For Shandalar, I want to make the Inherit mechanic work. While I know what the mechanic should do, getting the wording right is not a trivial task.
All you need to know about the functionality of Inherit:
If you cast an instant or sorcery spell with Inherit from your hand, you choose up to one target creature.
If you chose one target creature this way, you exile the spell as it resolves and the chosen creature gains "T: You may cast the exiled card" for as long as that card remains exiled.
Sorceries can only be recast as a sorcery, and instants at any time. This can be written by adding "Activate only as a sorcery" on sorceries, and omitting it on instants.
It is important that the ability targets so that you can respond by killing the targeted creature, and so that token generator spells can't be inherited onto the tokens they just created.
You have to pay the mana cost of the spell because it doesn't say that you don't have to. This is the default, and shouldn't be included in the reminder text. The card goes to the graveyard after you cast it, restricting you to one additional cast. The clause "that creature gains [...] for as long as that card remains exiled" is only in the definition of Inherit so that the creature doesn't continue to have a T-ability that does nothing. This also doesn't have to be included in the reminder text.
My current wording is:
Inherit (If you cast this spell from your hand, you may teach up to one target creature to cast it. Exile this spell as it resolves and that creature gains "T: You may cast the exiled card.")
The most condensed version is:
Inherit (If you cast this spell from your hand, choose up to one target creature. (If you do,) exile this spell and that creature gains "T: You may cast the exiled card.")
But there's a bit room for "reminder-flavor text", similar to convoke where it starts with "Your creatures can help cast this spell." It has no rules meaning but it speeds up comprehension process. For my current wording, this doesn't seem to work very well. My guess is that to "teach" implies something more permanent and doesn't resonate with a single recast. That's also why the name of the mechanic is maybe not optimal.
Is my assumption correct? What would you suggest for the "reminder-flavor text?"
Inherit [cost] (If you cast this spell from your hand, you may choose a creature you control. If you do, exile this spell and that creature has [cost],T: You may cast this spell from exile without paying it's mana cost. If you do, put it into your graveyard when it resolves.)
Again - this way it's clear that you need to tap mana to play the spell, and like the errated echo your Inherit cost need not be the cost of the spell. And yeah, that's a lot of reminder text for your spell that haunts a creature and gives it an activated ability.
Inherit seems a bit wordy. It's similar to Imprint and Cipher. Cipher is about as wordy as Inherit and works in a similar way.
Apoquallyp
Sulfuric Boulder2R
Sorcery (C)
Sulfuric Boulder deals 2 damage to target creature or player.
Inherit (Then you may tap an untapped creature you control and exile this card. If you do, that creature gains "T: You may cast the exiled card.")
I think your condensend version makes sense. My biggest problem I think was thahlt you used the word "taught" and to me that meant that this creature now has this knowledge and you can't just lose that knowledge. However, the above version is clear.
What I'm saying is, the rules text you provide here is fairly clear as to what the ability does.
I'm not sure what more you want or need to make it 'work'. I suggested Imprint and Cipher. Perhaps look at a few more cards with those abilities to compare your ability to. Isochron Scepter seems like a good place to start.
I think your condensend version makes sense. My biggest problem I think was thahlt you used the word "taught" and to me that meant that this creature now has this knowledge and you can't just lose that knowledge. However, the above version is clear.
Interesting. Do you think the name could benefit from a change too? Something more casual like "Sling" for example.
What I'm saying is, the rules text you provide here is fairly clear as to what the ability does.
I'm not sure what more you want or need to make it 'work'. I suggested Imprint and Cipher. Perhaps look at a few more cards with those abilities to compare your ability to. Isochron Scepter seems like a good place to start.
My problem isn't making it work. It's conveying the functionality in a few lines. There were some misconceptions about how much mana you have to pay / how often you get to cast the spell.
1st: You don't put "may" and "up to one target" together.It's nnecessary redundancy when you want condensed reminder text.
"teach up to one target creature to cast it"
=>
"allow up to one target creature to recast it."?
The condensed version obviously does not have this problem.
It is not generally necessary to turn the mana cost in an activation cost and similar nonsense, though in the context of your set it should be noted that the ability granted can be easily exploited by forgoing casting the spell to get an infinite source of wizardry triggers, so the whole interaction with wizardry you are setting up is doubtful to begin with and a much simpler wording becomes available if you give up on it.
It is important to note that you don't get your correct answer about which reminder text works from here. You get it from actual playtests with players that have never seen the mechanics. Playtests during which you keep your mouth shut and all they have are the cards and maybe a Tips & Tricks card with a summary of important information.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
It is not generally necessary to turn the mana cost in an activation cost and similar nonsense, though in the context of your set it should be noted that the ability granted can be easily exploited by forgoing casting the spell to get an infinite source of wizardry triggers, so the whole interaction with wizardry you are setting up is doubtful to begin with and a much simpler wording becomes available if you give up on it.
You're right. How did I not see this?
The ability has to be worded in a way that it is an activated ability, otherwise it wouldn't be working with Wizardry at all. Something like "You may cast the exiled card by tapping that creature in addition to paying its other costs" doesn't work. It's not difficult to make a fix in the comp. rules of Inherit, something like "T: You may cast the exiled card. If you don't, put that card into your graveyard. This creature loses this ability." The question is, how much do you write into the reminder text? I figure that people who are clever enough to think of abusing Inherit this way would know the exact rules about it.
It is important to note that you don't get your correct answer about which reminder text works from here. You get it from actual playtests with players that have never seen the mechanics. Playtests during which you keep your mouth shut and all they have are the cards and maybe a Tips & Tricks card with a summary of important information.
The result of several discussions was this version:
Inherit(If you cast this spell from your hand, you may teach a creature to cast it. If you do, exile this card and target creature gains “T: You may cast the exiled card. Activate only once {and only as a sorcery}.”)
All you need to know about the functionality of Inherit:
My current wording is:
Inherit (If you cast this spell from your hand, you may teach up to one target creature to cast it. Exile this spell as it resolves and that creature gains "T: You may cast the exiled card.")
The most condensed version is:
Inherit (If you cast this spell from your hand, choose up to one target creature. (If you do,) exile this spell and that creature gains "T: You may cast the exiled card.")
But there's a bit room for "reminder-flavor text", similar to convoke where it starts with "Your creatures can help cast this spell." It has no rules meaning but it speeds up comprehension process. For my current wording, this doesn't seem to work very well. My guess is that to "teach" implies something more permanent and doesn't resonate with a single recast. That's also why the name of the mechanic is maybe not optimal.
Is my assumption correct? What would you suggest for the "reminder-flavor text?"
Completed sets:
Iamur — The Underwater Set
Overworld — Pirates vs. Octopuses
Esparand — The Sands of Time
Unfinished Sets:
Siege of Ravnica — Eldrazi in Ravnica
Shandalar — The Mana Set
Iamur Reimagined — Iamur v2
You can find more creative projects on my page Antaresdesigns!
Again - this way it's clear that you need to tap mana to play the spell, and like the errated echo your Inherit cost need not be the cost of the spell. And yeah, that's a lot of reminder text for your spell that haunts a creature and gives it an activated ability.
Your example here is very close to Cipher.
Servien
Chaos' Realm
Escalation of Chaos
Tales of Cahdaria
Enigmatic Distrubance
Celestial Unveiling
Completed sets:
Iamur — The Underwater Set
Overworld — Pirates vs. Octopuses
Esparand — The Sands of Time
Unfinished Sets:
Siege of Ravnica — Eldrazi in Ravnica
Shandalar — The Mana Set
Iamur Reimagined — Iamur v2
You can find more creative projects on my page Antaresdesigns!
BGStandard Green AggroGB
UWRGModern Saheeli CobraGRWU
UBRGLegacy StormGRBU
Wizards Certified Rules Advisor
What I'm saying is, the rules text you provide here is fairly clear as to what the ability does.
I'm not sure what more you want or need to make it 'work'. I suggested Imprint and Cipher. Perhaps look at a few more cards with those abilities to compare your ability to.
Isochron Scepter seems like a good place to start.
Servien
Chaos' Realm
Escalation of Chaos
Tales of Cahdaria
Enigmatic Distrubance
Celestial Unveiling
My problem isn't making it work. It's conveying the functionality in a few lines. There were some misconceptions about how much mana you have to pay / how often you get to cast the spell.
Completed sets:
Iamur — The Underwater Set
Overworld — Pirates vs. Octopuses
Esparand — The Sands of Time
Unfinished Sets:
Siege of Ravnica — Eldrazi in Ravnica
Shandalar — The Mana Set
Iamur Reimagined — Iamur v2
You can find more creative projects on my page Antaresdesigns!
"teach up to one target creature to cast it"
=>
"allow up to one target creature to recast it."?
The condensed version obviously does not have this problem.
It is not generally necessary to turn the mana cost in an activation cost and similar nonsense, though in the context of your set it should be noted that the ability granted can be easily exploited by forgoing casting the spell to get an infinite source of wizardry triggers, so the whole interaction with wizardry you are setting up is doubtful to begin with and a much simpler wording becomes available if you give up on it.
It is important to note that you don't get your correct answer about which reminder text works from here. You get it from actual playtests with players that have never seen the mechanics. Playtests during which you keep your mouth shut and all they have are the cards and maybe a Tips & Tricks card with a summary of important information.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
The ability has to be worded in a way that it is an activated ability, otherwise it wouldn't be working with Wizardry at all. Something like "You may cast the exiled card by tapping that creature in addition to paying its other costs" doesn't work. It's not difficult to make a fix in the comp. rules of Inherit, something like "T: You may cast the exiled card. If you don't, put that card into your graveyard. This creature loses this ability." The question is, how much do you write into the reminder text? I figure that people who are clever enough to think of abusing Inherit this way would know the exact rules about it.
I will do that this evening.
Completed sets:
Iamur — The Underwater Set
Overworld — Pirates vs. Octopuses
Esparand — The Sands of Time
Unfinished Sets:
Siege of Ravnica — Eldrazi in Ravnica
Shandalar — The Mana Set
Iamur Reimagined — Iamur v2
You can find more creative projects on my page Antaresdesigns!
Inherit (If you cast this spell from your hand, you may teach a creature to cast it. If you do, exile this card and target creature gains “T: You may cast the exiled card. Activate only once {and only as a sorcery}.”)
Syntax changes still possible.
Completed sets:
Iamur — The Underwater Set
Overworld — Pirates vs. Octopuses
Esparand — The Sands of Time
Unfinished Sets:
Siege of Ravnica — Eldrazi in Ravnica
Shandalar — The Mana Set
Iamur Reimagined — Iamur v2
You can find more creative projects on my page Antaresdesigns!