A new Shriekmaw variant that sweeps up small creatures. The flexibility is really nice, although the ETB trigger can be detrimental to you as well. This can be very matchup dependent and is pretty useless against a lot of combo decks, but it still has evasion and hits hard by itself. This is a good option if you're looking for more versatile removal / sweepers for control decks.
If it was "Your opponent's creatures", then I think this would be a very good card, but since its "all other creatures", then this make it a weak to unplayable option for toolbox decks, thus really limiting it.
If it was "Your opponent's creatures", then I think this would be a very good card, but since its "all other creatures", then this make it a weak to unplayable option for toolbox decks, thus really limiting it.
Thus, my instinct says no.
If you are ahead on board and playing this would be unadvantageous then you can just use the targeted removal ability which is fine and certainly not unplayable. When the board state is good for you to play this its going to be very strong.
If it was "Your opponent's creatures", then I think this would be a very good card, but since its "all other creatures", then this make it a weak to unplayable option for toolbox decks, thus really limiting it.
This is more of a flexible card for control, not so much for a toolbox midrange card. Need to think of it like Wrath of God / Damnation and build around its symmetrical effects. I'm always looking to give control more options, so I might give this a test.
If it was "Your opponent's creatures", then I think this would be a very good card, but since its "all other creatures", then this make it a weak to unplayable option for toolbox decks, thus really limiting it.
This is more of a flexible card for control, not so much for a toolbox midrange card. Need to think of it like Wrath of God / Damnation and build around its symmetrical effects. I'm always looking to give control more options, so I might give this a test.
I could see this as viable, but cuts are becoming increasingly hard to find/ justify nowadays. There are quite a few cards I'm interested in from the new set, but I have no idea what to cut - Mostly just waiting on yourself/ wtwlf.
Necron Deathmark is a card that I tested out of the blue alongside Royal Warden. I predicted Warden would test much better, but Necron Deathmark ended up vastly over performing my expectations and has been a huge hit in my playgroup. It's often a 3 for 1 in combat and can kill you really fast afterwards. It often feels like a mono black Fractured Identity with the added benefit of being a creature and an artifact.
On one hand, this is more versatile than Necron Deathmark since it's modal and can bin itself in the graveyard. On the other hand, it's a more narrow effect than Necron Deathmark and its symmetry means it can't just be shoved into any deck like Necron Deathmark can. Still, its ability to sweep away small creatures in combination with menace makes it a reliable stabilizer / win condition in the late game. Not being able to sweep away larger creatures isn't too much of an issue since black can already deal with any sized creatures / planeswalkers fairly reliable anyways.
Having slept on Necron Deathmark, I don't want to sleep on this one as well. It's definitely at least worth a test, especially since control could use some more help slowing the game down.
Good card, but not sure I'll find room for it. I think I like Primaris Eliminator better than this, it doesn't have the cheap mode but its sweep effect is one-sided which is huge, and it can also snipe a single big target with its other mode.
I think that I’d also prefer to play Primaris Eliminator over this. Primaris Eliminator is on the outside looking in for me currently (playing Necron Deathmark and Junji). This definitely has a better body than Eliminator, but the symmetrical effect isn’t quite selling it for me at this rate.
Being able to play Eliminator and then attack is a big swing this can’t really provide.
I prefer this to the Primaris Eliminator.
The cheap mode is a huge part of what makes this card good.
You will mostly be casting it for the cheap mode.
It's like, imagine the difference between a walking ballista that can't be played for x = 1 and a walking ballista that can.
The difference between those two cards are considerably smaller than the difference between this card with it's discard mode and this card without it.
The flexibility is definitely strong. It’s also ultimately a different card than Eliminator. I agree with steve_man that this is more of a control card, while I think Eliminator is more of a midrange card. Imo it depends on which deck you want to support more, and my group enjoys a good midrange deck.
I think that this is competing more directly with Necron Deathmark, which I think fits in better for a control deck than Eliminator, and I’m not interested in cutting Deathmark for this.
EDIT: This does kill about 60% of the creatures in my cube, and I think if I was considering this, I’d be considering it with the discard as the primary mode (and the card I’d be cutting for it). I might see how I feel about it over Go for the Throat, which I like more than considering a 5-drop creature. I currently categorize Beanstalk Giant this way, although I don’t categorize Bonecrusher Giant this way.
The cheap mode is a huge part of what makes this card good.
You will mostly be casting it for the cheap mode.
Better body also, which is a big reason why Necron Deathmark is so good. Primaris Eliminator never felt great unless you were sweeping. The flexibility of being able to channel this for 2 mana is more desirable to me than the flexibility of the Murder mode in a control deck. This having a big body, ability to sweep, and having a channel ability really makes this much more versatile than other creatures with ETB sweep modes.
Other cards are more valuable in midrange decks, but black control decks specifically need more tools like this. I think it's at least worth testing or as a holdover until something better comes around. This + Nuclear Fallout is a good jolt in the arm for black control.
Comparing this to Shriekmaw is interesting.
