I was designing a few different hydras and I really liked the simplicity of this one but want some feedback on its power level.
Hydra of the Twilight GroveXG
Creature - Hydra (R)
Hydra of the Twilight Grove enters the battlefield with X +1/+1 counters on it.
Tap another untapped creature you control: Put a +1/+1 counter on Hydra of the Twilight Grove.
0/0
This is one of those A-list cards: it's not overpowered, but it would probably be one of the strongest cards in standard and shape the format enough that you'd have to design around it.
Reminds me of a card I fully expected to see in m15:
Convoke HydraxG
Creature - Hydra (R)
Convoke
~ enters the battlefield with X +1/+1 counters.
0/0
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"In the beginning, MTG Salvation switched to a new forum format.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
It was at that moment that I realized: I'm kinda just making these things up. We can just write the rules the way we want them to work. People will have fun, and people will get it.
It a beautiful, elegant card. My thoughts on it are that, if they're willing to print Kalonian Hydra, I don't see why this card should be taboo.
In terms of flavor, I'm not quite sure I understand what's going on. Are the creatures bringing the hydra sacrifices when you tap them? Is that why they're preoccupied?
And one more thing: I really think this thing ought to cost (XWG). It requires other--presumably smaller--creatures to work together in order to create something bigger. That smacks of almost every big Selesnya creature ever printed. And this thing could do with one extra casting requirement. As is, he's more or less just straight-up better than every other 4-drop in standard. Eats Polukranos for breakfast if you play him on turn three as a 4/4 and tap all your creatures before the swings in next turn (as a 7/7-8/8 on turn 4--pretty silly at rare). And this only scales up later in the game.
I think this would be a more interesting card if the tap a creature ability was nerfed to "Activate this ability only as a sorcery." Currently it is absurdly strong on defense. Alternatively, a in the activation cost for the ability would make it more of a decision point.
What. I can't even. I literally can't even. How are people saying this isn't extraordinarily powerful? This is stronger than most mythics! Definitely needs more cost somewhere, perhaps 1 in the activation or G in the overall cost. Perhaps both.
I think Guesswork's quote is spot on. I saw this and immediately I thought, "That's way too good. I better post an example situation or deck to make it clear just how unprintable this is." Then I got about to actually thinking about it in depth, and I couldn't really come up with one. At the end of the day, creatures in competitive decks are there to attack or to use abilities (usually by tapping), so it's a vanilla beater with significant resource cost.
Is it better than Loxodon Smiter? Probably not, Smiter is good because it's a three drop. This on three takes two taps to be as beefy.
Better than Deadbridge Goliath? Again it takes two taps to be comparable for the same mana, and it has no value vs. removal.
Certainly worsethan Poly; Poly kills things.
How about Kalonian Hydra? Hydra is effectively an 8/8 for five, so way more efficient, and it tramples and grows faster.
@MOON-E: a Convoke hydra is great, would have loved to see it in M15.
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I primarily play limited, so most of my spoiler season comments view cards through that lens.
What. I can't even. I literally can't even. How are people saying this isn't extraordinarily powerful? This is stronger than most mythics! Definitely needs more cost somewhere, perhaps 1 in the activation or G in the overall cost. Perhaps both.
Well it should definitely be a mythic, but it's not really that strong. At best it's just a giant beater (no trample, no protection), but it only grows if you have a good board state. I mean, compare this to Primordial Hydra, which grows much faster with absolutely no effort and has trample, yet still wasn't very good. Honestly if this had a sorcery speed restriction I could almost imagine it as a rare.
This is still great, it's just not what I'd call "extraordinarily powerful".
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"In the beginning, MTG Salvation switched to a new forum format.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
It was at that moment that I realized: I'm kinda just making these things up. We can just write the rules the way we want them to work. People will have fun, and people will get it.
Nice design. Peoples claims of it being overpowered couldn't be more wrong. Without some support, I wouldn't even expect to see much play in a normal standard.
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Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
- Manite
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Hydra of the Twilight Grove XG
Creature - Hydra (R)
Hydra of the Twilight Grove enters the battlefield with X +1/+1 counters on it.
Tap another untapped creature you control: Put a +1/+1 counter on Hydra of the Twilight Grove.
0/0
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Excellent design.
I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
Reminds me of a card I fully expected to see in m15:
Convoke Hydra xG
Creature - Hydra (R)
Convoke
~ enters the battlefield with X +1/+1 counters.
0/0
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
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In terms of flavor, I'm not quite sure I understand what's going on. Are the creatures bringing the hydra sacrifices when you tap them? Is that why they're preoccupied?
And one more thing: I really think this thing ought to cost (XWG). It requires other--presumably smaller--creatures to work together in order to create something bigger. That smacks of almost every big Selesnya creature ever printed. And this thing could do with one extra casting requirement. As is, he's more or less just straight-up better than every other 4-drop in standard. Eats Polukranos for breakfast if you play him on turn three as a 4/4 and tap all your creatures before the swings in next turn (as a 7/7-8/8 on turn 4--pretty silly at rare). And this only scales up later in the game.
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Is it better than Loxodon Smiter? Probably not, Smiter is good because it's a three drop. This on three takes two taps to be as beefy.
Better than Deadbridge Goliath? Again it takes two taps to be comparable for the same mana, and it has no value vs. removal.
Certainly worsethan Poly; Poly kills things.
How about Kalonian Hydra? Hydra is effectively an 8/8 for five, so way more efficient, and it tramples and grows faster.
@MOON-E: a Convoke hydra is great, would have loved to see it in M15.
Interested in Custom Card Creation.
My Cube:Cardinal Custom Cube
A custom version of a third modern masters: MM2019
(filter->rarity to see in set rarity).
Well it should definitely be a mythic, but it's not really that strong. At best it's just a giant beater (no trample, no protection), but it only grows if you have a good board state. I mean, compare this to Primordial Hydra, which grows much faster with absolutely no effort and has trample, yet still wasn't very good. Honestly if this had a sorcery speed restriction I could almost imagine it as a rare.
This is still great, it's just not what I'd call "extraordinarily powerful".
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
Comic Book Set
Archester: Frontier of Steam (A steampunk set!)
A Good Place to Start Designing
Interested in Custom Card Creation.
My Cube:Cardinal Custom Cube
A custom version of a third modern masters: MM2019
(filter->rarity to see in set rarity).
- Manite