I'll give a bit of back story, before the school year started, my friend was in a car crash and suffered problems such as depression and problems paying attention after the crash.
He decided to go to school the next term, which kinda leads to my story.
Basically, his marks weren't good enough to stay in school, so he told the school his problems and got a doctor's note to back up his claims but they made him get another person to back up his story even more, that's where I come in.
He asked me if I'd sign a form to back up his claim, which i agreed to, despite not actually seeing him in pain.
at the time, I thought I'd be a good friend and do it, but looking back at it, I'm not sure I should have done this without knowing the consequences of doing something like this in case of the fact they don't accept it and contact me because of it.
I also think I should've gotten more information out of him.
this is why I'm asking people here, was I right in wanting to help a friend stay in school, should I have gotten more information out of him or should I have just down right said no?
also, is there anything a university can do to me if they don't accept his claim ?
Is there a picture of the wreck or a police report?
Has your friend ever complained about it?
Has your friend seemed different after the wreck (assuming that there was one...)?
If you can have him show any proof that there actually was a wreck then there's no reason for you to be worried. Saying "ya, he was in pain sometime..." is a very general statement. If they ask you for specifics just say you don't really know exactly what was wrong.
Don't think there is anything the school can or will do to you. If anything you can say that he lied to you about the wreck also.
Are they claiming psychological damage because of the depression and lost drive, or are they claiming something else?
Because I find it odd that you'd be asked to say you saw them in pain if they're suffering mental scars.
Otherwise it's all on you. If you believe in your friend you should help them get out of trouble and back on track.
What does or doesn't constitute seeing someone in pain is a bit vague. If you noticed the depression and stuff affecting them, I'd say that'd qualify.
@Arnnaria: Drug abuse didn't cross my mind when I read the OP.
Your fine. You wont be tied into that and its not wrong to help a friend but ont let it be at a cost of your dignity. Respect the word no.. use it wisely. But your ok its just a statement of witness. Nothing more.
I'd say as long as you're not signing some kind of legal and binding document, you're fine. However, it's on your friend to make it up to you by actually TRYING to get himself on the "right path." If staying in school meant that much to him, he should prove it by working to make sure he gets better grades. Oh, and I'd say you've got every right to remind him of this...
it was just a form saying I had seen him in pain before
are you sure that's what you signed? Because that doesn't sound like something the school would need or want from you.
What did you exactly sign? What did it say? As long as whatever it said is arguably true and you didnt claim to see something you didn't see, you're fine.
If it really did only say you saw him in pain, it's not really refutable, because even in the worst case scenario where he's busted and he comes clean taking the doctor and you and every other "co conspirator" down with him, it's your word against his. You can claim he acted like he was in pain and conned you too. As long as he didn't give you consideration (I.e. pay you for your statement) there is very little reason for anybody to take the word of a busted liar over yours. Even the doctor can't be touched, because frankly, the doctor and you both took the lying accident victims claims of pain at face value.
The thing about pain is that it can't be verified or disputed. Chronic, vague, post accident pain, without identifiable cause... MOST of it is bull****, and even the non-lying stuff is mostly psychological based. Whiplash my ASS. The medical community knows this. The orthopedic and rehab community knows this. But doctors are stuck between a rock and a hard place because pain Is real unless proven otherwise, and there's now a dozen chronic pain diagnoses that have no identified physiologic cause.
It's just interesting that almost nobody gets fibromyalgia after working on their car or boat, or moving furniture in their house... It's always workplace related if the workplace has workmen's comp, and after some car accident where the OTHER guy is at fault. Most pain diagnoses are utter garbage, but we're STUCK, because there is no test to verify pain.
So I think you're fine either way on the "saw my roommate in pain" deal.
Here is some advice about dealing with friends and family.
Don't take their word for anything you have to sign or vouch for. Confirm the facts, if they get annoyed that you want to, it will usually mean they are hiding something. I've never been burned by this because I'm fairly suspicious by nature when someone asks me to back their story up, but I have friends who've gotten into trouble. Or friends who got stuck with the full mortgage of a house after the other couple that was supposed to split it left suddenly.
Also, don't go into business with friends or family unless you are okay with losing the relationship you have with them. If things go south, blame starts flying and it gets ugly. Don't lend a friend anything you aren't willing to lose.
Most likely the thing you signed won't come back to bite you (see dcartist's post on the ambiguousness of disproving pain), but you should be more careful in the future.
I think it is right to be cautious, but unless this becomes a pattern of enabling behavior it is not really that bad. Legally...you have nothing to worry about.
Back before I struggled with addiction myself, I gave my sister a clean Urine sample for a new job screening. She had used a substance that does not clear out of your system for around 30 days and was just a few days shy of this period. I know her well, and trusted that she knew the risk she was running, so I said I would but did not want any splashback (gross) if things went bad.
After ruining my life (and the lives of my family) with substances in the past few years I would probably probe more if she asked again (though I doubt she uses the substance more than a couple times a year now), but I still feel okay with my original decision.
It's not like you perjured yourself, you just signed a form saying he had a tough semester. The accident was factual and you didn't lie about that, everything else is subjective. I'm not saying you should blindly sign forms but this sounds fine.
Friends should put themselves out there for each other once in a while.
well friend might not be the right word if you didn't already have the information you needed to sign off on it. Are you disputing whether or not the crash happened???
