Oh god I almost voted Fable for saying I didn't answer Sir Chris's statement when he meant Silver.
Yeah let's not use that.
Come on do I really need to spell that out?
It classic buddying.
I jokingly say Sir Chris is cleared to mess with KOD and to go on a deep sea halibut expedition.
Then Silver was just like yeah I agree with that. For no good reason. Like Chris had posted 4 posts none of which really had any merit, hen he attacks KOD, and his reasoning is weak at best and it read to me the main reason he was going after KOD was because KOD looked like an Easy target and because he attacked Chris.
The play just reeks of inside information which makes me believe that Chris is town and that Silver is scum with info on who is town.
Oh bonus points for lynching Silver I can use SC again as an abbreviation to refer to Chris, this alone is worth it.
@DV:
You might be right on Chris. I bet this is within his scum spectrum, too, though.
is this what you're referring to? Because if so Silver is being neutral by saying Chris could also be acting in his scum spectrum as well. Granted this reads like Silver trying to play sides which has it's own problems but I think you might be attributing to much to this post. Everyone is trying to feel each other out right out of the gate so even if Silver was buddying I don't see that as a scum tell.
@DV:
You might be right on Chris. I bet this is within his scum spectrum, too, though.
is this what you're referring to? Because if so Silver is being neutral by saying Chris could also be acting in his scum spectrum as well. Granted this reads like Silver trying to play both sides which has it's own problems but I think you might be attributing to much to this post. Everyone is trying to feel each other out right out of the gate so even if Silver was buddying I don't see that as a scum tell.
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
It's been said, but this post is worrysome. Honestly, who threatens a cat? Serial Murderers.
I'll say this about the environment here, not one of the people that is engaging you, is incapable of admitting they were wrong and changing their mind.
But you know the only thing that is going to change minds? If you scumhunted, instead of "tearing through" people. Maybe just a poor choice of words here, but if I was you I'd be less worried about TS/SC making you look scummy and more about catching scum.
Why are you coaching here?
It's the yankees to my red sox, this guy. The lex luthor to my Superman. The fly in my oatmeal. Coke to my Pepsi. The one, the only, JD.
You were town that game, but misread me so badly, that you speed hammered an innocent man
But I'll let bygones be bygones.
I love that you think me capable of coaching anyone. I literally asked for a mentor this game, and (sad panda) didn't get one. In any case, that post was a little softer than I meant to be. "Knock off the ***** and put your money where your mouth is" wouldn't have come off as coaching, oh well, C'est la vie.
On another topic entirely. Is anyone buying the Necarg posting restriction? I'll admit I'm not the biggest nerd in the thread (most likely), but I also don't remember many alien species who just wanted people "on their dick". Necarg, what's the deal dude?
What the hell do you mean, what's the deal I totally just want people on my dick.
Oh, I get it. You're jelly.
Do you want some lovin' too?
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I jokingly say Sir Chris is cleared to mess with KOD and to go on a deep sea halibut expedition.
Then Silver was just like yeah I agree with that. For no good reason. Like Chris had posted 4 posts none of which really had any merit, hen he attacks KOD, and his reasoning is weak at best and it read to me the main reason he was going after KOD was because KOD looked like an Easy target and because he attacked Chris.
I mean, I thought I was pretty clearly fence sitting, so I have no idea how you got that out of my post, but ok.
The play just reeks of inside information which makes me believe that Chris is town and that Silver is scum with info on who is town.
Sorry, could you ELI5 please? I'm feeling a little slow today. Which part of my tone, phrasing, or words seem to have implied that I knew Chris was town? Especially when TappingStones took the same exact posts and thought I was being too suspicious of him?
Oh bonus points for lynching Silver I can use SC again as an abbreviation to refer to Chris, this alone is worth it.
I'm pretty sure you're joking, but that's just about the worst reason to lynch someone I've heard.
Liking Sir Chris so far, even though he sometimes set my Kosa Sense off a bit (for exemple on #12. Don't think it's anything tangible, just cinic gut feel).
Oh man if I am ever telling you I am being completely honest, you should lynch me you have surely caught a scum Chris lying through his teeth. Unless it is like, you know, later in the game or something where transparency needs to happen usually. But day 1 yeah I am a sneaky guy who tends to plot a lot of stuff against scum.
20 posts in and we're already up with meta self-consciousness? I missed this subforum so much
---
Disliking KoD. Didn't like the voteless "Major" FoS at all, nor the forced (#6) and/or half-assed ways of expressing suspicion (#8 and #15). The latter might just be a lighthearted way to be funny/have fun, I don't know the guy, but it didnt jive well on me.
#24 on the other hand confuses me. I can't see scum OMGUS'ing like that so early in the game. Reads as VI (no offense intended). Don't know what's happening here.
KoD. I noticed you tend to explain yourself a lot. Why didn't you comment on my post over your FoS at #65?
Shock's #20 is terrible. If he's scum, Chris and Kod are almost certainly townslapping each other.
* Cythare cocks her head slightly, then jumps onto a table next to Kosakosa and lightly bats him in the face. She then curls up in the corner and begins rolling around with a ball of yarn. *
Also I find it interesting you are voting mindreaver for a post I really liked. I thought it was quite the opposite of busy stuff, it was quite cutting.
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I jokingly say Sir Chris is cleared to mess with KOD and to go on a deep sea halibut expedition.
Then Silver was just like yeah I agree with that. For no good reason. Like Chris had posted 4 posts none of which really had any merit, hen he attacks KOD, and his reasoning is weak at best and it read to me the main reason he was going after KOD was because KOD looked like an Easy target and because he attacked Chris.
I mean, I thought I was pretty clearly fence sitting, so I have no idea how you got that out of my post, but ok.
The play just reeks of inside information which makes me believe that Chris is town and that Silver is scum with info on who is town.
Sorry, could you ELI5 please? I'm feeling a little slow today. Which part of my tone, phrasing, or words seem to have implied that I knew Chris was town? Especially when TappingStones took the same exact posts and thought I was being too suspicious of him?
Oh bonus points for lynching Silver I can use SC again as an abbreviation to refer to Chris, this alone is worth it.
I'm pretty sure you're joking, but that's just about the worst reason to lynch someone I've heard.
It would help if I had read that first post correctly the first time instead of just cutting out part of the information in my head and making conclusions based upon that.
Incorrect. It is inherently scummy for Chris to throw suspicion back on me while citing I could have asked why only for him to later give his reasoning anyway. Also, you are wrong yet again. Chris was never asked to provide his reasoning by anyway. He willingly gave it out without being asked in his post where he talked about the fishing accusation. Other than that, my reasoning for not asking why is acceptable. Matter of fact, why wasn't even a factor. As the situation stood, Chris cleared Shock without stating a reason. To me, that comes off as random since no reason was given, thus my accusation. I'm not obligated to ask "why" he is town clearing the person since no reason was readily given initially. If you dislike this/disagree with it, that's really not my concern since I have no problem with my train of thought on the matter as it developed.
As for your vote, you can let it stand for as long as you like.
@Stones:
It's not sarcastic. In case that wasn't clear. I'm sorry you're not a fan of it though. Perhaps we'll grow fond of each other given time. Do you like my use of words to describe? Apparently it made an impression of you. Also, so what if it was that person's first post? I feel strongly about no lynches, and I stated how I felt. Seems straight forward to me. Doesn't it seem straight forward to you? Is that a bad thing? If it is, I'm sure we'll get past it. If not, oh well. As for the WHY, I refer you to my response to Sauce up above. And what do you mean by guilty for not asking why when I was in an "obvious" position to do so? I mean if that's how you would of posted, that's fine and dandy, but I'm posting how I see fit. As I indicated, there's no reason for me to ask why since it was readily obvious to me that he had no reason due to his lack of having posted one initially. You can fault me for that as much as you like, but if you're thinking I'm going to nod my head that you're right, then you'll be waiting a while.
And no, you're wrong. The use of the word random was correct since no reason was given by Chris initially. Now, we can argue this all day, but at the end of the day you'll be wrong no matter what. With nothing stated, I am right to assume it was randomly done. Plus, there's no rule that says I have to ask why when it was apparent that it was randomly done as far as I was concerned.
What do I care if someone accuses me of fishing? Why wouldn't I care? You seem to think it's ok for someone to ask why did you clear this person. As far as I'm concerned, that is grounds for fishing for a person's role or information concerning their role. Asking that is an easy way to get setup to be accused as such. Whether you agree with that or not hardly matters as that is how I perceive it.
Also also, it's harder for mafia to continuously convey they are town as they have to keep track of what they are saying so they don't trip over their own words. So just because mafia strive to do the same thing town does doesn't mean town should stop striving to do their job.
@wasabi:
I'm full of surprises. Also, it shouldn't "come off" as mudsling to you. It flat out is mudsling since I am throwing suspicion on him for clearing the guy (Shock?) randomly at the time. Now if you want to make the argument that one post is enough to town read a person and invalidate my randomly accusation, that's your right, but you'll have to excuse me for ignoring it. As for being hard to read me, I'll grow on you. You just read me however you want, and make your arguments based on whatever you're thinking about me.
Anyway, disregard Fable's stuff about me. I made a huge impression on him. Or her.
@Mind: Rescue. I'd call it sarcasm.
Hi Yomako.
@Mind again:
Pretty much what you said. That's why I said disregard Fable's rules. Also, Fable doesn't know my meta. Your best bet is to just judge me on my content. I mean if you ***want*** to bring style into it (which Kill seems to be interested in with his request to see a game I've played in), you can do that, but I'd hardly say you'll be an expert at reading my style with little interaction with me. But that's just me.
