Posted this in spectator chat but it'll probably be read by nobody there so I'll repost it:
Deserved to lose this game based on how little I cared.
If I actually wanted to play to wincon I would have sandbagged Naming instead of making a game-losing move seconds into D1, pushed my reads more, wouldn't have chosen a stupid post restriction.
Unsure if I could have fulfilled my first and second wincons, though, based on how the game played out?
Scum team played very well - Necarg was the weak link but I mostly ignored him after D1, DCIII convinced me was town based on the counterclaim, and Wheat.. Wheat was amazingly town all game. Wow. I'm still shocked.
Because there are more important things to discuss. Also Necarg is a newbie who probably didn't know that you're supposed to claim miller on D1. You think his team would really suggest he claim miller on Day 3?
I find this funny because that's EXACTLY what happened.
GG's to all. Thanks to Wheat and DC for helping me out.
Mafia MVP undoubtedly goes to Wheat. DC also did very well, especially at the end to clear Me/Wheat.
Win rate now 66%. Thanks to KoolKoal for hosting the game.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My thoughts are with the friends and family of the Orlando Shooting victims and with the rest of the LGBTQA+ community.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
Necarg, please don't acknowledge this in any way whatsoever.
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Too much scum power, a survivor and not enough town power.
Well, I have a lot of thoughts on this game in the spec chat, but I couldn't disagree more about the setup. If you want to see a truly unbalanced mini setup look at what we were facing in Futurama where there were three scum, they had an extra kill, and there was a neutral SK.
In this case, Town had an investigative role, a player who was cleared based on his ability, a gifted investigative role, two protection roles, and an ability to gift a third protection role. Plus, the neutral could very well have needed to kill scum rather than town. I think the set up was fine. Town had a lot of power.
I must say, Wheat and Necarg, I very much enjoyed playing with you guys this game (and everyone else)! Wheat played his role well and was super towny, and Necarg did a lot of dirty work that needed to be done
I did enjoy that the miller claim ended up taking Necarg out of the suspect pool as well, and that I was able to successfully lead a trail back to Proph when I flipped.
Proph, if it makes you feel any better, you were basically the center of my game even though we barely interacted. Your PoE made me feel the need to CC Az to expand my playing space and I intentionally countered your wagon on GJ toward the end of D1. When Iso was talking about how suspicious it was that your wagon disbanded as suddenly as it did I was happy because my intent was to do that not to keep you alive, but to ensure you wouldn't be alive later on, especially since I was playing with my likely inevitable death in mind after I cced Az.
People were too quick to clear me on the double vote thing. Only Az even considered that I might not be confirmed town early; if anyone else did, they didn't say anything. That put me in position to run people into the ground over things that were scummy but didn't make them scum: it was a false righteousness that only reinforced the town read everyone had on me. And there was no shortage of really scummy things happening. I would have been screwed if I was town; I kept waiting for a mislynch to flip SK or something.
Then there were just enough people who "had" to be killed before me, so me living never became an issue. We had to win as early as possible because of that though; if necarg died too then we might have lost altogether.
I laughed a lot whenever I wrote that necarg couldn't be scum because no one would tell him to claim miller; no one was stupid or insane enough among the scumteam to claim miller despite never being copped, and not claiming it until day 3. I laughed because I'M that stupid and insane! Necarg played it off perfectly with feigning that he had to go look up what miller was when he had already looked it up previously. Seppel bought it, I reinforced it, no one ever questioned the possibility he was scum again.
Meanwhile, DC played like Iso as far as figuring out what people were. He knew Seppel had the cop shots, found out Proph's role via his ability, and even suspected that Iso wasn't actually innocent child. That gave us all the info we needed to ensure we didn't step on a landmine.
And finally, the Huntz mislynch suddenly going through REALLY helped us out.
Essentially, anything that could have broken in our favor, did, and we took full advantage of every break.
---
@Jobie: If the Day didn't end right then I was about to say "I'll show you where toMorrow" because I knew toMorrow would never dawn.
The town should never lose after two mislynches. The only reason we didn't lose yesterday was that Proph didn't realize he could hold the lynch to a stalemate, scum kill Jobie, gg town. All those power roles the town have only matter if we all correctly name a player on day one, and I doubt a day 1 massclaim would have happened, as we were unsure of if everyone had the same mechanic. For instance, I could only EVER track WG, and anyone he may or may not name. There also would have been an asston of confusion. Proph was absolutely the correct lynch, as it easily could have been a mafia gambit, and even if it were not, the presence of a neutral should have been clear at it being two mafia members total, meaning with you down, there should have been one left.
Calling another mini worse doesn't mean that this set-up wasn't ridiculously scum sided.
@DC/necarg: Definitely agreed all around with having had fun with you guys; it was a real team effort that I'm wholly unused to when playing as scum (usually I just bus and run)
re: balance: This game was definitely scum-sided. I think Naming didn't go exactly how KK planned, and a lot of town power was based on Naming. If town coordinated naming, it probably would have been about even in power.
Because there are more important things to discuss. Also Necarg is a newbie who probably didn't know that you're supposed to claim miller on D1. You think his team would really suggest he claim miller on Day 3?
I find this funny because that's EXACTLY what happened.
GG's to all. Thanks to Wheat and DC for helping me out.
Mafia MVP undoubtedly goes to Wheat. DC also did very well, especially at the end to clear Me/Wheat.
Win rate now 66%. Thanks to KoolKoal for hosting the game.
"You received a note from Iso saying that Iso is Iso."
This was on the night he died.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My thoughts are with the friends and family of the Orlando Shooting victims and with the rest of the LGBTQA+ community.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
Necarg, please don't acknowledge this in any way whatsoever.
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Also,
As DCIII pointed out in the spec thread, me hammering and then insta-naming the next morning helped enforce my appearance as at least a douche who needed to be dealt with. I apologize for the team for that, as I take responsibility for putting us back two townies. If I had been a little more careful it could have gone down a little different.
The town should never lose after two mislynches. The only reason we didn't lose yesterday was that Proph didn't realize he could hold the lynch to a stalemate, scum kill Jobie, gg town. All those power roles the town have only matter if we all correctly name a player on day one, and I doubt a day 1 massclaim would have happened, as we were unsure of if everyone had the same mechanic. For instance, I could only EVER track WG, and anyone he may or may not name. There also would have been an asston of confusion. Proph was absolutely the correct lynch, as it easily could have been a mafia gambit, and even if it were not, the presence of a neutral should have been clear at it being two mafia members total, meaning with you down, there should have been one left.
Calling another mini worse doesn't mean that this set-up wasn't ridiculously scum sided.
I hear what you're saying, and 3 is the correct normal number of lynches in a mini. That being said, I've played in several where 2 can get the scum there... and those games are normally games with high power and normally things have to go very wrong for town in order to get there (and Town's power often has the potential to blow up the scum team). In this game, it was kind of a perfect storm where the double voting towny helped to lynch the bodyguard gifted towny with only 6 people on the wagon. Then D2 happened and everyone was named by non (important, at least) PRs. Az's role effectively got neutered (other than clearing him), and Proph ended up in a situation where his wincon was to have a townie die, where he easily could have been in a situation where he needed scum dead.
Eh. I mean, if you pointed it up, I bet it is scum sided, but I think you overstate how much. It very easily could have gone the other way and, if KA counterclaims me or if Hunt doesn't hammer Charm, I bet we lose that game.
Last aside, if Proph was town, I don't see that game ending much differently. He was hunting as Town D1 which is when my association with him was planted. Maybe he doesn't name D2... but Jobie was also being linked to me and Seppel never actually copped Proph to begin with. If Proph isn't lynched there, Jobie is. And if Proph is a Town Vanilla... there's still a good chance he's lynched there. All speculation, but I don't think the setup was the driving factor in the outcome.
Yeah, I didn't really have an issue with the setup aside from Proph's role, but that particular role was a pretty major issue. 4/12 roles who need to lie about their alignment in a mini is too much. Whether or not they're given a killing role, they're a probable mislynch if the town does its behavioral analysis correctly and determines they're a liar. That sets the town back two lives, for essentially playing correctly. *shrugs* Oh well.
The naming mechanic didn't work out as expected, but that was largely due to town misplay. WG was amazing, and Necarg wasn't bad either. GG.
We also basically outed all of the Town's PRs Day 1 through play, so that helped.
Something I noticed you mention was that my true name T/S list helped you because you cross-referenced it with your own reads, but honestly, I figured the scum were going to know everybody/everybody was going to be named by the end of Day 2 so I didn't think it was going to have any huge detriment to the town.
-
Why in the **** was Jobie ever a suspect after Day 1? I cleared him through his behavior + claimed mindset and how they added up together, as well as his eagerness to admit to his mistakes; normally, scum try to stonewall you into believing that they don't know better.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Why in the **** was Jobie ever a suspect after Day 1? I cleared him through his behavior + claimed mindset and how they added up together, as well as his eagerness to admit to his mistakes; normally, scum try to stonewall you into believing that they don't know better.
I was sooooooooooo confused when this started to happen. It started when Seppel flipped his view of me and then everyone parroted him. I was getting SO frustrated by that.
Pretty much exactly what happened in Avant Garde: Lazy town quick lynches townies without taking time to pause and think about their turbo-lynches. When 90% of the game are in for a Hunt lynch, we need to stop and reconsider.
2 mislynches to lose for the town is bull*****.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Mafia Stats (10-22 Overall) Random Mafia 2 Town MVP '08 MTGS Fantasy Football Overall Champion Best Non-SK Neutral Performance (Individual)
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
"You received a note from Iso saying that Iso is Iso."
This was on the night he died.
I think I sent that to Az, yeah?
Yeah. About thaaaaaat,
My role's ability is such: If whoever I target with it would be targeted, it targets me instead, while if something would target me, it targets whoever I targeted instead.
I used Az as a meat shield for a good portion of the game.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My thoughts are with the friends and family of the Orlando Shooting victims and with the rest of the LGBTQA+ community.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
Necarg, please don't acknowledge this in any way whatsoever.
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Overall, I'm unhappy about how this game went. The town and mafia roles are well balanced against each other, and the game appears worse balanced than it really was due to poor town D1 play (outing every town PR besides the very weakest). However, it was still scum-sided. That, and really every important problem with the game, stem from the neutral role.
I say the town and scum were balanced, because they both had balancing in place for a strong Naming game, and checks for if all the names were guessed immediately. In general, the starting abilities were meant to be powerful in a high-skill, slow Naming environment, and the gifts were to compensate for a fast-Naming game, which is why they only target Named players.
Iso, Town Info-Dealer - Jan_Brock
During the night, you may choose any player other than yourself to receive the Name of any player you choose. Gift (This ability will not appear in any public display of your role PM once it has activated.): The player that Names you gains the ability "During the night, you may choose a Named player and learn their alignment." for the rest of the game.
I like Iso's base role. It still does something relevant after everyone is Named.
And here's the first Gift ability. Gift works the way it does to prevent the unnecessary or random outing of power roles, and also allows the gifted ability to hide from DCIII's ability. Iso chose to hint that he gave away an ability, which turned out to be a mistake, though perhaps an inconsequential one*. The mistake being that Mafia had a Gift as well.
It did allow the mafia to correctly predict Seppel being the cop and who he would target if he chose correctly and likely contributed to the strong front the mafia put up on Day 3.
Gentleman Johnny, Town Spy - Juunn
Every night you learn who each player you have Named targeted.
During the night you may choose a player who was Named by a player you have Named. The chosen player's targets will be revealed to you as well this night.
GJ's was the most swingy role in the game, it had the possibility to be amazing, or vanilla. It would take a lot of skill for it to work at its highest potential, but its highest potential was game-endingly strong. As such, the mafia have a counter as long as Necarg is unnamed.
Is it possible to design a role that is too dependent on the player outplaying the rest? I think so. A more tame role was likely the way to go here, it would have freed up more design space that felt tight near the end of the process.
KamikazeArchon, Town Skulk - DiviFilius
You cannot be killed by players you have Named (you can still be lynched).
The weakest town PR, kami's role simple and elegant. It gives him an obvious goal to play with and rewards him for playing well without ever becoming too powerful. This is my favorite role in the game.
Azrael, Town Priest - March_of_the_Ocelots
Players you have Named cannot be killed while you are alive (they can still be lynched). Gift (This ability will not appear in any public display of your role PM once it has activated.): The player that Names you gains "During the night, you may target a named player. If that player would be killed tonight, you die in their place." for the rest of the game. Your first ability cannot prevent the player that Named you from dying as a result of protecting someone.
Azrael's role is the better designed of the two roles that are so "swingy." For how exciting and potentially powerful it is, it can never solve the game by itself. Just the fact that I didn't need to counter it in scum makes it a better design in my opinion.
4 Town Vanillas - Seppel/MaytheForce, Charm_Master/Septicemia_ItIs, Jobie/Decerebrate, Huntzilla/ApricornLover
I've realized one of the big problem with the naming mechanic was giving 1/3 of the players no direction with naming, causing confusion, and (in at least one case) poor Naming decisions because Vanillas have no idea who they should name, so they should just name whoever once they know gifts exist. This is only one reason the Naming didn't work out ideally, and not the biggest.
Prophylaxis, Neutral Name-Collector - OctopusToes
You win and leave the game when you have Named three players over the course of the game.
or
You win and leave the game if you're alive when you have Named 1/2 of the living players, rounded up.
or Third possible win condition will be revealed when all living players have been Named
If you're alive at the end of the game, and no other living players have been named by you, you win the game.
The problem child. I was too in-love with the first two win conditions to look at this role correctly. Even with the chance that the Name game went the way I hoped, even if there were only 2 scum, this role is awful. The problem with this role, specifically, is the third win condition. Its just bad. I put a band-aid on the fact that the correct play for this role was to claim survivor in the first post and play as a survivor. Not only that, but the quasi-survivor role is awful, even if it doesn't punish the player for playing to their previous win conditions. This is the role that isn't balanced around the name game not going exactly how I wanted. So first I want to apologize to proph for that.
Now, as for the rest of you. I have to apologize for myself and on the behalf of my reviewers. I think we focused too hard on the Spy, the Priest, the Soul-Stealer, and the Manipulator and just neglected to notice that this role was scum-sided in ~80% of games. While in this case, the mafia was playing strongly enough that they likely would have one regardless, this role certainly tipped the game further in their favor than was fair.
I'm sorry I blew it on this role.
DCIII, Mafia Soul-Stealer - TheFebbre
When you Name a player, you learn their role.
At night, you may choose to steal the role of any living player you have Named. You keep your alignment, but lose all of your other abilities from your original role, then gain all abilities that player had for the rest of the game (you cannot gain alternate win conditions this way). That player becomes vanilla after that night concludes.
