Just checked the rules and rule 3. Votes must be in BOLD or they will not be counted. Unvoting is not required, but is appreciated. ---- I'm confused by the last past, we can all vote multiple times or maybe it's talking about bolding for unvoting? Basically wtf with that wording but vote TappingStones to test. I think it's intended that the mods didn't post the wagon because someone has an ability for it.
This just means that if you change your vote, an intervening unvote isn't required.
Quote from thing 1 »
Vote Person A
Unvote
Vote Person B
is functionally equivalent to
Quote from thing 2 »
Vote Person A
Vote Person B
.
@Kosa: Prods will be handled after i'm off work tonight.
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The point is to PoE them since the wagon is almost entirely town. You check the wagon and then use behavior to narrow it down.
I don't personally think they're scum. Kosa admitted he was Borg, but I bet he's 7 of 9 or something. I've been leaning town on him virtually all game and I don't think we need him to claim any further than he has already. If a sizeable portion of player want him dead for being Borg, we should probably lynch him now and have done with it before he gets to MyLo and loses us the game because of it.
Half_Time is a mindset read for me, but I'll go back through your case and his iso to see if that changes things. I admit I can't quite remember specifically why I'm leaning town on him and I should probably reread to check.
If you want to look at them (as well as KoD, whose vote was also dangling on DoTA), feel free. Personally, I'll be concentrating on the smaller list and leaving my vote on Necarg (after I check Killjoy for TS and HT for you).
I'm less concerned about Kosa. He had an interesting D1, but the timing of his borg claim was definitely pro-town, as he was in no danger of being caught. I'm concerned about why he targeted cythere. I'd like a better explanation than I've been given, even if it's sufficiently vague to avoid outing his ability.
On Half-Time, do an ISO for the game. I think it speaks for itself. But ask yourself afterwards, what has he done? What are his reads? And more specifically, what has he done to figure those reads out. He says "top scum reads, in no particular order or severity are TS (will get into this after he finishes his recapping), <D_V> (for the reasons I stated yesterday), DotA (for reasons stated yesterday). Tom has pinged me as odd. Subtle little things that I'll continue to watch." He's not advancing these cases. He's made no progress in two days. Look at the topic's he's choosing to engage in instead. This is scum.
Yo Mindreaver don't steal my Thunder I was about to present that on H_T =/.
While I am typing crap up, I have two questions to be answered.
Cynth are you claiming immunity to Conversion from borg?
If yes, why did you not tell us yesterday?
Anyone else want to claim immunity now? This is important and should be claimed. I'll explain later.
* Cythare jumps up at D_V and claws him in the face. *
So are you immune or not this is important. And I think you know why.
* Cythare rolls her eyes at D_V, noses the cyan ball in front of Kosakosa and the blue ball in front of tomsloger. She then runs back over to the brick wall she constructed earlier and lays down next to it. *
The first votecount for toDay is correct; I ran it twice. I'll do another one tonight after I'm off work.
Sorry, I meant the first votecount overall, meaning Day 1 first votecount Stardate 69966.5 or Post #245.
As the one who did that votecount, can you tell me what seems to be the issue? I know I skipped a few unbolded votes, if that's what you're thinking of.
Based on our own experience with Fable, Half isn't wrong to dismiss what Fable has said. You literally have to make assumptions about what Fable really meant (such as everything up until he decided to claim mafia was true except that he lied about his role so that destroys that assumption). Focusing on what Fable has done only serves to lead us on a potential goose chase. Course I believe the goose chase has already commenced with the focus Half is receiving.
btw TS is lying. He's not Spock. He's Jack, a genetically engineered human just like you Shock.
This is just a snippet of what's in my notes concerning day one. I've got a lot more and would like to share it, but I'm feeling pretty demotivated that I'm being voted and pressured so hard on this. Where are everyone else's detailed reads? I see not a single one.
@Tom-Do you think the attacks on me are reasonable? I'm trying not to let them bother me but with the amount of work I did on this game last night. Slogging through PBPA for multiple players it's sort of tilting me that we have players who have barely posted anything of substance trying to join a speed wagon against me.
ive completely forgotten killjoy, but i have fair confidence ill be able to figure out his mindset after just being scum with him for approximately 4 years.
Ok, I'm pretty convinced that Kosa and H_T are scum. I'll get to it later.
Be careful about with the "get to it later" part, I caught hell for sleeping and going to work. While the rest of the players sat back doing nothing.
No seriously, TS needs to die.
He's not scum because he lied about the name. That doesn't matter. This attitude of "I'm dying because I actually did stuff" is what has to go. It's a giant ball of CFTWR
Hey W_G, you should've put the pieces together with flavoring like that and ATLEAST asked Necarg if this was him that roleblocked you... yaknow so we can hold him to that or if someone has the ability to write their flavor on the block and paint Necarg as shady. So anyway: Necarg- Did you block Wheat_Grinder?