@Fable:
Defensive how? By accusing me of stuff and watching me argue over it? Also, if you like screwing with me, why wouldn't you want people to get into 20 pages of discussion with me? It'll certainly generate content/stances to look at as opposed to not having stuff to read.
@Silver:
In fact, a major part of town's job is fishing for motivation. It's only a scum tell when you're trying to out a power role or something, and not even always then.
I mean, I can point out how odd it is to read this given what occurred, but I would hope you can see the irony in saying this. So we're talking about clearing someone. You say it's only a scum tell when trying to out a power role or something (and add that that's not always the case even though there's no guidelines to provide why). So tell me, should I laugh at this since asking why someone was cleared as town constitutes power role fishing essentially? Or are you going to say that isn't the case wrt to my case (and go on to cite the rule/guideline that exempts my case)? I'd like to know since it is interesting.
5) Chris seems to take the same view of this and wonders if you thought he was soft claiming day cop or something.
Did he? That's odd of him to think that. What gave him the impression that I thought he was a cop at all? The fact that I said he would accuse me of fishing for asking why even though that was tied strictly to asking why?
Then you two argue about the word random or something and you settle on voting him for not asking you why you suspected him.
So, like, I took great care to mention several times why I was voting him. Apparently doing so didn't matter since you managed to get it wrong as to why I am voting him. That or you're intentionally misrepresenting me.
I aware you scum points.
*Stares at Cythare.*
@Mind: I'm against no lynching on principle. As for what you guys are used to (posting styles, certain types of things happening, etc) I'll mostly be ignoring. Strictly because I don't know any of you so I'll judge you based on the content I see in your posts. Standards and the such that I am not privy to are useless to me. That being said, Silver's no lynch post doesn't strike me one way or the other in and of itself. Quite frankly, given how long it took for you guys to fill this game, I could see the post from a town perspective as a way to generate activity potentially. Likewise, I can see the scum motivation you're painting.
Although, I will say it is funny I had Silver grilling me over how my post is perceived only for the same thing to be leveled back at him. I do love the smell of hypocrisy in the air.
Also, fun thought: It seems to me all this "clearing" you guys do is your way of doing something D1. It's on part with junk posting I've seen since it looks to have no actual, important basis. Which is fine if that's what you guys are into.
Also, after having read what Fable listed, I'm awarding scum points to Fable for how he read me. I'm not going to explain it any further beyond this until later when I feel like it.
Hi Goose.
Looks like you guys are taking the no lynch vote to heart. In my mind it looks like Mind vs Silver since Mind (by my count) is calling Silver out on it. Now if I'm following the exchange properly, Silver thinks it is odd Stones took the no lynch vote seriously. It may be just me, but given all the talk about "not caring how your posts come across", isn't Stones caring about how his post came off when -- justifying? describing? -- it to Silver? Because that's what it looks like. It's hard for me to say whether or not anyone is scummy or townie wrt to this (especially since the no lynch post doesn't rub me either way), but seeing how they interact with one another (as far as who is siding where if at all) is helpful.
I have to disagree with you Fable wrt to Stones's post. Near as far as I can tell from reading it, he's not "giving a pass" to "good" players more so than anyone else. He's saying Silver shouldn't be "heavily focused" on a good player more so than anyone else, otherwise it'll lead to reading in between the lines for scum tells. Also, more scum points to you for trying to link the clearly separate ideas in his post and describing it as cover for taking the bait.
@Kosak: idk Kosak, is it?
@Half_Time: Cannonball. Also, I disagree with you disagreeing.
@Chris:
From my perspective, there was no need for me to ask for an explanation since it was readily apparent what you were doing was at random. Describing it the way you are is nothing more than shoving words down my throat while ignoring how the posts transpired in the first place (scum points). As far as I'm concerned, it's too early to try and game solve without anything to go off of be it a death or reveal of information that has backing to it. You "clearing" someone constitutes neither of those. I say "clearing" because your reason for doing so has no actual bearing on the game.
Also, I wouldn't have to "pile on" with my words if you guys read it right the first time, but that can't be helped. I will make sure to reiterate a point which I feel you're misrepresenting so no worries there.
Also, if the best that can be managed is two votes on me, I won't need your help. Bring your considerable skills to bear once I'm L-1, then we'll see how effective you are.
Also also, what you consider a problem with words is just a problem with opinions. Everyone has one, and it sucks.
Oh cool, Cythare is sheeping Chris. Scum points awarded.
@Fable: You're not helping. By that I mean, and I echo -- Mind I think it was?, you're not providing any actual reads on me. You're, more or less, saying I'm annoying.
@Stones: Oh Fable is definitely the pot calling the kettle black. The jabs at me are w/e since I don't care about that stuff. I can't say for sure that he stated that post with malicious intent (scum intent or w/e you want to call it). Beyond that though, I'm trusting my scum points I awarded to him earlir wrt to his reads post/thoughts on what has happened thus far.
@Necar:
Yeah, no. I'm definitely not utilizing LAL wrt to Chris. You're like the fourth person to completely ignore my stated reason for voting Chris. Anyway, you're wrong here.
Also, as I stated earlier in this post, I made a huge impression on Fable.
This is so much OMGUS and the first part is directly a threat. He also acts extremely salty and irratible. He seems to be giving off a rather large reaction for having, what, 2 votes on him?
Vote: Fable07
Hm. Well then, Fable is town. Disregard all scum points and thoughts of Fable being scum I have stated thus far. Necar is likely scum at this point to me.
Normally, the third vote on a wagon is the Jeep tell, but Stones is the third vote with a justified vote (given the exchange with Fable) as far as I am concerned. Necar's vote, though, reeks of scummyness based on what he's focused on. Yeah, skinning a cat is a "serious" threat. Totally. Also, I know when someone is salty. Fable isn't salty atm. His desire to help is entirely genuine since, as he noted, he didn't want to see 20 pages of arguing with him. Yes, his "rules" don't help give a standard to read me on, but that's not the point. Instead I see Necar jumping onto Fable's wagon and "piling on" reasons to "reinforce" his vote.
Unvote, Vote Necarg
I've still got my eye on you Chris.
@Fable: Carefree like claiming scum while your teammates tell you that's a bad idea. Am I right? You're definitely more carefree, and I'm definitely more serious.
From Fable
I'm not one to take mafia that seriously and I like teasing people.
HaHaHaHa!
@DV:
Isn't that what town is supposed to do? Get as much info out onto the open field as possible?
That's what I thought, but apparently there is a double standard being applied to me wrt to that whole conversation. Apparently, it's towny of Chris to not state his reasoning initially while it us untowny of me to not ask why as opposed to assuming (due to lack of any stated reasoning) that what he did was random. Or, if this is in regards to not knowing me, then yes. Assuming it is in the context of this game. If you want to do research on me, feel free to do so without me indulging you since that's not my responsibility. If it's something else you're getting at with this, then I don't know.
This is just the best vote ever. I don't like your logic, but it really isn't logic. Clearly you are scum even though it doesn't matter what you actually said, because the logic is bad. I'm in love.
From KoD
Rather than react to a person you don't know with what you said, you just threw suspicion back at the player. That's scummy on your part. You've just earned a vote.
I love you too. I think.
Anyway, in case it isn't clear, that is the reason for the vote. The focus is on the fact that rather than respond how he did in his later post (not his initial) to someone he doesn't know, he decided to throw suspicion right back at me.
If that was already clear to you, then I miss the jab as I don't see how it connects to what I stated. Perhaps you could walk me through it.
Anyway, you think Silver is pocketing Chris? Or sheeping. Or whatever you call it.
@Fable: By reading its reactions. Also, we're totally not alike. You worry too much about people liking you.
Good vibes from Half_Time for no particular reason.
Sir Chris' #70 has two minor language tells against him, which is odd since he's an enough experienced player to not incur on that. Food for thought, though.
Liking TappingStones so far except for the Fable vote, which is bad. Still town though.
Fable's posting style reminds me of DRey. Which means he's probably town.
Necarg's reasoning for voting Fable in #85 is the worst of the bunch and textbook bandwagoning. Consider my vote on you as well.
...
Mindreaver's #89 is mindboggling. It looks so much like coaching that it can't possibly be.
Nevertheless, it's terrible though. Absolutely noncommital, and it's first sentence is, again, BusyStuff. You're lucky that I don't have a bullet else I'd have vigged you on the spot after that.
More people should be voting for MR, like, seriously. And if he's scum, Fable is 99% scum with him.
...
D_V, reasoning for your vote on Silver?
jd why no vote though? Vote him. Do it.
Ok, wait. #106 > Mindreaver, are you inexperienced with Mafia?
Also I find it interesting you are voting mindreaver for a post I really liked. I thought it was quite the opposite of busy stuff, it was quite cutting.
I'll talk about my reasoning after he adresses my points.
* Cythare cocks her head slightly, then jumps onto a table next to Kosakosa and lightly bats him in the face. She then curls up in the corner and begins rolling around with a ball of yarn. *
I assure you, I'm not being light hearted or funny.
No idea so I can't take offense to what you're saying. Nor would I care to actually take offense anyway.
I do like to talk. As for what you're referencing, if I didn't comment on it, it probably wasn't important enough to me for me to comment on. If this is about you disliking my FoS at Chris, then oh well. You dislike it. Or is this about me not voting the FoS? I view voting as being higher than FoSing. If I was going to vote a FoS, I wouldn't bother FoSing in the first place.
I took a moment to go look at the post you referenced (65 right?). I believe I can answer why I never responded to it for you Kosa. It was probably because I never actually responded to it or any other post since my last post (until my most recent post in the last five mins). Hope that answers your question.
@Goose:
Perhaps Cythare is a cat that has to post like how a cat would act (or as a means to communicate her stances).
Hmm. I disagree with just about everything in Kosa's #113 but I like the way he's thinking about the game.
Don't know how I feel about Shockwave. I think he just thought the SC/KOD thing was funny.
@Kosa:
TS/Fable seemed like town on town to me. What do you think?
@Col_Mongoose:
In a couple of the older Trek games one of the roles was a cat that was immune to the Borg cult. The name escapes me, but I assume that role has made a reappearance.
There was only a Borg cult in one of them, though.
I'll probably go rooting around the sign-up thread in a minute to dig the name up.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
@Silver: I mean, I can point out how odd it is to read this given what occurred, but I would hope you can see the irony in saying this. So we're talking about clearing someone. You say it's only a scum tell when trying to out a power role or something (and add that that's not always the case even though there's no guidelines to provide why). So tell me, should I laugh at this since asking why someone was cleared as town constitutes power role fishing essentially? Or are you going to say that isn't the case wrt to my case (and go on to cite the rule/guideline that exempts my case)? I'd like to know since it is interesting.
What I was saying is that fishing is (usually) only a scum tell if the fisher is trying to out role information. The more general case of fishing, which you seemed to be referring to (fishing for motivation or information about a vote/town read) is not alignment indicative. Which is why it seemed curious that you were worried about being accused of fishing when you wouldn't be fishing for role info.
Obviously, there are no hard-and-fast rules in Mafia, and as soon as you come up with some the scum learn to fake them. But generally the above is true.
Did he? That's odd of him to think that. What gave him the impression that I thought he was a cop at all? The fact that I said he would accuse me of fishing for asking why even though that was tied strictly to asking why?
Yes, because here (as in, on MTGS) "fishing" is usually a scum tell when the fisher is role fishing, because as I said a large part of being Town is figuring out other people's alignments. Asking for reasoning behind a vote or town read isn't a scum tell for "fishing," so when you said you didn't want to be called out for fishing he assumed you thought he was implying a power role.
So, like, I took great care to mention several times why I was voting him. Apparently doing so didn't matter since you managed to get it wrong as to why I am voting him. That or you're intentionally misrepresenting me.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm not misrepping you (gee, you really are like TS). You're essentially saying that he is scum because he didn't ask you why... when he was scum reading you, because you didn't ask him why. Am I wrong?
I aware you scum points
Ok.
Looks like you guys are taking the no lynch vote to heart. In my mind it looks like Mind vs Silver since Mind (by my count) is calling Silver out on it. Now if I'm following the exchange properly, Silver thinks it is odd Stones took the no lynch vote seriously. It may be just me, but given all the talk about "not caring how your posts come across", isn't Stones caring about how his post came off when -- justifying? describing? -- it to Silver? Because that's what it looks like. It's hard for me to say whether or not anyone is scummy or townie wrt to this (especially since the no lynch post doesn't rub me either way), but seeing how they interact with one another (as far as who is siding where if at all) is helpful.
I was surprised because one of the regulars here (Gentleman Johnny) is well known for voting No Lynch during RVS and TappingStones has played with him at least a bit, if that helps you follow the exchange better.
Shock's #20 is terrible. If he's scum, Chris and Kod are almost certainly townslapping each other.
Specifically, I don't think Shock's alignment indicates yours or Chris's and I don't think it's a scummy post. It's just sort of a... do nothing feel-good post to me. Scum make those posts, yes, but so does town.
Now, if we get ten pages in and the majority of his posts are like that, it might be worth scrutinizing because he could be skating.
No no no. First, your general case that you're trying to apply to me, by your words, deals with votes and reads. Unless you are using reads interchangeably with clears/clearing, your general case doesn't apply to me. Second, that's what I would be doing by asking why, is it not? That's rhetorical since I know your stance is that it isn't. I'll explain though. Chris starts off by flat out clearing Shock. He mentions, prior to clearing, how people dislike(?) it and that it is mystifying. He offers nothing else. I'm faced with two options (though the obvious one for me given that he never gave any reasoning is that he is being random). Asking why is the other option. Asking why he "cleared" (I put this in quotations in case you're focused on using clear and read interchangeably) opens the door to role information potentially. Now if you're going to assert to me that clearing someone is the same as reading them, then ok. It would fall into your general case then. However, if you're not going to assert that clearing is the same as reading, then we're back to my perspective that it is fishing (read: role fishing).
Now your perspective aside, Chris responding to me by pointing out that I didn't ask why reeks of a setup/trap. You'll have to excuse me if I disregard your perspective since you finding it odd and (in your opinion) that I wouldn't be accused of fishing is unknown to me. Opinions aside, I'm not familiar with how you view what is or isn't fishing (even if I find your reasoning flawed anyway with differentiating between what counts as role fishing and general discussion).
Generally speaking, Chris clearing someone as town and me asking why would constitute role fishing as far as I am concerned. The only way that isn't the case is if you are talking about reading the player when you say clearing/cleared/etc.
And yes, you are wrong. He's scummy for throwing suspicion on me, then going on to give his reasoning without being asked. A lot of this back and forth could have been avoided (along with the fishing accusation that I brought up) had he led with what wasn't important in not saying (why he cleared Shock). He got a cheap shot in by saying I'm scummy for not asking, then giving his reasoning anyway. In no way was he being consistent.
Chris
Why give any information away freely when you can get further interaction based on it? Look, by not specifying we are now having words. A townie's job is not to be transparent, but it is to solve the game while at the same time not getting horribly murdered via their method of choice.
I say he's being random. He says I should have asked why, and that I'm scummy. I say I would be accused of fishing had I asked why. He responds, in part, with the above. He then goes on to freely give the information without having been asked (in the same post) while contradicting his "townie's job is not to be transparent". He definitely accomplished words being discussed, but as I said, not before he got a cheap shot in.
That's why he's scummy to me.
@DV: Yes, there is doubt. At least until Chris decided to start leaning town on me before claiming, after my post, that "that's town." I'm viewing it as a pocket on his end.
I think we're just talking past each other, to be honest.
Essentially, town clearing (here, again, and I know your meta is probably different) isn't necessarily role-related and doesn't mean "this person is mod-confirmed town to me." Usually it just means "I have a strong town read on that player and would not support a lynch without a lot of evidence." Besides which, there's also the possibility that he was just doing it to get reactions and he wasn't actually town reading him at all.
And no, we're not talking past each other. I'm aware of how you're viewing what I'm saying. I just don't think you're giving how I'm looking at it its just deserts. You're focused on me calling him scum for calling me scum while not taking it upon himself to say his reasons at the start. I said you're wrong on this because it seems to me you're ignoring looking at it from my shoes.
As the situation stood, Chris cleared Shock without stating a reason. To me, that comes off as random since no reason was given, thus my accusation. I'm not obligated to ask "why" he is town clearing the person since no reason was readily given initially. If you dislike this/disagree with it, that's really not my concern since I have no problem with my train of thought on the matter as it developed.
Hopefully, this will clear things up. The reason some people are having difficulty with you is partially related to the bolded wording. It's not rational to assume people's actions have random motivation. It's a not a very logical way to frame your thinking. Do you really assume people make decisions in this game with no motivation? I assure you there aren't any coin flips going on in front of the other players computers and there are likely no players saying "I'm gonna vote for player X without reasoning. Do you do that?
You are correct when you say you aren't obligated to give a why. But if you don't then players are free to ask why. It's not fishing and anyone who is super worried about that is operating at a very low play level. No strong player is going to sit back and let players say things without finding out their reasoning. Your worry about someone claiming role-fishing there is bizarre because it would only imply the existence of a day cop, which I've never seen in a game yet. So, again it's one of those "level one" Mafia fears. it doesn't add up when you think through the consequences.
It's not sarcastic. In case that wasn't clear. I'm sorry you're not a fan of it though. Perhaps we'll grow fond of each other given time. Do you like my use of words to describe?
That was my point. It seems like you are almost offended that someone suggested no lynch. And if you don't think it sounds that way feel free to clarify it. i'm trying to let you see where i'm coming from as clearly as possible.
Apparently it made an impression of you. Also, so what if it was that person's first post? I feel strongly about no lynches, and I stated how I felt. Seems straight forward to me. Doesn't it seem straight forward to you? Is that a bad thing? If it is, I'm sure we'll get past it. If not, oh well.
It does seem like a bad idea and I've already brought it up with Crystal. Read through the thread.
As for the WHY, I refer you to my response to Sauce up above. And what do you mean by guilty for not asking why when I was in an "obvious" position to do so? I mean if that's how you would of posted, that's fine and dandy, but I'm posting how I see fit. As I indicated, there's no reason for me to ask why since it was readily obvious to me that he had no reason due to his lack of having posted one initially. You can fault me for that as much as you like, but if you're thinking I'm going to nod my head that you're right, then you'll be waiting a while.
The above bolded is faulty logic, not an opinion. Not listing a reason doesn't equal random. Not in any universe. Hence, several people questioning your understanding of the word random. They aren't trying to pick on you, on the contrary, they are trying to rationalize how someone could think such a thing. As a rule, you should never assume someone's actions are random. You should ALWAYS be trying to glean motivation from actions. This is not an opinion.
And no, you're wrong. The use of the word random was correct since no reason was given by Chris initially. Now, we can argue this all day, but at the end of the day you'll be wrong no matter what. With nothing stated, I am right to assume it was randomly done. Plus, there's no rule that says I have to ask why when it was apparent that it was randomly done as far as I was concerned.
This is the last time I'll labor this point. I like to give everyone a chance to get on the same page. It might be helpful for others to read this too. Random does not equal to no reason given. This is a hole in your game you can start working on immediately. Go back and think about the possible motivations for SC's blind townclearance. Notice I already questioned the motivation by considering he might be gunshy because he's been under fire early in quite a few games lately. I was likely wrong because being cheeky fits better but I was thinking of motivations.
What do I care if someone accuses me of fishing? Why wouldn't I care? You seem to think it's ok for someone to ask why did you clear this person. As far as I'm concerned, that is grounds for fishing for a person's role or information concerning their role. Asking that is an easy way to get setup to be accused as such. Whether you agree with that or not hardly matters as that is how I perceive it.
I guess this comes down to your strength as a player. I just ask what I want to ask and have no worries about someone giving the "fishing" allegation. Maybe that's because I consider those fishing accusations to be poor Mafia play that I see from weaker players? I'll think about that a bit though. Very likely comes down to town shouldn't be spending a ton of time crafting their posts to sound towny, or avoiding questions in fear of looking scummy. Just scum hunt. That last part is theory and I could understand if you disagree with it. It's not nearly as unassailable as my comments on the weird usage onf "random".
Also also, it's harder for mafia to continuously convey they are town as they have to keep track of what they are saying so they don't trip over their own words. So just because mafia strive to do the same thing town does doesn't mean town should stop striving to do their job.
1. Concerning confusion with the bold: That's a matter of opinion. Given that this is D1 and what as posted occurred literally near the very start of the game, it stands to reason that there is no logical reason for clearing someone as town. Thus, no reason being stated logically leads me to it being motivated at random. Indeed, with it being confirmed as an opinion (an opinion on one post at the start of the game no less) (plus, as my discourse with Silver has revealed, clearing is essentially how you guys read people) it is more or less "random" on some level. At this point though we're going to argue in circles over it. That being said, asking me that question is ignorant. It's D1. It's more likely things will be done at random today as opposed to any other day in a game of Mafia. To answer your question though, yes. I do believe people make decisions in this game with no reason behind it (on D1 though it's not impossible for it to happen on other days). A better question to ask me if do I think Chris cleared Shock randomly to which I'll say yes given my perspective on the matter.
2. Concerning fishing: I'm going to assume you never bothered to read the posts that addressed this. You call it bizarre. That's fine. I say it isn't bizarre. My assertion is based on the fact that saying you "cleared" a player as town more or less implies knowledge of their alignment. As was noted by Silver to me, you guys use "clearing/cleared" in a variety of ways of which one is meant for reading that person's alignment as such (in your opinion) and being against their lynch. Disregarding this out the window, you have me come in and see someone "clear" a player as town. From my shoes (which you haven't bothered to stand in) to be called scummy for not asking why to a question regarding information on a person's alignment comes off as a trap. Asking Chris why he "cleared" Shock as town opens the discussion to how he obtained that info (assuming he isn't lying about it). Thus why I state it's a trap to accuse me of fishing (which you guys apparently have two definitions for too -- role fishing and motivation/read fishing which I consider to be general discussion).
3.
You are correct when you say you aren't obligated to give a why. But if you don't then players are free to ask why. It's not fishing and anyone who is super worried about that is operating at a very low play level.
Not obligated to ask why you mean. As for players being free to ask why, I assume you mean to me not asking why and instead mentioning fishing. Pretty sure we talked about that a lot. Are you asking again? Also, I suppose I'm operating at a very low play level while you are being purposefully ignorant to the details of the situation. I'll forgive you for being purposefully ignorant if you forgive me for operating at a very low play level.
4.
That was my point. It seems like you are almost offended that someone suggested no lynch. And if you don't think it sounds that way feel free to clarify it. i'm trying to let you see where i'm coming from as clearly as possible.
Is that a problem for you that I am offended/disgusted/repulsed by his voting no lynch?
5.
It does seem like a bad idea and I've already brought it up with Crystal. Read through the thread.
Not sure who Crystal is at this time, but as far as it being a bad idea, I think it is a good idea. Honestly I'm surprised, given how forthcoming I've been about no lynching, that you're -- confused? -- about my stance on it.
6.
The above bolded is faulty logic, not an opinion. Not listing a reason doesn't equal random. Not in any universe. Hence, several people questioning your understanding of the word random. They aren't trying to pick on you, on the contrary, they are trying to rationalize how someone could think such a thing. As a rule, you should never assume someone's actions are random. You should ALWAYS be trying to glean motivation from actions. This is not an opinion.
I'm not sure what universe you're from, but where I'm from if it's not stated, then it doesn't exist. Simply put, with it being near the beginning of the game and no reason having been given, it is perfectly acceptable for me to assume Chris did what he did at random. There is no faulty logic in there as I gave clear reason how I came to my conclusion about it. Now, if you're going to sit there and tell me that something not being said makes it the case, then we're going to have problems.
As for random, would you prefer pseudo-random? Either way, it's random enough in my eyes, and them taking offense to it doesn't concern me. Oh oh, even better. Maybe, since Chris didn't say anything about it, he randomly thought up a number (though I doubt he'd randomly think up a number) and somehow correlated that number to Shock to give his clear. It wasn't stated so that must be the case.
7.
This is the last time I'll labor this [blah blah blah]...
Refer to 6 (the one above this one).
8. Does it look like I'm crafting my posts to not sound scummy or that I'm avoiding questions? All it seems to me is that you're hammering on a point that you didn't fairly evaluate from my perspective.
Mindreaver's #89 is mindboggling. It looks so much like coaching that it can't possibly be.
Nevertheless, it's terrible though. Absolutely noncommital, and it's first sentence is, again, BusyStuff. You're lucky that I don't have a bullet else I'd have vigged you on the spot after that.
More people should be voting for MR, like, seriously. And if he's scum, Fable is 99% scum with him.
Can you reconcile these? Fable is likely town, but I should be killed because I coached likely town, and then in the case where I flip scum fable is then scum? Sounds convoluted at best. Unless your point is just that people that coach each other are aligned... but derp derp, we know that.
Mindreaver's #51 seems BusyStuff(tm). The last sentence makes no sense to me from a town PoV.
The last sentence where I said I was leaning town on KoD? I explained why in one of the other posts of mine you hated (the no lynching one, where his response was completely what I would have expected from town), and the most recent wall of text reinforced my opinion. Kindly explain why town identifying other town isn't from a town PoV?
Also, why are you buddying JD in every post? He's totes scum dude, it's just a matter of time until he slips. But you already knew that. Vote Kosakosa
It was Spot the Cat, and the role has also been a tracker, watcher, and a bunch of other things, apparently.
Did not know that. With that being the case could Cy be doing an aggressive fakeclaim? What I mean is if Cy knew spot was a role used in other games and was convinced that it wasn't in this game could she be using it as a cover?
And no, we're not talking past each other. I'm aware of how you're viewing what I'm saying. I just don't think you're giving how I'm looking at it its just deserts. You're focused on me calling him scum for calling me scum while not taking it upon himself to say his reasons at the start. I said you're wrong on this because it seems to me you're ignoring looking at it from my shoes.
Right because you're so good at considering other people's perspectives.
Also everyone has figured it out already it seems but I'm pretty confident this is town KoD.
And actually now that I see TS posts right next to KoD posts he looks more town too. Is it possible TS and KoD are related? Because I feel like I'm seeing double.
As far as Mindreaver goes I've seen too many "coaching" attempts from townies to consider that a scum tell. Also I thought #51 was rather amusing since by all accounts since I don't consider MR wrong. While I was trying to "help" it doesn't actually progress the game in any meaningful way though asking me to just tell KoD's alignment like I should just automatically know after a page or two was a little unfair.
I'm starting to get worried because I'm not getting too many scum vibes from the active players with the exception of Cy if I'm right about her. Lurker scum team?
@KingofDominaria and @Kosakosa I presume you have not examined my other meta before, so here's some towngames where I shamelessly bandwagon. It's just as common as GJ voting no lynch and TS calling Misrep.
Oh yeah, sex joke. Something something Fable get over here and **** me or something, I'm way too tired.
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Well KOD doesn't seem like he's going to be much help to us if he is town. But I gave him a chance. I don't get how he says he hates the idea of a no vote and then when I agree that it's a bad idea he then says it's a good idea
I guess fable was right about a couple of those rules. I don't usually interact much with people that think they are right about everything, especially if those people are overly worried about someone thinking they are fishing. Moving along...
UNVOTE
@crystal-How would you characterize the interactions between fable and KoD?
If you think you're too tired now just you wait. See I can make sex jokes too. I mean not good ones but I can make them.
@TS
Told you and everyone thought I was just trying to be a dick. I mean I was but I also wasn't lying.
Ok, let's try to move it into a constructive territory. As you've played with KOD before what are his known scum tells? Anyone who's played with him can answer that.
Scum KoD is on a high horse and is a bit calmer than town KoD. He won't feel the need to explain his actions and will just dismiss arguments against him in many MANY words. I mean town or scum you'll still get walls of text from him because he just likes to talk that much. Scum KoD will also try to convince people he's right about people he feels are scum rather than attacking the person he's after and assuming people will follow him.
