*sigh*
I shouldn't be posting when I don't have the time. I feel very ineffective right now...
Any thoughts on my main post, since your the one who prodded me for it?
I think much of what you called out against Mikey is not really alignment indicative, but he's not helping himself by not explaining all his thoughts when asked. I can't tell if he's scum or uncooperative town, so if he'd explain his reasoning for his reads, I think I'd have a better idea...
I don't disagree with his sentiment that you were told by your scumbuddies to make a case, not that it actually happened (because you aren't actually a new player), but I kinda felt like you had to force yourself to make those reads (you had quite a lot to say, I don't know why I had to ask you first).
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
What thoughts am I not explaining, and why are yoiu calling me out on it instead of calling anyone else out who's done the same thing , including you?
I don't think not explaining thoughts is inherently scummy, and I don't have issue with most of your reads. I take particular interest in your read of Manasi, which Kami already asked about.
Yes, I should have said this in my other post.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
@Tom what does "really showy" mean re: Vezok & Mikey? Anyone can answer this, I suppose.
@RR what makes you think experience precludes him (or anyone) from doing busywork? Also, I don't find the discussion on quarterbacking in scumchat to be productive. I don't think that happening or not should really influence someone's reads, as scum language is often going to feel forced/constructed regardless of whether they're parroting another individual or just otherwise trying to create unnatural reads
@Vezok can you cite sources re: 258?
---
@Mikey Did you find issue with people bringing up how vague you were early in the game? Do you have any intentions of going into detail on those early posts/reads? I think I can help with thoughts you hadn't explained in much detail:
27, 41 (vote on tom for being "weird" but not what weird meant)
62-87 (tom being town but not why, considering you "liked nothing." I know you said you thought the behavior was more likely to be town, but not WHY. And what about his posts are towny?)
118 Manasi townread (I don't remember seeing an explanation here)
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@RE I've already explained why I thought it was an RVS vote, based on your wording. "Late for RVS" reads to me as "a bit later than usual for RVS, but still within the area," not "later than RVS." I (we) get that it was not your intention, and I misunderstood you.
The town mindset of your post felt lazy, as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset. So, automatically assuming I spent 0 thought on both sides of your potential motivations is lame. Having never played a game with you, I'm going to operate at face value until given reason to do otherwise, and I omitted your justification because it didn't fit my clearly scum-driven narrative while I understand the motivation to withhold information, I have experience with it being more of a scumtell than a towntell because it's very convenient for scum to swoop in with correct logic after the fact, while creating some low-hanging fruit in the process of building yourself town cred.
Would you say that Mikey has still not been explaining his posts in sufficient detail after, say, 168? While not to the level of detail I'd like/would personally choose to go into, I think they've been sufficient both in a vacuum and by comparison to his previous posts.
@RR what makes you think experience precludes him (or anyone) from doing busywork? Also, I don't find the discussion on quarterbacking in scumchat to be productive. I don't think that happening or not should really influence someone's reads, as scum language is often going to feel forced/constructed regardless of whether they're parroting another individual or just otherwise trying to create unnatural reads
I just dont find good players to do busywork at this stage in the game. The discussion about scumchat was not brought up by me, i was just defending myself when accused of it
@RE I've already explained why I thought it was an RVS vote, based on your wording. "Late for RVS" reads to me as "a bit later than usual for RVS, but still within the area," not "later than RVS." I (we) get that it was not your intention, and I misunderstood you.
You could have asked: "Why did you call your vote RVS when you offered game-related reasoning to it?" Instead, you jumped on it. You even say here the logic behind it was correct. Plus. Now that I've clearly indicated that my vote was not RVS, does your read on me change? I'm willing to count on the answer being "no."
The town mindset of your post felt lazy, as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset. So, automatically assuming I spent 0 thought on both sides of your potential motivations is lame.
Does it matter that you don't buy into it? I know for a fact there are players on this site who don't share the reasoning for their reads immediately as town. Are you the kind of player who lynches others over differing mafia ideologies? I would hope not.
