Chase

  • #1

    River Gem Smuggling
    :1mana::symu::symu:

    Sorcery
    (R)

    Chase 10 (start a parallel game with each player at 10 life, with turns and phases advancing with the main game, and life totals as the only win condition. Players may cast spells into this Chase.)

    Put a 2/1 unblockable blue Rogue creature token into this Chase's battlefield.

    When a player wins this Chase, he or she draws 3 cards and takes an extra turn after this one.


    FAQ:

    1 - What happens with the cards in the Chase when it ends?
    A - They become exiled in the main game. (No need for reminder because players can expect that those cards won't interact with the main game 99.99% of the time).

    2 - What happens with the library, graveyard, card drawing, etc. in the Chase?
    A - All of the zones exist (empty at first) and card drawing happens. As it says in the reminder text, losing because of drawing in an empty library doesn't happen.

    3 - Can I send lands into the Chase?
    A - No, only spells. You choose whether to cast them into the Main Game / Chase during the modal choices of casting.

    4 - Does my Wrath of God destroy creatures in the Chase?
    A - Only if you cast it there, but then it won't destroy creatures in the Main Game. You are actually playing two games at the same time, and they only interact when casting a spell, or when the Chase ends.

    5 - If the Main Game ends, does the Chase continue?
    A - No.

    6 - Can I cast a Chase into a Chase?
    A - Yes. In that case, winning the second Chase will make then effect happen in the first chase. If you win the first Chase first, see (5).
  • #2
    Look at how much text you have to use for that keyword. You have hardly any room left for other text! Also, I think Shahrazad is the only proof needed to know that subgames are bad in black-bordered Magic.
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  • #3
    A lot of text, yes, it was needed. I think it'd be printable with small font, which is annoying, but there you have it.

    Now, Shahrazad is a great comparison, but I hope you see how parallel games need none of the time Sharazad's subgames do. First, setup time is 0. Second, it happens at the same time as the normal game, so attackers are declared at the same time, and blockers too (exactly like 2HG... except faster, because you decide for both games). The parallel game also wastes no time in card drawing, library searching, etc. And I don't think players would want to waste resources creating nested games that impact the main game even less (this was whole reason Sharazad was broken).

    I'd say the parallel game is more akin to a new battlefield zone than to subgames.
  • #4
    Quote from Lapson2
    I'd say the parallel game is more akin to a new battlefield zone than to subgames.

    I know I proposed parallel subgames recently as well, but with that in mind: Why not simply make it really a new battlefield zone?
    Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.

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  • #5
    I know I proposed parallel subgames recently as well, but with that in mind: Why not simply make it really a new battlefield zone?


    Quick try:


    River Gem Smuggling
    :1mana::symu::symu:

    Sorcery
    (R)

    Chase 10 (start another battlefield with player's life totals of 10. When it ends, move its permanents to the main one). (Players choose a battlefield to affect as they cast a spell).

    Put a 2/1 unblockable blue Rogue creature token into this Chase's battlefield.

    When a player wins this Chase, he or she draws 3 cards and takes an extra turn after this one.


    Ok, that wasn't that quick, it took me a long while to make it as short as I could... and I actually started to like it very much in the process, from an initial standpoint of "this will never work!".

    What do you think about this version?
    Last edited by JuanCu: 2/16/2013 9:52:07 AM
  • #6
    The idea that battlefields are attached to life totals is very confusing.
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  • #7
    Quote from willows
    The idea that battlefields are attached to life totals is very confusing.

    Seconded. If you are married to the life total, then the subgame was already the right way. I just think life totals aren't necessary.
    Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.

    [thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
    Quote from MajoraX
    The explanation is simple: mortals trample; Gods annihilate.


    Factions: Sleeping
    Remnants: Valheim
    Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
    Saga: Shards of Rabiah
    Legends: The Elder Dragons
  • #8
    Mmm, I really think the 10 damage is the core concept of the chase. That, and the fact that global effects don't affect it. How about these wordings? Too long? Intuitive?

    Shortest version:

    River Gem Chase 1UU

    Sorcery

    Chase 10 (start a parallel game with win condition "an opponent has lost 10 or more life" that advances with the main game. Players may cast spells into the Chase.)

    Put a 2/1 unblockable blue Rogue creature token into this Chase's battlefield.

    When a player wins the Chase, he or she draws 3 cards and takes an extra turn after this one.

    Longest version (with more explicative reminder and better gameplay I think):

    River Gem Chase 1UU

    Sorcery

    Chase 10 (start a parallel game with only win condition "an opponent has lost 10 or more life" that advances with the main game. Players may add mana and cast spells into the Chase. When it ends, put each zone on top of the main game's one).

    Put a 2/1 unblockable blue Rogue creature token into this Chase's battlefield.

    When a single player wins the Chase, he or she draws 3 cards and takes an extra turn after this one.
  • #9
    It looks like a lot more complicated version of Water Gun Balloon Game. Do you really need to mess around with parallel-games to make this work? I'm just imagining a scenario where you play multiple chases and end up with three or four or more parallel games going at the same time. It seems like it would be really awkward to play.

    River Gem Chase 1UU
    Enchantment - Chase
    As CARDNAME enters the battlefield, each player puts a gem counter on a 0.
    Whenever a source player controls deals damage to one of his or her opponents, move that player's gem counter up 1.
    When a player's gem counter hits 10(?), sacrifice CARDNAME. That player draws three cards and takes an extra turn after this one.
  • #10
    Thanks. It really helps to take a step back. I think I may be too enamored of the idea of "Choose what you Wrath". Then again, I like it because I think its extremely cool, and a parallel game can work on quasi-2HG rules.

    Maybe I could take a page out of Planeswalkers and Water Balloon Game to make it simpler. Let's see:
    River Gem Chase :1mana::symu::symu:
    Enchantment - Chase

    Run 10 (Each player has an Emblem annexed to this with "When this has 10 or more Run counters on it, win this Chase". A creature may be declared attacking through this to deal damage to players in the form of putting Run counters on an Emblem this turn.)

    When this enters the battlefield, put a 2/1 blue rogue creature token into the battlefield that can't be blocked when it's attacking through a Chase.

    When a player wins this Chase, sacrifice it. That player draws 3 cards and takes an extra turn after this one.

    Still a mouthful, but I like it a lot, as well.
    Another try:

    Run 10 (Each creature may be declared attacking through this to gain "This deals combat damage to players in the form of you gaining that many Run counters" until end of turn. A player may spend 10 Run counters anytime to win this Chase.)
    Last edited by JuanCu: 2/18/2013 11:21:18 PM
  • #11
    River Gem Chase - 1UU
    Enchantment - Chase
    Chase - When River Gem Chase enters the battlefield, each player places 10 chase counters on it. Whenever a creature a player controls would deal combat damage to an opponent, that creature's controller may remove that many of their chase counters from River Gem Chase instead. When a player removes their last chase counter, sacrifice River Gem Chase and that player draws 3 cards and takes an extra turn after this one.
    When River Gem Chase enters the battlefield, put a 2/1 blue Faerie Rogue creature token onto the battlefield that's unblockable and has "Whenever this creature would deal combat damage to a player, its controller must remove chase counters from a Chase, if able."

    I think the italicized keyword, then description template might suit this better. Then, you can have different requirements for chases besides combat damage. Like, a card-drawing race, or a playing-lands race.
  • #12
    How about making parallel games share everything but battlefields and life totals? Things originating from one field don't acknowledge anything happening in the other, and things happening outside the field have their influence decided by the controller.
  • #13
    TerminusEdge's solution is the only one that's close to workable. I don't see how or why this should be an ability word or a keyword- it's far too complicated for anything but a weirdo one-of rare. MAYBE you could justify a cycle of enchantments like this one, like the hideaway lands, but you'd be spending a lot of complexity points for not much gain.

    Chase also has the issue of possibly backfiring on its controller. You spend however much mana and wait however many turns, AND forego dealing damage to your opponent, and it's possible to be left with nothing- less than nothing, down three cards and a turn.
    Clone never targets.

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