I specifically said I wasn't roleblocked.
KoD and Brinatoo can't be scum together but KoD probably wasn't scum anyway.
Not voting (7): Killjoy, Silvercrys3467, tomsloger, Shockwave07, Half_Time, Fable07, D_V
19 alive, 10 to lynch.
HalfTime vote on DV didn’t go through #323
Tom vote on Silver didn’t go through #428 probably putting it in that weird shade of grey caused the overlook
Now that this'll be clarified, hopefully finalized, we can assess why it was potentially a lynch between 8-9 votes. Also we should probably backtrack and see why some people were certain that the lynch threshold was that close to a lynch.
Also, since that vote rule was clarified, I'll be keeping my vote on TS because I'll take Kosa's word for it for now: I seriously doubt cult but I wouldn't put it past a bad-gambit. Which in that case I'm sure he would be caught in a lie concerning his role so we'll figure out that scenario when we get to it. But in the meantime: KoD vs. TS.
I think it's weird to have a fakeclaim when you are vanilla town. Spock is Vulcan and upon review of what Alcohol is like in the Star Trek Universe. I hate flavor-gaming but I don't mind intertwining it with mechanics/behavior to push an argument. If a vanilla town was given a drunk Spock(and he guesses a future Spock doesn't exist) fakeclaim for NK bait, wouldn't using this claim just be assuming that the mafia are looking for specific names for power- which is imo a bad idea because the past games that have been hosted were fairly random if you narrow it down to individual characters. I read a decent chunk of the first game and Worf is a good example to deter thought processes like this. Hell, Col_Mon was Worf and flipped a vig-of-sorts. I think it would have been reasonable to just ignore the fakeclaim but still try to draw a NK with the stuff that he's claiming on a future Spock. But he didn't and assumed Spock would be a better choice, regardless of his intentions. And even if he was dumb and decided to take this line of play as town, we only lynch a vanilla. So to weigh his behavior/KoD target/claim, I think a potential scum lynch far exceeds a mislynch. I'll get to looking at his behavior and hope someone else will take the time to ISO him, particularly someone that needs more content so we can assess them as well, but if noone gets to it and lurkers still be lurking- I'll eventually get to it.
The first votecount for toDay is correct; I ran it twice. I'll do another one tonight after I'm off work.
Sorry, I meant the first votecount overall, meaning Day 1 first votecount Stardate 69966.5 or Post #245.
As the one who did that votecount, can you tell me what seems to be the issue? I know I skipped a few unbolded votes, if that's what you're thinking of.
Sorry I didn't get to you sooner, was working on looking through it myself and ultimately going through like 3 times to be triply sure. But my post above should lead to what I'm talking about.
Towncircle rn is cyth, wheat, kosa, mind. Prolly KoD but I haven't actually read all his posts.
I miss having rhand and dv in here. Why you gotta dissappear/be all weird (respectively)?
Feeling better about brinatoo for reasons I don't care to explain and probably won't unless he's actually getting lynched.
Ok, so re: the Fable wagon. I wasn't paying attention in a lot of ways, apparently.
In my most recent post, I realized I left my name off the wagon and thought that would make ten. Turns out there were only eight names in the list.
When Fable was getting run up, I just took the last vote count and counted votes after that - I'm sure others did too. I didn't notice that Necarg was already on the wagon when he voted Fable again, so his vote got counted twice accidentally (by me). I can't say for sure whether the lynch was "legal" or not.
Actually at the time I was reading I didn't have two or three posts between mine and wheat's. Then post ninja business. Happened a few times this game, and others as of late.
So yeah, it looks like there were only 9 votes on Fable. Necarg was 3 and 9 lol.
In practical terms, I doubt that matters much. He was self-confessed scum, and (seemingly) hammered himself. I doubt the result would be different if we'd waiting another hour for somebody to come around to vote him.
Unless the mods want to confirm that it was a perfectly valid and legal, and then we just have a double voter of some variety (or it's possible that Fable just had a reduced threshold).
@Mindreaver:
I iso'd Half_Time and went back through your case... but I don't see the same things you do. I mean, he is contributing relatively little in the way of his own reads, but that's not necessarily scummy in a vacuum. I'll quote some of his posts that pinged me as town.
Given that half your points on TS seem to apply to silver instead, fable, he might have a point that you aren't paying close enough attention. At least that's where the witch hunting comments seem to lead to me, as TS was talking about hypothetical witch hunting and silver was the one that said he wasn't witch hunting him in the specific. I think both sides of that are being a bit poorly misrepresented as silver was never indicating additional shade be thrown to better players, rather not cutting them extra slack. Kind of opposite sides of the same coin. It seems to me that those involved in this are only looking at one side. Somebody says don't give them a pass. The other side looks at that as throw extra shade on them and vice versa. In reality though playing them straight up means no passes and no extra shade and saying one isn't indicative of the other.
If he's scum, what is this exactly? Defending TS from his scum buddy for the pocket play, only to turn around and be suspicious of him? Distancing from his scum buddy who's under very little pressure?
It reads... well, to be honest, it reads like a reasonable person just asking other people to be reasonable. Not necessarily alignment indicative, I suppose, but it pinged me as town at the time and still reads that way to me.
Fable - I don't have much experience with this guy. Only one completed game shared so far. As I said under KoD, he seemed to be trying to read the displacement as well, but unlike KoD he simmered down when he started taking heat. I don't like that. Slight scum lean.
Kosa - I like Kosa's analysis so far. Not necessarily all the conclusions but the general nature of the actions. A question here, unrelated to reads, when you say BusyStuff that's essentially saying a post ja fluff/filler ja? Slight town read.
Same thing here. Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game? Looking at a Kosa townread when virtually the whole active game besides me was trying to lynch him?
Then he spends the majority of the day pushing D_V as a counter wagon to Kosa. Alone. Is that a scummy thing to do? I don't think so. It seems much more like town thought they caught scum and was hoping to get them lynched. Scum would have tried to let that wagon go once they realized it wasn't going to go the way they wanted. Especially now that, you know, we're pretty sure Kosa is town.
Now Day 2, he's still suspicious of TS and D_V for pushing his town lean Kosa on Day 1. He wants to talk about TS but would prefer to wait until TS finishes his reread posts. And to be honest, I'm in sort of the same spot. Day 1, I was town leaning on TS but with recent events I'm suspicious and I think whatever TS finds in his reread will be illuminating in a variety of ways - to his alignment and the alignments of others. I think it's perfectly reasonable to want to wait.
Overall, I rate Half_Time's iso a solid "lean town" / 10. I think you're reading too much into his recent posts, like TS is reading too much into my very early ones.
I see what I did. I accidentally read "unvote name" as "vote name."
My bad for reporting that vote as standing when it clearly shouldn't have been.
... and since I used that votecount to start the second one, that error carried over into my votecount 1.2. Fable was lynched at L-1.
I do not believe much would have changed had this error been caught given that Fable had claimed scum. I apologize for the error; I'm self-reporting it to the Council and the other site admins for any actions they feel necessary to resolve the situation. I do not feel that stopping the game would make any difference, so things will continue as they are now unless directed by the council or the administration.
The Day 2 votecount that is up now is correct.
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@Pronoun restriction: That's imaginary. It's really my fault for not being clear in the first place and for foolishly not thinking 2 to 10 posts might not pop up in the time I'm writing a post.
----------
On another note, I hate the post search here. Tried Tapping (and since I'm almost always on mobile) can only get results up to right now 17 to 18 hours ago.
The search is paginated; i.e. there are 8 pages of posts in TappingStones' iso currently with the last post on the first page being from 18 hours ago. Can you see the page index? It should look the same as the thread one.
and change the username and page number by hand when you want to look at earlier stuff.
Or you can request the desktop site from your phone's browser options; that should give you the page index but it might be hard to read without zooming in.
... and since I used that votecount to start the second one, that error carried over into my votecount 1.2. Fable was lynched at L-1.
I do not believe much would have changed had this error been caught given that Fable had claimed scum. I apologize for the error; I'm self-reporting it to the Council and the other site admins for any actions they feel necessary to resolve the situation. I do not feel that stopping the game would make any difference, so things will continue as they are now unless directed by the council or the administration.
The Day 2 votecount that is up now is correct.
I can't help but laugh at how perfect your profile picture is given the circumstances Kidding aside, I'll be pretty nittygritty on the votecounts from now on.
More tomorrow but for the sake of confirming Necarg had an extra vote and TS's didn't count to add up to only 9? Mods:Can we get a votecount of Fable's lynch? Couldn't hurt to ask but if [redacted] at least we know it's fishy- if TS's vote didn't count.
@Mindreaver:
I iso'd Half_Time and went back through your case... but I don't see the same things you do. I mean, he is contributing relatively little in the way of his own reads, but that's not necessarily scummy in a vacuum. I'll quote some of his posts that pinged me as town.
Given that half your points on TS seem to apply to silver instead, fable, he might have a point that you aren't paying close enough attention. At least that's where the witch hunting comments seem to lead to me, as TS was talking about hypothetical witch hunting and silver was the one that said he wasn't witch hunting him in the specific. I think both sides of that are being a bit poorly misrepresented as silver was never indicating additional shade be thrown to better players, rather not cutting them extra slack. Kind of opposite sides of the same coin. It seems to me that those involved in this are only looking at one side. Somebody says don't give them a pass. The other side looks at that as throw extra shade on them and vice versa. In reality though playing them straight up means no passes and no extra shade and saying one isn't indicative of the other.