Okay. So I'm not going to post by post lime a lot of people are seeming to do. As my regulars know most of my posting lately has been phone posting and doing that is a hassle. I've let people run their course a bit so I'm going to give my initial reads here and then continue with my guerilla style posting.
KoD - KoD is being a blend of his usual argumentative self and what I can only label as playing dumb. Typically he's a logic driven player who can't admit he was wrong. Half of this can be seen by the random argument and that would be the can't admit he was wrong part. Assuming unstated reasons simply do not exist and people are randomly moving through the game is about as far from logical as one can get, hence the playing dumb part. If I had to guess he chose the opposite path that I did in this alien environment of splashing around, making waves, and trying to read the displacement. This is a manner similar to how I see Fable act in games, which is where I'd probably attribute people comparing the two. Null lean for now, based on prior experience with both townKoD and scumKoD.
Chris - Still don't agree with the town clear on Shock, especially given that it's coming out that his actions are more role related than behavioral, but I understand the theory Chris was using. Same goes for his interactions with KoD. I don't necessarily agree with the conclusions, but I understand his reasons and where he's coming from. Currently leaning town.
Cyth - I find the cat persona a bit difficult to get a handle on. But I'm starting to pattern the nuances. Having used roles that essentially blocked players from talking before without actually being silent roles, I can understand the difficulty in having to convey yourself without words. Currently a null lean.
TS - I kinda don't like this guy's holy-er than thou posting mentality with all his talk of player level and what have you. Given Chris made a similar comment about hardware though, I take it you guys put a lot of stock in your track records. Personally I find that dumb, but I am a Johnny not a Spike. Null lean.
Fable - I don't have much experience with this guy. Only one completed game shared so far. As I said under KoD, he seemed to be trying to read the displacement as well, but unlike KoD he simmered down when he started taking heat. I don't like that. Slight scum lean.
Shock - As I understand it Shock is more of a regular here. Or was? I'd consider him a P/T player in NGA and I've said more than once over there that I just read him as scum like all the time. This game isn't an exception with his relative flying under the radarness. Slight scum read. I will caveat that if he is a little more prominent here and people (read as a majority) seem to town read him I'll probably attribute this read to bias since I've literally scum read him in every single game we've played together.
Kosa - I like Kosa's analysis so far. Not necessarily all the conclusions but the general nature of the actions. A question here, unrelated to reads, when you say BusyStuff that's essentially saying a post ja fluff/filler ja? Slight town read.
Necar - I'm not sure if he's trying to push some buttons or is just generally misreading situations. He's being thrown down as bandwagon Inga because of his vote on fable, but in the same post he tried to say KoD was using an LaL stand. So I'm currently leaning g to the latter? Anybody with more experience got some insight on if he does this on the regular?
Nobody else has really stood out for me as a prominent player yet. Killjoy, wasabi, and JD I recall posting but haven't formed anything on them yet. There are a few others that I'll have to go dig into more because I seriously don't remember posts from (like DoT but given their last post I'm willing to give them some time).
TS - I kinda don't like this guy's holy-er than thou posting mentality with all his talk of player level and what have you. Given Chris made a similar comment about hardware though, I take it you guys put a lot of stock in your track records. Personally I find that dumb, but I am a Johnny not a Spike. Null lean.
If you take a look at the posts I'm making you'll probably agree that I'm coming from a position of solving the game and getting in people's heads. As far as my posting mentality I wouldn't worry about that so much. If you are the type of player that wants everyone to play within a certain parameter you're going to be playing in groups that will have a hard time getting outside the box reads. When you play this game with similar player groups over and over it's very valuable to have players who are trying to hold their teammates to a higher level to win. And by all means questions me if you think I'm misplaying/making a mistake, etc. That's called teamwork.
Necar - I'm not sure if he's trying to push some buttons or is just generally misreading situations. He's being thrown down as bandwagon Inga because of his vote on fable, but in the same post he tried to say KoD was using an LaL stand. So I'm currently leaning g to the latter? Anybody with more experience got some insight on if he does this on the regular?
Necarg is a frequent target for early lynch. He is a self-confessed "terrible day one" player. He often finds himself in a very unfavorable position and struggles to stay above water. But he can be insightful at times. I think he's improving, but yeah it's really hard to tell if he's scum or just making a mistake as town.
Necarg is a frequent target for early lynch. He is a self-confessed "terrible day one" player. He often finds himself in a very unfavorable position and struggles to stay above water. But he can be insightful at times. I think he's improving, but yeah it's really hard to tell if he's scum or just making a mistake as town.
Um excuse you I'm just making mistakes regardless of alignment.
And yes, I'm almost always either lynched day one or endgame, regardless of alignment.
I'm just going to Unvote: Fable07 while I take a nap.... with TS, if you know what I mean *wink*
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Yeah let's not use that.
Come on do I really need to spell that out?
It classic buddying.
I jokingly say Sir Chris is cleared to mess with KOD and to go on a deep sea halibut expedition.
Then Silver was just like yeah I agree with that. For no good reason. Like Chris had posted 4 posts none of which really had any merit, hen he attacks KOD, and his reasoning is weak at best and it read to me the main reason he was going after KOD was because KOD looked like an Easy target and because he attacked Chris.
The play just reeks of inside information which makes me believe that Chris is town and that Silver is scum with info on who is town.
Oh bonus points for lynching Silver I can use SC again as an abbreviation to refer to Chris, this alone is worth it.
SC is usually Sir Chris, he was here first.
I've been Silver, Crys (Kris/Chris), Silvercrys, Crys (cries), Silvercrys (cries), and Crystal which is new to me.
Call me what you want, I'll figure it out.
(For the record, it's actually from Dragonlance: http://dragonlancenexus.com/lexicon/index.php?title=Crysania_Tarinius)
is this what you're referring to? Because if so Silver is being neutral by saying Chris could also be acting in his scum spectrum as well. Granted this reads like Silver trying to play sides which has it's own problems but I think you might be attributing to much to this post. Everyone is trying to feel each other out right out of the gate so even if Silver was buddying I don't see that as a scum tell.
EBWOP
It's the yankees to my red sox, this guy. The lex luthor to my Superman. The fly in my oatmeal. Coke to my Pepsi. The one, the only, JD.
You were town that game, but misread me so badly, that you speed hammered an innocent man
But I'll let bygones be bygones.
I love that you think me capable of coaching anyone. I literally asked for a mentor this game, and (sad panda) didn't get one. In any case, that post was a little softer than I meant to be. "Knock off the ***** and put your money where your mouth is" wouldn't have come off as coaching, oh well, C'est la vie.
On another topic entirely. Is anyone buying the Necarg posting restriction? I'll admit I'm not the biggest nerd in the thread (most likely), but I also don't remember many alien species who just wanted people "on their dick". Necarg, what's the deal dude?
What the hell do you mean, what's the deal I totally just want people on my dick.
Oh, I get it. You're jelly.
Do you want some lovin' too?
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Also even it was a posting restriction would that mean anything? You can have roles with posting restrictions on both sides can't you?
Just saying
Still working else I'd get a real post going.
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I mean, I thought I was pretty clearly fence sitting, so I have no idea how you got that out of my post, but ok.
Sorry, could you ELI5 please? I'm feeling a little slow today. Which part of my tone, phrasing, or words seem to have implied that I knew Chris was town? Especially when TappingStones took the same exact posts and thought I was being too suspicious of him?
I'm pretty sure you're joking, but that's just about the worst reason to lynch someone I've heard.
Okay, one serious note. I do have a posting restriction. Real Killjoy.
;p
Nice to see you still around here.
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Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Liking Sir Chris so far, even though he sometimes set my Kosa Sense off a bit (for exemple on #12. Don't think it's anything tangible, just cinic gut feel).
Oh and:
20 posts in and we're already up with meta self-consciousness? I missed this subforum so much
---
Disliking KoD. Didn't like the voteless "Major" FoS at all, nor the forced (#6) and/or half-assed ways of expressing suspicion (#8 and #15). The latter might just be a lighthearted way to be funny/have fun, I don't know the guy, but it didnt jive well on me.
#24 on the other hand confuses me. I can't see scum OMGUS'ing like that so early in the game. Reads as VI (no offense intended). Don't know what's happening here.
KoD. I noticed you tend to explain yourself a lot. Why didn't you comment on my post over your FoS at #65?
Shock's #20 is terrible. If he's scum, Chris and Kod are almost certainly townslapping each other.
Based on?
And how much do you know Sir Chris' town meta to reach that conclusion in a handful of posts?
---
I disagree with jd's #33, but like him for pointing it out.
TappingStones seems fine.
Mindreaver's #51 seems BusyStuff(tm). The last sentence makes no sense to me from a town PoV.
Vote Mindreaver
Cythare, when will you start playing the game? Is there a reason as to why you are pseudo-mimicking KoD?
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Also I find it interesting you are voting mindreaver for a post I really liked. I thought it was quite the opposite of busy stuff, it was quite cutting.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
It would help if I had read that first post correctly the first time instead of just cutting out part of the information in my head and making conclusions based upon that.
I need to go rethink this now.
Unvote
No.