Why should I assume otherwise? This is a legit question. You said nothing of the sort. Even now, you're admitting you went into your read of me with a bias. "as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset" - What the hell does that have to do with me? You might as well have spent 0 thought if you're expecting everyone to play the same way you do. The fact you called it a "mindset" suggests to me you're acknowledging that it's a real play as town, though correct me if I'm wrong.
Having never played a game with you, I'm going to operate at face value until given reason to do otherwise, and I omitted your justification because it didn't fit my clearly scum-driven narrative while I understand the motivation to withhold information, I have experience with it being more of a scumtell than a towntell because it's very convenient for scum to swoop in with correct logic after the fact, while creating some low-hanging fruit in the process of building yourself town cred.
I don't mean my naked vote, I mean my explanation that his questions were forced. You left that out and said I voted Kami for trying to start the game, which was false. That was blatant misrepresentation. It suggests to me you cared more about owning your read on me rather than being accurate in it. I have experience of it being NAI, as it's more of a playstyle than anything. But please, do site your sources. I do not recall ever encountering a player who would do that exclusively as scum.
And it's not what I did. I didn't "swoop." I explained after you indicated curiosity, and Kill mislabeled my vote. I'm also quite certain you can't create low hanging fruit, that's defined by their own nature.
Would you say that Mikey has still not been explaining his posts in sufficient detail after, say, 168? While not to the level of detail I'd like/would personally choose to go into, I think they've been sufficient both in a vacuum and by comparison to his previous posts.
Considering he was questioned by Kami to explain his Manasi read and did not until #257, no. Aside from that read, I've been alright or neutral with his reads. Right now I think the read is understandable but not a solid tell. Don't agree with vez either that scum suggest it more than town.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
@RE: Saying your vote is "late for RVS" is not the same thing as "after RVS." If you'd intended the latter, I thought you would've come out and said so. That's a big part of our misunderstanding here, and I do agree that we're less likely to be accurate in these early Days. Also no argument that you're unlikely to stick to your first "real" vote.
re: random votes, I agree that unusual =/= scum. But it was confusing to me that you didn't take advantage of a reaction that your post was explicitly made to generate. We agree that page 1 was full of random votes. My understanding was that you were trying to pass a serious vote as a random one, and needed to explain it after the fact, which is disingenuous if that was your intent.
But calling my read malicious is, in itself, malicious (but understandable as town that thinks they are being wronged). Call it OMGUS, but you provided the first concrete "lead" for me to pursue this game, right or wrong. As we know, wrong =/= scum, and if you think it's founded on misunderstandings between my perception of what you wrote versus your intention, then wrong is a very plausible outcome. Using my misinterpretations to paint you as scum, if I believe them to be true, really isn't something that can be faulted if you don't think it's malicious in intent.
tom's behavior this game is the equivalent of a 10 hour youtube video of Gregg from Night in the Woods waving his arms in the air with cups on his head and I see no reason to wolf read that
ok but why loudly declare it as scum
I'm getting the vibe it's not abnormal for Tom to be pretty outlandish in his posting by reactions here? Let me know if this is an unfair call but it's s pretty easy wolf gimmick for a wolf to try to do something that would make people go "l0l0l why would a wolf be so weird l0l"
and I kinda feel like its pretty natural for that to occur to someone when they're trying to read a player hard gimmicking
so town!Tom why exactly?
I don't think there's a good reason for it yet, thus my skepticism of Emcee's explanation yet. Tom has a very pronounced opinion that he does nothing AI.
@Cantrip remind me to respond to your question towards the worst regarding Emcee once he answers it (or once I progress far enough in reading to see his answer). In case it wasn't clear, not a dichotomy, but two separate, opposite reads.
I've no more time to acknowledge anything that happened beyond this (pages 4-5). Tomorrow!
Would you say that Mikey has still not been explaining his posts in sufficient detail after, say, 168? While not to the level of detail I'd like/would personally choose to go into, I think they've been sufficient both in a vacuum and by comparison to his previous posts.
Actually, I'm just going to do it now. vote: ganderin_dan
I'll do a meta dive tomorrow and see if it makes a difference.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
Just an fyi, I wont be as active in this game on Wed-Fri as I am the rest of the week, but I will still post atleast once a day, so if you guys have anything for me, make it count
"The Doldrums, my young friend, are where nothing ever happens and nothing ever changes."
This time the voice came from so close that Milo jumped with surprise, for, sitting on his right shoulder, so lightly that he hardly noticed, was a small creature exactly the color of his shirt.
"Allow me to introduce all of us," the creature went on. "We are the Lethargarians, at your service."
Milo looked around and, for the first time, noticed dozens of them — sitting on the car, standing in the road, and lying all over the trees and bushes. They were very difficult to see, because whatever they happened to be sitting on or near was exactly the color they happened to be. Each one looked very much like the other (except for the color, of course) and some looked even more like each other than they did like themselves.
"I'm very pleased to meet you," said Milo, not sure whether or not he was pleased at all. "I think I'm lost. Can you help me please?"
"Don't say 'think,' " said one sitting on his shoe, for the one on his shoulder had fallen asleep. "It's against the law." And he yawned and fell off to sleep, too.
"No one's allowed to think in the Doldrums," continued a third, beginning to doze off.
I've been swamped with work for the past few days, haven't managed to properly check on the thread. Sufficiently looking at it now, and through the newest posts, I think I'm finally ready to give my opinion on the state of affairs, as educated as I am on them at the moment.
@Killmatronix: Let's say you have a vig shot that needs to be used in the next post. Who do you shoot and why?
Having read up, I'd safely say it's Mikey.
Mikey's posts have all followed the basic formula of pushing for a lot of people or doing nothing. His defense hasn't instilled any faith in him from my point of view.
The point I'm trying to demonstrate is the post #226, where it's shown Mikey was either trying to early push or presents half-assed reasonings for his decisions.
Speaking of: Vote Mikey
@RE I've already explained why I thought it was an RVS vote, based on your wording. "Late for RVS" reads to me as "a bit later than usual for RVS, but still within the area," not "later than RVS." I (we) get that it was not your intention, and I misunderstood you.
You could have asked: "Why did you call your vote RVS when you offered game-related reasoning to it?" Instead, you jumped on it. You even say here the logic behind it was correct. Plus. Now that I've clearly indicated that my vote was not RVS, does your read on me change? I'm willing to count on the answer being "no."
Incorrect, despite the deliberate ignorance accusation. Part of me wants to keep my vote here because of your condescending tone and horrible assumptions that bash my intentions, despite what seems like a productive discussion getting to the bottom of both of our mindsets this game. But at this point I have no game-related info to push your lynch with.
Correct, you have accurately summarized in-thread posts that I have made. You have said that not moving your vote is not indicative of wanting to lynch the player you had it on. Why can I not live by the same standards? As you'll see in your meta dive (you'll need to look years back beyond the last few games I've been in, FYI, as I'm just recently coming back from an extended break from online mafia), my vote doesn't tend to hop from person to person. But, clearly this is the result you're aiming for with such pointed language (I've also put this outside of the spoiler for votecounter purposes):
Unvote
The town mindset of your post felt lazy, as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset. So, automatically assuming I spent 0 thought on both sides of your potential motivations is lame.
Does it matter that you don't buy into it?
Uh, yes? You wanted justifications for my actions and a glean into my mindset in an attempt to discern alignment. I provided it in the most forthcoming fashion possible. It's not within my control to have you refuse my reality.
I know for a fact there are players on this site who don't share the reasoning for their reads immediately as town. Are you the kind of player who lynches others over differing mafia ideologies? I would hope not.
Why should I assume otherwise? This is a legit question. You said nothing of the sort. Even now, you're admitting you went into your read of me with a bias. "as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset" - What the hell does that have to do with me? You might as well have spent 0 thought if you're expecting everyone to play the same way you do. The fact you called it a "mindset" suggests to me you're acknowledging that it's a real play as town, though correct me if I'm wrong.
I went into the read of you with previous experiences that have created my set of reads, yes. I suppose that created an implicit bias against you, given that we'd never played before, but you exhibited what I took to be a scumtell, and in trying to be less passive in the early stages of games (to further help flesh out my meta for you, I generally speaking [Playstation excluded] tend to solve by creating a townpile and working towards educated PoE as opposed to finding scum), I ran with it. I'm not very good at it yet.
Yes, I acknowledge that it can be a town line of play. It has to do with you because... you demonstrated it? You had a read, and you withheld information explaining it for a period of time, as we've discussed. There's no deeper level of meaning here.
I'm not sure what you mean by the bolded.
Having never played a game with you, I'm going to operate at face value until given reason to do otherwise, and I omitted your justification because it didn't fit my clearly scum-driven narrative while I understand the motivation to withhold information, I have experience with it being more of a scumtell than a towntell because it's very convenient for scum to swoop in with correct logic after the fact, while creating some low-hanging fruit in the process of building yourself town cred.
I don't mean my naked vote, I mean my explanation that his questions were forced. You left that out and said I voted Kami for trying to start the game, which was false. That was blatant misrepresentation. It suggests to me you cared more about owning your read on me rather than being accurate in it. I have experience of it being NAI, as it's more of a playstyle than anything. But please, do site your sources. I do not recall ever encountering a player who would do that exclusively as scum.
And it's not what I did. I didn't "swoop." I explained after you indicated curiosity, and Kill mislabeled my vote. I'm also quite certain you can't create low hanging fruit, that's defined by their own nature.
And as I've already said, I didn't find that pertinent in the summary because your delayed explanation was a scumtell to me, not something that would contradict my overall point. Call it misrepresentation, but it's not as though I was hiding information from people, they were free to read it and come to their own conclusion. I'd say that low hanging fruit can certainly be a matter of perspective as well as the end result of someone's behavior, but that's neither here nor there. But I was not accusing you of swooping, but giving you context as to (part of) why I interpret that to be a mildly scummy behavior. I don't know how much clearer I could've been in providing that in a general sense as opposed to your specific context (thus my not putting you into it or directly drawing correlations between your actions and what I was describing), which feels like you're misunderstanding me.
When you ask me to cite my sources, are you asking for more specific self-meta?
It feels like our conversation along these lines is no longer productive, but feel free to disagree. I feel like I'm borderline groveling while I continue to say "I misunderstood the intent of your vote" while you continue to beat the horse into mincemeat.
Would you say that Mikey has still not been explaining his posts in sufficient detail after, say, 168? While not to the level of detail I'd like/would personally choose to go into, I think they've been sufficient both in a vacuum and by comparison to his previous posts.
Considering he was questioned by Kami to explain his Manasi read and did not until #257, no. Aside from that read, I've been alright or neutral with his reads. Right now I think the read is understandable but not a solid tell. Don't agree with vez either that scum suggest it more than town.
Also, I don't ever acknowledge any one player calling me scummy this early in the game as either alignment. As scum, it's showing a sign of vulnerability, and as town, it's distracting efforts away from more productive scumhunting. You and I have had extended dialogue outside of that context. Why do you think this is a scumtell?
Also, do you have any experience with the other players in this game?
Unvote
@KA And if this continues to not yield fruit, how will you tell from game to game a difference between Tom's behavior?
@Tom So showy is not a mafia-specific term, but just someone being fairly blunt/transparent? Do you have an opinion on RR's interpretation of Mikey's vagueness in his reads?
@RR What do you expect good players to be doing at this stage? Break down what you expect scumhunting this early in the game to look like for me.
@Mikey I can't tell if the second sentence in 269 is serious or tongue-in-cheek. I know you were on mobile for a good while early in the game, but I feel like you should have all the more motivation and, implicitly, more information to explain your reads with, yet are still choosing not to do so.
HOT TAKE: WOLVES POINTED OUT ME ASKING FOR A FRIEND AND THOUGHT IT WAS PR HUNTING
THIS IS WHY REVERSE ROOT KNEW IT HAPPENED BUT TOTALLY FAILED THE CONTEXT
This is emotional manipulation at it's finest and I'd rather not have this type of drama in the game. Maybe when you come back we talk about the gamestate more instead of doing this.
On that note, what is your read on Manasi?
Emotional, yes; manipulation, no. I'm just tired of pouring effort into the game and everyone going "pass" and not reading or not caring and especially not responding, so I'm going to try something different. When I stormed off, I was more frustrated at myself for not being able to communicate in a way that was productive than I wanted to admit.
Manasi is still mostly null for me with a slight scum lean. His comments on Kpaca and Tom in 114 felt like shading, but he really hasn't posted enough.
Why this vote? And what do you think of Mikey and Root?
Mostly OMGUS because he wasn't answering my question and calling it boring.
Unvote
I'm liking Root, in general. I don't feel like he has a lot of substance in his posts, but he's persistent and focused, which is a good sign. Why are you asking me about him, specifically?
Speaking of which...I had recently indicated (139) that Mikey was near the top of my town list; he's one of the players I'd taken a solid stance on, so it's interesting that you're asking me about him...?
However, I'm liking Mikey a lot less now. That claim felt intentionally vague, and 287 and 288 feel like nervous scum ramblings. I'd vote him if he wasn't at L-2. If Mikey flips scum, I'll feel a lot better about Gan_Dan, and ReverseRoot will be pretty solidly town.
I assumed a couple things
A) neighborizer is not a standard role
B) the term is somewhat self-explanatory
C) the less I have to reveal about my role the better
Um...neighborizer is nowhere near a town-exclusive role. Unless I'm not thinking of the right role. But if it's "target a player, gain a Night chat with them" or "target two players; those players gain a Night chat" or something similar, yeah, not even close to a "blue role". Nice try, though.
@RR What do you expect good players to be doing at this stage? Break down what you expect scumhunting this early in the game to look like for me.
Good players at this stage are scumhunting by setting up questions that will be alignment/dichotomy related in later days. Outside of blind luck or scum slips day 1 is the least important day at the time, and the most important day at the end of the game.
Basically what you want to be able to do, is make sure that at some point during day 1 everyone has been asked hard questions about the game by someone, even if its not you, and even better for multiples. This data in the late game when analyzing voting and wagon patterns is very helpful in narrowing down, or atleast it has been for me, and for some others ive seen with similar styles
But seriously, Cantrip is right, neighborizer is not a 100% lock town role by any means. Not enough to vote you for by any means, but I wouldn't think that's enough of a claim to prompt unvotes if someone already thought you were scum.
I shouldn't be posting when I don't have the time. I feel very ineffective right now...
Any thoughts on my main post, since your the one who prodded me for it?
I don't disagree with his sentiment that you were told by your scumbuddies to make a case, not that it actually happened (because you aren't actually a new player), but I kinda felt like you had to force yourself to make those reads (you had quite a lot to say, I don't know why I had to ask you first).
Yes, I should have said this in my other post.
Then you'd be really really wrong. Most of the time the first perosn to suggest a town circle is scum.
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[ ]Yes
[ ]No
[X] Doubt
HI I'M TOM NICE TO MEET YOU FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME
I ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION YOU JUST DECIDED YOU DIDN'T LIKE THE ANSWER
SO
WTF IS THIS QUESTION?
It sounds like you're going with "This is my playstyle, #dealwithit", which I dislike.
@RR what makes you think experience precludes him (or anyone) from doing busywork? Also, I don't find the discussion on quarterbacking in scumchat to be productive. I don't think that happening or not should really influence someone's reads, as scum language is often going to feel forced/constructed regardless of whether they're parroting another individual or just otherwise trying to create unnatural reads
@Vezok can you cite sources re: 258?
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@Mikey Did you find issue with people bringing up how vague you were early in the game? Do you have any intentions of going into detail on those early posts/reads? I think I can help with thoughts you hadn't explained in much detail:
27, 41 (vote on tom for being "weird" but not what weird meant)
62-87 (tom being town but not why, considering you "liked nothing." I know you said you thought the behavior was more likely to be town, but not WHY. And what about his posts are towny?)
118 Manasi townread (I don't remember seeing an explanation here)
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@RE I've already explained why I thought it was an RVS vote, based on your wording. "Late for RVS" reads to me as "a bit later than usual for RVS, but still within the area," not "later than RVS." I (we) get that it was not your intention, and I misunderstood you.
The town mindset of your post felt lazy, as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset. So, automatically assuming I spent 0 thought on both sides of your potential motivations is lame. Having never played a game with you, I'm going to operate at face value until given reason to do otherwise, and I omitted your justification because
it didn't fit my clearly scum-driven narrativewhile I understand the motivation to withhold information, I have experience with it being more of a scumtell than a towntell because it's very convenient for scum to swoop in with correct logic after the fact, while creating some low-hanging fruit in the process of building yourself town cred.Would you say that Mikey has still not been explaining his posts in sufficient detail after, say, 168? While not to the level of detail I'd like/would personally choose to go into, I think they've been sufficient both in a vacuum and by comparison to his previous posts.
I just dont find good players to do busywork at this stage in the game. The discussion about scumchat was not brought up by me, i was just defending myself when accused of it
It takes me a while to catch up with my subconscious
Sounds like OMGUS to me
@Osie v/la 48 hours maximum.
Why should I assume otherwise? This is a legit question. You said nothing of the sort. Even now, you're admitting you went into your read of me with a bias.
"as someone who doesn't really buy into the "town should withhold reads that aren't generated by private information" mindset" - What the hell does that have to do with me? You might as well have spent 0 thought if you're expecting everyone to play the same way you do. The fact you called it a "mindset" suggests to me you're acknowledging that it's a real play as town, though correct me if I'm wrong. I don't mean my naked vote, I mean my explanation that his questions were forced. You left that out and said I voted Kami for trying to start the game, which was false. That was blatant misrepresentation. It suggests to me you cared more about owning your read on me rather than being accurate in it. I have experience of it being NAI, as it's more of a playstyle than anything. But please, do site your sources. I do not recall ever encountering a player who would do that exclusively as scum.
And it's not what I did. I didn't "swoop." I explained after you indicated curiosity, and Kill mislabeled my vote. I'm also quite certain you can't create low hanging fruit, that's defined by their own nature. Considering he was questioned by Kami to explain his Manasi read and did not until #257, no. Aside from that read, I've been alright or neutral with his reads. Right now I think the read is understandable but not a solid tell. Don't agree with vez either that scum suggest it more than town.
Actually, I'm just going to do it now.
vote: ganderin_dan
I'll do a meta dive tomorrow and see if it makes a difference.
I think you're going for wifom
ganderin_dan (3) - Killmatronix, tomsloger, RE1031
ReverseRoot (2) - KamikazeArchon, Emcee_Mikey
RE1031 (1) - ganderin_dan
vezokpiraka (1) - Cantripmancer
Not voting: Manasi
Day 1 Lynch Deadline will be Sunday, September 30th at 1500 MST. There will be a Twilight period (No voting) of 0-8 hours to account for the host having a life outside of Mafia.
With 12 players, it takes 7 to lynch.
Killmatronix has been prodded.
Should I write some more of my screenplay today
Having read up, I'd safely say it's Mikey.
Mikey's posts have all followed the basic formula of pushing for a lot of people or doing nothing. His defense hasn't instilled any faith in him from my point of view.
The point I'm trying to demonstrate is the post #226, where it's shown Mikey was either trying to early push or presents half-assed reasonings for his decisions.
Speaking of:
Vote Mikey
You guys suck at this game
Can we lynch reverse root now
Correct, you have accurately summarized in-thread posts that I have made. You have said that not moving your vote is not indicative of wanting to lynch the player you had it on. Why can I not live by the same standards? As you'll see in your meta dive (you'll need to look years back beyond the last few games I've been in, FYI, as I'm just recently coming back from an extended break from online mafia), my vote doesn't tend to hop from person to person. But, clearly this is the result you're aiming for with such pointed language (I've also put this outside of the spoiler for votecounter purposes):
Unvote Uh, yes? You wanted justifications for my actions and a glean into my mindset in an attempt to discern alignment. I provided it in the most forthcoming fashion possible. It's not within my control to have you refuse my reality. And as I've already said, I didn't find that pertinent in the summary because your delayed explanation was a scumtell to me, not something that would contradict my overall point. Call it misrepresentation, but it's not as though I was hiding information from people, they were free to read it and come to their own conclusion. I'd say that low hanging fruit can certainly be a matter of perspective as well as the end result of someone's behavior, but that's neither here nor there. But I was not accusing you of swooping, but giving you context as to (part of) why I interpret that to be a mildly scummy behavior. I don't know how much clearer I could've been in providing that in a general sense as opposed to your specific context (thus my not putting you into it or directly drawing correlations between your actions and what I was describing), which feels like you're misunderstanding me.
When you ask me to cite my sources, are you asking for more specific self-meta?
It feels like our conversation along these lines is no longer productive, but feel free to disagree. I feel like I'm borderline groveling while I continue to say "I misunderstood the intent of your vote" while you continue to beat the horse into mincemeat.
Also, I don't ever acknowledge any one player calling me scummy this early in the game as either alignment. As scum, it's showing a sign of vulnerability, and as town, it's distracting efforts away from more productive scumhunting. You and I have had extended dialogue outside of that context. Why do you think this is a scumtell?
Also, do you have any experience with the other players in this game?
@KA And if this continues to not yield fruit, how will you tell from game to game a difference between Tom's behavior?
@Tom So showy is not a mafia-specific term, but just someone being fairly blunt/transparent? Do you have an opinion on RR's interpretation of Mikey's vagueness in his reads?
@RR What do you expect good players to be doing at this stage? Break down what you expect scumhunting this early in the game to look like for me.
@Mikey I can't tell if the second sentence in 269 is serious or tongue-in-cheek. I know you were on mobile for a good while early in the game, but I feel like you should have all the more motivation and, implicitly, more information to explain your reads with, yet are still choosing not to do so.
The second statement was my best guess at the truth
THIS IS WHY REVERSE ROOT KNEW IT HAPPENED BUT TOTALLY FAILED THE CONTEXT
Manasi is still mostly null for me with a slight scum lean. His comments on Kpaca and Tom in 114 felt like shading, but he really hasn't posted enough.
Mostly OMGUS because he wasn't answering my question and calling it boring.
Unvote
I'm liking Root, in general. I don't feel like he has a lot of substance in his posts, but he's persistent and focused, which is a good sign. Why are you asking me about him, specifically?
Speaking of which...I had recently indicated (139) that Mikey was near the top of my town list; he's one of the players I'd taken a solid stance on, so it's interesting that you're asking me about him...?
However, I'm liking Mikey a lot less now. That claim felt intentionally vague, and 287 and 288 feel like nervous scum ramblings. I'd vote him if he wasn't at L-2. If Mikey flips scum, I'll feel a lot better about Gan_Dan, and ReverseRoot will be pretty solidly town.
A) neighborizer is not a standard role
B) the term is somewhat self-explanatory
C) the less I have to reveal about my role the better
yeah, gaining private communication is not beneficial to town whatsoever
unvote
vote: cantrip
trying to delegitimize my claim is the play scum makes 99.9999% of the time
trying to protect your partner, I guess.
Good players at this stage are scumhunting by setting up questions that will be alignment/dichotomy related in later days. Outside of blind luck or scum slips day 1 is the least important day at the time, and the most important day at the end of the game.
Basically what you want to be able to do, is make sure that at some point during day 1 everyone has been asked hard questions about the game by someone, even if its not you, and even better for multiples. This data in the late game when analyzing voting and wagon patterns is very helpful in narrowing down, or atleast it has been for me, and for some others ive seen with similar styles
That might be the first thing that has came out of your mouth that makes sense, even if it is a lie
Care to give thoughts on your wagon?