If a doctor signed off on this then I don't really understand them needing your sig. Last time I checked a doctors opinion should supersede yours.
As for getting in trouble no. I doesn't sound like a legally binding document, and further more it is opinion based. Last time I cheeked it is unlawful in most free countries to not be allowed an option and to state that opinion if asked. I don't really know Canadian laws though.(assuming your Canadian since you said university instead of college or maybe I saw the flag and forgot about it consciously...)
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He decided to go to school the next term, which kinda leads to my story.
Basically, his marks weren't good enough to stay in school, so he told the school his problems and got a doctor's note to back up his claims but they made him get another person to back up his story even more, that's where I come in.
He asked me if I'd sign a form to back up his claim, which i agreed to, despite not actually seeing him in pain.
at the time, I thought I'd be a good friend and do it, but looking back at it, I'm not sure I should have done this without knowing the consequences of doing something like this in case of the fact they don't accept it and contact me because of it.
I also think I should've gotten more information out of him.
this is why I'm asking people here, was I right in wanting to help a friend stay in school, should I have gotten more information out of him or should I have just down right said no?
also, is there anything a university can do to me if they don't accept his claim ?
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Has your friend ever complained about it?
Has your friend seemed different after the wreck (assuming that there was one...)?
If you can have him show any proof that there actually was a wreck then there's no reason for you to be worried. Saying "ya, he was in pain sometime..." is a very general statement. If they ask you for specifics just say you don't really know exactly what was wrong.
Don't think there is anything the school can or will do to you. If anything you can say that he lied to you about the wreck also.
Just remember... never lie.
I just have a feeling that I've gotten myself into something that I shouldn't have
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Pretty much this.
It should be noted that unless you're a professional, the university likely didn't/wouldn't put as much weight in your words than the doctor's note.
I don't think so.
Don't sweat it. You may have misjudged, but it doesn't seem you're outright lying.
Pump your friend for details. And if your friend asks you to lie, that's another matter.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
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Are we thinking he's on drugs?
Because I find it odd that you'd be asked to say you saw them in pain if they're suffering mental scars.
Otherwise it's all on you. If you believe in your friend you should help them get out of trouble and back on track.
What does or doesn't constitute seeing someone in pain is a bit vague. If you noticed the depression and stuff affecting them, I'd say that'd qualify.
@Arnnaria: Drug abuse didn't cross my mind when I read the OP.
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What did you exactly sign? What did it say? As long as whatever it said is arguably true and you didnt claim to see something you didn't see, you're fine.
If it really did only say you saw him in pain, it's not really refutable, because even in the worst case scenario where he's busted and he comes clean taking the doctor and you and every other "co conspirator" down with him, it's your word against his. You can claim he acted like he was in pain and conned you too. As long as he didn't give you consideration (I.e. pay you for your statement) there is very little reason for anybody to take the word of a busted liar over yours. Even the doctor can't be touched, because frankly, the doctor and you both took the lying accident victims claims of pain at face value.
The thing about pain is that it can't be verified or disputed. Chronic, vague, post accident pain, without identifiable cause... MOST of it is bull****, and even the non-lying stuff is mostly psychological based. Whiplash my ASS. The medical community knows this. The orthopedic and rehab community knows this. But doctors are stuck between a rock and a hard place because pain Is real unless proven otherwise, and there's now a dozen chronic pain diagnoses that have no identified physiologic cause.
It's just interesting that almost nobody gets fibromyalgia after working on their car or boat, or moving furniture in their house... It's always workplace related if the workplace has workmen's comp, and after some car accident where the OTHER guy is at fault. Most pain diagnoses are utter garbage, but we're STUCK, because there is no test to verify pain.
So I think you're fine either way on the "saw my roommate in pain" deal.
Don't take their word for anything you have to sign or vouch for. Confirm the facts, if they get annoyed that you want to, it will usually mean they are hiding something. I've never been burned by this because I'm fairly suspicious by nature when someone asks me to back their story up, but I have friends who've gotten into trouble. Or friends who got stuck with the full mortgage of a house after the other couple that was supposed to split it left suddenly.
Also, don't go into business with friends or family unless you are okay with losing the relationship you have with them. If things go south, blame starts flying and it gets ugly. Don't lend a friend anything you aren't willing to lose.
Most likely the thing you signed won't come back to bite you (see dcartist's post on the ambiguousness of disproving pain), but you should be more careful in the future.
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Scary the level of fear the system has instilled in young folks these days.
Back before I struggled with addiction myself, I gave my sister a clean Urine sample for a new job screening. She had used a substance that does not clear out of your system for around 30 days and was just a few days shy of this period. I know her well, and trusted that she knew the risk she was running, so I said I would but did not want any splashback (gross) if things went bad.
After ruining my life (and the lives of my family) with substances in the past few years I would probably probe more if she asked again (though I doubt she uses the substance more than a couple times a year now), but I still feel okay with my original decision.
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Friends should put themselves out there for each other once in a while.
If a doctor signed off on this then I don't really understand them needing your sig. Last time I checked a doctors opinion should supersede yours.
As for getting in trouble no. I doesn't sound like a legally binding document, and further more it is opinion based. Last time I cheeked it is unlawful in most free countries to not be allowed an option and to state that opinion if asked. I don't really know Canadian laws though.(assuming your Canadian since you said university instead of college or maybe I saw the flag and forgot about it consciously...)
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