talk about other things and ill talk about them too
or, i guess, lynch me and ill just spam really threatening hip hop lyrics on my way out
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The GJ way path to no lynching:
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
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2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
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I don't see how this entire situation confirms nor condemns tom. There are so many ways it can be played and so many of them could be done by either alignment, it all reads like a bunch of null WIFOM to me and seems like a huge time waste.
That being said, I've thought tom was scummy all along and . Anak is still scummy. So is Bur. Tordeck I'm second guessing since he calmed down and is contributing (kind of), so I'll keep an eye on him. Nothing else has changed.
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******* done, lynch me if you want. Figure out empowerment, make sure Axel/SC/DV have what they need, give me two empowerment. And then, move on. We are stagnating anyway, lets see what our friends can do.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I'm voting Bur, you donut.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
@GJ: You're distracting because your post about lynching you or not is just straight WIFOM and doesn't match the mood of the thread. Where is your head at currently?
Anyone who isn't voting to empower, now is the time.
I want to reiterate that Tom's interaction with D_V isn't slam-dunk scum. As Manders correctly points out, it's too complicated. But there's nothing townie about it either, and plenty of reason to believe it's scummy. It's just yet another reason to believe Tom is scum.
GJ, do remind me how "doing anything" is a scumtell.
I don't like long day 1s. They annoy the ever lasting **** out of me. I am also kind of cranky. I am at my most vulerable to tilt, bUT EVEN NOW I WONT TILT.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Why do you think claims mean anything in this game?
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Meh.
The thing that kind of stands out the most is that, in a game he's not participated much in, Anak appears hyper aware of votes cast on him. To the point of even responding to Shadow's random opening vote. He also respond to Cyan's vote, and GJ's vote. And in #857, he comments (briefly) on everyone who has voted for him and even ranks them in order of scumminess. This from someone who only has 15 posts total.
I point this out but I'm not even drawing a conclusion from it. I guess my gut feel is that scum tend to be more aware/sensitive to votes cast on them than town. At least the early, random votes and votes based on not much.
A lot of the rest of his stuff is non-committal or obvious. His votes have been for Tordeck - for his "OMGUS" reaction to Cyan, and for Bur, which was basically a wagon vote for the (and he himself recognized the irony) fact that Bur was "doing nothing."
His "analysis" is fairly weak, consisting of insights like:
He had a couple of slightly better opinions on some other people, but none of this strikes me as particularly Townie. So my professional opinion is that Anak is scum or just lazy.
Next stop.
I don't know in what you are referencing that too.
I also didn't notice this post before because lols mtgs refresher.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
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Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
I'm fine with scumreading my behavior. I invite that.
Here's a town read
Tom's kinda sitting Scummy-Neutral right now for me.
Tom do you think anyone was disingenuous on their attacks on you?
He was reading me at the same level you were and he knows better
Hey man I approached it pretty neutral.
Like I said I wasn't sure what to make of it. I kinda saw both angels.
What about Chris's kinda weird jump?
Naw **** it Angels.
Ask again later.
Fwiw, I asked bur about it because of a conversation we once had about IRL mafia and the importance of timing
I expected him to have something, but I think IRL timing reads are more a micro/hesitations thing than a macro/gameflow thing and it's not like bur has his finger on the pulse of the game regardless of his alignment
Bur- GJ, shadow, Anak, seppel
Tom- Wildfire, Tordeck, Cyan
Anak-Cythare, manders
GJ - TheIceMan, tom
Sir Chris- Axelrod
WF - Sir Chris
9 to lynch
Official Empowerment Count:
DV- Manders, Cyan, Seppel, Shadow, Tordeck
Seppel- Sir Chris, DV
Axelrod- GJ, Theiceman
Sir Chris- Iso, Cythare
TheIceMan-Wildfire, Axelrod
Wildfire- Tom
Vote Bur
LEz go people.
Vote Bur
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Unvote Vote Bur
That should put him in claim range if he hasnt already.
Since we caught scum I havent been paying much attention I admit. This circle jerk is getting boring and I have other games to focus on.
The Family
Hey look Tordeck is still not paying attention to the game, why is he town again?
@Iso Seeing how difficult it is for people to meaningfully get information from your large posts, why continue down that route?