@Sauce:
Incorrect. It is inherently scummy for Chris to throw suspicion back on me while citing I could have asked why only for him to later give his reasoning anyway. Also, you are wrong yet again. Chris was never asked to provide his reasoning by anyway. He willingly gave it out without being asked in his post where he talked about the fishing accusation. Other than that, my reasoning for not asking why is acceptable. Matter of fact, why wasn't even a factor. As the situation stood, Chris cleared Shock without stating a reason. To me, that comes off as random since no reason was given, thus my accusation. I'm not obligated to ask "why" he is town clearing the person since no reason was readily given initially. If you dislike this/disagree with it, that's really not my concern since I have no problem with my train of thought on the matter as it developed.
As for your vote, you can let it stand for as long as you like.
@Stones:
It's not sarcastic. In case that wasn't clear. I'm sorry you're not a fan of it though. Perhaps we'll grow fond of each other given time. Do you like my use of words to describe? Apparently it made an impression of you. Also, so what if it was that person's first post? I feel strongly about no lynches, and I stated how I felt. Seems straight forward to me. Doesn't it seem straight forward to you? Is that a bad thing? If it is, I'm sure we'll get past it. If not, oh well. As for the WHY, I refer you to my response to Sauce up above. And what do you mean by guilty for not asking why when I was in an "obvious" position to do so? I mean if that's how you would of posted, that's fine and dandy, but I'm posting how I see fit. As I indicated, there's no reason for me to ask why since it was readily obvious to me that he had no reason due to his lack of having posted one initially. You can fault me for that as much as you like, but if you're thinking I'm going to nod my head that you're right, then you'll be waiting a while.
And no, you're wrong. The use of the word random was correct since no reason was given by Chris initially. Now, we can argue this all day, but at the end of the day you'll be wrong no matter what. With nothing stated, I am right to assume it was randomly done. Plus, there's no rule that says I have to ask why when it was apparent that it was randomly done as far as I was concerned.
What do I care if someone accuses me of fishing? Why wouldn't I care? You seem to think it's ok for someone to ask why did you clear this person. As far as I'm concerned, that is grounds for fishing for a person's role or information concerning their role. Asking that is an easy way to get setup to be accused as such. Whether you agree with that or not hardly matters as that is how I perceive it.
Also also, it's harder for mafia to continuously convey they are town as they have to keep track of what they are saying so they don't trip over their own words. So just because mafia strive to do the same thing town does doesn't mean town should stop striving to do their job.
@wasabi:
I'm full of surprises. Also, it shouldn't "come off" as mudsling to you. It flat out is mudsling since I am throwing suspicion on him for clearing the guy (Shock?) randomly at the time. Now if you want to make the argument that one post is enough to town read a person and invalidate my randomly accusation, that's your right, but you'll have to excuse me for ignoring it. As for being hard to read me, I'll grow on you. You just read me however you want, and make your arguments based on whatever you're thinking about me.
Anyway, disregard Fable's stuff about me. I made a huge impression on him. Or her.
@Mind: Rescue. I'd call it sarcasm.
Hi Yomako.
@Mind again:
Pretty much what you said. That's why I said disregard Fable's rules. Also, Fable doesn't know my meta. Your best bet is to just judge me on my content. I mean if you ***want*** to bring style into it (which Kill seems to be interested in with his request to see a game I've played in), you can do that, but I'd hardly say you'll be an expert at reading my style with little interaction with me. But that's just me.
@Fable:
Defensive how? By accusing me of stuff and watching me argue over it? Also, if you like screwing with me, why wouldn't you want people to get into 20 pages of discussion with me? It'll certainly generate content/stances to look at as opposed to not having stuff to read.
@Silver:
I mean, I can point out how odd it is to read this given what occurred, but I would hope you can see the irony in saying this. So we're talking about clearing someone. You say it's only a scum tell when trying to out a power role or something (and add that that's not always the case even though there's no guidelines to provide why). So tell me, should I laugh at this since asking why someone was cleared as town constitutes power role fishing essentially? Or are you going to say that isn't the case wrt to my case (and go on to cite the rule/guideline that exempts my case)? I'd like to know since it is interesting.
Did he? That's odd of him to think that. What gave him the impression that I thought he was a cop at all? The fact that I said he would accuse me of fishing for asking why even though that was tied strictly to asking why?
So, like, I took great care to mention several times why I was voting him. Apparently doing so didn't matter since you managed to get it wrong as to why I am voting him. That or you're intentionally misrepresenting me.
I aware you scum points.
*Stares at Cythare.*
@Mind: I'm against no lynching on principle. As for what you guys are used to (posting styles, certain types of things happening, etc) I'll mostly be ignoring. Strictly because I don't know any of you so I'll judge you based on the content I see in your posts. Standards and the such that I am not privy to are useless to me. That being said, Silver's no lynch post doesn't strike me one way or the other in and of itself. Quite frankly, given how long it took for you guys to fill this game, I could see the post from a town perspective as a way to generate activity potentially. Likewise, I can see the scum motivation you're painting.
Although, I will say it is funny I had Silver grilling me over how my post is perceived only for the same thing to be leveled back at him. I do love the smell of hypocrisy in the air.
Also, fun thought: It seems to me all this "clearing" you guys do is your way of doing something D1. It's on part with junk posting I've seen since it looks to have no actual, important basis. Which is fine if that's what you guys are into.
Also, after having read what Fable listed, I'm awarding scum points to Fable for how he read me. I'm not going to explain it any further beyond this until later when I feel like it.
Hi Goose.
Looks like you guys are taking the no lynch vote to heart. In my mind it looks like Mind vs Silver since Mind (by my count) is calling Silver out on it. Now if I'm following the exchange properly, Silver thinks it is odd Stones took the no lynch vote seriously. It may be just me, but given all the talk about "not caring how your posts come across", isn't Stones caring about how his post came off when -- justifying? describing? -- it to Silver? Because that's what it looks like. It's hard for me to say whether or not anyone is scummy or townie wrt to this (especially since the no lynch post doesn't rub me either way), but seeing how they interact with one another (as far as who is siding where if at all) is helpful.
I have to disagree with you Fable wrt to Stones's post. Near as far as I can tell from reading it, he's not "giving a pass" to "good" players more so than anyone else. He's saying Silver shouldn't be "heavily focused" on a good player more so than anyone else, otherwise it'll lead to reading in between the lines for scum tells. Also, more scum points to you for trying to link the clearly separate ideas in his post and describing it as cover for taking the bait.
@Kosak: idk Kosak, is it?
@Half_Time: Cannonball. Also, I disagree with you disagreeing.
@Chris:
From my perspective, there was no need for me to ask for an explanation since it was readily apparent what you were doing was at random. Describing it the way you are is nothing more than shoving words down my throat while ignoring how the posts transpired in the first place (scum points). As far as I'm concerned, it's too early to try and game solve without anything to go off of be it a death or reveal of information that has backing to it. You "clearing" someone constitutes neither of those. I say "clearing" because your reason for doing so has no actual bearing on the game.
Also, I wouldn't have to "pile on" with my words if you guys read it right the first time, but that can't be helped. I will make sure to reiterate a point which I feel you're misrepresenting so no worries there.
Also, if the best that can be managed is two votes on me, I won't need your help. Bring your considerable skills to bear once I'm L-1, then we'll see how effective you are.
Also also, what you consider a problem with words is just a problem with opinions. Everyone has one, and it sucks.
Oh cool, Cythare is sheeping Chris. Scum points awarded.
@Fable: You're not helping. By that I mean, and I echo -- Mind I think it was?, you're not providing any actual reads on me. You're, more or less, saying I'm annoying.
@Stones: Oh Fable is definitely the pot calling the kettle black. The jabs at me are w/e since I don't care about that stuff. I can't say for sure that he stated that post with malicious intent (scum intent or w/e you want to call it). Beyond that though, I'm trusting my scum points I awarded to him earlir wrt to his reads post/thoughts on what has happened thus far.
@Necar:
Yeah, no. I'm definitely not utilizing LAL wrt to Chris. You're like the fourth person to completely ignore my stated reason for voting Chris. Anyway, you're wrong here.
Also, as I stated earlier in this post, I made a huge impression on Fable.
Hm. Well then, Fable is town. Disregard all scum points and thoughts of Fable being scum I have stated thus far. Necar is likely scum at this point to me.
Normally, the third vote on a wagon is the Jeep tell, but Stones is the third vote with a justified vote (given the exchange with Fable) as far as I am concerned. Necar's vote, though, reeks of scummyness based on what he's focused on. Yeah, skinning a cat is a "serious" threat. Totally. Also, I know when someone is salty. Fable isn't salty atm. His desire to help is entirely genuine since, as he noted, he didn't want to see 20 pages of arguing with him. Yes, his "rules" don't help give a standard to read me on, but that's not the point. Instead I see Necar jumping onto Fable's wagon and "piling on" reasons to "reinforce" his vote.
Unvote, Vote Necarg
I've still got my eye on you Chris.
@Fable: Carefree like claiming scum while your teammates tell you that's a bad idea. Am I right? You're definitely more carefree, and I'm definitely more serious.
From Fable
HaHaHaHa!
@DV:
That's what I thought, but apparently there is a double standard being applied to me wrt to that whole conversation. Apparently, it's towny of Chris to not state his reasoning initially while it us untowny of me to not ask why as opposed to assuming (due to lack of any stated reasoning) that what he did was random. Or, if this is in regards to not knowing me, then yes. Assuming it is in the context of this game. If you want to do research on me, feel free to do so without me indulging you since that's not my responsibility. If it's something else you're getting at with this, then I don't know.
From KoD
I love you too. I think.
Anyway, in case it isn't clear, that is the reason for the vote. The focus is on the fact that rather than respond how he did in his later post (not his initial) to someone he doesn't know, he decided to throw suspicion right back at me.
If that was already clear to you, then I miss the jab as I don't see how it connects to what I stated. Perhaps you could walk me through it.
Anyway, you think Silver is pocketing Chris? Or sheeping. Or whatever you call it.
@Fable: By reading its reactions. Also, we're totally not alike. You worry too much about people liking you.
Annnnnnnd caught up now.
Good vibes from Half_Time for no particular reason.
Sir Chris' #70 has two minor language tells against him, which is odd since he's an enough experienced player to not incur on that. Food for thought, though.
Liking TappingStones so far except for the Fable vote, which is bad. Still town though.
Fable's posting style reminds me of DRey. Which means he's probably town.
Necarg's reasoning for voting Fable in #85 is the worst of the bunch and textbook bandwagoning. Consider my vote on you as well.
...
Mindreaver's #89 is mindboggling. It looks so much like coaching that it can't possibly be.
Nevertheless, it's terrible though. Absolutely noncommital, and it's first sentence is, again, BusyStuff. You're lucky that I don't have a bullet else I'd have vigged you on the spot after that.
More people should be voting for MR, like, seriously. And if he's scum, Fable is 99% scum with him.
...
D_V, reasoning for your vote on Silver?
jd why no vote though? Vote him. Do it.
Ok, wait. #106 > Mindreaver, are you inexperienced with Mafia?
I'll talk about my reasoning after he adresses my points.
Sigh. Ok, I guess.
I assure you, I'm not being light hearted or funny.
No idea so I can't take offense to what you're saying. Nor would I care to actually take offense anyway.
I do like to talk. As for what you're referencing, if I didn't comment on it, it probably wasn't important enough to me for me to comment on. If this is about you disliking my FoS at Chris, then oh well. You dislike it. Or is this about me not voting the FoS? I view voting as being higher than FoSing. If I was going to vote a FoS, I wouldn't bother FoSing in the first place.
I took a moment to go look at the post you referenced (65 right?). I believe I can answer why I never responded to it for you Kosa. It was probably because I never actually responded to it or any other post since my last post (until my most recent post in the last five mins). Hope that answers your question.
@Goose:
Perhaps Cythare is a cat that has to post like how a cat would act (or as a means to communicate her stances).
Don't know how I feel about Shockwave. I think he just thought the SC/KOD thing was funny.
@Kosa:
TS/Fable seemed like town on town to me. What do you think?
@Col_Mongoose:
In a couple of the older Trek games one of the roles was a cat that was immune to the Borg cult. The name escapes me, but I assume that role has made a reappearance.
There was only a Borg cult in one of them, though.
I'll probably go rooting around the sign-up thread in a minute to dig the name up.
Yeaaaaaaaah that's town.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Obviously, there are no hard-and-fast rules in Mafia, and as soon as you come up with some the scum learn to fake them. But generally the above is true.
Yes, because here (as in, on MTGS) "fishing" is usually a scum tell when the fisher is role fishing, because as I said a large part of being Town is figuring out other people's alignments. Asking for reasoning behind a vote or town read isn't a scum tell for "fishing," so when you said you didn't want to be called out for fishing he assumed you thought he was implying a power role.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm not misrepping you (gee, you really are like TS). You're essentially saying that he is scum because he didn't ask you why... when he was scum reading you, because you didn't ask him why. Am I wrong?
Ok.
I was surprised because one of the regulars here (Gentleman Johnny) is well known for voting No Lynch during RVS and TappingStones has played with him at least a bit, if that helps you follow the exchange better.
Was there ever any doubt really?
Didn't I answer this and then unvote anyways?
Are you reading the game brobeans?
Shock knows how I play like Fable does. My assessment is he made that because he was ready to be entertained.
We're talking about his first post that came between Chris and I, right?
Specifically, I don't think Shock's alignment indicates yours or Chris's and I don't think it's a scummy post. It's just sort of a... do nothing feel-good post to me. Scum make those posts, yes, but so does town.
Now, if we get ten pages in and the majority of his posts are like that, it might be worth scrutinizing because he could be skating.
I like you more anyway after your vote on Necarg.
@Silver: see #122.
@D_V: I haven't refreshed the page when I started my second post, so your answer wasn't there.
Ok. I can wait.
Unvote
No no no. First, your general case that you're trying to apply to me, by your words, deals with votes and reads. Unless you are using reads interchangeably with clears/clearing, your general case doesn't apply to me. Second, that's what I would be doing by asking why, is it not? That's rhetorical since I know your stance is that it isn't. I'll explain though. Chris starts off by flat out clearing Shock. He mentions, prior to clearing, how people dislike(?) it and that it is mystifying. He offers nothing else. I'm faced with two options (though the obvious one for me given that he never gave any reasoning is that he is being random). Asking why is the other option. Asking why he "cleared" (I put this in quotations in case you're focused on using clear and read interchangeably) opens the door to role information potentially. Now if you're going to assert to me that clearing someone is the same as reading them, then ok. It would fall into your general case then. However, if you're not going to assert that clearing is the same as reading, then we're back to my perspective that it is fishing (read: role fishing).
Now your perspective aside, Chris responding to me by pointing out that I didn't ask why reeks of a setup/trap. You'll have to excuse me if I disregard your perspective since you finding it odd and (in your opinion) that I wouldn't be accused of fishing is unknown to me. Opinions aside, I'm not familiar with how you view what is or isn't fishing (even if I find your reasoning flawed anyway with differentiating between what counts as role fishing and general discussion).
Generally speaking, Chris clearing someone as town and me asking why would constitute role fishing as far as I am concerned. The only way that isn't the case is if you are talking about reading the player when you say clearing/cleared/etc.
And yes, you are wrong. He's scummy for throwing suspicion on me, then going on to give his reasoning without being asked. A lot of this back and forth could have been avoided (along with the fishing accusation that I brought up) had he led with what wasn't important in not saying (why he cleared Shock). He got a cheap shot in by saying I'm scummy for not asking, then giving his reasoning anyway. In no way was he being consistent.
Chris
I say he's being random. He says I should have asked why, and that I'm scummy. I say I would be accused of fishing had I asked why. He responds, in part, with the above. He then goes on to freely give the information without having been asked (in the same post) while contradicting his "townie's job is not to be transparent". He definitely accomplished words being discussed, but as I said, not before he got a cheap shot in.
That's why he's scummy to me.
@DV: Yes, there is doubt. At least until Chris decided to start leaning town on me before claiming, after my post, that "that's town." I'm viewing it as a pocket on his end.
Essentially, town clearing (here, again, and I know your meta is probably different) isn't necessarily role-related and doesn't mean "this person is mod-confirmed town to me." Usually it just means "I have a strong town read on that player and would not support a lynch without a lot of evidence." Besides which, there's also the possibility that he was just doing it to get reactions and he wasn't actually town reading him at all.
And no, we're not talking past each other. I'm aware of how you're viewing what I'm saying. I just don't think you're giving how I'm looking at it its just deserts. You're focused on me calling him scum for calling me scum while not taking it upon himself to say his reasons at the start. I said you're wrong on this because it seems to me you're ignoring looking at it from my shoes.
Hopefully, this will clear things up. The reason some people are having difficulty with you is partially related to the bolded wording. It's not rational to assume people's actions have random motivation. It's a not a very logical way to frame your thinking. Do you really assume people make decisions in this game with no motivation? I assure you there aren't any coin flips going on in front of the other players computers and there are likely no players saying "I'm gonna vote for player X without reasoning. Do you do that?
You are correct when you say you aren't obligated to give a why. But if you don't then players are free to ask why. It's not fishing and anyone who is super worried about that is operating at a very low play level. No strong player is going to sit back and let players say things without finding out their reasoning. Your worry about someone claiming role-fishing there is bizarre because it would only imply the existence of a day cop, which I've never seen in a game yet. So, again it's one of those "level one" Mafia fears. it doesn't add up when you think through the consequences.
That was my point. It seems like you are almost offended that someone suggested no lynch. And if you don't think it sounds that way feel free to clarify it. i'm trying to let you see where i'm coming from as clearly as possible.
It does seem like a bad idea and I've already brought it up with Crystal. Read through the thread.
The above bolded is faulty logic, not an opinion. Not listing a reason doesn't equal random. Not in any universe. Hence, several people questioning your understanding of the word random. They aren't trying to pick on you, on the contrary, they are trying to rationalize how someone could think such a thing. As a rule, you should never assume someone's actions are random. You should ALWAYS be trying to glean motivation from actions. This is not an opinion.
This is the last time I'll labor this point. I like to give everyone a chance to get on the same page. It might be helpful for others to read this too. Random does not equal to no reason given. This is a hole in your game you can start working on immediately. Go back and think about the possible motivations for SC's blind townclearance. Notice I already questioned the motivation by considering he might be gunshy because he's been under fire early in quite a few games lately. I was likely wrong because being cheeky fits better but I was thinking of motivations.
I guess this comes down to your strength as a player. I just ask what I want to ask and have no worries about someone giving the "fishing" allegation. Maybe that's because I consider those fishing accusations to be poor Mafia play that I see from weaker players? I'll think about that a bit though. Very likely comes down to town shouldn't be spending a ton of time crafting their posts to sound towny, or avoiding questions in fear of looking scummy. Just scum hunt. That last part is theory and I could understand if you disagree with it. It's not nearly as unassailable as my comments on the weird usage onf "random".
This part is pretty good.
1. Concerning confusion with the bold: That's a matter of opinion. Given that this is D1 and what as posted occurred literally near the very start of the game, it stands to reason that there is no logical reason for clearing someone as town. Thus, no reason being stated logically leads me to it being motivated at random. Indeed, with it being confirmed as an opinion (an opinion on one post at the start of the game no less) (plus, as my discourse with Silver has revealed, clearing is essentially how you guys read people) it is more or less "random" on some level. At this point though we're going to argue in circles over it. That being said, asking me that question is ignorant. It's D1. It's more likely things will be done at random today as opposed to any other day in a game of Mafia. To answer your question though, yes. I do believe people make decisions in this game with no reason behind it (on D1 though it's not impossible for it to happen on other days). A better question to ask me if do I think Chris cleared Shock randomly to which I'll say yes given my perspective on the matter.
2. Concerning fishing: I'm going to assume you never bothered to read the posts that addressed this. You call it bizarre. That's fine. I say it isn't bizarre. My assertion is based on the fact that saying you "cleared" a player as town more or less implies knowledge of their alignment. As was noted by Silver to me, you guys use "clearing/cleared" in a variety of ways of which one is meant for reading that person's alignment as such (in your opinion) and being against their lynch. Disregarding this out the window, you have me come in and see someone "clear" a player as town. From my shoes (which you haven't bothered to stand in) to be called scummy for not asking why to a question regarding information on a person's alignment comes off as a trap. Asking Chris why he "cleared" Shock as town opens the discussion to how he obtained that info (assuming he isn't lying about it). Thus why I state it's a trap to accuse me of fishing (which you guys apparently have two definitions for too -- role fishing and motivation/read fishing which I consider to be general discussion).
3.
Not obligated to ask why you mean. As for players being free to ask why, I assume you mean to me not asking why and instead mentioning fishing. Pretty sure we talked about that a lot. Are you asking again? Also, I suppose I'm operating at a very low play level while you are being purposefully ignorant to the details of the situation. I'll forgive you for being purposefully ignorant if you forgive me for operating at a very low play level.
4.
Is that a problem for you that I am offended/disgusted/repulsed by his voting no lynch?
5.
Not sure who Crystal is at this time, but as far as it being a bad idea, I think it is a good idea. Honestly I'm surprised, given how forthcoming I've been about no lynching, that you're -- confused? -- about my stance on it.
6.
I'm not sure what universe you're from, but where I'm from if it's not stated, then it doesn't exist. Simply put, with it being near the beginning of the game and no reason having been given, it is perfectly acceptable for me to assume Chris did what he did at random. There is no faulty logic in there as I gave clear reason how I came to my conclusion about it. Now, if you're going to sit there and tell me that something not being said makes it the case, then we're going to have problems.
As for random, would you prefer pseudo-random? Either way, it's random enough in my eyes, and them taking offense to it doesn't concern me. Oh oh, even better. Maybe, since Chris didn't say anything about it, he randomly thought up a number (though I doubt he'd randomly think up a number) and somehow correlated that number to Shock to give his clear. It wasn't stated so that must be the case.
7.
Refer to 6 (the one above this one).
8. Does it look like I'm crafting my posts to not sound scummy or that I'm avoiding questions? All it seems to me is that you're hammering on a point that you didn't fairly evaluate from my perspective.
This will be my 4th game ever.
Can you reconcile these? Fable is likely town, but I should be killed because I coached likely town, and then in the case where I flip scum fable is then scum? Sounds convoluted at best. Unless your point is just that people that coach each other are aligned... but derp derp, we know that.
The last sentence where I said I was leaning town on KoD? I explained why in one of the other posts of mine you hated (the no lynching one, where his response was completely what I would have expected from town), and the most recent wall of text reinforced my opinion. Kindly explain why town identifying other town isn't from a town PoV?
Also, why are you buddying JD in every post? He's totes scum dude, it's just a matter of time until he slips. But you already knew that. Vote Kosakosa
Did not know that. With that being the case could Cy be doing an aggressive fakeclaim? What I mean is if Cy knew spot was a role used in other games and was convinced that it wasn't in this game could she be using it as a cover?
Right because you're so good at considering other people's perspectives.
Also everyone has figured it out already it seems but I'm pretty confident this is town KoD.
And actually now that I see TS posts right next to KoD posts he looks more town too. Is it possible TS and KoD are related? Because I feel like I'm seeing double.
As far as Mindreaver goes I've seen too many "coaching" attempts from townies to consider that a scum tell. Also I thought #51 was rather amusing since by all accounts since I don't consider MR wrong. While I was trying to "help" it doesn't actually progress the game in any meaningful way though asking me to just tell KoD's alignment like I should just automatically know after a page or two was a little unfair.
I'm starting to get worried because I'm not getting too many scum vibes from the active players with the exception of Cy if I'm right about her. Lurker scum team?
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Where I shamelessly wagon in Battle For Vanillaville
And CCIX (Although note that this is the closest thing I have to a wagon vote, as I repped in so late in that game.)
And Bravely Default ( Iactually find this one funny, as I tried to cover it up rather than not giving a *****, like I do now)
I've got Three here From Ace Attourney, including one that explains my wagoning habits.
Oh yeah, sex joke. Something something Fable get over here and **** me or something, I'm way too tired.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
I guess fable was right about a couple of those rules. I don't usually interact much with people that think they are right about everything, especially if those people are overly worried about someone thinking they are fishing. Moving along...
UNVOTE
@crystal-How would you characterize the interactions between fable and KoD?
If you think you're too tired now just you wait. See I can make sex jokes too. I mean not good ones but I can make them.
@TS
Told you and everyone thought I was just trying to be a dick. I mean I was but I also wasn't lying.
Ok, let's try to move it into a constructive territory. As you've played with KOD before what are his known scum tells? Anyone who's played with him can answer that.
KoD - KoD is being a blend of his usual argumentative self and what I can only label as playing dumb. Typically he's a logic driven player who can't admit he was wrong. Half of this can be seen by the random argument and that would be the can't admit he was wrong part. Assuming unstated reasons simply do not exist and people are randomly moving through the game is about as far from logical as one can get, hence the playing dumb part. If I had to guess he chose the opposite path that I did in this alien environment of splashing around, making waves, and trying to read the displacement. This is a manner similar to how I see Fable act in games, which is where I'd probably attribute people comparing the two. Null lean for now, based on prior experience with both townKoD and scumKoD.
Chris - Still don't agree with the town clear on Shock, especially given that it's coming out that his actions are more role related than behavioral, but I understand the theory Chris was using. Same goes for his interactions with KoD. I don't necessarily agree with the conclusions, but I understand his reasons and where he's coming from. Currently leaning town.
Cyth - I find the cat persona a bit difficult to get a handle on. But I'm starting to pattern the nuances. Having used roles that essentially blocked players from talking before without actually being silent roles, I can understand the difficulty in having to convey yourself without words. Currently a null lean.
TS - I kinda don't like this guy's holy-er than thou posting mentality with all his talk of player level and what have you. Given Chris made a similar comment about hardware though, I take it you guys put a lot of stock in your track records. Personally I find that dumb, but I am a Johnny not a Spike. Null lean.
Fable - I don't have much experience with this guy. Only one completed game shared so far. As I said under KoD, he seemed to be trying to read the displacement as well, but unlike KoD he simmered down when he started taking heat. I don't like that. Slight scum lean.
Shock - As I understand it Shock is more of a regular here. Or was? I'd consider him a P/T player in NGA and I've said more than once over there that I just read him as scum like all the time. This game isn't an exception with his relative flying under the radarness. Slight scum read. I will caveat that if he is a little more prominent here and people (read as a majority) seem to town read him I'll probably attribute this read to bias since I've literally scum read him in every single game we've played together.
Kosa - I like Kosa's analysis so far. Not necessarily all the conclusions but the general nature of the actions. A question here, unrelated to reads, when you say BusyStuff that's essentially saying a post ja fluff/filler ja? Slight town read.
Necar - I'm not sure if he's trying to push some buttons or is just generally misreading situations. He's being thrown down as bandwagon Inga because of his vote on fable, but in the same post he tried to say KoD was using an LaL stand. So I'm currently leaning g to the latter? Anybody with more experience got some insight on if he does this on the regular?
Nobody else has really stood out for me as a prominent player yet. Killjoy, wasabi, and JD I recall posting but haven't formed anything on them yet. There are a few others that I'll have to go dig into more because I seriously don't remember posts from (like DoT but given their last post I'm willing to give them some time).
If you take a look at the posts I'm making you'll probably agree that I'm coming from a position of solving the game and getting in people's heads. As far as my posting mentality I wouldn't worry about that so much. If you are the type of player that wants everyone to play within a certain parameter you're going to be playing in groups that will have a hard time getting outside the box reads. When you play this game with similar player groups over and over it's very valuable to have players who are trying to hold their teammates to a higher level to win. And by all means questions me if you think I'm misplaying/making a mistake, etc. That's called teamwork.
Necarg is a frequent target for early lynch. He is a self-confessed "terrible day one" player. He often finds himself in a very unfavorable position and struggles to stay above water. But he can be insightful at times. I think he's improving, but yeah it's really hard to tell if he's scum or just making a mistake as town.
Um excuse you I'm just making mistakes regardless of alignment.
And yes, I'm almost always either lynched day one or endgame, regardless of alignment.
I'm just going to Unvote: Fable07 while I take a nap.... with TS, if you know what I mean *wink*
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True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated