2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@Blur - Care you share how you got this information?
@Iso you seem to be townreading players awfully easily so far. What makes you so sure Void/Blur are town?
Kinda feels like a good spot to get on a wagon. Not really behind the idea of a wagon ika. Not sure of Iso. mirrorentity has been quieter than the last time we've played. I'll start there...
vote mirrorentity
I assume this "Blur" refers to me. Also, if by "this information" you refer to my knowledge that there is something at Sanctum, that's easy. I searched today Sanctum for my Grimoire and got that information from Mod.
Fair enough. The other option was there was something in your role PM. Did you have any reason to focus on the Sanctum?
I think Iso is town. I still disagree about dumping out info, though. First, narrowing down locations for scum to find grimoires is bad, even if we also help town find grimoires - I think the typical balance of such games is that one scum power role is stronger than one town power role.Second, by declaring the information, you're narrowing down the field of activated town power roles for scum to kill.
I don't see the difference Iso is claiming in ika's posts. This ika feels just like the ika I saw at the start of UT. So I have a town lean there as well. That said, if you two could lighten up on the argument, that would be great. We need to get interaction from everyone else too.
Bolded part: Finally something from you that I like.
I'm not so sure on this. You've essentially claimed that you have to find a grimoire to activate a power. At best you've declared not having a power night 1 (and you could still be lying about that). I don't see the downside in what you've done.
Btw, do you guys agree with the underlined part? I don't know the meta here, so I can't comment at all, but I'd like to hear other's opinions about it.
Not particularly. Scum powers can include things designed to counter town powers or locate them but sometimes there can get extra kills and stuff which is more powerful than town extra kills. It's too early to make assumptions over the setup.
We should have a formal vote on what we should share and what not. I think it might be better to d it early because at some point we will have to stop sharing knowledge or the scum will know exactly who powered up.
Example, I went to place A, something exists but it's not mine. If we all do that eventually people will hit theirs and the scum will know who to NK.
I think Iso is town. I still disagree about dumping out info, though. First, narrowing down locations for scum to find grimoires is bad, even if we also help town find grimoires - I think the typical balance of such games is that one scum power role is stronger than one town power role. Second, by declaring the information, you're narrowing down the field of activated town power roles for scum to kill.
I don't see the difference Iso is claiming in ika's posts. This ika feels just like the ika I saw at the start of UT. So I have a town lean there as well. That said, if you two could lighten up on the argument, that would be great. We need to get interaction from everyone else too.
I'm actually all for revealing information, but I think it would be better tomorrow.
So we can go to a location at any given point of time but only once per day. Scum will be working together andprobably figure out where there stuff is faster. If we all just info dump day 2, the numbet of town is greater than the number of scum so hopefully the town are paying attention and can go get the items first.
Also I think Ika's town. On the other hand, Burs tone bothers me in his rvs.
unvote vote bur
Had a quick look at ika's last game. His posts here didn't ring any alarm bells for me. Looked like a genuine misunderstanding over those few pages.
RE: Mechanics. I think this is a case where we have to cut a fine balance. I think there is a reasonable amount of information now to stop without getting to the point where town activated powers are easily red flagged. However, if the vote goes to full disclosure then I am flexible to post my result.
@Blur - Care you share how you got this information?
@Iso you seem to be townreading players awfully easily so far. What makes you so sure Void/Blur are town?
Kinda feels like a good spot to get on a wagon. Not really behind the idea of a wagon ika. Not sure of Iso. mirrorentity has been quieter than the last time we've played. I'll start there...
vote mirrorentity
I'm not behind either an Iso or ika wagon at this point.
Well let you do the benefit of doubt of assuming your not behind a mirrorentity wagon either Why don't you try and persuade of a better place for my vote ME?
@Bur
It's easy to catch Scum lying with PR's that going to be floating around as more Days go by.
You're assuming the Mafia have Night talk? That is a weird line of thought.
@Void - First in a nonbasic what makes you so sure it will be easy to catch scum lying about PR? Second, when was the last time you played a game without night talk? Like anywhere, at anytime?
@Blur - Care you share how you got this information?
Hi Antny, have you read the rules yet?
Of course not. What kind of stupid question is that?
Quote from Antny223 »
@Iso you seem to be townreading players awfully easily so far. What makes you so sure Void/Blur are town?
I think I answered this already but for anyone who's not convinced on Void and Bur yet, just read their posts. Seriously.
I meant specifically at the time you cleared them. Subsequent posts don't matter. If you can link the posts where did that or restate please.
Quote from Antny223 »
Kinda feels like a good spot to get on a wagon. Not really behind the idea of a wagon ika. Not sure of Iso. mirrorentity has been quieter than the last time we've played. I'll start there...
vote mirrorentity
What the hell is this? (This = a number of things that baffle me about the quoted segment, so feel free to be as detailed as possible.)
It's a vote. I even explained my reasons. You need detail fine. Let's get detailed.
I wanted a wagon. There were three players with two votes (ika/Iso/mirrorentity). I didn't want to vote ika (feels too much like ika from uPick and UnrealTournament so far, which is to say mislynchable town). That left you and mirrorentity. I could easily vote you here. In fact let's be frank I don't think there's a game we've played where I haven't read your posts and thought "Let's vote Iso". I've been told the feelings neutral ;). And then there's ME who hasn't started this game anything like the last I played with him (Walking Dead - you were in that too if you remember) so I voted there. So I guess we could say a weak meta read based on the idea I was voting something who already had two votes. Hope that's enough detail.
I'd care more but essentially we're not really out of rvs at this point. Most people haven't done much and the only reason we're on page 6 is you/ika and Void whittering like old women.
I'll read the rest later. Though it might be a nice idea to repost the screwed up part to make easier for everyone. Just saying.
Bolded part: Finally something from you that I like.
Btw, do you guys agree with the underlined part? I don't know the meta here, so I can't comment at all, but I'd like to hear other's opinions about it.
For the bold: Why do you like that? Did it not seem obvious initially? Do you think scumArch would say this sort of thing to seem town?
For the underlined: I've really never thought of it in such a phrasing before (which is another thing that's hella weird about Arch this game), but I guess it would have to be true, yeah.
We should have a formal vote on what we should share and what not. I think it might be better to d it early because at some point we will have to stop sharing knowledge or the scum will know exactly who powered up.
Example, I went to place A, something exists but it's not mine. If we all do that eventually people will hit theirs and the scum will know who to NK.
Taking a formal vote on this is a waste of time. Share your information if you want. Otherwise, don't. I don't see any harm in it, as I suspect all of our PRs will be online by Day 3 at the absolute latest.
Regarding the bolded part: At 2AM, counting one plus one can be surprisingly hard.
Regarding the information: I disagree. Even though formal vote might be bit too much, I think we should seek to come to an agreement regarding the information. We aren't doing full disclosure, but I think we shouldn't still withhold all the information.
@Blur - Care you share how you got this information?
@Iso you seem to be townreading players awfully easily so far. What makes you so sure Void/Blur are town?
Kinda feels like a good spot to get on a wagon. Not really behind the idea of a wagon ika. Not sure of Iso. mirrorentity has been quieter than the last time we've played. I'll start there...
vote mirrorentity
I assume this "Blur" refers to me. Also, if by "this information" you refer to my knowledge that there is something at Sanctum, that's easy. I searched today Sanctum for my Grimoire and got that information from Mod.
Fair enough. The other option was there was something in your role PM. Did you have any reason to focus on the Sanctum?
I think Iso is town. I still disagree about dumping out info, though. First, narrowing down locations for scum to find grimoires is bad, even if we also help town find grimoires - I think the typical balance of such games is that one scum power role is stronger than one town power role.Second, by declaring the information, you're narrowing down the field of activated town power roles for scum to kill.
I don't see the difference Iso is claiming in ika's posts. This ika feels just like the ika I saw at the start of UT. So I have a town lean there as well. That said, if you two could lighten up on the argument, that would be great. We need to get interaction from everyone else too.
Bolded part: Finally something from you that I like.
I'm not so sure on this. You've essentially claimed that you have to find a grimoire to activate a power. At best you've declared not having a power night 1 (and you could still be lying about that). I don't see the downside in what you've done.
Why Sanctum, you ask? Simple: like I said earlier, my PM contained a hint about the location and I had begin from somewhere.
When you claim to have information about a location, you reveal that you haven't found your grimoire yet (in D1). I don't think it is really wise of town for everyone to reveal whether they still are vanilla or not, since that makes it easier for mafia to try and kill people with unlocked abilities.
Also, having part "and you can lie about it" in a plan is really stupid. Assuming we somehow end up catching someone lying, we have no way of telling whether it is mafia or town following the plan...
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Prophylaxis »
Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
I think that you were asking them a question you already knew the answer to figure out if their line of thought was like yours. I'm assuming you asked thme specifically because you are familiar with them and we're looking for a meta reaponse.
@Hunger
Re Post #106: I found it to be very non-committal. The vote is very weak and doesn't make sense from town mindset.
I'm not following you on the townslip you are claiming happened. Please elaborate.
re: townslip - His question to Bur means he obviously doesn't understand how searching works and hasn't really read the rules (later noted by Iso as well). I would imagine if he were scum, they would have shared information in some way and he would at least understand how Bur got that information.
hunger, whos scum and why? also whats your favorite color and why?
Not sure. Calling people scum before even a Day is through is not really my style. I don't really vote early or often. I like vote and role analysis more than behavior analysis and I hate Day 1. Right now my top suspect is Kam for what I mentioned earlier, his posts feel careful and calculated, but not really like he is adding anything or trying to figure anything out.
Color depends on what it's for, car? clothes? paint?. Typically, I like the black/white/gray spectrum, but am also a fan of blue and orange.
Hunger - you're surprised by Iso's RVS behaviour? I'm not especially based on some previous experience.
I've played one full game with Iso and it was a specialty that didn't have true mafia and was testing out a new mechanic. It was a while ago and don't even really remember what he did in RVS. I understand from what other people have said, he typically does some unconventional things. So I guess it's not that surprising, no. I just don't think he and a scumbuddy would so brazenly town clear each other in RVS.
What do you think of it? Are you saying Iso town clearing and calling out scum after a couple posts is normal? Does he do it as scum and town or just town?
Not sure how I feel about Iso. His questions have felt like he is trying to figure out the game, but stuff like apologizing to Ika for pushing him too much and the "scum" claim in RVS are weird. Feels like he could be trying too hard to be obvtown, which makes it seem forced and less genuine to me.
How does one force being obvtown, exactly? Isn't a player obvtown of their own merits, rather than by forcing it? How do you explain this disconnect?
When someone doesn't come off as genuine to me it feels forced. What else would someone be trying to force other than looking town? The tone of some of your posts read to me like you were TRYING to be towny instead of just being towny. But I also liked your questioning and thought it felt legit, so there was a disconnect that I made note of.
The way Iso and Bur towncleared each other off basically nothing makes me think they are at least not scum together.
I don't think Bur stated what you think he stated. Also, it wasn't "basically nothing".
Pretty sure at the time you called Bur town, he had only said that he would eat his hat if you stayed alive as scum, and announced that he searched Sanctum and there is a grimoire there. To me, that's basically nothing. Two posts with like a sentence each. Granted, I was thinking the revealing of his search right away was probably more likely coming from town.
I think that you were asking them a question you already knew the answer to figure out if their line of thought was like yours. I'm assuming you asked thme specifically because you are familiar with them and we're looking for a meta reaponse.
So why ask this question to Void if you already thought you knew what he was doing and you didn't find it suspicious?
So anyone notice how dciii painted 4 people as scummy in his last post? Gotta keep those options open.
@dciii
Who do you think is town?
If you think I'm painting people to make them look scummy then what specifically don't you like about my reads? You just attempted to dismiss my whole post as painting people as scummy and keeping my options open but if you actually thought that, you'd have had at least something to reference about my post that made you think that. Also, who was the fourth person that you think I painted as scummy in that post? If you legitimately thought that my reasoning was off, then you'd had to have read the post to come to that conclusion, which I don't think you did.
Votes on Hawk, please.
--
Bur is my strongest town read but I can't elaborate on those reasons atm, ika probably is because of #97, and I have lean town reads on Void (mostly meta) and Rhand because of the timing and way he reiterated his Iso vote.
So you say I'm scummy for my vote on bur and moving my vote around.
Do you disagree that scum generally have better formatted and mechanical posts then town due to reedditing them?
Also from my limited experience with citric, he seems to not contribute as much as other players. I'd rather pressure someone that will change the game for the better.It's interesting how I voted for citric before he checked in to say that he wanted to catch up later... and he's still not caught up.
@Iso - a few things I don't like about the above - The first part about making it clear that you would have voted sooner if you could have is what I thought you were doing and it's weird that you felt it necessary to let people know that you would have voted him sooner because the only post he made prior to when you'd last posted was #12. You'd have voted him just based on #12 - but despite #25 being part of the read that helped you build off of #12, you felt the need to specify that you would have voted for him beforehand.
So what was the purpose of that? Why does it matter when you'd have voted for him if #25 was still part of your read and you were voting for him then? It's an unnatural thing to focus on and feels like you were concerned with how your involvement with ika was perceived.
The purpose was to remind everyone that I can't bold on my phone, because I get really annoyed when people ask me where my vote is and I'm posting from my phone.
Quote from DCIII »
I also don't like your whole "would he really say this as scum?" play throughout - especially #52 in response to Rhand where you talk about, in retrospect, channeling Az - which feels fake because making so many jokes about being scum doesn't feel like something that you wouldn't have weighed the pros and cons of beforehand. Don't believe that you'd just now think about that being something Az does as scum - seems like that'd be something you'd be much more aware of when you were doing it.
I think that you were asking them a question you already knew the answer to figure out if their line of thought was like yours. I'm assuming you asked thme specifically because you are familiar with them and we're looking for a meta reaponse.
So why ask this question to Void if you already thought you knew what he was doing and you didn't find it suspicious?
So anyone notice how dciii painted 4 people as scummy in his last post? Gotta keep those options open.
@dciii
Who do you think is town?
If you think I'm painting people to make them look scummy then what specifically don't you like about my reads? You just attempted to dismiss my whole post as painting people as scummy and keeping my options open but if you actually thought that, you'd have had at least something to reference about my post that made you think that. Also, who was the fourth person that you think I painted as scummy in that post? If you legitimately thought that my reasoning was off, then you'd had to have read the post to come to that conclusion, which I don't think you did.
Votes on Hawk, please.
--
Bur is my strongest town read but I can't elaborate on those reasons atm, ika probably is because of #97, and I have lean town reads on Void (mostly meta) and Rhand because of the timing and way he reiterated his Iso vote.
I'm starting to lean town on Iso, as well.
Quoting is BS from the phone. Notice how you say what you don't like about Iso, then you say he us lean town when nothing that he posted between should have any bearing on his alignment. Did you forget your made up scum reads already?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
With that being said, why would you believe that I would use meta to help determine alignment?
I asked that question to the two of them to see where their mindset is at. Rhand's response was good, but in comparison to DCIII, it wasn't the best it could be. DCIII took the little bit of extra time to expand further on what I was asking.
I'm having trouble believing that you thought I would use meta there. There is no need to use meta in that situation. You have enough completed games to know this information. Inb4 ika meta . I haven't played any games with ika prior so getting to know his meta was very useful for me.
Either you are trying to play the dumb card here as Town or you are purposefully trying to get a reaction out of me that would allow you to vote me as Scum.
btw i lied about finding my grimstone. i just wanted to ignite some discussion with that. (IN B4 MASS WIFOM)
hawk, talk to me buddy, id DC "4 scum" thing is so scummywhy arent you voting him? i miss your archer play and it doesnt feel like its coming out here. wheres that abrasiveness that i saw?
hunger: lets go with favorite color when getting a role pm. what is the color your want to see
you have one power what would it be?
Are you scum?
are you town?
Why are you scum?
why are you town?
what is your favorite class you would want to be?
who is your tops scumspect and why?
who is your top town read and why?
-----------------------------------
i will start
you have one power what would it be? viggin powers so i can wreck shop
Are you scum? no
are you town? yes
Why are you scum? im not
why are you town? cus apparently this is my town meta again.
what is your favorite class you would want to be? mage OPed
who is your tops scumspect and why? iso: he claimed scum first post
hawk: doesnt feel like unreal tornament hawk
hunger: lots of his posts read "words,words,words"
anty: his play reminds me of our old game where he was scum
who are your top town reads and why? bur: transparent thoughts
void: hes straigt to the point about his things and doesnt sit around
Can you explain why you think Iso is scum Ika? Cus I'm kinda leaning soft town on him, his attacks on you felt a little forced (especially with the tone arguments he brought up), but his position shift and play from there felt a lot more genuine.
Vote: Rhand
This is a serious vote, not an RVS vote, because unless I'm understanding the setup incorrectly [redacted]
So you say I'm scummy for my vote on bur and moving my vote around.
Do you disagree that scum generally have better formatted and mechanical posts then town due to reedditing them?
Also from my limited experience with citric, he seems to not contribute as much as other players. I'd rather pressure someone that will change the game for the better.It's interesting how I voted for citric before he checked in to say that he wanted to catch up later... and he's still not caught up.
@Blur - Care you share how you got this information?
Hi Antny, have you read the rules yet?
Of course not. What kind of stupid question is that?
What makes it stupid, aside from the fact that you obviously hadn't read the rules yet? How were you planning on unlocking your role if you didn't know how?
Quote from Antny223 »
Quote from Antny223 »
@Iso you seem to be townreading players awfully easily so far. What makes you so sure Void/Blur are town?
I think I answered this already but for anyone who's not convinced on Void and Bur yet, just read their posts. Seriously.
I meant specifically at the time you cleared them. Subsequent posts don't matter. If you can link the posts where did that or restate please.
I don't feel like letting you use your "get 1 repeat free" card yet. Read my posts. They're hard to miss.
Quote from Antny223 »
Quote from Antny223 »
Kinda feels like a good spot to get on a wagon. Not really behind the idea of a wagon ika. Not sure of Iso. mirrorentity has been quieter than the last time we've played. I'll start there...
vote mirrorentity
What the hell is this? (This = a number of things that baffle me about the quoted segment, so feel free to be as detailed as possible.)
It's a vote. I even explained my reasons. You need detail fine. Let's get detailed.
I wanted a wagon. There were three players with two votes (ika/Iso/mirrorentity). I didn't want to vote ika (feels too much like ika from uPick and UnrealTournament so far, which is to say mislynchable town). That left you and mirrorentity. I could easily vote you here. In fact let's be frank I don't think there's a game we've played where I haven't read your posts and thought "Let's vote Iso". I've been told the feelings neutral ;). And then there's ME who hasn't started this game anything like the last I played with him (Walking Dead - you were in that too if you remember) so I voted there. So I guess we could say a weak meta read based on the idea I was voting something who already had two votes. Hope that's enough detail.
I'd care more but essentially we're not really out of rvs at this point. Most people haven't done much and the only reason we're on page 6 is you/ika and Void whittering like old women.
I'll read the rest later. Though it might be a nice idea to repost the screwed up part to make easier for everyone. Just saying.
I think you mean "mutual", not "neutral".
But sure, that seems reasonable. That said, it doesn't explain how awkward your lead-up to it is.
Not sure how I feel about Iso. His questions have felt like he is trying to figure out the game, but stuff like apologizing to Ika for pushing him too much and the "scum" claim in RVS are weird. Feels like he could be trying too hard to be obvtown, which makes it seem forced and less genuine to me.
How does one force being obvtown, exactly? Isn't a player obvtown of their own merits, rather than by forcing it? How do you explain this disconnect?
When someone doesn't come off as genuine to me it feels forced. What else would someone be trying to force other than looking town? The tone of some of your posts read to me like you were TRYING to be towny instead of just being towny. But I also liked your questioning and thought it felt legit, so there was a disconnect that I made note of.
But I'm scum, so where is your disconnect coming from?
The way Iso and Bur towncleared each other off basically nothing makes me think they are at least not scum together.
I don't think Bur stated what you think he stated. Also, it wasn't "basically nothing".
Pretty sure at the time you called Bur town, he had only said that he would eat his hat if you stayed alive as scum, and announced that he searched Sanctum and there is a grimoire there. To me, that's basically nothing. Two posts with like a sentence each. Granted, I was thinking the revealing of his search right away was probably more likely coming from town.
What he said wasn't why I thought he was town - it's how he said it. I'm surprised you haven't picked up on that by now.
1. you have one power what would it be?
2. Are you scum?
3. are you town?
4. Why are you scum?
5. why are you town?
6. what is your favorite class you would want to be?
7. who is your tops scumspect and why?
8. who is your top town read and why?
1. Bulletproof SK gogogo
2. Yes
3. No
4. Because my role PM says I'm scum
5. I'm not
6. My scumbuddies didn't post their role PMs in our pre-game chat, so the only class I know is mine. Which I guess I'm fine with having?
7. Me, because there's red in my role PM; Hunger, because wtf? + copying my townreads and my reasons for my townreads; Arch, because significant lack of effort; Antny, because wtf?; hawk, because dumb; and ME, because uncompelling. But, I can't have 5 scumbuddies - that would just be silly. So I guess sort out the WIFOM when I'm dead?
8. Void, because I have a psychic link to his role PMs at all times; Bur, because his thought process is transparent; ika, because his emotional explosion was town.
-
Vote Arch
* I don't see how anyone can think ika is scum at this point.
* Arch has contributed literally nothing to the game - which is saying something, considering Citric is just now catching up and ME has been 100% uncompelling.
* Arch failed to answer my question (which I guess isn't really alignment-contingent, but still annoys me).
* Arch isn't scumhunting.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
So you say I'm scummy for my vote on bur and moving my vote around.
Do you disagree that scum generally have better formatted and mechanical posts then town due to reedditing them?
Also from my limited experience with citric, he seems to not contribute as much as other players. I'd rather pressure someone that will change the game for the better.It's interesting how I voted for citric before he checked in to say that he wanted to catch up later... and he's still not caught up.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@ME
You misunderstood what I was saying about PR's. The Town PR's are what catch lying Scum and the more Days that go by the more PR's the Town will unlock to catch Scum lying.
I'm certain you have figured out at this point that I wasn't Scum hunting Bur in that post. I just noted it was weird since Night Talk is the normal for most Mafia games.
@ika
Fishing! How dare you! I'll comply.
Cult or Jester Seriously though, Unlynchable
No
Yes
I'm not Scum. And those who know my meta well enough know that I am not Scum.
Because I am Town and most players already know this.
Class? Meh.
Top Scum: Hunger followed by Arch then you, ika.
Top Town: DCIII
Don't care to answer why since it is in the thread and people need to read the game.
Pretty sure I made it clear that it's valuable to the town to just assume you are town given you are better at town then at scum. Why would I be looking for reasons to vote you after saying that?
you have one power what would it be?
Are you scum?
are you town?
Why are you scum?
why are you town?
what is your favorite class you would want to be?
who is your tops scumspect and why?
who is your top town read and why?
Mason with proph.
No
Yes
I'm not
because I'm in a good mood about this game and I hate being scum
No idea, I guess the one I got?
There are a few people that I'm interested in, dciiis vote is bad which gives me question, I need to figure out if archon is derp town or scum and there are still a couple unknowns.
Going in to unreal tournament, I had lost the past 5 games before that so my resolve was very high which made me more serious. Secondly fulcrum tried to frustrate me as a scum tactic which made me more emotional than normal.
I asked him, void followed up with a response but not a direct answer.
No but my point was if your thought was that he was doing what you said most recently (which implied he was acting in a town way), why did you ask him to begin with?
So you say I'm scummy for my vote on bur and moving my vote around.
Do you disagree that scum generally have better formatted and mechanical posts then town due to reedditing them?
Also from my limited experience with citric, he seems to not contribute as much as other players. I'd rather pressure someone that will change the game for the better.It's interesting how I voted for citric before he checked in to say that he wanted to catch up later... and he's still not caught up.
You voted Bur for tone, that's not why I suspect you. Your immediate post after that post was a question to Bur that felt like a throw away (and later you moved your vote from him without getting an answer to that question). I think you put a vote on Bur and then thought that you needed to add something to it so added that question after the fact.
Iso calls out your post and then just a few posts later, your opinion on Bur changed and you voted Citric who hadn't posted yet and Bur hadn't once posted in between.
So, it's not that you moved your vote, it's when you moved your vote and who you moved it to. There was nothing from Bur within that time window and you had a question outstanding to him which didn't get answered.
To your point on Citric - he hadn't checked in yet. It would be one thing to vote him to add pressure if he was around and not doing anything, he's posted once saying that he wouldn't be able to catch up until later and your vote on him came prior to that. There were plenty of things happening in the game but rather than press those, you put your vote on the player who hadn't posted yet.
Quoting is BS from the phone. Notice how you say what you don't like about Iso, then you say he us lean town when nothing that he posted between should have any bearing on his alignment. Did you forget your made up scum reads already?
Look at the language you've used "Did you forget your made up scum reads already," "keeping your options open" "painted 4 people as scum" three smears and yet your vote is on Citric, who hasn't delivered content yet.
Firstly, I clearly didn't forget my thoughts on Iso note the "am starting to" - but what Iso posted in response to me did have bearing on my read of him.
------
@Iso - I agree with your thoughts on Kamikaze, but am more confident on Hawk and would rather lynch him. What do you think of my Hawk case?