I'm torn on this role. I love it for its originality, but I hate that its, again, "swingy" and mildly insincere to its player. There really aren't enough roles in the game worth stealing, this probably should have only been a vanillaizer. Its got some cute interactions, but over all I'd call this "over-designed."
Wheat_Grinder, Mafia Mayor - novel_plan Gift (This ability will not appear in any public display of your role PM once it has activated.): The non-mafia player that Names you has two votes to cast for the lynch for the rest of the game. The mafia player that Names you will show a result of Town in investigative results for the rest of the game.
As a design, this role was in the game for the dilemma for the scum team: Do we name our teammate for the godfather ability and how do we make it look natural?
The half that actually got taken, the double vote, may be a good lesson for players not to mod-game so easily. However, Wheat latched on to the early mod-gaming and didn't seem to slip until the final day (when he could taste the win anyway). Part of me worried (and still worries) that I unfairly hit some ingrained mafia psychology, but Azrael correctly guessing Wheat's role mostly mollified me.
Necarg, Mafia Manipulator - YuLying2Me
While you are alive and unNamed, your allies that are tracked/watched will show no results.
When you have been Named by a non-mafia player, you can target another Named player at Night. All abilities that target you that night will target the chosen player instead, but any abilities that target that player will target you instead.
Necarg's second ability was literally a last minute addition. I'd been trying off and on to give him an ability once he was named*, because my reviewers felt that scum would be at a disadvantage with all the gifts in the case of a name-massclaim or another early naming such as this. I played it safe with his role (as you do with last-minute changes) and I realized in the middle of the game just how little interaction it actually promoted. So, it was a mistake but a mistake I expected to make.
His first ability is spoken about under Gentleman Johnny's role already.
*The others are so awful they will never see the light of day.
As for the Naming game itself, in addition to the problem with Vanillas above, I feel I did a poor job assuring players of how important it was to hide their identity. The small player-base meant every player that didn't succeed in hiding their true name made each other player that much easier to name. I realized this after Iso showed me the thought process behind figuring out every player, which was heavily helped by the process of elimination (not to diminish his accomplishment, he was still the first person to guess everyone correctly, and he dug deep to figure out GJ).
True Name Mafia 2* would likely have 15-18 players (idk how it could ever get enough interest for that, the site activity would need to pick up) no vanillas, and maybe even random roles in an open setup. IDK, failure makes me try to fix things
*clarification: True Name Mafia 2 will likely never, ever happen.
My role got used as basically a glorified Day role cop. I figured from the beginning that vanillaizing someone after naming them wouldn't really go over so well and figured I'd only use that aspect if I absolutely needed to... but then couldn't for Hunt or Proph anyway.
Eh. I enjoyed it KK, I'll play the next round if it's feasible!
I think that your analysis of the roles is fairly spot-on, except that I think the scum thought Seppel was the Cop independent of my ability.
If you do host another game, I'm likely to play in it, though - you clearly have a good understanding of what does and doesn't work in a post-game setting, which I think you can use to improve yourself as a setup designer and make even better games.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
It had nothing to do with town misplay. Unless KK was not expecting all 12 players to be named, half the abilities don't do anything night 1. For me not to name WG means that I essentially roleblocked myself, along with you guessing wrong on whoever you thought was Seppel.
4 non town roles was the difference between the town having an extra day, which could have been a huge pivot.
That being said, I've played in several where 2 can get the scum there... and those games are normally games with high power and normally things have to go very wrong for town in order to get there (and Town's power often has the potential to blow up the scum team).
That's the thing though: High power or not, the town should never be put in a position where they can lose in two mislynches. The town also had very little power, and because the power was granted as a naming mechanic, most people were (or should have been) hesistant on naming. The ones who did named would have picked out as immediate power roles for the mafia anyway.
Eh. I mean, if you pointed it up, I bet it is scum sided, but I think you overstate how much. It very easily could have gone the other way and, if KA counterclaims me or if Hunt doesn't hammer Charm, I bet we lose that game.
I think that part of the weakness of this setup is that the town can actually end up being completely vanilla.
In fairness, I don't think we would have won with another lynch, because I'm pretty sure it was going to be either Jobie or KA on the chopping block next. But in principle, I do agree with the disgruntlement, there.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I disagree that town had little power. Town had two protection roles, the ability for three, the ability for two investigative, and basically a cleared player. That severely limits scum's maneuverability even if the roles aren't played optimally.
I agree that the majority of game designs if not all should allow for three mislynches in a mini, so from that perspective I agree with you.
I disagree that if town had an extra lynch to work with this game, it likely would have mattered, so I don't really think the design gripe had a negative impact on the game. Both Jobie and KA were more likely to be lynched than either Wheat or Necarg, like Iso said.
DCIII, you seem to be under the assumption that town will get all those roles, and that they can target anyone they want. Two protective roles, where Az only protects people he has named. Kami is protected ONLY from the player he names (meaning another mafia member could still kill him even if he named a mafia member). The only way for him to be pure bulletproof would be for him to name all 3 members by day 3. The bodyguard could have also gone to a scum player, so it isn't completely three players. The scum had the ability to get the gifts as well.