I'd argue that Shriekmaw's body is better than this, considering it's more splashable and has better evasion, while this card is also risking killing your own stuff.
However, in modern cube, I'd argue that this channel ability is better than Shriekmaw's evoke, since it's instant speed and kills more targets.
Overall I'd say that both are quite comparable, which means this card should probably be an easy include.
I like this card, and I might try to make room for it. I like Shriekmaw-style effects; having a cheap option and a full-cost option is powerful. This one is limited on which decks can run it though, since the Infest effect isn't for every deck.
I'm surprised no one compared this to Troll of Khazad-dûm yet. I think having another black self discard creature might be great to help smooth out reanimator decks.
Comparing this to Shriekmaw is interesting.
I'd argue that Shriekmaw's body is better than this, considering it's more splashable and has better evasion, while this card is also risking killing your own stuff.
However, in modern cube, I'd argue that this channel ability is better than Shriekmaw's evoke, since it's instant speed and kills more targets.
Overall I'd say that both are quite comparable, which means this card should probably be an easy include.
Id argue this body is much better than shriekmaws.
a 1/4 or so creatures in my cube render shriekmaw a measly 3/2.
Most decks are 2+ colors making the chances you encounter a creature it can’t kill or attack through reasonably high.
shriekmawks achilles heel is that it can’t kill the creatures it can’t attack through.
this creature has none of those problems. Its ETB trigger is synergistic with menace (reduces the ability for cheap creatures to double block).
4 Toughness makes it more resilient to removal and good on defense. 5 power hits like a truck.
Seems very good. I like it as an alernative to Shriekmaw. The restrictions of Shriekmaw are pretty annoying at times, but -2/-2 is hardly reliable removal.
I was way overhyped for Primaris Eliminator, so when I see another Black 5-drop with a sweeping effect alarms start going off in my head. I do like the flexibility of Harvester's Disfigure mode far more than the Eliminator's Chupacabra mode. But I still have this sinking feeling that this card is going to be relegated to the sideboard way too often.
Testing so far has been very positive, much better than Primaris Eliminator due to its modal cost, ability to bin itself, and bigger body. This card can be down right oppressive against aggro / go-wide decks, especially if you have ways to recur it. This weekend my reanimator opponent swept my board 3 times in one game, the only reason I was able to recover each time was because I had Bitterblossom + Staff of the Storyteller. hadThe ceiling is much higher than Shriekmaw and is more effective against its bad matchups with its much more relevant body. Shriekmaw's ability to bin itself, kill a wide variety of creatures, and contest monarch / initiative with its evasion is still pretty valuable enough to deal with occasionally siding it out.
Testing so far has been very positive, much better than Primaris Eliminator due to its modal cost, ability to bin itself, and bigger body. This card can be down right oppressive against aggro / go-wide decks, especially if you have ways to recur it. This weekend my reanimator opponent swept my board 3 times in one game, the only reason I was able to recover each time was because I had Bitterblossom + Staff of the Storyteller. hadThe ceiling is much higher than Shriekmaw and is more effective against its bad matchups with its much more relevant body. Shriekmaw's ability to bin itself, kill a wide variety of creatures, and contest monarch / initiative with its evasion is still pretty valuable enough to deal with occasionally siding it out.
Shriekmaw's sorcery speed has been very problematic and Cut Down has been a bit too narrow. I'm glad to have this as a replacement.
Testing so far has been very positive, much better than Primaris Eliminator due to its modal cost, ability to bin itself, and bigger body. This card can be down right oppressive against aggro / go-wide decks, especially if you have ways to recur it. This weekend my reanimator opponent swept my board 3 times in one game, the only reason I was able to recover each time was because I had Bitterblossom + Staff of the Storyteller. hadThe ceiling is much higher than Shriekmaw and is more effective against its bad matchups with its much more relevant body. Shriekmaw's ability to bin itself, kill a wide variety of creatures, and contest monarch / initiative with its evasion is still pretty valuable enough to deal with occasionally siding it out.
Shriekmaw's sorcery speed has been very problematic and Cut Down has been a bit too narrow. I'm glad to have this as a replacement.
sorry to derail, but I’ve had opposite experiences with cut down recently.
it’s so good against the busted red 3 drops and more decks than ever utilize cheap utility creatures. (Killing hullbreacher for 1 mana at instant speed etc)
I had it below fatal push and blood chiefs thirst at first and now I rank it above. (Fatal push triggering revolt is an issue, but it’s still good)
Bloodchief's Thirst > Cut Down > Fatal Push for me. Fatal Push is fine, but it was replaced in favor of Harvester of Misery. Fatal Push really needs non-singleton fetches to be better than Cut Down, IMO. Cut Down has gotten more important to me since it's much more reliable at killing key dangerous 3 drops like Hullbreacher / Bombardiers / Gut / most other Rabblemasters / most Kiki-Twin pieces / etc. Most of the really threatening 3-cmc creatures have 2 toughness, making Shock effects or things like Harvester of Misery still pretty effective. Fatal Push not being reliable answer against these power creeped 3-cmc creatures is a liability, IMO.
Played against it in a friends cube and I was fairly impressed. Having menace on something that sweeps away all the little dudes is pretty effective.
It's removal spell was more effective than I thought. Turns out an uncounterable disfigure that dumps a solid creature into the yard, is better than I gave it credit for.
A new Shriekmaw variant that sweeps up small creatures. The flexibility is really nice, although the ETB trigger can be detrimental to you as well. This can be very matchup dependent and is pretty useless against a lot of combo decks, but it still has evasion and hits hard by itself. This is a good option if you're looking for more versatile removal / sweepers for control decks.
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Thus, my instinct says no.
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If you are ahead on board and playing this would be unadvantageous then you can just use the targeted removal ability which is fine and certainly not unplayable. When the board state is good for you to play this its going to be very strong.
Going to test this for sure.
This is more of a flexible card for control, not so much for a toolbox midrange card. Need to think of it like Wrath of God / Damnation and build around its symmetrical effects. I'm always looking to give control more options, so I might give this a test.
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I could see this as viable, but cuts are becoming increasingly hard to find/ justify nowadays. There are quite a few cards I'm interested in from the new set, but I have no idea what to cut - Mostly just waiting on yourself/ wtwlf.
At the hard casted rate alone it almost gets there.. add in the alternative casted mode (that plays well with reanimation) and it’s a slam dunk.
Massacre girl isn’t far off cube level and this adds an almost on rate self pitch discard mode as an alternative option.
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On one hand, this is more versatile than Necron Deathmark since it's modal and can bin itself in the graveyard. On the other hand, it's a more narrow effect than Necron Deathmark and its symmetry means it can't just be shoved into any deck like Necron Deathmark can. Still, its ability to sweep away small creatures in combination with menace makes it a reliable stabilizer / win condition in the late game. Not being able to sweep away larger creatures isn't too much of an issue since black can already deal with any sized creatures / planeswalkers fairly reliable anyways.
Having slept on Necron Deathmark, I don't want to sleep on this one as well. It's definitely at least worth a test, especially since control could use some more help slowing the game down.
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Being able to play Eliminator and then attack is a big swing this can’t really provide.
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The cheap mode is a huge part of what makes this card good.
You will mostly be casting it for the cheap mode.
It's like, imagine the difference between a walking ballista that can't be played for x = 1 and a walking ballista that can.
The difference between those two cards are considerably smaller than the difference between this card with it's discard mode and this card without it.
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I think that this is competing more directly with Necron Deathmark, which I think fits in better for a control deck than Eliminator, and I’m not interested in cutting Deathmark for this.
EDIT: This does kill about 60% of the creatures in my cube, and I think if I was considering this, I’d be considering it with the discard as the primary mode (and the card I’d be cutting for it). I might see how I feel about it over Go for the Throat, which I like more than considering a 5-drop creature. I currently categorize Beanstalk Giant this way, although I don’t categorize Bonecrusher Giant this way.
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Better body also, which is a big reason why Necron Deathmark is so good. Primaris Eliminator never felt great unless you were sweeping. The flexibility of being able to channel this for 2 mana is more desirable to me than the flexibility of the Murder mode in a control deck. This having a big body, ability to sweep, and having a channel ability really makes this much more versatile than other creatures with ETB sweep modes.
Other cards are more valuable in midrange decks, but black control decks specifically need more tools like this. I think it's at least worth testing or as a holdover until something better comes around. This + Nuclear Fallout is a good jolt in the arm for black control.
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I'd argue that Shriekmaw's body is better than this, considering it's more splashable and has better evasion, while this card is also risking killing your own stuff.
However, in modern cube, I'd argue that this channel ability is better than Shriekmaw's evoke, since it's instant speed and kills more targets.
Overall I'd say that both are quite comparable, which means this card should probably be an easy include.
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Id argue this body is much better than shriekmaws.
a 1/4 or so creatures in my cube render shriekmaw a measly 3/2.
Most decks are 2+ colors making the chances you encounter a creature it can’t kill or attack through reasonably high.
shriekmawks achilles heel is that it can’t kill the creatures it can’t attack through.
this creature has none of those problems. Its ETB trigger is synergistic with menace (reduces the ability for cheap creatures to double block).
4 Toughness makes it more resilient to removal and good on defense. 5 power hits like a truck.
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Shriekmaw's sorcery speed has been very problematic and Cut Down has been a bit too narrow. I'm glad to have this as a replacement.
sorry to derail, but I’ve had opposite experiences with cut down recently.
it’s so good against the busted red 3 drops and more decks than ever utilize cheap utility creatures. (Killing hullbreacher for 1 mana at instant speed etc)
I had it below fatal push and blood chiefs thirst at first and now I rank it above. (Fatal push triggering revolt is an issue, but it’s still good)
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It's removal spell was more effective than I thought. Turns out an uncounterable disfigure that dumps a solid creature into the yard, is better than I gave it credit for.