KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@Killjoy
I don't really think I am considered an evil neutral? maybe more benign? My win-con matches a benign more than anything since it doesn't tell me I need to be the last one standing
I mean any neutral that needs to kill town is evil.
@Highroller: It's bad because scum care more about killing neutrals than town does. Town cares about killing Mafia first, then neutrals, as neutrals help them sometimes by killing Mafia.
Oh that's a great argument. Let's double the number of hostile factions that have nightkills on the off-chance that the guy who is evil and whose win condition is to kill towns might accidentally kill a mafia.
also so back reading a few games, and I've noticed that highroller always comes in with a flavor claim in his first post, I checked two other games on this site.
I love how it's only now that you mention why you thought my entrance was bad. Like, you never mention the fact that I roleclaimed before was the reason you voted for me previously, it's only now.
It's almost like you made an opportunistic vote without any real reason and now you need to backpedal somehow...
I personally wanted to hit lower posters, and not people getting heat
... which you totally just admit here. Ok, cool. That was nice of you.
Also, YOU are going to claim that you thought I was obviously scum and then suddenly backpedal, and your claimed rationale for doing it was because you found my roleclaim suspicious?!
YOU are you going to claim my roleclaim is suspicious? Yeah, I'ma love to see your attempts to explain that.
@Highroller
do you have a wolf game anywhere on this site?
Hot take: if Tubba is town, then Vaimes, Silver, Tammy and Cuthalion are all town for not jumping on tubba. Because mafia would not pass up a chance to attack a town that is going all in on the neutral.
That argument Highroller used that our wincon says to eliminate all anti-town doesn’t hold up with Wisp because he can leave the game. Eliminating him is not a necessity.
Oh that's a fantastic reason to double the number of hostile factions with nightkills.
You do realize that all of this hinges upon you accepting whatever a claimed hostile role has told you without question, right?
Seriously, does no one else even consider the possibility that LastWhisper might be lying is instead one of the mafia? I've been in a game in which the town lost because that exact thing happened on this very site.
How does lynching a neutral (and you said you believe he is a neutral) give us any information to work with toMorrow?
That's like saying, "How would lynching a mafia flip from a confirmed inspector day one give us any information to work with tomorrow?"
FFS, he's confirmed to be a threat to the town on day one!
High roller - I’m responding to your neutral party response to me but I’m on my phone and quoting that response is too much.
I understand that sometimes a 3p in the game can cost the game for town, but I’ve also been in games with 3p which have done nothing really to hurt towns chances of winning, and have had 3p actually be a help to town.
I do not think leaving alive a 3p for this moment is going to do grave damage to town. If you think he’s lying and he’s really mafia, that’s one thing, but if you believe his claim then leave it alone for right now.
And really it’s a moot point that should quite frankly not be addressed again. Only high roller and tuba (azrael?) want to eliminate him which means you’re not reaching majority on this, and continued arguing is just a distraction today. It’s an easy place for scum to hide because it takes up valuable headspace. Might as well accept it, look for scum to yeet and begrudgingly move on. Make a discussion thread about what we should do with claimed neutrals after the game if it makes you feel better.
This is the equivalent of having the ball on the 1-yard line, and then not running it.
I did not finish all of my grading today so I'll still be a bit distracted but will hopefully have all the bits I skimmed past actually read tomorrow or Sunday. I don't think I missed too much though.
Vaimes and Cuth - Do you guys think Sloth is town? I think you both have played more with him. I'm not sure how much I should buy into my "doesn't feel like he has an agenda" for being too alignment indicative. I just remember that one game I played with him over a year ago? where he was a scum and his reads and reasoning just really didn't feel right but that was also him coming off a long break, so I might be working with a terrible model.
I didn't realize Vaimes changed his avatar to a bird. chirp chirp
Also Azrael - Congrats on upcoming baby #3; I hope the delivery is easy and the baby is healthy
stop with the bravado or I will just work around you @Highroller
Also, YOU are going to claim that you thought I was obviously scum and then suddenly backpedal, and your claimed rationale for doing it was because you found my roleclaim suspicious?!
what role claim are you even talking about? you mean your flavor claim? I think your starting post was terrible, but it holds better when you did it in all the games I've noticed on this site
stop over-exaggerating your responses to literally everything, it looks gross
Vaimes and Cuth - Do you guys think Sloth is town? I think you both have played more with him. I'm not sure how much I should buy into my "doesn't feel like he has an agenda" for being too alignment indicative. I just remember that one game I played with him over a year ago? where he was a scum and his reads and reasoning just really didn't feel right but that was also him coming off a long break, so I might be working with a terrible model.
the only game i've played with him where we were both villagers was in team mafia when we were on the same team, so i can't say i have a lot of experience finding him as a villager
i think i expect a certain amount of dynamic movement and depth from him as v-- he can absolutely write out long cases and put effort into things as a wolf, but it's hard to maintain a cohesive yet spread-out narrative while being genuine and having the end of each thought connect to the beginning of the other as a wolf
more to the point i think most of the people pushing him are in my poe, so i'm not super worried there atm
@Tammy
I do have a wolf game from Sloth if you want to read it, I'll post it after Vaimes responds if you helps you, or if anyone else wants it
anyways going to bed
also so back reading a few games, and I've noticed that highroller always comes in with a flavor claim in his first post, I checked two other games on this site.
@Highroller
do you have a wolf game anywhere on this site?
still dislike his response to my claim, but there are definitely more palpable options
unvote: Highroller vote: Azreal
He needs to respond to Iso, because based on my own analysis his claim makes not much sense in regards to Iso's lean list. That fact that Tubba also doesn't have a scum lean is definitely not something I like
also I certainly care who gets flipped for the most part, but at the end of the day I asked to be on that train once we come to a consensus, and in that regards is less of me decision as it is your decision, like honestly removing my ability to take Vit, and I am just a 3/5 target executioner
Just woke up though so I’ll actually read what he said in full later, but my first impression is too blustery. Might just be normal for him. I haven’t played with him in years, and only once or twice maybe.
Sorry, something broke in me yesterday. Working on catching up.
I like Iso, I dislike Az. Iso feels super solvey so far, even if I am not sold on CC being wolfy.
Az, from my bird brain memory of his posts felt really consensus. He also seems weirdly giddy which feels so out of character for him, but that is probably nai.
Wisp is bothering me for some reason, but I can't really put my finger on why. I will try to explore that when I have less work in front of me.
I don't get the Tubba hate. I kind of agree with him. and think it also reads genuine. Every time I see a town try to work with a neutral, I get Vietnam flashbacks of Xyer's game of neutrals and how willing the town is willing to accommodate him.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm burning the midnight oil (and now weekend oil, which really stings) on this work project, so this will unfortunately be brief.
Most of what raised my eyebrows on early Iso can be explained by him trying to be a little less manic, a choice I applaud. Other things that gave me pause:
- Him liking my first post, which--given that I was getting flak for it from others--made me eye Iso's pockets suspicously.
- The "completely glazing over page 5, only 7 posts in" comment, which felt like a way to conveniently not notice things on that page, although I'm pretty sure he then went on to comment on things on that page.
- Some of his comments felt like fluff, which I don't recall being normal for him.
@Iso: I did a skim of Silver's early posts, and I'm reevaluating on him a little. There's not a lot of content there, and a whole lot of joking. Also, I think his 272 potentially comes from a scum!Chad buddy wanting to point out that Chad didn't really comment on him (Silver) before anyone else did. I'll finish iso'ing him when I have more time.
@Vaimes: In 629, why do you "subtract the self (in theory)" when you're trying to emphasize the count of town players?
Tubba and Cuth are both trending up for me from recent posts. And Tammy continues to feel obvTown.
Yep, a few more posts of unbridled righteous indignation from Highroller jogged my memory: this is very standard Highroller. First post flavor claim, then latch onto a polarizing controversy and ride it hard. Problem with that playstyle is that it's pretty easy to imitate as either alignment, so I'm still not getting strong vibes either way.
@Highroller: You may have mentioned this already, but if Wisp weren't yeetable, who would you yeet instead?
I have reservations about Wisp because it feels like his ability is a combination arsonist/serial killer/hitman concept, which is super cool in execution, but also feels potentially devastating and swingy. N1 he only does 1 or 3 damage, but N2 he's up to 3-9 damage total, depending, and N3 he's dealt 6-18 damage, and somewhere in there is likely at least one extra death, possibly three, and possibly all three occurring on N3. It just feels like it has potential to get out of hand. (Less so if he doesn't hit his desired targets, obviously, but his winning scenario is where I'm concerned.)
@Az: I'll take a look at the posts you mentioned on Sloth when I have time, but right now I'm giving you a pretty big side-eye because Sloth is high on my townlean list, and you having him as your highest suspect just doesn't track for me.
Also: Good luck/congrats on 3rd child. We just welcomed our (completely unplanned) third child a few months back and it's been pretty wild.
Vaimes - his cheerful self, checking postcounts is a town thing to do
Highroller - anti Wisp because he’s one of Wisp’s targets.
Iso - town or very rusty mafia. Probably just town.
Silvercrys3467 - gut town lean. His normal D1 behavior.
Gentleman Johnny - with Wisp claimed neutral my reason to distrust him is gone.
Slothful - hasn’t left his scum range but volume speaks in his favor.
Cantripmancer - latest wall feels townish but is within his scum range.
Killjoy - hard null
Tammy - fully capable of this stream of consciousness posting as mafia. Hard null.
Cuthalion - a bit worried about them because I don’t remember any stances
xX_WakeMeUp1337_Xx - Should be easy enough to figure out once she becomes active
Bur - can’t explain for now
Azrael - catch up wasn’t up to par. Az is a real solver as town, missing that.
ChadMD - felt like mafia. Notoriously hard to read though.
Tubba Fett - wants to lunch the neutral by lack of better reads, but isn’t developing those
CropCircles42 - his play reminds me of Snow White. I wish there was a recent town game to compare but alas. Gut screams scum.
I realised after reading page 1 that I played with the majority of the players, but is the first time playing with Iso, Bur, GJ, Tammy and Azrael, except they have on MU a different username and we played in the last 2 years and i don't know this.
My MU name is Michelle, a translation in English of my name.
Nice to meet you!
Being the first page I think the fluff posting from some people is not a crime.
I wish to know why is P#34 the scummiest for @Sloth and if in the P#54 of @GJ the mention about Iso solving until page 4 is a meme.
I don't understand what Rhand posted but being RP I don't think he wanted to transmit important game informations that way.
@Chad can you reformulate for me P#23? Looks like an odd strategy and I want to know if I understood it correct.
@Killjoy
I don't really think I am considered an evil neutral? maybe more benign? My win-con matches a benign more than anything since it doesn't tell me I need to be the last one standing
I mean any neutral that needs to kill town is evil.
@Highroller: It's bad because scum care more about killing neutrals than town does. Town cares about killing Mafia first, then neutrals, as neutrals help them sometimes by killing Mafia.
Oh that's a great argument. Let's double the number of hostile factions that have nightkills on the off-chance that the guy who is evil and whose win condition is to kill towns might accidentally kill a mafia.
also so back reading a few games, and I've noticed that highroller always comes in with a flavor claim in his first post, I checked two other games on this site.
I love how it's only now that you mention why you thought my entrance was bad. Like, you never mention the fact that I roleclaimed before was the reason you voted for me previously, it's only now.
It's almost like you made an opportunistic vote without any real reason and now you need to backpedal somehow...
I personally wanted to hit lower posters, and not people getting heat
... which you totally just admit here. Ok, cool. That was nice of you.
Also, YOU are going to claim that you thought I was obviously scum and then suddenly backpedal, and your claimed rationale for doing it was because you found my roleclaim suspicious?!
YOU are you going to claim my roleclaim is suspicious? Yeah, I'ma love to see your attempts to explain that.
@Highroller
do you have a wolf game anywhere on this site?
Hot take: if Tubba is town, then Vaimes, Silver, Tammy and Cuthalion are all town for not jumping on tubba. Because mafia would not pass up a chance to attack a town that is going all in on the neutral.
That argument Highroller used that our wincon says to eliminate all anti-town doesn’t hold up with Wisp because he can leave the game. Eliminating him is not a necessity.
Oh that's a fantastic reason to double the number of hostile factions with nightkills.
You do realize that all of this hinges upon you accepting whatever a claimed hostile role has told you without question, right?
Seriously, does no one else even consider the possibility that LastWhisper might be lying is instead one of the mafia? I've been in a game in which the town lost because that exact thing happened on this very site.
How does lynching a neutral (and you said you believe he is a neutral) give us any information to work with toMorrow?
That's like saying, "How would lynching a mafia flip from a confirmed inspector day one give us any information to work with tomorrow?"
FFS, he's confirmed to be a threat to the town on day one!
High roller - I’m responding to your neutral party response to me but I’m on my phone and quoting that response is too much.
I understand that sometimes a 3p in the game can cost the game for town, but I’ve also been in games with 3p which have done nothing really to hurt towns chances of winning, and have had 3p actually be a help to town.
I do not think leaving alive a 3p for this moment is going to do grave damage to town. If you think he’s lying and he’s really mafia, that’s one thing, but if you believe his claim then leave it alone for right now.
And really it’s a moot point that should quite frankly not be addressed again. Only high roller and tuba (azrael?) want to eliminate him which means you’re not reaching majority on this, and continued arguing is just a distraction today. It’s an easy place for scum to hide because it takes up valuable headspace. Might as well accept it, look for scum to yeet and begrudgingly move on. Make a discussion thread about what we should do with claimed neutrals after the game if it makes you feel better.
This is the equivalent of having the ball on the 1-yard line, and then not running it.
Sunday is still a lazy day, and I made the mistake to take notes like the day would be longer but i checked and is still 24 hours. I will not do this anymore because I want to read as much as I can today.
Page 2
I like GJs activity, he is focused on the game, I noticed Wisp says his tone is not from his town self but I started to distrust meta lately so I am waiting to see what i find in the next pages.
@Wisp i understand that GJ didn't play in long time, do you think meta remains the same after a break? Also what means the case for Kj is up in the air (P#88)?
@Rhand if you reformulated P#92 somewhere, I think I will find it. If not, please tell me what's about.
See being on the other side of high roller gives me a different perspective of his play here, and I honestly can't really get what's townie about this, and a lot of people have just used meta. Like how is this not an over exaggeration, I just wanted his thoughts, and then he proceeds to Omgus me, and rage
Some one tell why this looks good outside of meta
@Wake
While I do hate his tone, I still mostly hate his posts
That’s really the nothingburger question you want to ask me? I said it because Tubba isn’t going to entertain hypothetical worlds where he’s mafia, and he typically isn’t a high priority kill.
My weekend post is super spotty, so this might be one of the only posts I do to Monday.
@Az Congrats OoG! Hope it goes well. But lol at your posts of interest.
@Highroller: I am talking about something being wrong = him not being a neutral, or at least not the flavor of one he claims.
@Tubba: I liked you in the beginning, but every time you fall back, I can just feel Rhand smugly staring at me for calling him out as I start to agree with him. Give me something with all those posts you quote that aren't the vibing cat.
My weekend post is super spotty, so this might be one of the only posts I do to Monday.
@Az Congrats OoG! Hope it goes well. But lol at your posts of interest.
@Highroller: I am talking about something being wrong = him not being a neutral, or at least not the flavor of one he claims.
@Tubba: I liked you in the beginning, but every time you fall back, I can just feel Rhand smugly staring at me for calling him out as I start to agree with him. Give me something with all those posts you quote that aren't the vibing cat.
The entirety of the post you reference deals with the assertion that yeeting Wisp is a viable move. Nobody seems to agree but Highroller, as per the quoted post. I don’t/didn’t see much point in rehashing the post but wanted to show my support and agreement, via our true lord and saviour Catjam. I will if you’d like me too, but at this point it seems like a strategy discussion left for after game.
Rhand - what makes you think I’m fully capable of this posting as mafia?
With this statement you’re acting like you have first hand knowledge of my scum game but I feel like if this was a real thought, you’d have argued against vaimes talking about my scummy scum game. It feels like a superficial comment focusing on a style of writing rather than any thing I, or really anyone has done, that’s alignment indicative.
I mean if youre town and you actually hold this opinion, thank you very much for thinking this! I do wish I could post like this as scum! I’d totally be peacocking around my house patting myself on the back.
(Is the vaimes “looking at vote counts is townie” a real thought too?
i feel like i've done enough to warrant people remembering my posts and opinions
p
I remember your posts!
(That readslist felt a bit positional.)
(it did, and my comment was only poking at the bit that directly concerned me, but)
(it has an overwhelming sense of like)
(i have x read on wisp, therefore these reads must be here)
(i think this gamestate could be vaguely hard to find village reads in if you disagree with, like, we the ascendant towncore)
(but all of the village reads are like "this person feels fine so far")
(there's zero conviction in that, i don't see why checking postcounts is a substantial enough thing to mention there on your strongest townread)
(and most of the wolfreads are very much "this person isn't doing villagery things")
(but the sheer volume of that sort of thing)
(i'm just not seeing enough nuance of reads for this stage in the game, and some weird things like the thing on me which just seems to be echoing what others have said rather than trying to have any opinion)
Rhand - what makes you think I’m fully capable of this posting as mafia?
With this statement you’re acting like you have first hand knowledge of my scum game but I feel like if this was a real thought, you’d have argued against vaimes talking about my scummy scum game. It feels like a superficial comment focusing on a style of writing rather than any thing I, or really anyone has done, that’s alignment indicative.
I mean if youre town and you actually hold this opinion, thank you very much for thinking this! I do wish I could post like this as scum! I’d totally be peacocking around my house patting myself on the back.
(Is the vaimes “looking at vote counts is townie” a real thought too?
Have I never played with you as mafia? Then the “Tammy is always like this” idea doesn’t mean much I guess.
Yes, I think looking at post count is a townie reflex.
@Cuthalion: why not ask me to fleshen out certain reads rather than just commenting? And what’s with all the brackets?
Highroller claimed to be Wisp’s target. If a mafia would do that, he should be damn sure that Wisp can get lynched toDay. Because he painted a huge “take my vitality” sign on his head. I mean iso Highroller. He keeps repeating Wisp’s job is to kill town. That’s because Highroller is town and a target. I’m pretty sure there.
About the interacting and proportional reads: I tend to focus. I do develop a broad sense of the gamestate meanwhile, but my own efforts are focused on 1-2 people at a time. I spent a lot of (wasted) energy on Wisp here.
I also rely on my gut a lot.
This is the game in which KamikazeArchon, who was mafia, claimed neutral and the town lost the game by refusing to vote him - even when it was lynch-or-lose!
And now this game feels like deja vu.
With that in mind, Epic FOS: Vaimes and Rhand. Both of you know better. Especially you, Vaimes; you were alive until the endgame. When someone claims neutral - and a serial killer variant, no less - you do not refuse to lynch them, and you damn sure don’t take what they say at face value.
@Highroller: You may have mentioned this already, but if Wisp weren't yeetable, who would you yeet instead?
Either Rhand or Gentleman_Johnny.
I have reservations about Wisp because it feels like his ability is a combination arsonist/serial killer/hitman concept
IF he's telling the truth about his role, then yeah. That's exactly what he'd be. The fact that he has a nightkill attempt each night is a clear giveaway.
@Highroller: I am talking about something being wrong = him not being a neutral, or at least not the flavor of one he claims.
... So, let me see if I understand this correctly.
Are you suggesting that the guy who openly claimed being a hostile role to the town - and specifically a role that is serial killer-esque - may not be entirely trustworthy?
And we maybe would be better off not taking everything he says at face value?
Is everyone very stoned?
Yeah, I'm quite positive LastWhisper didn't spontaneously decide to roleclaim a serial killer variation and thereby hamstring his attempts to win the game for no reason. It's obvious this is a gambit. If he's neutral, clearly his win-condition isn't what he claims for it to be, and is very likely much more easily attainable than he lets on. Of course, he could just be mafia, which, I will stress, I’ve been in a game on this very site in which the mafia tried this
There are two things that we can reasonably trust about LastWhisper:
1. He is hostile to the town
2. He started with 7 Vitality
As far as I am concerned, everything else he says we should ignore. He’s outed scum. We should probably also lynch him too, but hey, for some reason that’s controversial.
CropCircles42 - his play reminds me of Snow White. I wish there was a recent town game to compare but alas. Gut screams scum.
You know, on this, I actually will agree with you. CropCircles' play feels exactly like it did in Snow White, but I don't know enough about him to know how much of that's him being mafia or how much of it is him being him.
Highroller claimed to be Wisp’s target. If a mafia would do that, he should be damn sure that Wisp can get lynched toDay. Because he painted a huge “take my vitality” sign on his head. I mean iso Highroller. He keeps repeating Wisp’s job is to kill town. That’s because Highroller is town and a target. I’m pretty sure there.
About the interacting and proportional reads: I tend to focus. I do develop a broad sense of the gamestate meanwhile, but my own efforts are focused on 1-2 people at a time. I spent a lot of (wasted) energy on Wisp here.
I also rely on my gut a lot.
Okay but, counterpoint
Why would you ever say this out loud if you think Highroller is a villager
You're telling Wisp one of the villagers he needs to kill to achieve his wincon
@Highroller Wisp needs to die / leave the game before lylo for sure. But Day 1?
The thing is that I believe his claim. He named a very specific ability that should be present on 5 different people. If that is a lie, we WILL find out.
And he needs only 3 of them dead. That’s not a game changer since lynching works too.
I really don’t see the point in offing him toDay.
Was there any doubt? How are you even questioning this?
Oh that's a great argument. Let's double the number of hostile factions that have nightkills on the off-chance that the guy who is evil and whose win condition is to kill towns might accidentally kill a mafia.
Is everyone here very stoned?
Really? Is there something that Wisp did that has caused you to be suspicious of him? Whatever could that be?
He openly declared he was a threat to the town. Why were you not bothered by him earlier?
I love how it's only now that you mention why you thought my entrance was bad. Like, you never mention the fact that I roleclaimed before was the reason you voted for me previously, it's only now.
It's almost like you made an opportunistic vote without any real reason and now you need to backpedal somehow...
... which you totally just admit here. Ok, cool. That was nice of you.
Also, YOU are going to claim that you thought I was obviously scum and then suddenly backpedal, and your claimed rationale for doing it was because you found my roleclaim suspicious?!
YOU are you going to claim my roleclaim is suspicious? Yeah, I'ma love to see your attempts to explain that.
Nope.
I'm standing right here, dude.
Oh that's a fantastic reason to double the number of hostile factions with nightkills.
You do realize that all of this hinges upon you accepting whatever a claimed hostile role has told you without question, right?
Seriously, does no one else even consider the possibility that LastWhisper might be lying is instead one of the mafia? I've been in a game in which the town lost because that exact thing happened on this very site.
That's like saying, "How would lynching a mafia flip from a confirmed inspector day one give us any information to work with tomorrow?"
FFS, he's confirmed to be a threat to the town on day one!
This is the equivalent of having the ball on the 1-yard line, and then not running it.
Vaimes and Cuth - Do you guys think Sloth is town? I think you both have played more with him. I'm not sure how much I should buy into my "doesn't feel like he has an agenda" for being too alignment indicative. I just remember that one game I played with him over a year ago? where he was a scum and his reads and reasoning just really didn't feel right but that was also him coming off a long break, so I might be working with a terrible model.
I didn't realize Vaimes changed his avatar to a bird. chirp chirp
Also Azrael - Congrats on upcoming baby #3; I hope the delivery is easy and the baby is healthy
what role claim are you even talking about? you mean your flavor claim? I think your starting post was terrible, but it holds better when you did it in all the games I've noticed on this site
stop over-exaggerating your responses to literally everything, it looks gross
@Azreal
Congratz my dude
the only game i've played with him where we were both villagers was in team mafia when we were on the same team, so i can't say i have a lot of experience finding him as a villager
i think i expect a certain amount of dynamic movement and depth from him as v-- he can absolutely write out long cases and put effort into things as a wolf, but it's hard to maintain a cohesive yet spread-out narrative while being genuine and having the end of each thought connect to the beginning of the other as a wolf
more to the point i think most of the people pushing him are in my poe, so i'm not super worried there atm
I do have a wolf game from Sloth if you want to read it, I'll post it after Vaimes responds if you helps you, or if anyone else wants it
anyways going to bed
On mobile so quoting all of this so that I can remind myself to respond to it later.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Most of what raised my eyebrows on early Iso can be explained by him trying to be a little less manic, a choice I applaud. Other things that gave me pause:
- Him liking my first post, which--given that I was getting flak for it from others--made me eye Iso's pockets suspicously.
- The "completely glazing over page 5, only 7 posts in" comment, which felt like a way to conveniently not notice things on that page, although I'm pretty sure he then went on to comment on things on that page.
- Some of his comments felt like fluff, which I don't recall being normal for him.
@Iso: I did a skim of Silver's early posts, and I'm reevaluating on him a little. There's not a lot of content there, and a whole lot of joking. Also, I think his 272 potentially comes from a scum!Chad buddy wanting to point out that Chad didn't really comment on him (Silver) before anyone else did. I'll finish iso'ing him when I have more time.
@Vaimes: In 629, why do you "subtract the self (in theory)" when you're trying to emphasize the count of town players?
Tubba and Cuth are both trending up for me from recent posts. And Tammy continues to feel obvTown.
Yep, a few more posts of unbridled righteous indignation from Highroller jogged my memory: this is very standard Highroller. First post flavor claim, then latch onto a polarizing controversy and ride it hard. Problem with that playstyle is that it's pretty easy to imitate as either alignment, so I'm still not getting strong vibes either way.
@Highroller: You may have mentioned this already, but if Wisp weren't yeetable, who would you yeet instead?
I have reservations about Wisp because it feels like his ability is a combination arsonist/serial killer/hitman concept, which is super cool in execution, but also feels potentially devastating and swingy. N1 he only does 1 or 3 damage, but N2 he's up to 3-9 damage total, depending, and N3 he's dealt 6-18 damage, and somewhere in there is likely at least one extra death, possibly three, and possibly all three occurring on N3. It just feels like it has potential to get out of hand. (Less so if he doesn't hit his desired targets, obviously, but his winning scenario is where I'm concerned.)
@Az: I'll take a look at the posts you mentioned on Sloth when I have time, but right now I'm giving you a pretty big side-eye because Sloth is high on my townlean list, and you having him as your highest suspect just doesn't track for me.
Also: Good luck/congrats on 3rd child. We just welcomed our (completely unplanned) third child a few months back and it's been pretty wild.
Vaimes - his cheerful self, checking postcounts is a town thing to do
Highroller - anti Wisp because he’s one of Wisp’s targets.
Iso - town or very rusty mafia. Probably just town.
Silvercrys3467 - gut town lean. His normal D1 behavior.
Gentleman Johnny - with Wisp claimed neutral my reason to distrust him is gone.
Slothful - hasn’t left his scum range but volume speaks in his favor.
Cantripmancer - latest wall feels townish but is within his scum range.
Killjoy - hard null
Tammy - fully capable of this stream of consciousness posting as mafia. Hard null.
Cuthalion - a bit worried about them because I don’t remember any stances
xX_WakeMeUp1337_Xx - Should be easy enough to figure out once she becomes active
Bur - can’t explain for now
Azrael - catch up wasn’t up to par. Az is a real solver as town, missing that.
ChadMD - felt like mafia. Notoriously hard to read though.
Tubba Fett - wants to lunch the neutral by lack of better reads, but isn’t developing those
CropCircles42 - his play reminds me of Snow White. I wish there was a recent town game to compare but alas. Gut screams scum.
"Vy-mes" is the only right pronunciation.
I am avoiding prod with this post.
I hopefully have time tomorrow.
My MU name is Michelle, a translation in English of my name.
Nice to meet you!
Being the first page I think the fluff posting from some people is not a crime.
I wish to know why is P#34 the scummiest for @Sloth and if in the P#54 of @GJ the mention about Iso solving until page 4 is a meme.
I don't understand what Rhand posted but being RP I don't think he wanted to transmit important game informations that way.
@Chad can you reformulate for me P#23? Looks like an odd strategy and I want to know if I understood it correct.
I see, I will take this in ocnsideration, thanks
Page 2
I like GJs activity, he is focused on the game, I noticed Wisp says his tone is not from his town self but I started to distrust meta lately so I am waiting to see what i find in the next pages.
@Wisp i understand that GJ didn't play in long time, do you think meta remains the same after a break? Also what means the case for Kj is up in the air (P#88)?
@Rhand if you reformulated P#92 somewhere, I think I will find it. If not, please tell me what's about.
Some one tell why this looks good outside of meta
@Wake
While I do hate his tone, I still mostly hate his posts
where exactly are you pulling these numbers from?
That’s really the nothingburger question you want to ask me? I said it because Tubba isn’t going to entertain hypothetical worlds where he’s mafia, and he typically isn’t a high priority kill.
Now divine my alignment from that answer.
@Az Congrats OoG! Hope it goes well. But lol at your posts of interest.
@Highroller: I am talking about something being wrong = him not being a neutral, or at least not the flavor of one he claims.
@Tubba: I liked you in the beginning, but every time you fall back, I can just feel Rhand smugly staring at me for calling him out as I start to agree with him. Give me something with all those posts you quote that aren't the vibing cat.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
@Wakemeup: It's a meme with ISo, although he has a strong ability to solve.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
we still have chad/bur/azreal/circles
all very optimal trains, though I would like to see a replacement in Chad's slot before we bury him
Cantrip can you tell me why you asked me that and what it did for you?
The entirety of the post you reference deals with the assertion that yeeting Wisp is a viable move. Nobody seems to agree but Highroller, as per the quoted post. I don’t/didn’t see much point in rehashing the post but wanted to show my support and agreement, via our true lord and saviour Catjam. I will if you’d like me too, but at this point it seems like a strategy discussion left for after game.
If you think Wisp isn't a neutral what do you think of Azrael confirming his flavor as a neutral character?
I haven't read the novels so
Let’s not go the flavorgaming route. I googled my character and he seems to be a bad guy.
Haha yeh I figured that would be totally in my scum mo when I posted it lol.
i feel like i've done enough to warrant people remembering my posts and opinions
I'm wondering what GJ thinks of Az doing that if he thinks Wisp isn't a neutral
I remember your posts!
(That readslist felt a bit positional.)
With this statement you’re acting like you have first hand knowledge of my scum game but I feel like if this was a real thought, you’d have argued against vaimes talking about my scummy scum game. It feels like a superficial comment focusing on a style of writing rather than any thing I, or really anyone has done, that’s alignment indicative.
I mean if youre town and you actually hold this opinion, thank you very much for thinking this! I do wish I could post like this as scum! I’d totally be peacocking around my house patting myself on the back.
(Is the vaimes “looking at vote counts is townie” a real thought too?
(it has an overwhelming sense of like)
(i have x read on wisp, therefore these reads must be here)
(i think this gamestate could be vaguely hard to find village reads in if you disagree with, like, we the ascendant towncore)
(but all of the village reads are like "this person feels fine so far")
(there's zero conviction in that, i don't see why checking postcounts is a substantial enough thing to mention there on your strongest townread)
(and most of the wolfreads are very much "this person isn't doing villagery things")
(but the sheer volume of that sort of thing)
(i'm just not seeing enough nuance of reads for this stage in the game, and some weird things like the thing on me which just seems to be echoing what others have said rather than trying to have any opinion)
Have I never played with you as mafia? Then the “Tammy is always like this” idea doesn’t mean much I guess.
Yes, I think looking at post count is a townie reflex.
@Cuthalion: why not ask me to fleshen out certain reads rather than just commenting? And what’s with all the brackets?
because the thing that bothers me about it isn't any of the specific reads
i'd maybe appreciate you talking a bit more about why you have highroller up so far
but honestly i just looked at the list again and none of the reads are actually
anything i can poke at
it's just "this person is a bit villagery, but probably in their wolf range" sort of thing
the most helpful thing you could do would probably just be to continue solving and going more into depth
i feel like you've done a lot of interacting, proportionally, but don't have a lot to show for it right now in terms of read complexity?
About the interacting and proportional reads: I tend to focus. I do develop a broad sense of the gamestate meanwhile, but my own efforts are focused on 1-2 people at a time. I spent a lot of (wasted) energy on Wisp here.
I also rely on my gut a lot.
Everyone, here is the link to Ghostbusters mafia:
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/community-forums/mafia/801746-ghostbusters-mafia-game-over-ghostbusted
This is the game in which KamikazeArchon, who was mafia, claimed neutral and the town lost the game by refusing to vote him - even when it was lynch-or-lose!
And now this game feels like deja vu.
With that in mind, Epic FOS: Vaimes and Rhand. Both of you know better. Especially you, Vaimes; you were alive until the endgame. When someone claims neutral - and a serial killer variant, no less - you do not refuse to lynch them, and you damn sure don’t take what they say at face value.
Either Rhand or Gentleman_Johnny.
IF he's telling the truth about his role, then yeah. That's exactly what he'd be. The fact that he has a nightkill attempt each night is a clear giveaway.
... So, let me see if I understand this correctly.
Are you suggesting that the guy who openly claimed being a hostile role to the town - and specifically a role that is serial killer-esque - may not be entirely trustworthy?
And we maybe would be better off not taking everything he says at face value?
Is everyone very stoned?
Yeah, I'm quite positive LastWhisper didn't spontaneously decide to roleclaim a serial killer variation and thereby hamstring his attempts to win the game for no reason. It's obvious this is a gambit. If he's neutral, clearly his win-condition isn't what he claims for it to be, and is very likely much more easily attainable than he lets on. Of course, he could just be mafia, which, I will stress, I’ve been in a game on this very site in which the mafia tried this
There are two things that we can reasonably trust about LastWhisper:
1. He is hostile to the town
2. He started with 7 Vitality
As far as I am concerned, everything else he says we should ignore. He’s outed scum. We should probably also lynch him too, but hey, for some reason that’s controversial.
And because I have common sense and remember what happened in Ghostbusters Mafia.
You know, on this, I actually will agree with you. CropCircles' play feels exactly like it did in Snow White, but I don't know enough about him to know how much of that's him being mafia or how much of it is him being him.
Why would you ever say this out loud if you think Highroller is a villager
You're telling Wisp one of the villagers he needs to kill to achieve his wincon
The thing is that I believe his claim. He named a very specific ability that should be present on 5 different people. If that is a lie, we WILL find out.
And he needs only 3 of them dead. That’s not a game changer since lynching works too.
I really don’t see the point in offing him toDay.
I'm not gonna shield Last forever lol.
and in the meantime we can ignore his abilities etc for the most part