If he's scum, what is this exactly? Defending TS from his scum buddy for the pocket play, only to turn around and be suspicious of him? Distancing from his scum buddy who's under very little pressure?
It reads... well, to be honest, it reads like a reasonable person just asking other people to be reasonable. Not necessarily alignment indicative, I suppose, but it pinged me as town at the time and still reads that way to me.
Scum aren't necessarily unreasonable. But let me flip that question on you. Lets say he's town. What is this post doing? Making sure we all get along? I neither need, nor want, a referee in here, trying to keep everyone calm and get all disagreements swept quietly under the rug. If anything, this is coaching fable to knock it off (possibly because he's bussing TS and it's a sloppy, food for thought).
Fable - I don't have much experience with this guy. Only one completed game shared so far. As I said under KoD, he seemed to be trying to read the displacement as well, but unlike KoD he simmered down when he started taking heat. I don't like that. Slight scum lean.
Kosa - I like Kosa's analysis so far. Not necessarily all the conclusions but the general nature of the actions. A question here, unrelated to reads, when you say BusyStuff that's essentially saying a post ja fluff/filler ja? Slight town read.
Same thing here. Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game? Looking at a Kosa townread when virtually the whole active game besides me was trying to lynch him?
Then he spends the majority of the day pushing D_V as a counter wagon to Kosa. Alone. Is that a scummy thing to do? I don't think so. It seems much more like town thought they caught scum and was hoping to get them lynched. Scum would have tried to let that wagon go once they realized it wasn't going to go the way they wanted. Especially now that, you know, we're pretty sure Kosa is town.
Now Day 2, he's still suspicious of TS and D_V for pushing his town lean Kosa on Day 1. He wants to talk about TS but would prefer to wait until TS finishes his reread posts. And to be honest, I'm in sort of the same spot. Day 1, I was town leaning on TS but with recent events I'm suspicious and I think whatever TS finds in his reread will be illuminating in a variety of ways - to his alignment and the alignments of others. I think it's perfectly reasonable to want to wait.
Overall, I rate Half_Time's iso a solid "lean town" / 10. I think you're reading too much into his recent posts, like TS is reading too much into my very early ones.
"Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game?" Well, honestly "Slight scum lean" is hardly bussing, It's barely anything at all (especially when that whole post, is maybe 6 or 7 "slight" leans one way or the other. Go read it again, everyone who had posted in the game, except me, is slight or null. The post is practically nothing. I can't point to a single solid stance from it). It's the same with his "D_V case". There isn't much there...
@Rhand, I was referring to the OMGUS being weaker if kosa's accusation on TS ended up being true. Looking back that was an ambiguous modifier since I mentioned looking back on TS's posts in there.
On the matter as a whole, kosa is right, not right. At least to me. TS was clearly wagoning hard on Mind's post but it feels less scum murder wagon to me. More like TS had the mind set, "I'm pretty sure this mind guy is town, I'm going to follow his vote." which I could see either alignment doing. Taking into account that TS goes back to follow up not only on the subject that rhand brought up when he voted but a post killjoy made before the fact, and I'm pretty sure TS didn't see rhand's vote before making his own, indicating the pile on was likely coincidental. This doesn't take away from the very valid point kosa made though, in that if TS was specifically looking for something like Kosa's first post, why has it taken him so long to say anything about it? That post does reek of TS trying to bury Kosa in mud rather than just slinging a little. And is something he never came back on. My final assessment is that Kosa definitely has grounds to throw a vote back at TS without it being strictly OMGUS. TS's behavior in the matter has me leaning scum mostly because of the burial post. DV's vote seems like the most suspicious on the Kosa wagon, given that kosa didn't make a blatant OMGUS, and ended up being a bit justified. Given how I assessed TS's initial post, I do not feel like DV's vote was to swing pressure off of TS, but if anything is a murderous intent bandwagon vote.
vote: D_V
He didn't like D_V's vote on kosa's wagon. A masterful case, it ain't. Even TS says it's odd, in a follow up. Why spend the whole post talking about how scummy TS is, but vote D_V.
So is that the case that he's bringing from day 1? That D_V's vote on kosa's wagon was suspect? What about Necarg's shady-ass vote? What about the Fable wagon? No no, don't look there. Nothing to see.
So that's why he's getting a townlean? I don't understand what you see in this guy. Same with KoD's read on him. I just don't get it. By your own admission, there isn't a lot of "stance taking" you can point to. There isn't a lot of scumhunting going on. Everything is a fence-sit. Half his posts are about situations happening around him, he isn't engaging anyone who doesn't engage him first. He's said more than once "I analyzed such and such", but where has that gotten us? Point to a single time he's progressed the town's understanding of the game.
As far as TS, yes, I'm wary too. HT doesn't get scum points for that. This is a strange place we've ended up with TS, and I'm very much trying to figure out if this is noob scum TS. Nobody has ever seen it before. I'm not at all sure, and I'm (mostly) patiently waiting for him to have some time to get there. I mean *****, I've waited almost a week for DoTA and Rhand. I can give TS a day or two.
Hey mind, what's the difference between fencesitting and just not knowing anything for sure?
We're looking for actively not taking a stance, not indecisiveness
Scum aren't necessarily unreasonable. But let me flip that question on you. Lets say he's town. What is this post doing? Making sure we all get along? I neither need, nor want, a referee in here, trying to keep everyone calm and get all disagreements swept quietly under the rug. If anything, this is coaching fable to knock it off (possibly because he's bussing TS and it's a sloppy, food for thought).
Hmm. I don't know, it'd be a seriously odd interaction if all three of them are scum together. I read it as a town member trying to break up an argument he thought was town/town/town.
"Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game?" Well, honestly "Slight scum lean" is hardly bussing, It's barely anything at all (especially when that whole post, is maybe 6 or 7 "slight" leans one way or the other. Go read it again, everyone who had posted in the game, except me, is slight or null. The post is practically nothing. I can't point to a single solid stance from it). It's the same with his "D_V case". There isn't much there...
I said considering. If they're scum together, he'd have to have been at least considering the possibility of bussing his buddy Fable at that point to say he's leaning scum on him. I don't think that's likely.
He didn't like D_V's vote on kosa's wagon. A masterful case, it ain't. Even TS says it's odd, in a follow up. Why spend the whole post talking about how scummy TS is, but vote D_V.
Half_Time responded to that yesterDay. He was thinking aloud and decided TS's vote wasn't scummy because it felt like he was town /barning town, but that D_V's was scummy because it was "murderous". I don't agree that wanting someone dead is necessarily scummy, but it's not inconsistent or confusing to me.
So is that the case that he's bringing from day 1? That D_V's vote on kosa's wagon was suspect? What about Necarg's shady-ass vote? What about the Fable wagon? No no, don't look there. Nothing to see.
He already said that the interactions of others regarding Fable are worth looking at, just not what Fable was saying about others. I agree. You'll never figure out when exactly in the day he decided to troll us, and it's probably not useful to go down that rabbit hole. But we can still see what other people were saying to Fable, and how they reacted to Fable's actions.
So that's why he's getting a townlean? I don't understand what you see in this guy. Same with KoD's read on him. I just don't get it. By your own admission, there isn't a lot of "stance taking" you can point to. There isn't a lot of scumhunting going on. Everything is a fence-sit. Half his posts are about situations happening around him, he isn't engaging anyone who doesn't engage him first. He's said more than once "I analyzed such and such", but where has that gotten us? Point to a single time he's progressed the town's understanding of the game.
I can't. But then, I'm not really in a position to criticize, since I hadn't done much until today (as in, the last 12 hours or so). To be honest, I think we'll have much better idea of Half_Time's alignment when he starts talking about TS. There's a lot of strange interactions around his (TS's) slot that I'm interested in unraveling.
As far as TS, yes, I'm wary too. HT doesn't get scum points for that. This is a strange place we've ended up with TS, and I'm very much trying to figure out if this is noob scum TS. Nobody has ever seen it before. I'm not at all sure, and I'm (mostly) patiently waiting for him to have some time to get there. I mean *****, I've waited almost a week for DoTA and Rhand. I can give TS a day or two.
Yeah, I'm not trying to rush him or anything. Something like half the players haven't even posted since the day started, and most of those hadn't posted much before N1, either. I'm perfectly content to wait.
Scum aren't necessarily unreasonable. But let me flip that question on you. Lets say he's town. What is this post doing? Making sure we all get along? I neither need, nor want, a referee in here, trying to keep everyone calm and get all disagreements swept quietly under the rug. If anything, this is coaching fable to knock it off (possibly because he's bussing TS and it's a sloppy, food for thought).
Hmm. I don't know, it'd be a seriously odd interaction if all three of them are scum together. I read it as a town member trying to break up an argument he thought was town/town/town.
"Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game?" Well, honestly "Slight scum lean" is hardly bussing, It's barely anything at all (especially when that whole post, is maybe 6 or 7 "slight" leans one way or the other. Go read it again, everyone who had posted in the game, except me, is slight or null. The post is practically nothing. I can't point to a single solid stance from it). It's the same with his "D_V case". There isn't much there...
I said considering. If they're scum together, he'd have to have been at least considering the possibility of bussing his buddy Fable at that point to say he's leaning scum on him. I don't think that's likely.
He didn't like D_V's vote on kosa's wagon. A masterful case, it ain't. Even TS says it's odd, in a follow up. Why spend the whole post talking about how scummy TS is, but vote D_V.
Half_Time responded to that yesterDay. He was thinking aloud and decided TS's vote wasn't scummy because it felt like he was town /barning town, but that D_V's was scummy because it was "murderous". I don't agree that wanting someone dead is necessarily scummy, but it's not inconsistent or confusing to me.
So is that the case that he's bringing from day 1? That D_V's vote on kosa's wagon was suspect? What about Necarg's shady-ass vote? What about the Fable wagon? No no, don't look there. Nothing to see.
He already said that the interactions of others regarding Fable are worth looking at, just not what Fable was saying about others. I agree. You'll never figure out when exactly in the day he decided to troll us, and it's probably not useful to go down that rabbit hole. But we can still see what other people were saying to Fable, and how they reacted to Fable's actions.
So that's why he's getting a townlean? I don't understand what you see in this guy. Same with KoD's read on him. I just don't get it. By your own admission, there isn't a lot of "stance taking" you can point to. There isn't a lot of scumhunting going on. Everything is a fence-sit. Half his posts are about situations happening around him, he isn't engaging anyone who doesn't engage him first. He's said more than once "I analyzed such and such", but where has that gotten us? Point to a single time he's progressed the town's understanding of the game.
I can't. But then, I'm not really in a position to criticize, since I hadn't done much until today (as in, the last 12 hours or so). To be honest, I think we'll have much better idea of Half_Time's alignment when he starts talking about TS. There's a lot of strange interactions around his (TS's) slot that I'm interested in unraveling.
As far as TS, yes, I'm wary too. HT doesn't get scum points for that. This is a strange place we've ended up with TS, and I'm very much trying to figure out if this is noob scum TS. Nobody has ever seen it before. I'm not at all sure, and I'm (mostly) patiently waiting for him to have some time to get there. I mean *****, I've waited almost a week for DoTA and Rhand. I can give TS a day or two.
Yeah, I'm not trying to rush him or anything. Something like half the players haven't even posted since the day started, and most of those hadn't posted much before N1, either. I'm perfectly content to wait.
Yo, why are you responding for H_S?
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This just means that if you change your vote, an intervening unvote isn't required.
is functionally equivalent to
.
@Kosa: Prods will be handled after i'm off work tonight.
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So are you immune or not this is important. And I think you know why.
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How's being the SK then? Good? Bad?
That has to be the scummiest comment of the game so far.
Still working on the voting inconsistencies.
Good thing mud slinging and discrediting are scum tells though right?
Agreed
Unvote, Vote Half_Time
@D_V - That's interesting. Why do you suspect that?
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The first votecount for toDay is correct; I ran it twice. I'll do another one tonight after I'm off work.
https://twitch.tv/annorax10 (classic retro speedruns & occasional MTGO/MTGA screwaround streams)
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Yup, correct.
I'll recheck it after I'm off work. Too many calls, I wish Q would just turn the callers into frogs or something.
https://twitch.tv/annorax10 (classic retro speedruns & occasional MTGO/MTGA screwaround streams)
https://twitch.tv/SwiftorCasino (yes, my team and I run live dealer games for the baldman using his channel points as chips)
As the one who did that votecount, can you tell me what seems to be the issue? I know I skipped a few unbolded votes, if that's what you're thinking of.
i always have to read three pages
oh snap
Unvote, Vote: TappingStones
Tom already answered so I will too.
The answer is yes.
Die.
I'm not worried about KJ's alignment.
No seriously, TS needs to die.
He's not scum because he lied about the name. That doesn't matter. This attitude of "I'm dying because I actually did stuff" is what has to go. It's a giant ball of CFTWR
I specifically said I wasn't roleblocked.
KoD and Brinatoo can't be scum together but KoD probably wasn't scum anyway.
but how, when he makes posts like this?
Sorry, I did try to google it
That's one thing that is on the table right now.
Along with him claiming the cat is somehow Ninja Whiskers serial killer.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
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Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
2. Cythare#156
3. Wheat_Grinder #621
4. TS Unbolded vote #637
5. D_V #638
6. Silvercrys3467 #658
7. Mindreaver #710
8. Necarg #717(unvoted from nothing)
9. Fable07 #723
Cythare (1): Fable07#156
Silvercrys3467 (1): D_V#90# unvote117
Necarg (1): KingofDominaria#119
Mindreaver (1): Kosakosa#113
Fable07 (3): Sir Chris#70, Cythare#74, Necarg#85 #unvote152
KingofDominaria (1); Brinatoo#33
Kosakosa (2): Mindreaver#141, Rhand#194
Rhand (1): col_mongoose#220
col_mongoose (1): DoTArchon#225
Silvercrys3467 (1): Tom
Fable07 (3): Sir Chris, Cythare, Necarg
Kosakosa (2): Mindreaver, Rhand, Tappingstones, Brinatoo
col_mongoose (1): DoTArchon
TappingStones(1):Kosakosa
D_V(1): Half_Time
DoT(2): KoD, Col_MoN
Stardate 69999.1
DoTArchon (2): KingofDominaria#366, col_mongoose#371
Fable07 (4): Sir Chris#70, Cythare#74, Necarg#85/#152, Wheat_Grinder#503
Kosakosa (4): Mindreaver#141, Rhand#194, Tappingstones#248, Brinatoo#296
col_mongoose (1): DoTArchon#225
TappingStones (1): Kosakosa#300
Not voting (7): Killjoy, Silvercrys3467, tomsloger, Shockwave07, Half_Time, Fable07, D_V
19 alive, 10 to lynch.
Tom vote on Silver didn’t go through #428 probably putting it in that weird shade of grey caused the overlook
Now that this'll be clarified, hopefully finalized, we can assess why it was potentially a lynch between 8-9 votes. Also we should probably backtrack and see why some people were certain that the lynch threshold was that close to a lynch.
Also, since that vote rule was clarified, I'll be keeping my vote on TS because I'll take Kosa's word for it for now: I seriously doubt cult but I wouldn't put it past a bad-gambit. Which in that case I'm sure he would be caught in a lie concerning his role so we'll figure out that scenario when we get to it. But in the meantime: KoD vs. TS.
I think it's weird to have a fakeclaim when you are vanilla town. Spock is Vulcan and upon review of what Alcohol is like in the Star Trek Universe. I hate flavor-gaming but I don't mind intertwining it with mechanics/behavior to push an argument. If a vanilla town was given a drunk Spock(and he guesses a future Spock doesn't exist) fakeclaim for NK bait, wouldn't using this claim just be assuming that the mafia are looking for specific names for power- which is imo a bad idea because the past games that have been hosted were fairly random if you narrow it down to individual characters. I read a decent chunk of the first game and Worf is a good example to deter thought processes like this. Hell, Col_Mon was Worf and flipped a vig-of-sorts. I think it would have been reasonable to just ignore the fakeclaim but still try to draw a NK with the stuff that he's claiming on a future Spock. But he didn't and assumed Spock would be a better choice, regardless of his intentions. And even if he was dumb and decided to take this line of play as town, we only lynch a vanilla. So to weigh his behavior/KoD target/claim, I think a potential scum lynch far exceeds a mislynch. I'll get to looking at his behavior and hope someone else will take the time to ISO him, particularly someone that needs more content so we can assess them as well, but if noone gets to it and lurkers still be lurking- I'll eventually get to it.
I miss having rhand and dv in here. Why you gotta dissappear/be all weird (respectively)?
Feeling better about brinatoo for reasons I don't care to explain and probably won't unless he's actually getting lynched.
In my most recent post, I realized I left my name off the wagon and thought that would make ten. Turns out there were only eight names in the list.
When Fable was getting run up, I just took the last vote count and counted votes after that - I'm sure others did too. I didn't notice that Necarg was already on the wagon when he voted Fable again, so his vote got counted twice accidentally (by me). I can't say for sure whether the lynch was "legal" or not.
who is this in response to
He's responding to you, about D_V. He has a pronoun restriction. Self-Imposed.
Actually at the time I was reading I didn't have two or three posts between mine and wheat's. Then post ninja business. Happened a few times this game, and others as of late.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
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In practical terms, I doubt that matters much. He was self-confessed scum, and (seemingly) hammered himself. I doubt the result would be different if we'd waiting another hour for somebody to come around to vote him.
Unless the mods want to confirm that it was a perfectly valid and legal, and then we just have a double voter of some variety (or it's possible that Fable just had a reduced threshold).
I see what I did. I accidentally read "unvote name" as "vote name."
My bad for reporting that vote as standing when it clearly shouldn't have been.
that's dumb
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
@Mindreaver:
I iso'd Half_Time and went back through your case... but I don't see the same things you do. I mean, he is contributing relatively little in the way of his own reads, but that's not necessarily scummy in a vacuum. I'll quote some of his posts that pinged me as town. If he's scum, what is this exactly? Defending TS from his scum buddy for the pocket play, only to turn around and be suspicious of him? Distancing from his scum buddy who's under very little pressure?
It reads... well, to be honest, it reads like a reasonable person just asking other people to be reasonable. Not necessarily alignment indicative, I suppose, but it pinged me as town at the time and still reads that way to me. Same thing here. Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game? Looking at a Kosa townread when virtually the whole active game besides me was trying to lynch him?
Then he spends the majority of the day pushing D_V as a counter wagon to Kosa. Alone. Is that a scummy thing to do? I don't think so. It seems much more like town thought they caught scum and was hoping to get them lynched. Scum would have tried to let that wagon go once they realized it wasn't going to go the way they wanted. Especially now that, you know, we're pretty sure Kosa is town.
Now Day 2, he's still suspicious of TS and D_V for pushing his town lean Kosa on Day 1. He wants to talk about TS but would prefer to wait until TS finishes his reread posts. And to be honest, I'm in sort of the same spot. Day 1, I was town leaning on TS but with recent events I'm suspicious and I think whatever TS finds in his reread will be illuminating in a variety of ways - to his alignment and the alignments of others. I think it's perfectly reasonable to want to wait.
Overall, I rate Half_Time's iso a solid "lean town" / 10. I think you're reading too much into his recent posts, like TS is reading too much into my very early ones.
... and since I used that votecount to start the second one, that error carried over into my votecount 1.2. Fable was lynched at L-1.
I do not believe much would have changed had this error been caught given that Fable had claimed scum. I apologize for the error; I'm self-reporting it to the Council and the other site admins for any actions they feel necessary to resolve the situation. I do not feel that stopping the game would make any difference, so things will continue as they are now unless directed by the council or the administration.
The Day 2 votecount that is up now is correct.
https://twitch.tv/annorax10 (classic retro speedruns & occasional MTGO/MTGA screwaround streams)
https://twitch.tv/SwiftorCasino (yes, my team and I run live dealer games for the baldman using his channel points as chips)
----------
On another note, I hate the post search here. Tried Tapping (and since I'm almost always on mobile) can only get results up to right now 17 to 18 hours ago.
Guess I'll have to dig the old fashioned way...
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Vote: Fable
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Is there a way from mobile to post pictures so I can show what it looks like?
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Actually. I just tried it on my phone, and you're right, there isn't a page index.
As a work around, you can copy-paste this into your address bar:
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/search?by-author=TappingStones&page=2&search-thread-id=719646
and change the username and page number by hand when you want to look at earlier stuff.
Or you can request the desktop site from your phone's browser options; that should give you the page index but it might be hard to read without zooming in.
More tomorrow but for the sake of confirming Necarg had an extra vote and TS's didn't count to add up to only 9? Mods:Can we get a votecount of Fable's lynch? Couldn't hurt to ask but if [redacted] at least we know it's fishy- if TS's vote didn't count.
Scum aren't necessarily unreasonable. But let me flip that question on you. Lets say he's town. What is this post doing? Making sure we all get along? I neither need, nor want, a referee in here, trying to keep everyone calm and get all disagreements swept quietly under the rug. If anything, this is coaching fable to knock it off (possibly because he's bussing TS and it's a sloppy, food for thought).
"Is he already considering bussing Fable in his third post of the game?" Well, honestly "Slight scum lean" is hardly bussing, It's barely anything at all (especially when that whole post, is maybe 6 or 7 "slight" leans one way or the other. Go read it again, everyone who had posted in the game, except me, is slight or null. The post is practically nothing. I can't point to a single solid stance from it). It's the same with his "D_V case". There isn't much there...
So is that the case that he's bringing from day 1? That D_V's vote on kosa's wagon was suspect? What about Necarg's shady-ass vote? What about the Fable wagon? No no, don't look there. Nothing to see.
So that's why he's getting a townlean? I don't understand what you see in this guy. Same with KoD's read on him. I just don't get it. By your own admission, there isn't a lot of "stance taking" you can point to. There isn't a lot of scumhunting going on. Everything is a fence-sit. Half his posts are about situations happening around him, he isn't engaging anyone who doesn't engage him first. He's said more than once "I analyzed such and such", but where has that gotten us? Point to a single time he's progressed the town's understanding of the game.
As far as TS, yes, I'm wary too. HT doesn't get scum points for that. This is a strange place we've ended up with TS, and I'm very much trying to figure out if this is noob scum TS. Nobody has ever seen it before. I'm not at all sure, and I'm (mostly) patiently waiting for him to have some time to get there. I mean *****, I've waited almost a week for DoTA and Rhand. I can give TS a day or two.
We're looking for actively not taking a stance, not indecisiveness
I said considering. If they're scum together, he'd have to have been at least considering the possibility of bussing his buddy Fable at that point to say he's leaning scum on him. I don't think that's likely.
Half_Time responded to that yesterDay. He was thinking aloud and decided TS's vote wasn't scummy because it felt like he was town /barning town, but that D_V's was scummy because it was "murderous". I don't agree that wanting someone dead is necessarily scummy, but it's not inconsistent or confusing to me.
He already said that the interactions of others regarding Fable are worth looking at, just not what Fable was saying about others. I agree. You'll never figure out when exactly in the day he decided to troll us, and it's probably not useful to go down that rabbit hole. But we can still see what other people were saying to Fable, and how they reacted to Fable's actions.
I can't. But then, I'm not really in a position to criticize, since I hadn't done much until today (as in, the last 12 hours or so). To be honest, I think we'll have much better idea of Half_Time's alignment when he starts talking about TS. There's a lot of strange interactions around his (TS's) slot that I'm interested in unraveling.
Yeah, I'm not trying to rush him or anything. Something like half the players haven't even posted since the day started, and most of those hadn't posted much before N1, either. I'm perfectly content to wait.
Yo, why are you responding for H_S?