GF/Killjoy is where I want to be, and at the same time seems way too easy.
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Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
EBWODP: I also think that KCC had a realization moment that Az was a likely lost cause... Let me find the point where it felt like that.
This is just not accurate. I mean, at no point did it look like this was what was going on, nor does this theory even follow from what was happening in the thread. IF KCC thought Az was a "lost cause" then it wouldn't have made sense for KCC to switch off Az to Fuwa in the first place, and then, when it looked like Fuwa was a complete goner, switching back to Az.
KCC being a super-deep wolf is not completely out of the realm of possibility in the same way that no one is out of the realm of possibility, but he's like near the bottom of the list of likely candidates. I would put Vaimes much higher.
I wouldn't even say "super-deep". The slot's play is openly scummy, like even more so than Grape or KJ, who can somewhat be explained away by flailing.
Like, the more I read of KCC the more I want to lunch that slot and the more I read of Grape and KJ, the less sure I am that at least one of them isn't just having a bad day.
I wouldn't even say "super-deep". The slot's [KCC] play is openly scummy, like even more so than Grape or KJ, who can somewhat be explained away by flailing.
I just...don’t come close to agreeing with this.
I thought KCC was mildly scummy at the start of day 1, but from about the time Chris defended Beeboy on I’ve felt her play was pretty darn townie (it not somewhat tunnel-y at points).
Your opponent rolls a 12 and you roll a 5. "Getting lucky to start the day," your opponent chuckles with a grin. Your opponent mulls to six, then five, then keeps, picking up two cards and sending them straight to the bottom of his deck. "Guess that lucky streak ended quick," you are quick to retort.
Your suspicions that they are Tron are confirmed when they play an Urza's Power Plant, then taps it to play a Chromatic Star. This matchup's hard if they get natural Tron on turn 3, but reasonable otherwise. You play a Stitcher's Supplier, milling over some lands. Whatever. You pass the turn back. Your opponent cracks the Star for green, then plays an Ancient Stirrings, finding another Tron land - an Urza's Tower. They play it and pass the turn. On yours, you play a Satyr Wayfinder, milling over a Vengevine. You chuckle to yourself, as you know your opponent is going to be in for a world of hurt. You exile five cards from your graveyard and tap your two creatures to summon a Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis from your hand. This brings back the Vengevine to crack in for 4. Your opponent draws their land, and scoops it up. "Easy," you think to yourself.
I wouldn't even say "super-deep". The slot's [KCC] play is openly scummy, like even more so than Grape or KJ, who can somewhat be explained away by flailing.
I just...don’t come close to agreeing with this.
I thought KCC was mildly scummy at the start of day 1, but from about the time Chris defended Beeboy on I’ve felt her play was pretty darn townie (it not somewhat tunnel-y at points).
Maybe it's a bit of hyperbole to say that it's an extreme, but honestly, her interactions with Az feel VERY fake to me, and in the Grape+KJ case, it's also somewhat fitting.
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while I continue to read, and actively ignore the grape wagon
Why is everyone voting Grape? this is for day 3 purposes regardless of his flip
@osie
Funny thing is I got the same feeling on rereading EoD day 1, but I dont want to humor it yet (in regards to KCC)
Do you actually believe that Azreal was TMIing/Signaling his partner wolf!KCC? it just feels NAI to me on reread at least nai enough that its hard to say if its coming from w/v or w/w without reaching or squinting really hard?
I feel like they are the lowest impact players in the game. Neither has done anything especially Townie-looking. I have literally two points in favor of GF, which are that Az gave him that weird, very-strong Town read early on, and that he didn't ask for an extension at a time when he was already saying he was against the Az. lynch. And I may be overrating the significance of both of those.
I don't even have two points for KJ. He's just kind of been there. I don't agree with a lot of what he says. Really didn't care for his page by page re-read that crashed and burned on p2. I have a history of not getting how Townie Killjoy thinks though.
Shoot, I can't think of any reason not to be voting for Killjoy right now.
Vote: Killjoy
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Shoot, I can't think of any reason not to be voting for Killjoy right now.
Off the top of my head, his reaction to pressure D1, his townReading me for not going after him D1 (which is such a convoluted mindset for scum to make up)
I mean, it's not impossible for him to be scum, but I don't like the odds, and he seems like such an easy target
Shoot, I can't think of any reason not to be voting for Killjoy right now.
Off the top of my head, his reaction to pressure D1, his townReading me for not going after him D1 (which is such a convoluted mindset for scum to make up)
I mean, it's not impossible for him to be scum, but I don't like the odds, and he seems like such an easy target
Is this how town talks about town and I'm just so rusty and out of the loop?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I originally said there was likely 1-2 in these 6. (I say 1-2 instead of just 1 due to the speed of the wagon.) With dking's out, there's 1-2 in Rhand, Cantripmancer, Axelrod, tomsloger, shadowlancerx. I don't think there's >1 scum in Rhand, Cantripmancer, Axelrod as they are basically just barning each other and I don't think scum typically interact like that. Well... ballsier scum might? I don't beleive they are ballsier scum though.
And the way he interacts with Tom in the early game looks very scum-on-town. Or just childish.
Killjoy's being very superficial in his responses early Day 1.
Interaction with Azrael in #1075 is bad. I'm not convinced that KJ and Grape are scum together, but KJ's interactions with Grape are able to be coordinated.
Ok Osie. Can you specify what you think of superficial? I don't think you were asked to justify that ever.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I originally said there was likely 1-2 in these 6. (I say 1-2 instead of just 1 due to the speed of the wagon.) With dking's out, there's 1-2 in Rhand, Cantripmancer, Axelrod, tomsloger, shadowlancerx. I don't think there's >1 scum in Rhand, Cantripmancer, Axelrod as they are basically just barning each other and I don't think scum typically interact like that. Well... ballsier scum might? I don't beleive they are ballsier scum though.
And the way he interacts with Tom in the early game looks very scum-on-town. Or just childish.
Killjoy's being very superficial in his responses early Day 1.
Interaction with Azrael in #1075 is bad. I'm not convinced that KJ and Grape are scum together, but KJ's interactions with Grape are able to be coordinated.
Ok Osie. Can you specify what you think of superficial? I don't think you were asked to justify that ever.
Why is 1075 bad?
Why are Grape and me connected in your mind?
Superficial I'll get back to at some point.
1075: You start by talking to Shadow as if he's town and you're unsure on Az. Then you ease into Last as scum, but then go hard on Shadow as scum. Then you finish off with talking to Az as if you're sure he's town, with what looks to be an intentionally leading question.
As for Grape and you, I've possibly said the least of you two being connected of anyone; I think you're individually connected to Az and individually scummy, but also individually have potential to just be flailing a bit.
Off the top of my head, his reaction to pressure D1, his townReading me for not going after him D1 (which is such a convoluted mindset for scum to make up)
I mean, it's not impossible for him to be scum, but I don't like the odds, and he seems like such an easy target
Is this how town talks about town and I'm just so rusty and out of the loop?
I couldn't tell you about the loop. My last game of Mafia was before your first.
But, if I'm remembering how Mafia works correctly, there doesn't tend to be a specific way townies talk about townies since we don't know each others alignment.
I'm not super excited about this wagon. The complete lack of movement heading into Night probably means it's a miss, and scum are okay not rocking the boat.
I have thoughts on Grape but he's about to do a catchup and I don't wanna scumcoach, so guess I'll wait a bit.
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so like im torn
The quickness of this wagon, as well as the thread being dead makes, fills me with paranoia
Ive reread a decent part of the game, as well as other games, mostly for sorting Vaimes
and ive concluded that Vaimes/Cantrip are always mostly town
Vaimes has questionable posts, yes, do I also hate meta reads as a whole for defining someone's alignment, yes? but I wouldnt even consider my read on vaimes to be strictly meta, its mostly a combination of his tone and meta, because yes he can easily fake a lot of the content he has produced here, I just feel as if the energy he is bringing here is leagues above his last 2-3 wolf games.
I keep 180ing on Vaimes, but I cant find myself justifying a Vaimes lynch anytime soon or Cantrip, based on the way he interacted with Azreal day 1
I want to say that Grape constantly throwing his votes around is less likely to come from a wolf, but he still lacks conviction in almost any of his votes
I'm back, work is slow, and it's time to catch up.
I think Chris and KCC are both town. That fight over Beeboy would have had some sort of pivot if one of them was scum.
I don't get the Az wagon. Cantrips pretty much seems to be a direct response to 522 I guess? I don't know what Shadow and KCC are voting him for. Does 564 have a typo or am I dumb? LW's is downright scummy.
Vez is really townie.
As is Vaimes.
Vote: Tom
If I vote him, it's mostly because of his shade of the Azreal wagon, but he has been consistent in some of reads making them less likely to be fake, in terms of Azreal and KJ
for a less optimal reason, lowering the PoE of people on the Fuwa would be great, but that reasoning alone is bad
I am also sad that nobody answered my question on why they are voting Grapefruit as of yet
@megiddo
why exactly are you voting Grape?
there seems to be a disconnect between your vote and your reads #1785 i’d be very surprised if grape, dkings, killjoy, vaimes were scum.
you also kinda stagnated the past couple day as well, bunch of one-liners
you still have the benefit of replacing Beeboy, but I would still like a lot more from your slot
wouldnt hate to see a wagon on you even if its against me beliefs
outside of that, Chris or killjoy are still both great lynches
Chris again with his, "if grape flips wolf, does that make me clear", just doesn't sound real
killjoy is catching up, so we will see what he brings
If we are going to believe Azreal was powerwolfing, then its less likely he was bussing
still dont wanna believe he makes that grape read on his own partner
I feel like they are the lowest impact players in the game. Neither has done anything especially Townie-looking. I have literally two points in favor of GF, which are that Az gave him that weird, very-strong Town read early on, and that he didn't ask for an extension at a time when he was already saying he was against the Az. lynch. And I may be overrating the significance of both of those.
I don't even have two points for KJ. He's just kind of been there. I don't agree with a lot of what he says. Really didn't care for his page by page re-read that crashed and burned on p2. I have a history of not getting how Townie Killjoy thinks though.
Shoot, I can't think of any reason not to be voting for Killjoy right now.
Vote: Killjoy
I agree with everything here, except for the extension point, that is easily fakeable
who else would you vote for if not Killjoy right now?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
K so Vezok: He also connects me and Grape but it seems less in a way to like, try to connect us but rather reactiing to Grapes defense of me.
While I appriciate his confidence in my abilities, his saying that "town KJ makes insightful posts" is like comparing all mountains to the Matterhorn. I do occasionally make a good post. But I also make really really bad posts, as town. I also tend to make sense as scum (knowing who my teammates are helps a lot there) though I suppose I'm prone to other tells at that point. Basically, saying "KJ isn't being insighful, therefore he is scum" is wrong. Go see (Zero Escape???) a recent game where I made a HUGE post on Osie... that was the exact opposite... and I was town. Actually a lot of my theories amount to "yeahm that doesn't REALLY make him scum" or "well, yeah, that was obvious" such as my "there's probably scum on my wagon" assertion from earlier.
As of 585, I'm thinking vezok is town for the reason that I think he actually thinks I'm scum, and isn't just pushing a townie.
705 seems... tunnely. I don't agree with it. Chris wasn't saying he doesn't tunnel unduely long on town, not that he doesn't tunnel at all on them. It also assumes that "thinking everyone should think he's town" is scummy, and not just bravado, which he is very well known for.
Interactions with/ about Az are probably coming from town... ala 895 and 959.
Though I dislike his assertion that "Az didn't sound like town Az" because town Az is too much like scum Az to find.
GAH WINDOWS UPDATE NO. gotta hurry.
His switching off of Az at the last second to is weird given he was scumreading Az so hard, lynches happen based on most votes instead of majority, and he comes in the next day saying he is 95% townreading Fuwa. He says that the reason he moved to her wagon was because he was townreading her? Still weird.
I'd like him to explain his town read of tom. It just kinda comes out of nowhere and stays there. It's apperently because meta (1674)
Actually, I just thought of something: Vez: When you said "Sad about dkings death. Felt townie to me, but the damn role sounded so scummy." The part where you say 'felt townie to me' were you reffering to dkings feeling townie or to tom's shooting of him? Because your response in 1908 makes little sense in the former world.
1921 is a decent response.
Overall, while underexplained I feel his progressions have been pretty fair. There's some stuff I disagree with, and he's tunneling me pretty hard but I think this is town Vezok.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Sorry, I thought I'd have a bit more time this weekend, but not so much.
V/LA until Monday night or Tuesday morning.
I was thinking Grape was more likely to flip town, but now that's he's gotten (especially after making a point to say he had the day off) makes me think he might be scum. If I have the opportunity tomorrow, I'll probably vote him if he hasn't posted.
Why did you feel the need to basically say "aww poor town dk! He was so town!" following his death? And why did you feel the need to say that his claim was scummy after he flipped town, when you had not started a scum read before?
Your still probably town, but that makes it possible that you're scum with Tom, trying to down play the scumminess of his shooting town.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
So I have this crazy theory on what's going on this game and I wanna put this out there for post game credit.
I think the scum (or at least most of them) are creating scummy interactions with me (town reading me, defending me, etc) so that if they for, I look bad.
Maybe there's one to two scum then in [Vaimes, Grape, Tom, KCC] for that reason. Tom is most likely for being on my original wagon.
I'm counting his swerving a day kill away from me as defending me.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KJ, Wisp, and Osie look good for not just accepting the status quo. KJ in particular I think it's a good look for as wolf!KJ has a lot to gain from my flip.
Meg and Vez are the worst votes on my wagon. Both are blatantly sheeping. Not voting either today because of claims but worth keeping an eye on.
Chris still feels like a wolf to me. Voting KJ here is just awful in general. Axel voting with him is even more head scratching. 2215 is just not a reason to vote someone. First off there are numerous reasons to think KJ is town (I've said enough about them) but more importantly a lack of reasons to town read someone isn't the same as a scum read. I'm someone who likes to play by PoE and building town blocks, but that still doesn't mean once I'm outside of my PoE I look for the person with the least town points and vote them. That's when you look for scum motivation and buddy interactions. You look for reasons to be town when building the town circle. Back to chris for a second. 2096 is one of those out of line priorities posts. Based on his convictions there he should 100% be voting me. And given the state of the game at the time there was no reason not to. But he doesn't.
You are in claim range, Grapefruit. Did I miss your claim while I hunkered down for the Hurricane?
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By the way that is a tragically thin reason to double down on voting me. Just, ouch for you there. "Why didn't Chris unvote his scum read to vote another scum read" is brutal on the 'fortifying my vote' scale.
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Sorry people. It will come back at some point I'm sure. I'm going to be busy for the next two days though.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Im pretty ready to end the day. Grape isnt the scummiest per se, but he probably is the most likely AZ buddy based on d1 interactions and d2 motivation
I wouldn't even say "super-deep". The slot's play is openly scummy, like even more so than Grape or KJ, who can somewhat be explained away by flailing.
I thought KCC was mildly scummy at the start of day 1, but from about the time Chris defended Beeboy on I’ve felt her play was pretty darn townie (it not somewhat tunnel-y at points).
Maybe it's a bit of hyperbole to say that it's an extreme, but honestly, her interactions with Az feel VERY fake to me, and in the Grape+KJ case, it's also somewhat fitting.
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Why is everyone voting Grape? this is for day 3 purposes regardless of his flip
@osie
Funny thing is I got the same feeling on rereading EoD day 1, but I dont want to humor it yet (in regards to KCC)
Do you actually believe that Azreal was TMIing/Signaling his partner wolf!KCC? it just feels NAI to me on reread at least nai enough that its hard to say if its coming from w/v or w/w without reaching or squinting really hard?
@axelrod
How is grapefruit/Killjoy too easy?
Lock it in
Vaimes = 6 characters
Coincidence??
I don't even have two points for KJ. He's just kind of been there. I don't agree with a lot of what he says. Really didn't care for his page by page re-read that crashed and burned on p2. I have a history of not getting how Townie Killjoy thinks though.
Shoot, I can't think of any reason not to be voting for Killjoy right now.
Vote: Killjoy
Off the top of my head, his reaction to pressure D1, his townReading me for not going after him D1 (which is such a convoluted mindset for scum to make up)
I mean, it's not impossible for him to be scum, but I don't like the odds, and he seems like such an easy target
Vote Count 2.12
Grapefruit21 (5): shadowlancerx, tomsloger, Megiddo, osieorb18, vezokpiraka
Sir Chris (3): Grapefruit21, Lastwhisper, KittyCupCake
Killjoy (2): Sir Chris, Axelrod
Lastwhisper (1): Grapefruit21
tomsloger (1): Vaimes
Abstain (2): Killjoy, Cantripmancer
With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
The deadline is Tuesday, September 3rd, at 11:59 PM.
Is this how town talks about town and I'm just so rusty and out of the loop?
I'm gonna try to reread ISOs and D2 to get some sort of idea what's going on.
There's an number of people linking me and grape, which makes me think Grape is scum and someone knows it.
I kinda don't trust Osie. I currently forget why. Whem I ISO him that should become clear.
IDK how far I'll get tonight, I drove back from Reno like 6 hours ago. I'm still tired.
Why is 1075 bad?
Why are Grape and me connected in your mind?
That means I think that if Osie is scum, Grape is probably town.
Keeps switching? What? Where?
Superficial I'll get back to at some point.
1075: You start by talking to Shadow as if he's town and you're unsure on Az. Then you ease into Last as scum, but then go hard on Shadow as scum. Then you finish off with talking to Az as if you're sure he's town, with what looks to be an intentionally leading question.
As for Grape and you, I've possibly said the least of you two being connected of anyone; I think you're individually connected to Az and individually scummy, but also individually have potential to just be flailing a bit.
I couldn't tell you about the loop. My last game of Mafia was before your first.
But, if I'm remembering how Mafia works correctly, there doesn't tend to be a specific way townies talk about townies since we don't know each others alignment.
That's exactly what I think we're seeing here, and I'm not particularly excited about how the rest of that wagon looks either.
I'm a bit torn on it though, I'm not expecting a scumflip
I'm not super excited about this wagon. The complete lack of movement heading into Night probably means it's a miss, and scum are okay not rocking the boat.
I have thoughts on Grape but he's about to do a catchup and I don't wanna scumcoach, so guess I'll wait a bit.
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The quickness of this wagon, as well as the thread being dead makes, fills me with paranoia
Ive reread a decent part of the game, as well as other games, mostly for sorting Vaimes
and ive concluded that Vaimes/Cantrip are always mostly town
Vaimes has questionable posts, yes, do I also hate meta reads as a whole for defining someone's alignment, yes? but I wouldnt even consider my read on vaimes to be strictly meta, its mostly a combination of his tone and meta, because yes he can easily fake a lot of the content he has produced here, I just feel as if the energy he is bringing here is leagues above his last 2-3 wolf games.
I keep 180ing on Vaimes, but I cant find myself justifying a Vaimes lynch anytime soon or Cantrip, based on the way he interacted with Azreal day 1
I want to say that Grape constantly throwing his votes around is less likely to come from a wolf, but he still lacks conviction in almost any of his votes
posts like this look bad in isolation
If I vote him, it's mostly because of his shade of the Azreal wagon, but he has been consistent in some of reads making them less likely to be fake, in terms of Azreal and KJ
for a less optimal reason, lowering the PoE of people on the Fuwa would be great, but that reasoning alone is bad
I am also sad that nobody answered my question on why they are voting Grapefruit as of yet
@megiddo
why exactly are you voting Grape?
there seems to be a disconnect between your vote and your reads
#1785
i’d be very surprised if grape, dkings, killjoy, vaimes were scum.
you also kinda stagnated the past couple day as well, bunch of one-liners
you still have the benefit of replacing Beeboy, but I would still like a lot more from your slot
wouldnt hate to see a wagon on you even if its against me beliefs
outside of that, Chris or killjoy are still both great lynches
Chris again with his, "if grape flips wolf, does that make me clear", just doesn't sound real
killjoy is catching up, so we will see what he brings
more later
@chris
speaking of vaimes team, whats yours?
still dont wanna believe he makes that grape read on his own partner
who else would you vote for if not Killjoy right now?
While I appriciate his confidence in my abilities, his saying that "town KJ makes insightful posts" is like comparing all mountains to the Matterhorn. I do occasionally make a good post. But I also make really really bad posts, as town. I also tend to make sense as scum (knowing who my teammates are helps a lot there) though I suppose I'm prone to other tells at that point. Basically, saying "KJ isn't being insighful, therefore he is scum" is wrong. Go see (Zero Escape???) a recent game where I made a HUGE post on Osie... that was the exact opposite... and I was town. Actually a lot of my theories amount to "yeahm that doesn't REALLY make him scum" or "well, yeah, that was obvious" such as my "there's probably scum on my wagon" assertion from earlier.
As of 585, I'm thinking vezok is town for the reason that I think he actually thinks I'm scum, and isn't just pushing a townie.
705 seems... tunnely. I don't agree with it. Chris wasn't saying he doesn't tunnel unduely long on town, not that he doesn't tunnel at all on them. It also assumes that "thinking everyone should think he's town" is scummy, and not just bravado, which he is very well known for.
Interactions with/ about Az are probably coming from town... ala 895 and 959.
Though I dislike his assertion that "Az didn't sound like town Az" because town Az is too much like scum Az to find.
GAH WINDOWS UPDATE NO. gotta hurry.
His switching off of Az at the last second to is weird given he was scumreading Az so hard, lynches happen based on most votes instead of majority, and he comes in the next day saying he is 95% townreading Fuwa. He says that the reason he moved to her wagon was because he was townreading her? Still weird.
I'd like him to explain his town read of tom. It just kinda comes out of nowhere and stays there. It's apperently because meta (1674)
Actually, I just thought of something: Vez: When you said "Sad about dkings death. Felt townie to me, but the damn role sounded so scummy." The part where you say 'felt townie to me' were you reffering to dkings feeling townie or to tom's shooting of him? Because your response in 1908 makes little sense in the former world.
1921 is a decent response.
Overall, while underexplained I feel his progressions have been pretty fair. There's some stuff I disagree with, and he's tunneling me pretty hard but I think this is town Vezok.
V/LA until Monday night or Tuesday morning.
I was thinking Grape was more likely to flip town, but now that's he's gotten (especially after making a point to say he had the day off) makes me think he might be scum. If I have the opportunity tomorrow, I'll probably vote him if he hasn't posted.
@kj: "felt townie" was reffering to dkings. I have been townreading that slot since the first few pages, but never vocalized that in thread.
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Why did you feel the need to basically say "aww poor town dk! He was so town!" following his death? And why did you feel the need to say that his claim was scummy after he flipped town, when you had not started a scum read before?
Your still probably town, but that makes it possible that you're scum with Tom, trying to down play the scumminess of his shooting town.
I think the scum (or at least most of them) are creating scummy interactions with me (town reading me, defending me, etc) so that if they for, I look bad.
Maybe there's one to two scum then in [Vaimes, Grape, Tom, KCC] for that reason. Tom is most likely for being on my original wagon.
I'm counting his swerving a day kill away from me as defending me.
Actually, I wouldn't mind lynching Tom today.
KJ, Wisp, and Osie look good for not just accepting the status quo. KJ in particular I think it's a good look for as wolf!KJ has a lot to gain from my flip.
Meg and Vez are the worst votes on my wagon. Both are blatantly sheeping. Not voting either today because of claims but worth keeping an eye on.
Chris still feels like a wolf to me. Voting KJ here is just awful in general. Axel voting with him is even more head scratching. 2215 is just not a reason to vote someone. First off there are numerous reasons to think KJ is town (I've said enough about them) but more importantly a lack of reasons to town read someone isn't the same as a scum read. I'm someone who likes to play by PoE and building town blocks, but that still doesn't mean once I'm outside of my PoE I look for the person with the least town points and vote them. That's when you look for scum motivation and buddy interactions. You look for reasons to be town when building the town circle. Back to chris for a second. 2096 is one of those out of line priorities posts. Based on his convictions there he should 100% be voting me. And given the state of the game at the time there was no reason not to. But he doesn't.
Unvote: Wisp
Vote: Chris
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Vote Grape
Sorry people. It will come back at some point I'm sure. I'm going to be busy for the next two days though.
vote: Killjoy
And ya this game is dead
Didn't see Cantrip's vote