So you say I'm scummy for my vote on bur and moving my vote around.
Do you disagree that scum generally have better formatted and mechanical posts then town due to reedditing them?
Also from my limited experience with citric, he seems to not contribute as much as other players. I'd rather pressure someone that will change the game for the better.It's interesting how I voted for citric before he checked in to say that he wanted to catch up later... and he's still not caught up.
Bolded statement contradicts itself
I don't see how
"he doesn't post much"
"I want to place my vote such that it makes an impact"
*voted me earlier*
you have one power what would it be?
Are you scum?
are you town?
Why are you scum?
why are you town?
what is your favorite class you would want to be?
who is your tops scumspect and why?
who is your top town read and why?
Cop. Or investigative of some sort.
No
Yes
Not
RNG
Not familiar with Vagrant Story, so not sure what exists in that world, but typically a Warrior type class. Big armor, big 2h weapons.
Kam. He isn't really doing anything and his posts seem forced/constructed.
Antny. I believe the townslip I pointed out was just that.
Top Scum: Hunger followed by Arch then you, ika.
Top Town: DCIII
Don't care to answer why since it is in the thread and people need to read the game.
To be fair, you haven't actually given any reasoning on me or Arch. I figured your questioning me after your naked vote was going to lead to an explanation, but nothing yet. And you literally haven't said anything about Arch. You asked Rhand and DC what they thought of one of his posts, but have said nothing one way or the other for yourself.
You did, however, say you thought Antny's vote doesn't make sense from town, where does he fall then?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Generally I figure out who is town and then work with them to solve the game. It's just how I operate. It's why I asked void that question and I'm much better at finding town then nailing down scum.
@KamikazeArchon
Can you briefly explain Ika's MO as a player after your experience with him in unreal?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
now i have to go see where i posted it
how about you answer it for me as well
Also, blue. Preferably navy blue, but most mid-to-deep blues sit well with me.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Fair enough. The other option was there was something in your role PM. Did you have any reason to focus on the Sanctum?
I'm not so sure on this. You've essentially claimed that you have to find a grimoire to activate a power. At best you've declared not having a power night 1 (and you could still be lying about that). I don't see the downside in what you've done.
Not particularly. Scum powers can include things designed to counter town powers or locate them but sometimes there can get extra kills and stuff which is more powerful than town extra kills. It's too early to make assumptions over the setup.
/barn
Well let you do the benefit of doubt of assuming your not behind a mirrorentity wagon either Why don't you try and persuade of a better place for my vote ME?
@Void - First in a nonbasic what makes you so sure it will be easy to catch scum lying about PR? Second, when was the last time you played a game without night talk? Like anywhere, at anytime?
Of course not. What kind of stupid question is that?
I meant specifically at the time you cleared them. Subsequent posts don't matter. If you can link the posts where did that or restate please.
It's a vote. I even explained my reasons. You need detail fine. Let's get detailed.
I wanted a wagon. There were three players with two votes (ika/Iso/mirrorentity). I didn't want to vote ika (feels too much like ika from uPick and UnrealTournament so far, which is to say mislynchable town). That left you and mirrorentity. I could easily vote you here. In fact let's be frank I don't think there's a game we've played where I haven't read your posts and thought "Let's vote Iso". I've been told the feelings neutral ;). And then there's ME who hasn't started this game anything like the last I played with him (Walking Dead - you were in that too if you remember) so I voted there. So I guess we could say a weak meta read based on the idea I was voting something who already had two votes. Hope that's enough detail.
I'd care more but essentially we're not really out of rvs at this point. Most people haven't done much and the only reason we're on page 6 is you/ika and Void whittering like old women.
I'll read the rest later. Though it might be a nice idea to repost the screwed up part to make easier for everyone. Just saying.
Regarding the bolded part: At 2AM, counting one plus one can be surprisingly hard.
Regarding the information: I disagree. Even though formal vote might be bit too much, I think we should seek to come to an agreement regarding the information. We aren't doing full disclosure, but I think we shouldn't still withhold all the information.
Why Sanctum, you ask? Simple: like I said earlier, my PM contained a hint about the location and I had begin from somewhere.
When you claim to have information about a location, you reveal that you haven't found your grimoire yet (in D1). I don't think it is really wise of town for everyone to reveal whether they still are vanilla or not, since that makes it easier for mafia to try and kill people with unlocked abilities.
Also, having part "and you can lie about it" in a plan is really stupid. Assuming we somehow end up catching someone lying, we have no way of telling whether it is mafia or town following the plan...
I think that you were asking them a question you already knew the answer to figure out if their line of thought was like yours. I'm assuming you asked thme specifically because you are familiar with them and we're looking for a meta reaponse.
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@dciii
Who do you think is town?
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Not sure. Calling people scum before even a Day is through is not really my style. I don't really vote early or often. I like vote and role analysis more than behavior analysis and I hate Day 1. Right now my top suspect is Kam for what I mentioned earlier, his posts feel careful and calculated, but not really like he is adding anything or trying to figure anything out.
Color depends on what it's for, car? clothes? paint?. Typically, I like the black/white/gray spectrum, but am also a fan of blue and orange.
I've played one full game with Iso and it was a specialty that didn't have true mafia and was testing out a new mechanic. It was a while ago and don't even really remember what he did in RVS. I understand from what other people have said, he typically does some unconventional things. So I guess it's not that surprising, no. I just don't think he and a scumbuddy would so brazenly town clear each other in RVS.
What do you think of it? Are you saying Iso town clearing and calling out scum after a couple posts is normal? Does he do it as scum and town or just town?
When someone doesn't come off as genuine to me it feels forced. What else would someone be trying to force other than looking town? The tone of some of your posts read to me like you were TRYING to be towny instead of just being towny. But I also liked your questioning and thought it felt legit, so there was a disconnect that I made note of.
Pretty sure at the time you called Bur town, he had only said that he would eat his hat if you stayed alive as scum, and announced that he searched Sanctum and there is a grimoire there. To me, that's basically nothing. Two posts with like a sentence each. Granted, I was thinking the revealing of his search right away was probably more likely coming from town.
So why ask this question to Void if you already thought you knew what he was doing and you didn't find it suspicious?
If you think I'm painting people to make them look scummy then what specifically don't you like about my reads? You just attempted to dismiss my whole post as painting people as scummy and keeping my options open but if you actually thought that, you'd have had at least something to reference about my post that made you think that. Also, who was the fourth person that you think I painted as scummy in that post? If you legitimately thought that my reasoning was off, then you'd had to have read the post to come to that conclusion, which I don't think you did.
Votes on Hawk, please.
--
Bur is my strongest town read but I can't elaborate on those reasons atm, ika probably is because of #97, and I have lean town reads on Void (mostly meta) and Rhand because of the timing and way he reiterated his Iso vote.
I'm starting to lean town on Iso, as well.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
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Do you disagree that scum generally have better formatted and mechanical posts then town due to reedditing them?
Also from my limited experience with citric, he seems to not contribute as much as other players. I'd rather pressure someone that will change the game for the better.It's interesting how I voted for citric before he checked in to say that he wanted to catch up later... and he's still not caught up.
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Quoting is BS from the phone. Notice how you say what you don't like about Iso, then you say he us lean town when nothing that he posted between should have any bearing on his alignment. Did you forget your made up scum reads already?
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{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I didn't realize I joined a Basic game...
How much stock do you put into meta reads?
Outdated Mafia Stats
I asked that question to the two of them to see where their mindset is at. Rhand's response was good, but in comparison to DCIII, it wasn't the best it could be. DCIII took the little bit of extra time to expand further on what I was asking.
I'm having trouble believing that you thought I would use meta there. There is no need to use meta in that situation. You have enough completed games to know this information. Inb4 ika meta . I haven't played any games with ika prior so getting to know his meta was very useful for me.
Either you are trying to play the dumb card here as Town or you are purposefully trying to get a reaction out of me that would allow you to vote me as Scum.
btw i lied about finding my grimstone. i just wanted to ignite some discussion with that. (IN B4 MASS WIFOM)
hawk, talk to me buddy, id DC "4 scum" thing is so scummywhy arent you voting him? i miss your archer play and it doesnt feel like its coming out here. wheres that abrasiveness that i saw?
hunger: lets go with favorite color when getting a role pm. what is the color your want to see
this gamestate is boring me
RQS time!
you have one power what would it be?
Are you scum?
are you town?
Why are you scum?
why are you town?
what is your favorite class you would want to be?
who is your tops scumspect and why?
who is your top town read and why?
-----------------------------------
i will start
you have one power what would it be?
viggin powers so i can wreck shop
Are you scum?
no
are you town?
yes
Why are you scum?
im not
why are you town?
cus apparently this is my town meta again.
what is your favorite class you would want to be?
mage OPed
who is your tops scumspect and why?
iso: he claimed scum first post
hawk: doesnt feel like unreal tornament hawk
hunger: lots of his posts read "words,words,words"
anty: his play reminds me of our old game where he was scum
who are your top town reads and why?
bur: transparent thoughts
void: hes straigt to the point about his things and doesnt sit around
This - "cus apparently this is my town meta again." - is too self-aware. town!ika was not self-aware at all in UT.
if i really knew what the key diffrence was between my town and scum meta (besicdes activity) i would like ot try to emulate it.
Ika, feel free to town-clear me whenever it's blatantly obvious enough to you (which will probably happen once I've posted enough)
Vote: Rhand
This is a serious vote, not an RVS vote, because unless I'm understanding the setup incorrectly [redacted]
Bolded statement contradicts itself
What makes it stupid, aside from the fact that you obviously hadn't read the rules yet? How were you planning on unlocking your role if you didn't know how?
I don't feel like letting you use your "get 1 repeat free" card yet. Read my posts. They're hard to miss.
I think you mean "mutual", not "neutral".
But sure, that seems reasonable. That said, it doesn't explain how awkward your lead-up to it is.
But I'm scum, so where is your disconnect coming from?
What he said wasn't why I thought he was town - it's how he said it. I'm surprised you haven't picked up on that by now.
I'm not getting that vibe from me, at all. Don't let me fool you, I'm dangerous!
LOOK HOW WELL THAT WORKED OUT
Tell me what you think you learned from the few comments made on your claim.
Am I still answering Hunger's questions, too? Because I personally love being Neutrals the best. SK and Cultist ftw. So, Gray.
So why not engage people directly?
1. Bulletproof SK gogogo
2. Yes
3. No
4. Because my role PM says I'm scum
5. I'm not
6. My scumbuddies didn't post their role PMs in our pre-game chat, so the only class I know is mine. Which I guess I'm fine with having?
7. Me, because there's red in my role PM; Hunger, because wtf? + copying my townreads and my reasons for my townreads; Arch, because significant lack of effort; Antny, because wtf?; hawk, because dumb; and ME, because uncompelling. But, I can't have 5 scumbuddies - that would just be silly. So I guess sort out the WIFOM when I'm dead?
8. Void, because I have a psychic link to his role PMs at all times; Bur, because his thought process is transparent; ika, because his emotional explosion was town.
-
Vote Arch
* I don't see how anyone can think ika is scum at this point.
* Arch has contributed literally nothing to the game - which is saying something, considering Citric is just now catching up and ME has been 100% uncompelling.
* Arch failed to answer my question (which I guess isn't really alignment-contingent, but still annoys me).
* Arch isn't scumhunting.
Let's make this happen.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I don't see how
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
You misunderstood what I was saying about PR's. The Town PR's are what catch lying Scum and the more Days that go by the more PR's the Town will unlock to catch Scum lying.
I'm certain you have figured out at this point that I wasn't Scum hunting Bur in that post. I just noted it was weird since Night Talk is the normal for most Mafia games.
@ika
Fishing! How dare you! I'll comply.
Cult or Jester Seriously though, Unlynchable
No
Yes
I'm not Scum. And those who know my meta well enough know that I am not Scum.
Because I am Town and most players already know this.
Class? Meh.
Top Scum: Hunger followed by Arch then you, ika.
Top Town: DCIII
Don't care to answer why since it is in the thread and people need to read the game.
Pretty sure I made it clear that it's valuable to the town to just assume you are town given you are better at town then at scum. Why would I be looking for reasons to vote you after saying that?
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Outdated Mafia Stats
Going in to unreal tournament, I had lost the past 5 games before that so my resolve was very high which made me more serious. Secondly fulcrum tried to frustrate me as a scum tactic which made me more emotional than normal.
What do you think of kamikaze so far?
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No but my point was if your thought was that he was doing what you said most recently (which implied he was acting in a town way), why did you ask him to begin with?
You voted Bur for tone, that's not why I suspect you. Your immediate post after that post was a question to Bur that felt like a throw away (and later you moved your vote from him without getting an answer to that question). I think you put a vote on Bur and then thought that you needed to add something to it so added that question after the fact.
Iso calls out your post and then just a few posts later, your opinion on Bur changed and you voted Citric who hadn't posted yet and Bur hadn't once posted in between.
So, it's not that you moved your vote, it's when you moved your vote and who you moved it to. There was nothing from Bur within that time window and you had a question outstanding to him which didn't get answered.
To your point on Citric - he hadn't checked in yet. It would be one thing to vote him to add pressure if he was around and not doing anything, he's posted once saying that he wouldn't be able to catch up until later and your vote on him came prior to that. There were plenty of things happening in the game but rather than press those, you put your vote on the player who hadn't posted yet.
Look at the language you've used "Did you forget your made up scum reads already," "keeping your options open" "painted 4 people as scum" three smears and yet your vote is on Citric, who hasn't delivered content yet.
Firstly, I clearly didn't forget my thoughts on Iso note the "am starting to" - but what Iso posted in response to me did have bearing on my read of him.
------
@Iso - I agree with your thoughts on Kamikaze, but am more confident on Hawk and would rather lynch him. What do you think of my Hawk case?
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
"he doesn't post much"
"I want to place my vote such that it makes an impact"
*voted me earlier*
Cop. Or investigative of some sort.
No
Yes
Not
RNG
Not familiar with Vagrant Story, so not sure what exists in that world, but typically a Warrior type class. Big armor, big 2h weapons.
Kam. He isn't really doing anything and his posts seem forced/constructed.
Antny. I believe the townslip I pointed out was just that.
To be fair, you haven't actually given any reasoning on me or Arch. I figured your questioning me after your naked vote was going to lead to an explanation, but nothing yet. And you literally haven't said anything about Arch. You asked Rhand and DC what they thought of one of his posts, but have said nothing one way or the other for yourself.
You did, however, say you thought Antny's vote doesn't make sense from town, where does he fall then?
-
@DCIII: Seems legit.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yes, I was just on my phone and it's hard to multi-quote there
I went ahead and recorded this vote, but in the future everyone please remember that...
Please keep up with current vote counts and posting them. We are nearing 200 posts in the game and you have not supplied one.
I will respond later when I have more time. I'm packing and moving for the next few days. V/LA until Monday.
Generally I figure out who is town and then work with them to solve the game. It's just how I operate. It's why I asked void that question and I'm much better at finding town then nailing down scum.
@KamikazeArchon
Can you briefly explain Ika's MO as a player after your experience with him in unreal?
Outdated Mafia Stats
Outdated Mafia Stats
Outdated Mafia Stats
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@hawk i think kazi is just being his same derp self as again.
i need to get a few things done but then i will most likely get around to doing stuff here