I assumed based on Rhand’s wording that he has to target a specific ability, and we don’t know Gemma’s abilities, so that made sense to me.
Asta is just the King, and apparently can only double vote in spring and summer, I don’t 100% see a day kill fitting there.
silver, I think we can assume it’s not just a summer day ability because if it were, they would’ve shot d2, right?
Why do you think it would be weird for Rhand to have the day kill ability? I feel like putting a janitored day kill with his backup ability presents an interesting trade-off - do you shoot someone and prevent yourself from stealing their role, or do you forgo the KP for the chance at stealing something later on? Does that idea make any sense? I probably need to go back and look at what Rhand posted specifically about the day kill, hmm.
I don’t really think KJ is the day killer. And I’m not, but I’m not sure how to prove the... absence of a role except by just claiming and having you all evaluate whether it seems to fit or something. But it’s very close to deadline, so I don’t see what we could gain from mass claiming now as opposed to toMorrow.
Dk was talking about the idea that the day kill happened because scum got to trade their night kill for it or something. To me, that seems a little esoteric along with any of the claimed roles too, but I’ve been wondering whether it could have been an inadvertent effect of someone’s ability - which probably just means Wisp. Idk maybe “tranquility” forced the mafia to kill during the day so the next night would be “tranquil”? It’s a stretch for sure.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Proph - when you were answering my question about TRing Vaimes, you quoted one post he made about him feeling drained, which you’d already pointed out when discussing the read at first. Are there others you could point to?
Not particularly? The way my Vaimes read went was
"Negative space + I would expect Vaimes to be more obviously town if he is town"
"He's been bandwagoning other people and not advancing his own reads, I think this is scum Vaimes"
> Me takes the time to read fulcrum's case
"Oh, this makes a lot more sense. fulcrum is looking at a couple of select Vaimes posts and is really diving deep into his mindset based on those posts, which seems like a better approach than the macro reading I've been doing"
"Oh, here's a Vaimes post that I don't think he makes if he's scum"
And we get to now.
--
I like KCC's debilitation when erring on the side of not voting me and I think it's a nuance that she doesn't really think to fake as scum. If she's scum here, then why does she hem and haw on me about me being scum mechanically but my behavior being decent? Feels like if she's scum she just tries to score a mislynch and makes up some contrived reasoning and votes me. Might be the victim of buddying here but I like her process WRT sorting me out.
I'm not really a fan of Rhand's neutral hunting and his vote on Keldeo; kind of want to see a case from him on why he thinks Keldeo is scum aside from "he's next on my PoE".
Quote from Keldeo »
fulcrum - do you think the behavior and claim-related reasons you cited about Vaimes being town are more like "town Vaimes" or "not mafia-with-a-team (i.e. town, or possibly neutral) Vaimes"? I know there's no real reason to speculate on the existence of a third party, but your posts about it laid out the distinction as more of a dichotomy. Same question to Proph, I guess.
My policy is to not care about a neutral until I have to.
Scum hunt neutrals. Mafia think neutrals as the enemy. If the scum have successfully convinced the town to do the neutral hunting for them, then they've won the game.
fulcrum moving off on me and onto Axelrod piques my interest quite a bit. I believe Axel's claim, but he's been lacking somewhat recently (I assume due to the holidays).
Quote from fulcrum »
I feel like everyone who should be pushing scum rn is just lamenting about a lack of strong reads instead, and there has to be scum satisfied with the gamestate in there, using the thread feeling as an excuse to do nothing.
This is a good post (and sentiment) by fulcrum. Not sure if I share that exact same sentiment but the fact that she is expressing it is good in my book.
Quote from Keldeo »
Can you tell us what this [redacted] is now that you've claimed, Proph, or was it related to something else?
I'm pretty sure I was intending to talk about the fact that KCC's busdrive was legit because I got swapped to Nacho, but I think I got swamped with a lot of work at the time. That was the REDACTED.
I am not particularly thrilled with Rhand's claim. Backup claims are pretty medium and his is even super slow in that he can't use the ability he takes on the same Night. People have already raised
Quote from Keldeo »
Proph, do dead people keep their orbs?
My role says that "orbs stay in effect after death" so I assume yes?
I would also like to hear how Axel thinks about me given that I think the last time he talked about me, he said "this is less good" WRT a V/LA post of mine.
Also, I just realized that Axel changed his user title to "quietly competent", and that made me giggle
Quote from Axelrod »
You can ask, but I don't have a real good read there yet. I don't like his lack of posting. Quite a bit actually. And I have issues with the role as claimed because it seems bad and also needlessly confusing.
I guess this is it but yeah. Would actually like him to explain more about what his issues with my role are/any analysis of my posts in question.
----
Alright, caught up for the most part.
- Still think Rhand is scum but would like to reread to double check; also feels weird that there is no real counterwagon to this given that I think if Rhand is scum then his team would be happy to push counterwagons given that it is 10 votes to lynch today. I'm like slightly paranoid that we're just being led by the nose and Rhand is actually town, but then my eternal question needs to get answered, which is - who are the scum?
- Been liking fulcrum's posts Today, I feel like she would be more hands-off about things if she is actually mafia.
- I feel pretty bad for wanting to look at Axelrod again given that I assume he's been swamped with holidays like most of us are, but there has to be scum somewhere and he has dropped off. The amount of confirmed information in this setup (dkings/Asta/Grape/vezok) makes me think that this setup might skimp on traditional information roles for the town.
- Keldeo has had a lot of very strong posts and sentiments Today and in general. If he's scum I'd be mighty impressed.
- Not sure if I have time for this but I would like to do some sort of reread on Silver. I still do think he's town but that's a read from a couple weeks ago and I would like to recheck my assumptions given that a lot of people I thought were mafia might be town instead.
I checked some things with the mod and turns out I didn't completely understand my role.
It's way weaker than I thought.
The ability name is God of the Underworld.
I target at Night and can use the ability to take a seasonal + a seasonal action in the same Night, which made me think I could use the one I got that Night immediately, but apparently I cannot because I will only receive it at the end of that Night.
The ability will match the current season.
I can target the same ability multiple times.
It would take me a full "year" to power up for the next year, so basically I am vanilla until Night 5 the earliest, and since we didn't create any targets for me on the first 2 Nights, it's going to take a looooong time for me to power up.
I was going to say that the people who are hiding things about their roles (Vaimes/Fulcrum/Rhand/someone else?) are not doing anyone any favors in terms of figuring stuff out, but it appears Rhand at least has now full-claimed?
I'm going to look at that later. I've actually been trying to review him for awhile and I have notes.
It feels like a lot of my concerns come from *apparent* philosophical disagreements about how to play/what things mean.
This is where this post should have ended. Because apparently we do have different views on what things mean.
For instance, when he says:
With that pocket remark, Fulcrum being scum without Vezok being a buddy would be very strange. Why would scum ever confess pocketing to town?
I want to roll my eyes and say "really?" Exactly how naive are you? And that I don't think Rhand is that naive.
I obviously do think that scum doesn't confess they're pocketing town. There are some exceptions like tom or Rodemy who would do things like that, but Fulcrum doesn't strike me as the kind of player that would ever do this. It's too much tongue-in-cheek for her style.
Or this:
Then you explain me why scum!Vaimes would ever tell town!Grape to go and read all his own posts in a vacuum. Grape is a good player. Making him ISO yourself when you’re scum is a completely needless risk.
Which seems like a completely trivial thing (to me) for someone to do as scum. In fact, it might be more likely for scum to brush off a comment with "go read my posts" than not. And again I'm going, does Rhand really believe this?
You pulled this completely out of context. Vaimes said to Grape, who was catching up, to ISO Mind, me and himself. Out of the blue.
That has nothing to do with scum brushing off a comment with "go read my posts".
He says:
I think Nacho is scum. His reason for changing to summer is very weak and then we get that daykill. I think whoever did that daykill was a lynch candidate and Nacho went yolo with the season change
And my reaction was just opposite. I thought whoever had that daykill was totally not in jeopardy and just waiting until late in the day to fire it off because they could.
Does your reaction being opposite mean mine is fake then? Because it isn't. It's what I thought.
His analysis of Vaimes claim:
If the ability would’ve worked on Vez, he would probably have joined the chat with whoever the partner is and outed him to scum.
And he would’ve closed mason chat, which is pretty big.
And if he knew he can’t take a passive, he didn’t give a BP vest to someone he would maybe have to kill later.
I see only mafia gain and no town gain in targeting Vez
Makes no sense to me. I was having trouble believing that Vaimes believed that he could get some kind of a Mason ability from targeting Vez, but this is totally different. It seems almost less likely to me that a scum with Vaimes' ability, targeting Vez would get a Neighborizor Chat out of it and "closed the mason chat." That's just wild, illogical spec. to me.
What would Vaimes have gotten then if it would have worked? A neighbour chat is the most logical thing. I don't think DV is going to add more straight clears to a game that has masons. AND I was under the assumption that Vaimes isn't town, so having him get a masoniser shot didn't even enter my thoughts.
Then there are the times he plays in a way that I just wouldn't and I don't think is correct.
You established from the beginning that we have disagreements on how the game is played.
Have you even read some of my other games? I'm sure you'll disagree with my play all the time. And yet we're both good players.
I’m going to ignore my instinct and let KJ slide for now. Too many of my townreads are calling this v/v.
I just don't think this way. I'm not saying I can't be persuaded I'm wrong, but I don't abandon a read because "my current townreads" seem to disagree.
I tend to step into v/v tunnels and taking distance and re-focussing is the only way to get out of them. If my town reads are saying that that is what is happening, then I have to take that step back.
You're twisting this into something "wrong" while it is the best thing to do. We were dominating the thread with our fight.
Then he said this:
If there’s anything post #300 has taught me for this game, it is that there’s no point in long explanations for my reads. It costs a lot of energy to write that all out and all it got me was flak.
Which is like a very scum response to me. And I say that as someone who often gets flack after posting a big read list.
How is this a real read? "a very scum response to me"? That doesn't mean anything and the "to me" qualifier makes this whole sentence moot.
There's a few more things I'll put in another post. None of this is, like, super-incriminating. It's just...wrong? And I think Rhand's a pretty good player and shouldn't be this wrong?
None of that is "wrong". I can't see any other reason for you posting this baloney than that you're bloodthirsty and want to see me hang now that I'm at 6 votes.
If I am strictly looking at where Rhand's votes have gone this game, it's:
Me (wrong)
Vezok (Mason? Unclaimed at that point)
Killjoy (my towniest read? And the reason here is that Rhand didn't like that Killjoy was saying he thought he had a read Rhand when he's (apparently) been wrong about Rhand a lot in the past)
Grape (Other Mason? Also was unclaimed at that point)
Me again (wrong)
Nacho (wrong)
Vaimes
Keldeo (and this is at a time when Keldeo is just making stronger and stronger posts)
If the Masons are real, and my read on Killjoy is right, this isn't particularly great. The Vaimes vote might be fine? Except then the reason he came off Vaimes is weird - because he decided he thinks Vaimes is actually Neutral, despite Vaimes explicitly saying that is not true.
I realize that no one else can credit the incorrect me votes either.
I'm using my vote what it's made for: pressure and lynching people I think are scum.
Your votes:
KCC (my strongest townread)
Mindreaver (who was absent)
KCC again
No lynch
I'm not really a fan of Rhand's neutral hunting and his vote on Keldeo; kind of want to see a case from him on why he thinks Keldeo is scum aside from "he's next on my PoE".
Neutral hunting? I unvoted him when I realised he's probably neutral rather than scum.
It bugs me that he denies it though. I'm pretty sure that's what he is. But I'm willing to wait and see what he claims toMorrow.
My case on Keldeo is that he doesn't take stances. There's not much more. I have a hard time digesting his posts and won't reread him again.
It is mainly a POE thing.
I checked some things with the mod and turns out I didn't completely understand my role.
It's way weaker than I thought.
The ability name is God of the Underworld.
I target at Night and can use the ability to take a seasonal + a seasonal action in the same Night, which made me think I could use the one I got that Night immediately, but apparently I cannot because I will only receive it at the end of that Night.
The ability will match the current season.
I can target the same ability multiple times.
It would take me a full "year" to power up for the next year, so basically I am vanilla until Night 5 the earliest, and since we didn't create any targets for me on the first 2 Nights, it's going to take a looooong time for me to power up.
You target an ability and get it. And then, you can use a different seasonal ability that you acquired on a previous night, is that what you are saying? And also that the seasonal ability that you use has to match the current season, you don't "change" the ability to match the current season? Or are you still saying that the ability you target will change so that it matches the current season, but won't be available to be used until that season comes around again?
And also, that once you use the ability, it's used up, and if you want to use it again, you have to target it again, and then you could use it again on a later night that matches the season?
I was going to say that the people who are hiding things about their roles (Vaimes/Fulcrum/Rhand/someone else?) are not doing anyone any favors in terms of figuring stuff out, but it appears Rhand at least has now full-claimed?
I'm going to look at that later. I've actually been trying to review him for awhile and I have notes.
It feels like a lot of my concerns come from *apparent* philosophical disagreements about how to play/what things mean.
This is where this post should have ended. Because apparently we do have different views on what things mean.
For instance, when he says:
With that pocket remark, Fulcrum being scum without Vezok being a buddy would be very strange. Why would scum ever confess pocketing to town?
I want to roll my eyes and say "really?" Exactly how naive are you? And that I don't think Rhand is that naive.
I obviously do think that scum doesn't confess they're pocketing town. There are some exceptions like tom or Rodemy who would do things like that, but Fulcrum doesn't strike me as the kind of player that would ever do this. It's too much tongue-in-cheek for her style.
Seems like scum joke about things like this literally all the time. You also didn't say this was specific to Fulcrum here, you just said "scum" like it was generic.
Or this:
Then you explain me why scum!Vaimes would ever tell town!Grape to go and read all his own posts in a vacuum. Grape is a good player. Making him ISO yourself when you’re scum is a completely needless risk.
Which seems like a completely trivial thing (to me) for someone to do as scum. In fact, it might be more likely for scum to brush off a comment with "go read my posts" than not. And again I'm going, does Rhand really believe this?
You pulled this completely out of context. Vaimes said to Grape, who was catching up, to ISO Mind, me and himself. Out of the blue.
That has nothing to do with scum brushing off a comment with "go read my posts".
Well, I'm iso-ing you and not re-reading the whole thread again, so some posts are not going to have all the context. But it does not seem that this changes anything. If someone asks "what's going on" or "who should I read to catch up" it is entirely possible for a scum trying to look helpful to include himself in a list like that. Your astonishment at the idea that scum would do such a thing just seems bizarre.
He says:
I think Nacho is scum. His reason for changing to summer is very weak and then we get that daykill. I think whoever did that daykill was a lynch candidate and Nacho went yolo with the season change
And my reaction was just opposite. I thought whoever had that daykill was totally not in jeopardy and just waiting until late in the day to fire it off because they could.
Does your reaction being opposite mean mine is fake then? Because it isn't. It's what I thought.
Not by itself, I kind of said that. This is an aggregate thing. I think I might have been the first person to speculate that Nacho turned on that dayklll by changing the season. But the person who was on the lynch block at the time that Nacho did the thing was KCC. KCC was completely going down on D1 before Nacho.
So who is this hypothetical scum who you say was a lynch candidate that you thought Nacho was changing the season so they could get their shot off before dying? There isn't anyone unless you think KCC is lying (or me? I was run up before KCC, but I don't think I was in jeopardy at that point anymore.)
His analysis of Vaimes claim:
If the ability would’ve worked on Vez, he would probably have joined the chat with whoever the partner is and outed him to scum.
And he would’ve closed mason chat, which is pretty big.
And if he knew he can’t take a passive, he didn’t give a BP vest to someone he would maybe have to kill later.
I see only mafia gain and no town gain in targeting Vez
Makes no sense to me. I was having trouble believing that Vaimes believed that he could get some kind of a Mason ability from targeting Vez, but this is totally different. It seems almost less likely to me that a scum with Vaimes' ability, targeting Vez would get a Neighborizor Chat out of it and "closed the mason chat." That's just wild, illogical spec. to me.
What would Vaimes have gotten then if it would have worked? A neighbour chat is the most logical thing. I don't think DV is going to add more straight clears to a game that has masons. AND I was under the assumption that Vaimes isn't town, so having him get a masoniser shot didn't even enter my thoughts.
You are speculating here that Vaimes is scum, and has the ability he claimed - i.e. he can offer a "trade" of abilities with someone. I don't have a speculation for what Vaimes would have gotten if it would have "worked" because it would not have occurred to me that it could have worked.
Masons just don't have anything to trade. How does one trade their knowledge that they are confirmed Town? And the idea that they could trade their access to a quicktopic/night communication, is just too bizarre to contemplate.
I thought Vaimes was going for possibly some "other" ability that Vez might have, separate from Mason-ness, and targeting Vez because he was closest to confirmed, and giving a BP vest to a Mason is great. But that was wrong, and apparently both you and Vaimes thought this was a possibility?
Then there are the times he plays in a way that I just wouldn't and I don't think is correct.
You established from the beginning that we have disagreements on how the game is played.
Have you even read some of my other games? I'm sure you'll disagree with my play all the time. And yet we're both good players.
I guess not recently.
You died N1 in Modern, but I don't recall you posting anything that made me go "that's just wrong" while you were alive.
In fact, I just re-read your D1. The only post you made that was somewhat similar to the kinds of things I'm talking about here was this one:
Scum!Shadow would not post this I think. Too early for a townclear.
Which seemed more specific to Shadow than a generic statement that "scum wouldn't "townclear" anyone this early." Which is a sentiment I would disagree with in general.
Otherwise, you basically said nothing I disagreed with D1.
And then I went and looked at Eurovision, where you were scum. You replaced out early, but even so, in that time you made these observations:
Quote from Vaimes »
Does anybody know EmikoYuriemoto?
Totally not pretending I’m not on a team with them.
It might be meant as a joke, but if it is not, then the following makes KJ town:
Quote from Vaimes »
Though it's nice knowing that Emiko/KJ are never partners.
@KJ: If tom is scum, it almost has to be with last.
Dismissing the claim and calling him town at the same time is something scum wouldn’t do with town.
Why would a N0 cop and another investigative be mutually exclusive?
A N0 cop is basically a weaker version of masons (no chat and only 1-way confirmation)
And this seems closer to the kind of stuff I am seeing here.
I’m going to ignore my instinct and let KJ slide for now. Too many of my townreads are calling this v/v.
I just don't think this way. I'm not saying I can't be persuaded I'm wrong, but I don't abandon a read because "my current townreads" seem to disagree.
I tend to step into v/v tunnels and taking distance and re-focussing is the only way to get out of them. If my town reads are saying that that is what is happening, then I have to take that step back.
You're twisting this into something "wrong" while it is the best thing to do. We were dominating the thread with our fight.
Well, I am saying I disagree, and that it seems "wrong" to me. I don't know why you call that "twisting". And saying "to me" is to make it perfectly clear that this is what "I" think and I am aware that other people might think differently.
Then he said this:
If there’s anything post #300 has taught me for this game, it is that there’s no point in long explanations for my reads. It costs a lot of energy to write that all out and all it got me was flak.
Which is like a very scum response to me. And I say that as someone who often gets flack after posting a big read list.
How is this a real read? "a very scum response to me"? That doesn't mean anything and the "to me" qualifier makes this whole sentence moot.
I say this from experience. As scum, I am less likely to want to make a big "reads" post, because it opens you up to criticism, and incidentally could contain tells about your teammates for later, no matter how much you try not to tie yourself to them. The fact you made the post at all was good for that reason. But this - this is what a scum would say, to avoid doing it again in general. And I feel like I've said something very similar as scum before. Essentially "why should I bother to make a big post on people when all I get is flack from it..."
You can get frustrated as Town also, yes, but I don't think you actually caught so much "flack" from that post as to justify this kind of response (not that it's "justified" per-se, but at least more understandable). I certainly don't remember you getting run up or anything. That was super early.
There's a few more things I'll put in another post. None of this is, like, super-incriminating. It's just...wrong? And I think Rhand's a pretty good player and shouldn't be this wrong?
None of that is "wrong". I can't see any other reason for you posting this baloney than that you're bloodthirsty and want to see me hang now that I'm at 6 votes.
Well, then you're not being very objective, are you?
If I am strictly looking at where Rhand's votes have gone this game, it's:
Me (wrong)
Vezok (Mason? Unclaimed at that point)
Killjoy (my towniest read? And the reason here is that Rhand didn't like that Killjoy was saying he thought he had a read Rhand when he's (apparently) been wrong about Rhand a lot in the past)
Grape (Other Mason? Also was unclaimed at that point)
Me again (wrong)
Nacho (wrong)
Vaimes
Keldeo (and this is at a time when Keldeo is just making stronger and stronger posts)
If the Masons are real, and my read on Killjoy is right, this isn't particularly great. The Vaimes vote might be fine? Except then the reason he came off Vaimes is weird - because he decided he thinks Vaimes is actually Neutral, despite Vaimes explicitly saying that is not true.
I realize that no one else can credit the incorrect me votes either.
I'm using my vote what it's made for: pressure and lynching people I think are scum.
Your votes:
KCC (my strongest townread)
Mindreaver (who was absent)
KCC again
No lynch
Pot - kettle much?
Vote Axelrod
Cheap shot?
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Well, I think I've convinced myself. And there's not a lot of time remaining.
Vote: Rhand
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KCC or Proph/Keldeo/Axel or Rhand/who? Asta? Fulcrum maybe if Rhand's a wolf like I think, I guess?
Whoever asked me about why I thought the daykill could be seasonal, I was thinking it might be 1/summer (refreshes when the season changes to Summer like Dkings said his BG does) not 1/day during Summer or something, that'd be super obnoxious. Rhand seemed pretty sure it's a 1-shot which is either TMI or a bad assumption imo.
Thinking about it a bit longer, yeah, whoever said he might have the daykill on him is ~maybe right. Or maybe Gemma was the backup and using the daykill on her gave him her role or something -- though why they hit someone unclaimed instead of Axelrod is weird in that instance but maybe they just used it as a kill and didn't particularly care about the role.
I don't know if I claimed this before, but I'm Thisbe. Also my role has the name Fated Mason, although that qualifier doesn't seem to mean anything. I'm literally the bog standard version of a mason.
Rhand's role seems simply horrible. The earliest he could do anything without nacho's intervention is night 5 which is kinda horrible considering all the seasonal abilities that we know of are just reasonable. There's nothing that would be really good for a second turn. I think Rhand is just scum here. Big chance of being scum with Vaimes, but that should be looked at on the next day.
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Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy. Check out the Shop Thread
We know they exist, I think it's best to just trust that they do what he claimed and have him spam blue orbs as much as possible?
I guess we could test Yellow Orb functionality by having him give me or Axel a Yellow Orb; since both our abilities are targeted and Inspect, his target toNight should get the Orange Orb before our action resolves. But whoever would have to announce their target in advance.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
It seems very unlikely to me that Rhand and Proph are both town. I just don't believe that town has two glacially slow end game power roles.
I actually think Rhand and Axel are reasonably likely to be buddies. I think we have too much information at the moment (masons, watcher, and two unknown but information claims). Plus Prophs sort of RB and Vaimes track gift.
Rhand at L-2. Would prefer for no maj, though I will probably miss deadline. Do you have any last words or a final legacy, Rhand?
And mmmm. I'm kind of voting because we need to get maj, but something that sticks out to me is like, the backtracking about how his role works when people were expressing skepticism about using an ability the same night as he backed it up (I think it was mainly Axel? which could be a point against Axel/Rhand w/w, but Axel probably needs to bury him as his partner here anyway because he's the CW.)
I guess reading into that is kind of a rock and hard place situation because being able to use an ability in the same night is a bit weird (designating two targets?), but yeah, his new claimed role is a bit slow to become useful at all. Even Nacho's role could only speed it up by one cycle, and then only once in the game.
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What do people think of this orb plan:
- Today, Proph uses one of his day shots to give a yellow orb to Axel (his target will learn his ability name) and confirms this in the thread. If he doesn't confirm this, Axel and Proph can do whatever in the night, since the yellow orb needs to be given for it to work.
- Tonight, Proph gives an orange orb to Asta (enables the ability name-telling to work.) Axel uses his fall ability, which tells him the names of abilities that target his target, on Asta.
Whoever people think is less trustworthy between Asta/Axel should claim Axel's supposed fall ability first, either toDay or early toMorrow. I think that's Axel atm. The other person confirms or denies.
If Asta learns the correct fall ability, we've confirmed the function of yellow orbs, and I guess that Axel wasn't lying about his fall ability name. If not, either at least one of the three is mafia, or somehow the chain got messed up because someone targeted Proph/Axel with a disruption ability. I don't actually know if this is worth it, but I don't think there's a better plan? And I also think it's good to have an orange orb on Asta anyway because bodyguard means Asta is living until late in the game, and if Proph is actually telling the truth, the orb could save him from a kill if he gets targeted by someone with a green orb, or get told an ability name if he gets targeted by someone with a yellow orb.
Asta in this scenario could technically be anyone, but I'm saying Asta here because I think he's trustworthy, and if dk is telling the truth, he shouldn't be able to die in the night.
Silver, sorry, what's the benefit of spamming blue orbs? Doesn't that just block town power, too?
I could choose my target at any time during Summer. I could have chosen as soon as Nacho switched the seasons, although I didn't. The BG is semi-permanent (I think my breadcrumb made that clear). It's always on, but I can choose to change my target the next time summer rolls around. I did select my target last night. I would prefer to keep that a secret for now.
Blue orbs give bulletproof to the targeter, don't they? Or did I mix those up, he claimed a roleblocking orb, a bulletproof orb, and a give-ability-name orb, he should hand out as many bulletproof ones as he can so we can chain them together is what I was trying to say
Also just highlighting that he clarified the bulletproof orb (whatever color that is) works on the targeting player not the player they target, so someone with a BP orb targeting Asta makes themselves bulletproof, not Asta
Blue orbs give bulletproof to the targeter, don't they? Or did I mix those up, he claimed a roleblocking orb, a bulletproof orb, and a give-ability-name orb, he should hand out as many bulletproof ones as he can so we can chain them together is what I was trying to say
Also just highlighting that he clarified the bulletproof orb (whatever color that is) works on the targeting player not the player they target, so someone with a BP orb targeting Asta makes themselves bulletproof, not Asta
Sorry, I went back and checked and it was my bad. I mixed up bulletproof/blue and roleblock/green.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
You're at L-2, Rhand, but Grape is gonna vote there.
My only concern with it being me getting an orb is that I don't have any targeted abilities, but I assume the orb grants me the ability to target? That's logistically the only way the orb ability could work I think.
Not much to say at this juncture. Game ends tomorrow at............... hold on, 12PM means Noon right? Alright cool, about 29 hours left on toDay. I might actually be around for End of Day! Neat.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
1. Silvercrys3467
Mythrilcrys would be more useful
2. Lastwhisper
Troll
3. shadowlancerxJackritoProphylaxis
Replacement extravaganza
4. Vaimes
Rhymes with rhymes
5. KittyCupCake
I’m a dog owner. His name is Jay and he’s a manchester terrier.
6. vezokpiraka
Arr Pirata
7. Rhand
Not your right hand
8. dkingsland967
should change his name to dpeasantsland
9. M1ndreaverKeldeo
spammmmmmmm
10. Axelrod
Axe El Rod asap
11. Killjoy
He did
13. SlothfulGrapefruit21
I have a citrus allergy (for real)
?. Fulcrum
I accidentally deleted her and forgot her number. I have nothing to say about her anyways because the only pun I could think of is NSFW.
17. Asta
La vista
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I would vote myself now but we have dayyyychaaaaat and I can help my buddies out some moooooreeee.
(and I'm drunk because I just sort of lost my job, which triggered that post)
I would vote myself now but we have dayyyychaaaaat and I can help my buddies out some moooooreeee.
(and I'm drunk because I just sort of lost my job, which triggered that post)
wait what... that sucks dude, I am sorry to hear that
Well, I both feel better, and am really sorry for Rhand's situation at the same time.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
yeh it does... I’ve been their top scorer for years, I have one year of results that aren’t as great and they’re ready to let me go.
All because some retired americans didn’t tick “excellent” on their surveys.
What they did now is cut back my amount of cruises from 7 to 4, and I can’t live off that.
Either I find myself a new job or a job that can complement that now.
I’ve actually spent the last 3 days in a combination of anger and breakdown. Which is why I couldn’t perform here either.
I’m usually better at this than now.
LOL well I'll vote to Rhand when we're ready to end the day.
I want to dig up some stuff first though... I haven't taken many notes since D1, but Keldeo is a virtual lock for scum with Rhand based on several defensive posts. Plus he's trying to direct night actions, so yeah.
Tinfoil theory: Rhand wanted Nacho dead to try to take the season-switching ability, which means the daykill is a summer seasonal and they were hoping to bring it back around again ASAP.
reminds me of my job, I do so much for this company, but all they do is ostracize me for my mistakes, as far and in-between as they are
@Rhand
hope it gets better Rhand
Oh no Rhand Best of luck with the job search, I hope having this game off your shoulders helps.
dk, do you mean my posts being defensive of or not taking hard stances on Rhand, when I’ve been calling for me/him/Proph wagons all day and not hard pushing either Proph or Axel? I don’t see how I am lock partners with R “Mindreaver was town, but actually I was wrong let’s kill Keldeo for waffling“ hand, but we have time to discuss.
On that note it... feels like it’d be kind of easy for mafia to not let one of their own get lynched today. Straightforwardly that points to KCC, the only person not to have Rhand in her implied POE, as well as the people pushing Axel late, but if KCC is scum here, why did her partners not join her in trying to shift it off Rhand?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Pretty sure killjoy isn't the daykiller.
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Curse PremiumLet me do like a cursory catchup then I'll see if I can work on some ISOs tomorrow.
Asta is just the King, and apparently can only double vote in spring and summer, I don’t 100% see a day kill fitting there.
silver, I think we can assume it’s not just a summer day ability because if it were, they would’ve shot d2, right?
Why do you think it would be weird for Rhand to have the day kill ability? I feel like putting a janitored day kill with his backup ability presents an interesting trade-off - do you shoot someone and prevent yourself from stealing their role, or do you forgo the KP for the chance at stealing something later on? Does that idea make any sense? I probably need to go back and look at what Rhand posted specifically about the day kill, hmm.
I don’t really think KJ is the day killer. And I’m not, but I’m not sure how to prove the... absence of a role except by just claiming and having you all evaluate whether it seems to fit or something. But it’s very close to deadline, so I don’t see what we could gain from mass claiming now as opposed to toMorrow.
Dk was talking about the idea that the day kill happened because scum got to trade their night kill for it or something. To me, that seems a little esoteric along with any of the claimed roles too, but I’ve been wondering whether it could have been an inadvertent effect of someone’s ability - which probably just means Wisp. Idk maybe “tranquility” forced the mafia to kill during the day so the next night would be “tranquil”? It’s a stretch for sure.
I feel like the double voter and the daykiller aren't both scum. That's a lot of killing power against town if both are scum.
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Curse Premium"Negative space + I would expect Vaimes to be more obviously town if he is town"
"He's been bandwagoning other people and not advancing his own reads, I think this is scum Vaimes"
> Me takes the time to read fulcrum's case
"Oh, this makes a lot more sense. fulcrum is looking at a couple of select Vaimes posts and is really diving deep into his mindset based on those posts, which seems like a better approach than the macro reading I've been doing"
"Oh, here's a Vaimes post that I don't think he makes if he's scum"
And we get to now.
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I like KCC's debilitation when erring on the side of not voting me and I think it's a nuance that she doesn't really think to fake as scum. If she's scum here, then why does she hem and haw on me about me being scum mechanically but my behavior being decent? Feels like if she's scum she just tries to score a mislynch and makes up some contrived reasoning and votes me. Might be the victim of buddying here but I like her process WRT sorting me out.
I'm not really a fan of Rhand's neutral hunting and his vote on Keldeo; kind of want to see a case from him on why he thinks Keldeo is scum aside from "he's next on my PoE".
My policy is to not care about a neutral until I have to.
Scum hunt neutrals. Mafia think neutrals as the enemy. If the scum have successfully convinced the town to do the neutral hunting for them, then they've won the game.
fulcrum moving off on me and onto Axelrod piques my interest quite a bit. I believe Axel's claim, but he's been lacking somewhat recently (I assume due to the holidays).
This is a good post (and sentiment) by fulcrum. Not sure if I share that exact same sentiment but the fact that she is expressing it is good in my book.
I'm pretty sure I was intending to talk about the fact that KCC's busdrive was legit because I got swapped to Nacho, but I think I got swamped with a lot of work at the time. That was the REDACTED.
I am not particularly thrilled with Rhand's claim. Backup claims are pretty medium and his is even super slow in that he can't use the ability he takes on the same Night. People have already raised
My role says that "orbs stay in effect after death" so I assume yes?
I would also like to hear how Axel thinks about me given that I think the last time he talked about me, he said "this is less good" WRT a V/LA post of mine.
Also, I just realized that Axel changed his user title to "quietly competent", and that made me giggleI guess this is it but yeah. Would actually like him to explain more about what his issues with my role are/any analysis of my posts in question.
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Alright, caught up for the most part.
- Still think Rhand is scum but would like to reread to double check; also feels weird that there is no real counterwagon to this given that I think if Rhand is scum then his team would be happy to push counterwagons given that it is 10 votes to lynch today. I'm like slightly paranoid that we're just being led by the nose and Rhand is actually town, but then my eternal question needs to get answered, which is - who are the scum?
- Been liking fulcrum's posts Today, I feel like she would be more hands-off about things if she is actually mafia.
- I feel pretty bad for wanting to look at Axelrod again given that I assume he's been swamped with holidays like most of us are, but there has to be scum somewhere and he has dropped off. The amount of confirmed information in this setup (dkings/Asta/Grape/vezok) makes me think that this setup might skimp on traditional information roles for the town.
- Keldeo has had a lot of very strong posts and sentiments Today and in general. If he's scum I'd be mighty impressed.
- Not sure if I have time for this but I would like to do some sort of reread on Silver. I still do think he's town but that's a read from a couple weeks ago and I would like to recheck my assumptions given that a lot of people I thought were mafia might be town instead.
It's way weaker than I thought.
The ability name is God of the Underworld.
I target at Night and can use the ability to take a seasonal + a seasonal action in the same Night, which made me think I could use the one I got that Night immediately, but apparently I cannot because I will only receive it at the end of that Night.
The ability will match the current season.
I can target the same ability multiple times.
It would take me a full "year" to power up for the next year, so basically I am vanilla until Night 5 the earliest, and since we didn't create any targets for me on the first 2 Nights, it's going to take a looooong time for me to power up.
This is where this post should have ended. Because apparently we do have different views on what things mean.
I obviously do think that scum doesn't confess they're pocketing town. There are some exceptions like tom or Rodemy who would do things like that, but Fulcrum doesn't strike me as the kind of player that would ever do this. It's too much tongue-in-cheek for her style.
You pulled this completely out of context. Vaimes said to Grape, who was catching up, to ISO Mind, me and himself. Out of the blue.
That has nothing to do with scum brushing off a comment with "go read my posts".
Does your reaction being opposite mean mine is fake then? Because it isn't. It's what I thought.
What would Vaimes have gotten then if it would have worked? A neighbour chat is the most logical thing. I don't think DV is going to add more straight clears to a game that has masons. AND I was under the assumption that Vaimes isn't town, so having him get a masoniser shot didn't even enter my thoughts.
You established from the beginning that we have disagreements on how the game is played.
Have you even read some of my other games? I'm sure you'll disagree with my play all the time. And yet we're both good players.
I tend to step into v/v tunnels and taking distance and re-focussing is the only way to get out of them. If my town reads are saying that that is what is happening, then I have to take that step back.
You're twisting this into something "wrong" while it is the best thing to do. We were dominating the thread with our fight.
How is this a real read? "a very scum response to me"? That doesn't mean anything and the "to me" qualifier makes this whole sentence moot.
None of that is "wrong". I can't see any other reason for you posting this baloney than that you're bloodthirsty and want to see me hang now that I'm at 6 votes.
I'm using my vote what it's made for: pressure and lynching people I think are scum.
Your votes:
KCC (my strongest townread)
Mindreaver (who was absent)
KCC again
No lynch
Pot - kettle much?
Vote Axelrod
Neutral hunting? I unvoted him when I realised he's probably neutral rather than scum.
It bugs me that he denies it though. I'm pretty sure that's what he is. But I'm willing to wait and see what he claims toMorrow.
My case on Keldeo is that he doesn't take stances. There's not much more. I have a hard time digesting his posts and won't reread him again.
It is mainly a POE thing.
>is shocked when he denies it
If I were a neutral, I'd have claimed Day 1.
You target an ability and get it. And then, you can use a different seasonal ability that you acquired on a previous night, is that what you are saying? And also that the seasonal ability that you use has to match the current season, you don't "change" the ability to match the current season? Or are you still saying that the ability you target will change so that it matches the current season, but won't be available to be used until that season comes around again?
And also, that once you use the ability, it's used up, and if you want to use it again, you have to target it again, and then you could use it again on a later night that matches the season?
Seems like scum joke about things like this literally all the time. You also didn't say this was specific to Fulcrum here, you just said "scum" like it was generic.
Well, I'm iso-ing you and not re-reading the whole thread again, so some posts are not going to have all the context. But it does not seem that this changes anything. If someone asks "what's going on" or "who should I read to catch up" it is entirely possible for a scum trying to look helpful to include himself in a list like that. Your astonishment at the idea that scum would do such a thing just seems bizarre.
Not by itself, I kind of said that. This is an aggregate thing. I think I might have been the first person to speculate that Nacho turned on that dayklll by changing the season. But the person who was on the lynch block at the time that Nacho did the thing was KCC. KCC was completely going down on D1 before Nacho.
So who is this hypothetical scum who you say was a lynch candidate that you thought Nacho was changing the season so they could get their shot off before dying? There isn't anyone unless you think KCC is lying (or me? I was run up before KCC, but I don't think I was in jeopardy at that point anymore.)
You are speculating here that Vaimes is scum, and has the ability he claimed - i.e. he can offer a "trade" of abilities with someone. I don't have a speculation for what Vaimes would have gotten if it would have "worked" because it would not have occurred to me that it could have worked.
Masons just don't have anything to trade. How does one trade their knowledge that they are confirmed Town? And the idea that they could trade their access to a quicktopic/night communication, is just too bizarre to contemplate.
I thought Vaimes was going for possibly some "other" ability that Vez might have, separate from Mason-ness, and targeting Vez because he was closest to confirmed, and giving a BP vest to a Mason is great. But that was wrong, and apparently both you and Vaimes thought this was a possibility?
I guess not recently.
You died N1 in Modern, but I don't recall you posting anything that made me go "that's just wrong" while you were alive.
In fact, I just re-read your D1. The only post you made that was somewhat similar to the kinds of things I'm talking about here was this one:
Which seemed more specific to Shadow than a generic statement that "scum wouldn't "townclear" anyone this early." Which is a sentiment I would disagree with in general.
Otherwise, you basically said nothing I disagreed with D1.
And then I went and looked at Eurovision, where you were scum. You replaced out early, but even so, in that time you made these observations:
And this seems closer to the kind of stuff I am seeing here.
Well, I am saying I disagree, and that it seems "wrong" to me. I don't know why you call that "twisting". And saying "to me" is to make it perfectly clear that this is what "I" think and I am aware that other people might think differently.
I say this from experience. As scum, I am less likely to want to make a big "reads" post, because it opens you up to criticism, and incidentally could contain tells about your teammates for later, no matter how much you try not to tie yourself to them. The fact you made the post at all was good for that reason. But this - this is what a scum would say, to avoid doing it again in general. And I feel like I've said something very similar as scum before. Essentially "why should I bother to make a big post on people when all I get is flack from it..."
You can get frustrated as Town also, yes, but I don't think you actually caught so much "flack" from that post as to justify this kind of response (not that it's "justified" per-se, but at least more understandable). I certainly don't remember you getting run up or anything. That was super early.
Well, then you're not being very objective, are you?
Cheap shot?
Vote: Rhand
Thinking "no" at the moment but man
KCC or Proph/Keldeo/Axel or Rhand/who? Asta? Fulcrum maybe if Rhand's a wolf like I think, I guess?
Whoever asked me about why I thought the daykill could be seasonal, I was thinking it might be 1/summer (refreshes when the season changes to Summer like Dkings said his BG does) not 1/day during Summer or something, that'd be super obnoxious. Rhand seemed pretty sure it's a 1-shot which is either TMI or a bad assumption imo.
Thinking about it a bit longer, yeah, whoever said he might have the daykill on him is ~maybe right. Or maybe Gemma was the backup and using the daykill on her gave him her role or something -- though why they hit someone unclaimed instead of Axelrod is weird in that instance but maybe they just used it as a kill and didn't particularly care about the role.
Unique roles
Masons?: [color=dodgerblue]Grape + Vezok[/color]
Double Voter: [color=mediumseagreen]Asta[/color] (extra vote is public)
Bodyguard: [color=deepskyblue]Dkingsland[/color] (confirmed by Asta)
Turtle speed backup: [color=orangered]Rhand[/color]
Season Changer: [color=blueviolet]Nacho[/color] (dead town)
Invendor: [color=mediumseagreen]Vaimes[/color] (confirmed by Vezok and fulcrum)
Dreaming God: [color=mediumseagreen]Lastwhisper[/color]
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Manipulative/Protective
Roleblocker/Busdriver: [color=goldenrod]KittyCupCake[/color]
Jailkeeper/Lightning rod: [color=blueviolet]tomsloger[/color](dead town)
Orbs everywhere: [color=mediumseagreen]Prophylaxis[/color] (confirmed by Nacho and Vezok)
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Investigatives
Random Info+: fulcrum
Summer Watcher: [mediumseagreen]Axelrod[/color]
Unknown: Silvercrys
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Unclaimed
Keldeo
Killjoy
[color=blueviolet]Gemma[/color] (dead town, flip janitored)
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I colored based on how likely I think the claimed role is to be town
If someone's lying about their role outright it's almost definitely the masons, everything else matches the set up pretty well
Rhand's role seems simply horrible. The earliest he could do anything without nacho's intervention is night 5 which is kinda horrible considering all the seasonal abilities that we know of are just reasonable. There's nothing that would be really good for a second turn. I think Rhand is just scum here. Big chance of being scum with Vaimes, but that should be looked at on the next day.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
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We know they exist, I think it's best to just trust that they do what he claimed and have him spam blue orbs as much as possible?
I guess we could test Yellow Orb functionality by having him give me or Axel a Yellow Orb; since both our abilities are targeted and Inspect, his target toNight should get the Orange Orb before our action resolves. But whoever would have to announce their target in advance.
The Current Season is Spring.
With 14 Alive it takes 10 to lynch.
I actually think Rhand and Axel are reasonably likely to be buddies. I think we have too much information at the moment (masons, watcher, and two unknown but information claims). Plus Prophs sort of RB and Vaimes track gift.
Rhand at L-2. Would prefer for no maj, though I will probably miss deadline. Do you have any last words or a final legacy, Rhand?
And mmmm. I'm kind of voting because we need to get maj, but something that sticks out to me is like, the backtracking about how his role works when people were expressing skepticism about using an ability the same night as he backed it up (I think it was mainly Axel? which could be a point against Axel/Rhand w/w, but Axel probably needs to bury him as his partner here anyway because he's the CW.)
I guess reading into that is kind of a rock and hard place situation because being able to use an ability in the same night is a bit weird (designating two targets?), but yeah, his new claimed role is a bit slow to become useful at all. Even Nacho's role could only speed it up by one cycle, and then only once in the game.
--
What do people think of this orb plan:
- Today, Proph uses one of his day shots to give a yellow orb to Axel (his target will learn his ability name) and confirms this in the thread. If he doesn't confirm this, Axel and Proph can do whatever in the night, since the yellow orb needs to be given for it to work.
- Tonight, Proph gives an orange orb to Asta (enables the ability name-telling to work.) Axel uses his fall ability, which tells him the names of abilities that target his target, on Asta.
Whoever people think is less trustworthy between Asta/Axel should claim Axel's supposed fall ability first, either toDay or early toMorrow. I think that's Axel atm. The other person confirms or denies.
If Asta learns the correct fall ability, we've confirmed the function of yellow orbs, and I guess that Axel wasn't lying about his fall ability name. If not, either at least one of the three is mafia, or somehow the chain got messed up because someone targeted Proph/Axel with a disruption ability. I don't actually know if this is worth it, but I don't think there's a better plan? And I also think it's good to have an orange orb on Asta anyway because bodyguard means Asta is living until late in the game, and if Proph is actually telling the truth, the orb could save him from a kill if he gets targeted by someone with a green orb, or get told an ability name if he gets targeted by someone with a yellow orb.
Asta in this scenario could technically be anyone, but I'm saying Asta here because I think he's trustworthy, and if dk is telling the truth, he shouldn't be able to die in the night.
Silver, sorry, what's the benefit of spamming blue orbs? Doesn't that just block town power, too?
Also just highlighting that he clarified the bulletproof orb (whatever color that is) works on the targeting player not the player they target, so someone with a BP orb targeting Asta makes themselves bulletproof, not Asta
I will write up my final thoughts later today.
I’m a bit sad that what looked like a very powerful role turned out to be a French vanilla.
I think I am at L-1 now? I would appreciate it of someone would unvote so I don’t get speedhammered before I manage to write up that post.
My only concern with it being me getting an orb is that I don't have any targeted abilities, but I assume the orb grants me the ability to target? That's logistically the only way the orb ability could work I think.
Not much to say at this juncture. Game ends tomorrow at............... hold on, 12PM means Noon right? Alright cool, about 29 hours left on toDay. I might actually be around for End of Day! Neat.
Vote Rhand.
You shouldn't be quick voted. How did you think you were at L-1? The votecount is right there?
1. Silvercrys3467
Mythrilcrys would be more useful
2. Lastwhisper
Troll
3. shadowlancerxJackritoProphylaxis
Replacement extravaganza
4. Vaimes
Rhymes with rhymes
5. KittyCupCake
I’m a dog owner. His name is Jay and he’s a manchester terrier.
6. vezokpiraka
Arr Pirata
7. Rhand
Not your right hand
8. dkingsland967
should change his name to dpeasantsland
9. M1ndreaverKeldeo
spammmmmmmm
10. Axelrod
Axe El Rod asap
11. Killjoy
He did
13. SlothfulGrapefruit21
I have a citrus allergy (for real)
?. Fulcrum
I accidentally deleted her and forgot her number. I have nothing to say about her anyways because the only pun I could think of is NSFW.
17. Asta
La vista
Rhand just claimed scum because we have a day until deadline hits and we aren't going to magically cfd to someone else.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
Check out the Shop Thread
(and I'm drunk because I just sort of lost my job, which triggered that post)
All because some retired americans didn’t tick “excellent” on their surveys.
What they did now is cut back my amount of cruises from 7 to 4, and I can’t live off that.
Either I find myself a new job or a job that can complement that now.
I’m usually better at this than now.
I want to dig up some stuff first though... I haven't taken many notes since D1, but Keldeo is a virtual lock for scum with Rhand based on several defensive posts. Plus he's trying to direct night actions, so yeah.
Tinfoil theory: Rhand wanted Nacho dead to try to take the season-switching ability, which means the daykill is a summer seasonal and they were hoping to bring it back around again ASAP.
@Rhand
hope it gets better Rhand
dk, do you mean my posts being defensive of or not taking hard stances on Rhand, when I’ve been calling for me/him/Proph wagons all day and not hard pushing either Proph or Axel? I don’t see how I am lock partners with R “Mindreaver was town, but actually I was wrong let’s kill Keldeo for waffling“ hand, but we have time to discuss.
On that note it... feels like it’d be kind of easy for mafia to not let one of their own get lynched today. Straightforwardly that points to KCC, the only person not to have Rhand in her implied POE, as well as the people pushing Axel late, but if KCC is scum here, why did her partners not join her in trying to shift it off Rhand?