Yeah, I think the towns abilities if used properly were quite sufficient to the task. Problem was, disclosing everyone's names on d1, and then not coming up with adequate controls on who or who should not have named, led to a lot of issues. And those issues were certainly foreseeable. Granted, it was a bit hard to institute controls without pinpointing townie power. That was a mechanic I hadn't considered. The town was in a position where its power roles had to either out themselves, or have its abilities wasted by non powered roles. I actually like the tension in that design element, quite a bit.
I suppose it also would not have hurt to put up a mod notice up that vanilla players got no abilities for naming, as we wasted some shots based on that.
The reason I adopted the posting style at the start of the game was that I assumed everyone would change up how they post, to avoid being Named. It seems that didn't really happen.
I think that your analysis of the roles is fairly spot-on, except that I think the scum thought Seppel was the Cop independent of my ability.
If you do host another game, I'm likely to play in it, though - you clearly have a good understanding of what does and doesn't work in a post-game setting, which I think you can use to improve yourself as a setup designer and make even better games.
I look forward to it.
/barn
In addition, the in-game modding was spot on. The right amount of vote counts. Everything well formatted.
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This. I'd totally play in another True Name or another KK game.
I feel that I personally didn't like using a gimmick account because it was too much hassle for not enough game change. For me, by the time I was named, so was everyone else, so I could choose ANYONE with my ability on Night 2. I feel it was also partially town's fault for just going all out "Herp, Derp speedname." I think that if we were to do this again, that it should be stressed that there are abilities for the town that rely on having 2+ named. Gift is a bit hard to judge, but I feel that it only incentivized the behavior from vanilla to name anyone and everyone.
I'll be all over a second True Name, and I look forward to playing with all of you in the future.
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My thoughts are with the friends and family of the Orlando Shooting victims and with the rest of the LGBTQA+ community.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
Necarg, please don't acknowledge this in any way whatsoever.
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@DC3 Thanks for the kind words in the spectator chat and I appreciate the constructive criticism. This game took place during a big transition period at work so everything I was doing in game was erratic and I had a hard time picking my thread back up. I'm mad I dropped the ball on Necarg, I'm mad I cleared WG for a non confirmed role.
This game was a blast, everything in this game was fun even if we lost.
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Turning Proph to our side never occurred to me. Even though I have been known to make such offers (Generic outed ourselves publicly to win the game once), this game was different. necarg and I were so locked in that I could even massively deteriorate in front of Jobie and the lynch on Proph was still pushed in.
Could only have done it that way if DC said "Well, you got me, I'm scum. HEY PROPH, wanna win the game?" Because necarg and I weren't going to give up our own auto-lock for another even if I realized that possibility.
I think I prefer winning the traditional way though.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I think the town performed pretty good this game, tbh. The only really bad play was the Huntz lynch; everything else was pretty reasonable (if ultimately incorrect)
@DC3 Thanks for the kind words in the spectator chat and I appreciate the constructive criticism. This game took place during a big transition period at work so everything I was doing in game was erratic and I had a hard time picking my thread back up. I'm mad I dropped the ball on Necarg, I'm mad I cleared WG for a non confirmed role.
This game was a blast, everything in this game was fun even if we lost.
Sure thing. I kept thinking "why won't Jobie just go along for the ride" I was happy when my opening line to you about being more suspicious with no follow up was taken to mean we were buddies though, haha.
Now if you want to call it best scum team performance, that I'll go with.
I'd take it. You also get the nod for MVP of the game though, IMO. As much as I was pleased about how I helped Necarg... In the end you weren't being caught regardless... And that despite driving all three mislynches. Well done sir.
Regarding Proph that's what I was saying at the end of the day but I agree that I prefer not having strong armed it.
I think I had a pretty good performance in this game.
We've chatted about this a bit. I think you had a good individual handle on the game and did a good job of being towny through your role and did a good job getting your gift to a VT. But I don't think you'd left enough in thread to negatively impact the game for our team prior to us killing you.
Deserved to lose this game based on how little I cared.
If I actually wanted to play to wincon I would have sandbagged Naming instead of making a game-losing move seconds into D1, pushed my reads more, wouldn't have chosen a stupid post restriction.
Unsure if I could have fulfilled my first and second wincons, though, based on how the game played out?
Scum team played very well - Necarg was the weak link but I mostly ignored him after D1, DCIII convinced me was town based on the counterclaim, and Wheat.. Wheat was amazingly town all game. Wow. I'm still shocked.
Notes: http://www.quicktopic.com/51/H/CjAQPXjL3SE3
I find this funny because that's EXACTLY what happened.
GG's to all. Thanks to Wheat and DC for helping me out.
Mafia MVP undoubtedly goes to Wheat. DC also did very well, especially at the end to clear Me/Wheat.
Win rate now 66%. Thanks to KoolKoal for hosting the game.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Well, I have a lot of thoughts on this game in the spec chat, but I couldn't disagree more about the setup. If you want to see a truly unbalanced mini setup look at what we were facing in Futurama where there were three scum, they had an extra kill, and there was a neutral SK.
In this case, Town had an investigative role, a player who was cleared based on his ability, a gifted investigative role, two protection roles, and an ability to gift a third protection role. Plus, the neutral could very well have needed to kill scum rather than town. I think the set up was fine. Town had a lot of power.
I must say, Wheat and Necarg, I very much enjoyed playing with you guys this game (and everyone else)! Wheat played his role well and was super towny, and Necarg did a lot of dirty work that needed to be done
I did enjoy that the miller claim ended up taking Necarg out of the suspect pool as well, and that I was able to successfully lead a trail back to Proph when I flipped.
And no replacements!
GG everyone!
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
People were too quick to clear me on the double vote thing. Only Az even considered that I might not be confirmed town early; if anyone else did, they didn't say anything. That put me in position to run people into the ground over things that were scummy but didn't make them scum: it was a false righteousness that only reinforced the town read everyone had on me. And there was no shortage of really scummy things happening. I would have been screwed if I was town; I kept waiting for a mislynch to flip SK or something.
Then there were just enough people who "had" to be killed before me, so me living never became an issue. We had to win as early as possible because of that though; if necarg died too then we might have lost altogether.
I laughed a lot whenever I wrote that necarg couldn't be scum because no one would tell him to claim miller; no one was stupid or insane enough among the scumteam to claim miller despite never being copped, and not claiming it until day 3. I laughed because I'M that stupid and insane! Necarg played it off perfectly with feigning that he had to go look up what miller was when he had already looked it up previously. Seppel bought it, I reinforced it, no one ever questioned the possibility he was scum again.
Meanwhile, DC played like Iso as far as figuring out what people were. He knew Seppel had the cop shots, found out Proph's role via his ability, and even suspected that Iso wasn't actually innocent child. That gave us all the info we needed to ensure we didn't step on a landmine.
And finally, the Huntz mislynch suddenly going through REALLY helped us out.
Essentially, anything that could have broken in our favor, did, and we took full advantage of every break.
---
@Jobie: If the Day didn't end right then I was about to say "I'll show you where toMorrow" because I knew toMorrow would never dawn.
The town should never lose after two mislynches. The only reason we didn't lose yesterday was that Proph didn't realize he could hold the lynch to a stalemate, scum kill Jobie, gg town. All those power roles the town have only matter if we all correctly name a player on day one, and I doubt a day 1 massclaim would have happened, as we were unsure of if everyone had the same mechanic. For instance, I could only EVER track WG, and anyone he may or may not name. There also would have been an asston of confusion. Proph was absolutely the correct lynch, as it easily could have been a mafia gambit, and even if it were not, the presence of a neutral should have been clear at it being two mafia members total, meaning with you down, there should have been one left.
Calling another mini worse doesn't mean that this set-up wasn't ridiculously scum sided.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Legit paraphrase of a PM from KK:
"You received a note from Iso saying that Iso is Iso."
This was on the night he died.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
As DCIII pointed out in the spec thread, me hammering and then insta-naming the next morning helped enforce my appearance as at least a douche who needed to be dealt with. I apologize for the team for that, as I take responsibility for putting us back two townies. If I had been a little more careful it could have gone down a little different.
So, my bad
I hear what you're saying, and 3 is the correct normal number of lynches in a mini. That being said, I've played in several where 2 can get the scum there... and those games are normally games with high power and normally things have to go very wrong for town in order to get there (and Town's power often has the potential to blow up the scum team). In this game, it was kind of a perfect storm where the double voting towny helped to lynch the bodyguard gifted towny with only 6 people on the wagon. Then D2 happened and everyone was named by non (important, at least) PRs. Az's role effectively got neutered (other than clearing him), and Proph ended up in a situation where his wincon was to have a townie die, where he easily could have been in a situation where he needed scum dead.
Eh. I mean, if you pointed it up, I bet it is scum sided, but I think you overstate how much. It very easily could have gone the other way and, if KA counterclaims me or if Hunt doesn't hammer Charm, I bet we lose that game.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
The naming mechanic didn't work out as expected, but that was largely due to town misplay. WG was amazing, and Necarg wasn't bad either. GG.
I think I sent that to Az, yeah?
But yeah, a standard 12-player Mini minus a townie is scum-sided, regardless of how you want to spin it.
Something I noticed you mention was that my true name T/S list helped you because you cross-referenced it with your own reads, but honestly, I figured the scum were going to know everybody/everybody was going to be named by the end of Day 2 so I didn't think it was going to have any huge detriment to the town.
-
Why in the **** was Jobie ever a suspect after Day 1? I cleared him through his behavior + claimed mindset and how they added up together, as well as his eagerness to admit to his mistakes; normally, scum try to stonewall you into believing that they don't know better.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Pretty much exactly what happened in Avant Garde: Lazy town quick lynches townies without taking time to pause and think about their turbo-lynches. When 90% of the game are in for a Hunt lynch, we need to stop and reconsider.
2 mislynches to lose for the town is bull*****.
Random Mafia 2 Town MVP
'08 MTGS Fantasy Football Overall Champion
Best Non-SK Neutral Performance (Individual)
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yeah. About thaaaaaat,
My role's ability is such: If whoever I target with it would be targeted, it targets me instead, while if something would target me, it targets whoever I targeted instead.
I used Az as a meat shield for a good portion of the game.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
I say the town and scum were balanced, because they both had balancing in place for a strong Naming game, and checks for if all the names were guessed immediately. In general, the starting abilities were meant to be powerful in a high-skill, slow Naming environment, and the gifts were to compensate for a fast-Naming game, which is why they only target Named players.
During the night, you may choose any player other than yourself to receive the Name of any player you choose.
Gift (This ability will not appear in any public display of your role PM once it has activated.): The player that Names you gains the ability "During the night, you may choose a Named player and learn their alignment." for the rest of the game.
I like Iso's base role. It still does something relevant after everyone is Named.
And here's the first Gift ability. Gift works the way it does to prevent the unnecessary or random outing of power roles, and also allows the gifted ability to hide from DCIII's ability. Iso chose to hint that he gave away an ability, which turned out to be a mistake, though perhaps an inconsequential one*. The mistake being that Mafia had a Gift as well.
It did allow the mafia to correctly predict Seppel being the cop and who he would target if he chose correctly and likely contributed to the strong front the mafia put up on Day 3.
Every night you learn who each player you have Named targeted.
During the night you may choose a player who was Named by a player you have Named. The chosen player's targets will be revealed to you as well this night.
GJ's was the most swingy role in the game, it had the possibility to be amazing, or vanilla. It would take a lot of skill for it to work at its highest potential, but its highest potential was game-endingly strong. As such, the mafia have a counter as long as Necarg is unnamed.
Is it possible to design a role that is too dependent on the player outplaying the rest? I think so. A more tame role was likely the way to go here, it would have freed up more design space that felt tight near the end of the process.
You cannot be killed by players you have Named (you can still be lynched).
The weakest town PR, kami's role simple and elegant. It gives him an obvious goal to play with and rewards him for playing well without ever becoming too powerful. This is my favorite role in the game.
Players you have Named cannot be killed while you are alive (they can still be lynched).
Gift (This ability will not appear in any public display of your role PM once it has activated.): The player that Names you gains "During the night, you may target a named player. If that player would be killed tonight, you die in their place." for the rest of the game.
Your first ability cannot prevent the player that Named you from dying as a result of protecting someone.
Azrael's role is the better designed of the two roles that are so "swingy." For how exciting and potentially powerful it is, it can never solve the game by itself. Just the fact that I didn't need to counter it in scum makes it a better design in my opinion.
I've realized one of the big problem with the naming mechanic was giving 1/3 of the players no direction with naming, causing confusion, and (in at least one case) poor Naming decisions because Vanillas have no idea who they should name, so they should just name whoever once they know gifts exist. This is only one reason the Naming didn't work out ideally, and not the biggest.
You win and leave the game when you have Named three players over the course of the game.
or
You win and leave the game if you're alive when you have Named 1/2 of the living players, rounded up.
or
Third possible win condition will be revealed when all living players have been Named
If you're alive at the end of the game, and no other living players have been named by you, you win the game.
The problem child. I was too in-love with the first two win conditions to look at this role correctly. Even with the chance that the Name game went the way I hoped, even if there were only 2 scum, this role is awful. The problem with this role, specifically, is the third win condition. Its just bad. I put a band-aid on the fact that the correct play for this role was to claim survivor in the first post and play as a survivor. Not only that, but the quasi-survivor role is awful, even if it doesn't punish the player for playing to their previous win conditions. This is the role that isn't balanced around the name game not going exactly how I wanted. So first I want to apologize to proph for that.
Now, as for the rest of you. I have to apologize for myself and on the behalf of my reviewers. I think we focused too hard on the Spy, the Priest, the Soul-Stealer, and the Manipulator and just neglected to notice that this role was scum-sided in ~80% of games. While in this case, the mafia was playing strongly enough that they likely would have one regardless, this role certainly tipped the game further in their favor than was fair.
I'm sorry I blew it on this role.
When you Name a player, you learn their role.
At night, you may choose to steal the role of any living player you have Named. You keep your alignment, but lose all of your other abilities from your original role, then gain all abilities that player had for the rest of the game (you cannot gain alternate win conditions this way). That player becomes vanilla after that night concludes.
I'm torn on this role. I love it for its originality, but I hate that its, again, "swingy" and mildly insincere to its player. There really aren't enough roles in the game worth stealing, this probably should have only been a vanillaizer. Its got some cute interactions, but over all I'd call this "over-designed."
Gift (This ability will not appear in any public display of your role PM once it has activated.): The non-mafia player that Names you has two votes to cast for the lynch for the rest of the game. The mafia player that Names you will show a result of Town in investigative results for the rest of the game.
As a design, this role was in the game for the dilemma for the scum team: Do we name our teammate for the godfather ability and how do we make it look natural?
The half that actually got taken, the double vote, may be a good lesson for players not to mod-game so easily. However, Wheat latched on to the early mod-gaming and didn't seem to slip until the final day (when he could taste the win anyway). Part of me worried (and still worries) that I unfairly hit some ingrained mafia psychology, but Azrael correctly guessing Wheat's role mostly mollified me.
While you are alive and unNamed, your allies that are tracked/watched will show no results.
When you have been Named by a non-mafia player, you can target another Named player at Night. All abilities that target you that night will target the chosen player instead, but any abilities that target that player will target you instead.
Necarg's second ability was literally a last minute addition. I'd been trying off and on to give him an ability once he was named*, because my reviewers felt that scum would be at a disadvantage with all the gifts in the case of a name-massclaim or another early naming such as this. I played it safe with his role (as you do with last-minute changes) and I realized in the middle of the game just how little interaction it actually promoted. So, it was a mistake but a mistake I expected to make.
His first ability is spoken about under Gentleman Johnny's role already.
*The others are so awful they will never see the light of day.
True Name Mafia 2* would likely have 15-18 players (idk how it could ever get enough interest for that, the site activity would need to pick up) no vanillas, and maybe even random roles in an open setup. IDK, failure makes me try to fix things
*clarification: True Name Mafia 2 will likely never, ever happen.
Mafia Chat
Spectator Chat
Eh. I enjoyed it KK, I'll play the next round if it's feasible!
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
If you do host another game, I'm likely to play in it, though - you clearly have a good understanding of what does and doesn't work in a post-game setting, which I think you can use to improve yourself as a setup designer and make even better games.
I look forward to it.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
4 non town roles was the difference between the town having an extra day, which could have been a huge pivot.
That's the thing though: High power or not, the town should never be put in a position where they can lose in two mislynches. The town also had very little power, and because the power was granted as a naming mechanic, most people were (or should have been) hesistant on naming. The ones who did named would have picked out as immediate power roles for the mafia anyway.
That has nothing to do with the game itself.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
In fairness, I don't think we would have won with another lynch, because I'm pretty sure it was going to be either Jobie or KA on the chopping block next. But in principle, I do agree with the disgruntlement, there.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I agree that the majority of game designs if not all should allow for three mislynches in a mini, so from that perspective I agree with you.
I disagree that if town had an extra lynch to work with this game, it likely would have mattered, so I don't really think the design gripe had a negative impact on the game. Both Jobie and KA were more likely to be lynched than either Wheat or Necarg, like Iso said.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Whatever though.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I suppose it also would not have hurt to put up a mod notice up that vanilla players got no abilities for naming, as we wasted some shots based on that.
In addition, the in-game modding was spot on. The right amount of vote counts. Everything well formatted.
Random Mafia 2 Town MVP
'08 MTGS Fantasy Football Overall Champion
Best Non-SK Neutral Performance (Individual)
This. I'd totally play in another True Name or another KK game.
I feel that I personally didn't like using a gimmick account because it was too much hassle for not enough game change. For me, by the time I was named, so was everyone else, so I could choose ANYONE with my ability on Night 2. I feel it was also partially town's fault for just going all out "Herp, Derp speedname." I think that if we were to do this again, that it should be stressed that there are abilities for the town that rely on having 2+ named. Gift is a bit hard to judge, but I feel that it only incentivized the behavior from vanilla to name anyone and everyone.
I'll be all over a second True Name, and I look forward to playing with all of you in the future.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Also, barn on liking KKs modding and potential future modding... Maybe a full on rematch when round 2 comes around?
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
This game was a blast, everything in this game was fun even if we lost.
Random Mafia 2 Town MVP
'08 MTGS Fantasy Football Overall Champion
Best Non-SK Neutral Performance (Individual)
Now if you want to call it best scum team performance, that I'll go with.
Turning Proph to our side never occurred to me. Even though I have been known to make such offers (Generic outed ourselves publicly to win the game once), this game was different. necarg and I were so locked in that I could even massively deteriorate in front of Jobie and the lynch on Proph was still pushed in.
Could only have done it that way if DC said "Well, you got me, I'm scum. HEY PROPH, wanna win the game?" Because necarg and I weren't going to give up our own auto-lock for another even if I realized that possibility.
I think I prefer winning the traditional way though.
Random Mafia 2 Town MVP
'08 MTGS Fantasy Football Overall Champion
Best Non-SK Neutral Performance (Individual)
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
The worst town between this and AG was easily AG.
Aside from making the entire town vanilla, you did pretty great.
Sure thing. I kept thinking "why won't Jobie just go along for the ride" I was happy when my opening line to you about being more suspicious with no follow up was taken to mean we were buddies though, haha.
I'd take it. You also get the nod for MVP of the game though, IMO. As much as I was pleased about how I helped Necarg... In the end you weren't being caught regardless... And that despite driving all three mislynches. Well done sir.
Regarding Proph that's what I was saying at the end of the day but I agree that I prefer not having strong armed it.
We've chatted about this a bit. I think you had a good individual handle on the game and did a good job of being towny through your role and did a good job getting your gift to a VT. But I don't think you'd left enough in thread to negatively impact the game for our team prior to us killing you.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player