I have a soft spot for Rebels, and one of my recurring themes has been to shift them into red for a set. I think white-red is the natural color pie home of a Rebel faction, as they would be coming together in a common cause (white) to fight passionately for freedom (red). I don't think the mechanical identity of searching up the chain is something that we would see reprinted for several reasons, such as the time required for tutoring/shuffling, the repetition it brings to games, and the fact that it wouldn't fit well into red mechanically and I don't think it makes all that much sense for a ragtag group of rebels flavorfully.
I thought of a somewhat boring but functional mechanic that would fit these criteria and create a somewhat new twist on tribal play. The idea is that the Rebels convert others to their cause and inspire them to fight, adding the Rebel creature type along with a +1/+1 counter. Associating counters with the type addition would alleviate some of the memory issues, thought it also means that other counter adding in the set would have to be kept to a minimum, or conversely that the mechanic might spread to green a bit.
Making this a keyword action gives it some flexibility. "Motivate" seems like a decent word to capture the flavor, although maybe it's a bit tame. "Instigate" is cool but has a slightly negative nuance, "inspire" is unfortunately too close to inspiration, and "arouse" or "excite" would induce too many facepalms with the man-children in my playgroup. Open to other suggestions though.
The basic applications are pretty obvious, so I won't bore you with 5 different ETB motivate french vanilla guys and the obligatory motivate combat tricks, but here are some experiments/support cards. Also, I thought about making it only possible to motivate non-Rebels, but I don't think that adds enough flavorfully to be worth the complexity. I think creatures should by convention only motivate other creatures, though.
Rebel Instigator2R
Creature - Human Rebel (U)
Flash, haste
When Rebel Instigator enters the battlefield, motivate another target creature. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.) That creature attacks this turn if able.
2/1
For the Cause2W
Enchantment (U)
Whenever a creature you control dies, motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)
(Could make this only trigger when a Rebel creature you control dies, but I'd probably want it to be a creature itself then. Might be a line to use on a lord.)
Sway to the Cause3R
Enchantment - Aura (U)
Enchant creature
You control enchanted creature as long as you control another Rebel creature.
Stir the Populace3WW
Sorcery (C)
Put a 1/1 white Human creature token onto the battlefield, then motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)
Repeat this process two more times.
Sympathetic Orgg1RR
Creature - Orgg (R)
Haste
At the beginning of each end step, sacrifice Sympathetic Orgg unless it has a counter on it.
4/4
Sparkbuilder1R
Creature - Goblin Shaman (U)
At the beginning of your precombat main phase, add R to your mana pool for each counter on Sparkbuilder.
1/2
Enthusiastic Conversion1W
Enchantment - Aura (U)
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature is a Rebel in addition to its other creature types and has "1, T: Motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)"
Spurred to ActionRW
Instant (U)
Motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.) Until end of turn, whenever a source would deal damage to you or another permanent you control, you may have that damage be dealt to the target creature instead.
On its own I don't think this is an "interesting" mechanic; it's all about the interactions. In particular I think you'd want to push tribal fairly hard alongside this. I really like Sparkbuilder and how it fits here...
I think a mechanic like this would have worked well for Allies, actually. Support sadly wound up less flashy than was intended, and a mechanic named something like Recruit that does for Allies what this does for Rebels would have been neat.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Yeah, actually it's unfortunate that "Rebel" didn't quite fit the flavor position that the Allies had, since the Eldrazi weren't the government or anything. Or that Wizards didn't decide to use the somewhat broader "Ally" in Masques block. There are conceptual ties and it would have been great for casual builders and maybe even for Constructed potential to have an open-ended "extra class" tribe in this flavor space that could sustain different implementations across planes, instead of to have these isolated groups like Rebels, Allies, the Coalition, and the Mirran resistance. Of course, some might consider the mechanic and flavor distinction between these factions a plus.
Tribal interactions are definitely the other piece here, so I guess this is more of an A+B mechanic or whatever they call it than a linear one; you need motivate cards and Rebel payoff, although motivate is generally going to be reasonable on its own. Tribal interactions are also the only way to tie back to the old Rebels, since motivate can't really do anything with Rebels in your library.
Regarding the Rebel payoff, something I realized while designing my Sagesse mechanic for my Legend of Zelda set is that it's a good idea to have some effects that scale based on the amount of X you have, where X is the thing the theme is built around; Sagesse is a keyword that gives you a wisdom counter upon casting the card, accompanied by an effect that scales based on the number of wisdom counters you have. Of course you also want cards that care if you have at least one X.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I really want there to be one oddball card that works in this space but doesn't point directly at creatures, like
Propagandize1RW
Enchantment — Aura
Enchant enchantment
Enchanted enchantment is a Rebel creature with power and toughness equal to its converted mana cost in addition to its other types. It loses all abilities.
At the beginning of your end step, motivate target creature.
Sway to the Cause is definitely not Mono-R. Perma control is something only Blue can do, also black on a few occasions. A variation of Might Makes Right is more fitting.
Sway to the Cause is definitely not Mono-R. Perma control is something only Blue can do, also black on a few occasions. A variation of Might Makes Right is more fitting.
Sure, maybe this space is better for like a rare that can both motivate (at least once) and Threaten a Rebel every turn or something like that.
Thanks for all the other comments, if I actually get around to building a custom cube I'll look for more feedback then.
I further think "instigate" would have been the perfect term.
I like the word, but "instigate target creature" reads pretty strange.
"Instigate a creature. (Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)"?
Yeah but "instigate" doesn't normally take just a person as an object like that without an infinitive as complement. You can "instigate the people to action" or "instigate a quarrel" but it's not natural to say "he instigated his friend" or something like that.
"Recruit" is pretty good but doesn't seem to carry the inspiring connotation that the +1/+1 would imply. "Impassion" and "Inflame" are options but not quite right. Maybe "Rouse" is actually the closest.
Instigate. (Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature. That creature becomes a Rebel in addition to its other types.)
Compare:
Support 2. (Put a +1/+1 counter on each of up to two target creatures.)
I personally do not love the idea of a second even more restricted version of support - and the subclause of adding the Rebel type seems rather minimal, but wording it like this should be perfectly fine.
BTW: For the control changing card I would go with something like:
Winds of Change v.2
Enchantment
Rebel creatures you control have haste.
At the beginning of your upkeep, instigate, then gain control of the instigated creature until end of turn. Untap it.
The weakest part of instigate is that it has a negative synergy with actually putting Rebel creature cards into your deck since it makes the flavorful part of the effect redundant.
Compare this to e. g. this:
Instigate. (Up to one target creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn. If it's a Rebel put a +1/+1 counter on it instead.)
Yes, converting a creature is more flavorful, but this would probably play better. Trying to bring the two ideas togeher would result in:
Instigate. (Up to one target creature gets +1/+1 and becomes a Rebel until end of turn. If it was a Rebel already put a +1/+1 counter on it instead and it stays a Rebel.)
On an average card this is exactly one line of text more than your version (which is itself one line longer than the simplistic support). I am quite certain this has the better gameplay though.
Maybe there is an overall better version.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
I thought of a somewhat boring but functional mechanic that would fit these criteria and create a somewhat new twist on tribal play. The idea is that the Rebels convert others to their cause and inspire them to fight, adding the Rebel creature type along with a +1/+1 counter. Associating counters with the type addition would alleviate some of the memory issues, thought it also means that other counter adding in the set would have to be kept to a minimum, or conversely that the mechanic might spread to green a bit.
Making this a keyword action gives it some flexibility. "Motivate" seems like a decent word to capture the flavor, although maybe it's a bit tame. "Instigate" is cool but has a slightly negative nuance, "inspire" is unfortunately too close to inspiration, and "arouse" or "excite" would induce too many facepalms with the man-children in my playgroup. Open to other suggestions though.
The basic applications are pretty obvious, so I won't bore you with 5 different ETB motivate french vanilla guys and the obligatory motivate combat tricks, but here are some experiments/support cards. Also, I thought about making it only possible to motivate non-Rebels, but I don't think that adds enough flavorfully to be worth the complexity. I think creatures should by convention only motivate other creatures, though.
Rebel Instigator 2R
Creature - Human Rebel (U)
Flash, haste
When Rebel Instigator enters the battlefield, motivate another target creature. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.) That creature attacks this turn if able.
2/1
For the Cause 2W
Enchantment (U)
Whenever a creature you control dies, motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)
(Could make this only trigger when a Rebel creature you control dies, but I'd probably want it to be a creature itself then. Might be a line to use on a lord.)
Sway to the Cause 3R
Enchantment - Aura (U)
Enchant creature
You control enchanted creature as long as you control another Rebel creature.
Stir the Populace 3WW
Sorcery (C)
Put a 1/1 white Human creature token onto the battlefield, then motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)
Repeat this process two more times.
Sympathetic Orgg 1RR
Creature - Orgg (R)
Haste
At the beginning of each end step, sacrifice Sympathetic Orgg unless it has a counter on it.
4/4
Sparkbuilder 1R
Creature - Goblin Shaman (U)
At the beginning of your precombat main phase, add R to your mana pool for each counter on Sparkbuilder.
1/2
Enthusiastic Conversion 1W
Enchantment - Aura (U)
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature is a Rebel in addition to its other creature types and has "1, T: Motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.)"
Spurred to Action RW
Instant (U)
Motivate target creature you control. (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types.) Until end of turn, whenever a source would deal damage to you or another permanent you control, you may have that damage be dealt to the target creature instead.
I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Tribal interactions are definitely the other piece here, so I guess this is more of an A+B mechanic or whatever they call it than a linear one; you need motivate cards and Rebel payoff, although motivate is generally going to be reasonable on its own. Tribal interactions are also the only way to tie back to the old Rebels, since motivate can't really do anything with Rebels in your library.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Propagandize 1RW
Enchantment — Aura
Enchant enchantment
Enchanted enchantment is a Rebel creature with power and toughness equal to its converted mana cost in addition to its other types. It loses all abilities.
At the beginning of your end step, motivate target creature.
Target creature protests (Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature and it becomes a Rebel in addition to its other creature types).
........................
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
I like the word, but "instigate target creature" reads pretty strange.
Sure, maybe this space is better for like a rare that can both motivate (at least once) and Threaten a Rebel every turn or something like that.
Thanks for all the other comments, if I actually get around to building a custom cube I'll look for more feedback then.
Yeah but "instigate" doesn't normally take just a person as an object like that without an infinitive as complement. You can "instigate the people to action" or "instigate a quarrel" but it's not natural to say "he instigated his friend" or something like that.
"Recruit" is pretty good but doesn't seem to carry the inspiring connotation that the +1/+1 would imply. "Impassion" and "Inflame" are options but not quite right. Maybe "Rouse" is actually the closest.
BTW: For the control changing card I would go with something like:
Winds of Change v.2
Enchantment
Rebel creatures you control have haste.
At the beginning of your upkeep, instigate, then gain control of the instigated creature until end of turn. Untap it.
The weakest part of instigate is that it has a negative synergy with actually putting Rebel creature cards into your deck since it makes the flavorful part of the effect redundant.
Compare this to e. g. this:
On an average card this is exactly one line of text more than your version (which is itself one line longer than the simplistic support). I am quite certain this has the better gameplay though.
Maybe there is an overall better version.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO