Hello. If you don't already know, I have been working on a custom set called Runin for a good deal of time. The set is based around Norse mythology. I've come to a point where I've done a little testing and I have a bunch of mechanics and some other ideas that could replace them. Currently I am not very content with my choices and I want to review that selection and decide which ideas I want to use going forward as I start to do some more major playtesting.
Currently, the set contains five mechanics:
Honoured- When (this creature) dies, if it attacked or blocked this turn, (effect).
Mantle- Whenever (condition), you may attach (this equipment) to target creature.
Fated [cost] (As you draw this card, you may reveal it and pay [cost].) (cards with fated will give an effect when fated)
Reinforce N [cost] ([cost], Discard this card: Put N +1/+1 counters on target creature.) (returns from Lorwyn)
Overwhelm [cost] (Whenever a creature you control with power equal to or greater than this card's power attacks, you may reveal this card and cast for it's overwhelm cost. If you do, it enters the battlefield tapped and attacking.)
And here are some mechanics that could fill in:
Fated 2.0 (As you draw this card, you may reveal it and play with it revealed for as long as it's in your hand. If you do, you can't cast it this turn.)
Bloodthirst N (If an opponent was dealt damage this turn, this permanent enters the battlefield with N +1/+1 counters on it.) (returns from Ravnica/M12) (could replace Overwhelm)
'Victorious'- Whenever a creature dealt combat damage by this creature dies, (effect) (Could replace Honoured)
'Rally' N (Whenever this creature attacks alone, put N 1/1 creature token onto the battlefield tapped and attacking)
(Could replace Honoured/Reinforce)
Monstrosity N (If this creature isn’t monstrous, put N +1/+1 counters on it and it becomes monstrous.)(returning from Theros) (Could replace Overwhelm)
Exalted (Whenever a creature you control attacks alone, that creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn.) (returning from Alara/M13) (Could replace Honoured)
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Which mechanics do you think are the most suitable and what would the lineup be? Any feedback is appreciated. Thanks for reading.
I don't think Mantle needs to be keyworded; it can just be a cycle or common trait among your equipment.
Honoured sounds like an extremely specific version of Morbid and seems too niche for my tastes
Overwhelm is pretty interesting to me. It's not like most other mechanics and makes you rethink whether to play things on-curve or not. I like it a lot and am curious how it plays.
I thought I read a thread on Fated once before and the only issue seems to be memory -- that once something has hit a Fated trigger, it's difficult to remember that that has happened for that particular card (and not a different card with the same name in your hand). It seems pretty sweet but I think the card probably has to be exiled and castable from exile after you use its Fated trigger.
Reinforce I've never played with, but Wizards tried it once so I can't really fault you for trying it here
Victorious is another too-specific version of Morbid. It's the Sengir Vampire ability, but that ability just doesn't really lead to feel-good moments in gameplay. It makes you not want to trade, feel bad when your opponent doesn't chump block, and your opponent feels bad that he can't really afford to chump block.
I would explore Overwhelm more instead of going with Bloodthirst or Monstrosity.
Rally N I don't like because it creates such a huge amount of board advantage. I prefer the St. Traft style of exiling the tokens at the end of combat, and am working on a mechanic that does the effect like that.
@zarepath.
Mantle isn't keyworded, it's an ability word. The thing is, if something appears at a high level like this does, and it can be an ability word, it's often good to be an ability word. Being an ability word just means it needs to be at appear at a high frequency, which this is, and is something you want to highlight, which is also true.
Honoured is quite different from Morbid, although it might look very similar, it plays into different gameplay. Honoured acts to interact with combat much more than morbid, and unlike it, there's no hidden information. It adds quite a bit of strategy to combat, in changing up how attacking and blocking decisions are made. It also has gotten good reception in immediate feedback, so I am hesitant to change it for now.
Interestingly, Overwhelm is actually the opposite, in that it has gotten rather poor immediate feedback. I will definitely be playtesting the mechanic specifically more.
Fated doesn't need to exile. It would be simpler in interactions, but it would also be more complex in flavour and likely in comprehension for newer players.
I actually like updating Reinforce to have similar effects to cards like Krosan Tusker, with wording of, "Whenever you reinforce, {effect}."
There will be effects like that, it's one of the areas I am using to expand upon the mechanic, others are Reinforce matters and better +1/+1 counter support.
Exalted definitely would be a good fit in set as is a pretty good mechanic. However, my concern (by no means unredeemable) is that it has flavour overlap with Honoured: both are about honour and glory and such. This isn't too bad, but I do like having the clearer parallel of Overwhelm (Jontar) vs Honoured (Aesir/Civilisations). If you read much of what I have posted on the main thread, you'll know that's where Overwhelm came from and is an important part of the world and story. IDK though, Exalted is really good.
Bloodthirst is high on my list for one reason in particular, it's a really, really, REALLY good fit for the flavour. The gameplay works well and it fits into the mechanical themes, it's not as prominent in mechanical themes as Exalted, but it fits the same role Overwhelm is in perfectly. 'Jotnar' for those that don't know, is a Norse term for a race/group of ancient and wild beings, typically of great size and humanoid (hence the English 'giants' is often used more casually). Jotnar literally means 'devourer', so the name 'Bloodthirst' fits extremely well. The whole Jotnar vs Aesir conflict is something I will expanding on when the set is in development (R&D wise).
Devour in name works and the mechanic concept in the abstract works, but the Jotnar devouring your own creatures isn't the idea. It also doesn't make sense in that devour wants lots of little creatures to devour while the Jotnar are only big, where as their enemies are smaller. Eating your enemy makes sense, but when their on your side...?
@Jetvans.
While the mechanic distinction parallel is nice, it's not necessary. This isn't a faction set, so I can afford to blur that line if it makes the set better otherwise.
Some other mechanics I am considering: Entwine, Convoke, Evoke.
Entwine, Evoke and Convoke are like with all the mechanics here are being considered to be a possible fit anywhere in the set, including without reinforce or fated as well.
Overwhelm has received significant dislike among players so far. It might not be that good. I'm not content, but that doesn't mean I think there is a problem, it means I think there may be a problem. Proper testing will give a better sense of how Overwhelm really plays.
Using mantle as a subtype is a good idea, I will definitely be considering that throughout this design process. Would also enable mantle matters cards. Put the attach part first is problematic in wording it correctly.
Currently, the set contains five mechanics:
Honoured- When (this creature) dies, if it attacked or blocked this turn, (effect).
Mantle- Whenever (condition), you may attach (this equipment) to target creature.
Fated [cost] (As you draw this card, you may reveal it and pay [cost].) (cards with fated will give an effect when fated)
Reinforce N [cost] ([cost], Discard this card: Put N +1/+1 counters on target creature.) (returns from Lorwyn)
Overwhelm [cost] (Whenever a creature you control with power equal to or greater than this card's power attacks, you may reveal this card and cast for it's overwhelm cost. If you do, it enters the battlefield tapped and attacking.)
And here are some mechanics that could fill in:
Fated 2.0 (As you draw this card, you may reveal it and play with it revealed for as long as it's in your hand. If you do, you can't cast it this turn.)
Bloodthirst N (If an opponent was dealt damage this turn, this permanent enters the battlefield with N +1/+1 counters on it.) (returns from Ravnica/M12) (could replace Overwhelm)
'Victorious'- Whenever a creature dealt combat damage by this creature dies, (effect) (Could replace Honoured)
'Rally' N (Whenever this creature attacks alone, put N 1/1 creature token onto the battlefield tapped and attacking)
(Could replace Honoured/Reinforce)
Monstrosity N (If this creature isn’t monstrous, put N +1/+1 counters on it and it becomes monstrous.)(returning from Theros) (Could replace Overwhelm)
Exalted (Whenever a creature you control attacks alone, that creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn.) (returning from Alara/M13) (Could replace Honoured)
-
Which mechanics do you think are the most suitable and what would the lineup be? Any feedback is appreciated. Thanks for reading.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
Honoured sounds like an extremely specific version of Morbid and seems too niche for my tastes
Overwhelm is pretty interesting to me. It's not like most other mechanics and makes you rethink whether to play things on-curve or not. I like it a lot and am curious how it plays.
I thought I read a thread on Fated once before and the only issue seems to be memory -- that once something has hit a Fated trigger, it's difficult to remember that that has happened for that particular card (and not a different card with the same name in your hand). It seems pretty sweet but I think the card probably has to be exiled and castable from exile after you use its Fated trigger.
Reinforce I've never played with, but Wizards tried it once so I can't really fault you for trying it here
Victorious is another too-specific version of Morbid. It's the Sengir Vampire ability, but that ability just doesn't really lead to feel-good moments in gameplay. It makes you not want to trade, feel bad when your opponent doesn't chump block, and your opponent feels bad that he can't really afford to chump block.
I would explore Overwhelm more instead of going with Bloodthirst or Monstrosity.
Rally N I don't like because it creates such a huge amount of board advantage. I prefer the St. Traft style of exiling the tokens at the end of combat, and am working on a mechanic that does the effect like that.
Mantle isn't keyworded, it's an ability word. The thing is, if something appears at a high level like this does, and it can be an ability word, it's often good to be an ability word. Being an ability word just means it needs to be at appear at a high frequency, which this is, and is something you want to highlight, which is also true.
Honoured is quite different from Morbid, although it might look very similar, it plays into different gameplay. Honoured acts to interact with combat much more than morbid, and unlike it, there's no hidden information. It adds quite a bit of strategy to combat, in changing up how attacking and blocking decisions are made. It also has gotten good reception in immediate feedback, so I am hesitant to change it for now.
Interestingly, Overwhelm is actually the opposite, in that it has gotten rather poor immediate feedback. I will definitely be playtesting the mechanic specifically more.
Fated doesn't need to exile. It would be simpler in interactions, but it would also be more complex in flavour and likely in comprehension for newer players.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
There will be effects like that, it's one of the areas I am using to expand upon the mechanic, others are Reinforce matters and better +1/+1 counter support.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
Bloodthirst is high on my list for one reason in particular, it's a really, really, REALLY good fit for the flavour. The gameplay works well and it fits into the mechanical themes, it's not as prominent in mechanical themes as Exalted, but it fits the same role Overwhelm is in perfectly. 'Jotnar' for those that don't know, is a Norse term for a race/group of ancient and wild beings, typically of great size and humanoid (hence the English 'giants' is often used more casually). Jotnar literally means 'devourer', so the name 'Bloodthirst' fits extremely well. The whole Jotnar vs Aesir conflict is something I will expanding on when the set is in development (R&D wise).
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
Venerate - Whenever a creature you control attacks (or blocks?) alone, EFFECT.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
While the mechanic distinction parallel is nice, it's not necessary. This isn't a faction set, so I can afford to blur that line if it makes the set better otherwise.
Some other mechanics I am considering: Entwine, Convoke, Evoke.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
Overwhelm has received significant dislike among players so far. It might not be that good. I'm not content, but that doesn't mean I think there is a problem, it means I think there may be a problem. Proper testing will give a better sense of how Overwhelm really plays.
Using mantle as a subtype is a good idea, I will definitely be considering that throughout this design process. Would also enable mantle matters cards. Put the attach part first is problematic in wording it correctly.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice