Apparently they have a role-blocker. They probably thought Iso was obv-town, or possibly didn't care for his pivot towards DC3.
Or maybe they just needed an excuse for Cyan to not show up dead for a while? One of me, Cyan, or the bodyguard, ought to have been killed off.
I'm not sure why the scum would choose to RB me over a town Cyan, unless my targets were more on point, but in that case, I'd expect to die before Iso.
I guess it's also possible they were more concerned with Iso redirecting either the kill OR the RB, either one of which would function as either a cop investigation, or a cop plus vig shot combo? I suppose that'd make him a higher threat than a one-shot vig in terms of night power, especially since they could essentially make me vanilla after last night.
*shrug*
Wheat needs to die.
I hate these situations. On the one hand, you claiming to have been RBed here is so, so obvious. It literally gets you off of the hook forever. On the other hand, my play as town is fairly consistent and transparent, and if anyone on the scum team has seen my response to this situation before(such as in Wu Tang, where Rhand claimed Doc Day 1 and then was vanillafied by the mafia N1), they would know that I would react with extreme skepticism toward you revealing this.
So, I think we need to wait and see if another person gets RBed tonight, and then decide what to do. Because I certainly don't believe that, if the scum RB were only one-shot, he was going to fire on you last night.
So over the night I went back and read True Name mafia and the difference between that game and this one is rather stark. I can see why people would say Wheat is a skilled scum player. The differences there are about the same level of difference as his town game in AG, which is not what I was expecting, but perhaps should have been given the fact that Wheat was so insistent that I view it. So wheat has attacked me far differently than he did in AG when he was town and I was scum, but he has also proven to be able to play on a far better level as scum than what has been on display here. But the fact that he kind of just throws the game at my feet and goes "look look" negates that a bit. I was left very unimpressed with his scum game after dismantling him in FF... would he go in the opposite direction in an attempt to throw me off? Maybe? If Az is town Wheat has to be scum, I'd think. I doubt scum go for wifom over simply having a dead member of town at their feet. Well, could be gj/dciii and they didn't want to risk that. Comedy option gj/dciii/wheat... heh, that'd please me.
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I hate these situations. On the one hand, you claiming to have been RBed here is so, so obvious. It literally gets you off of the hook forever. On the other hand, my play as town is fairly consistent and transparent, and if anyone on the scum team has seen my response to this situation before(such as in Wu Tang, where Rhand claimed Doc Day 1 and then was vanillafied by the mafia N1), they would know that I would react with extreme skepticism toward you revealing this.
So, I think we need to wait and see if another person gets RBed tonight, and then decide what to do. Because I certainly don't believe that, if the scum RB were only one-shot, he was going to fire on you last night.
Time to review.
Are you slow-rolling your cop result for reactions/info, or what?
I mean..Iso said he was going to redirect me, and flipped town(meaning that there would be no reason for him to be lying). I assumed you guys could put 2 and 2 together there.
Rhand didn't prevent a kill
Az is claiming to be roleblocked
Cyan's scan is on the dead person
Iso the redirector is dead
We know nothing from night one then.
I still trust Cyan with my life, he's way way too different from his scum meta here.
Still don't think Proph comes after me like he did there as scum
Seppel came off as genuine in his reading of me, but he keeps insisting we kill people I think are firmly town. Seppel you have a lot of experience with Cyan, what scum game do you think he is like here? And why do you think we don't have an investigative role?
Also I think redirecter could be, balance wise, seen as a type of protection which means strictly speaking we don't have to have a bodyguard. Although if that was the case I'd imagine scum would just have killed cyan last night.
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Iso ruined this game with his awful mass-claim suggestion, which he effectively forced through by him and Rhand putting their claims out there. We have mislynched all of once and the game honestly feels like we can't win.
Seppel's vote on me is also really unimpressive. There is literally no universe where I, as scum, 'forgot' that I was supposed to fake an investigation result on someone. I feel like his case on Iso was also 'he claimed Redirector', and had nothing at all to do with behavior, which is a great line for scum to take.
I'm still having a hard time reconciling Az's claim of having been RBed. The mafia could have been counting on that, but would they really take my singular reaction that heavily into account? This is hard for me to believe, but nothing else really makes sense.
Just something I'm going to keep in mind as I re-read today. I have a couple of other specific things to re-check also.
Don't evaluate Az in a vacuum btw. Evaluate him along with the people he named, because it's important. As town if he had, say, 2+ people on the scum team on his list there blocking him makes sense due to the numbers game. Getting vigged is pretty much the worst thing that can happen to a member of scum from a numbers stand point as it tilts the mislynches needed. Even getting cop scanned isn't as bad.
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I would like for some other people to go read Sir Chris' posts toward the end of Day 1 of Avant Garde Mafia, where ZDS got lynched and he was scum, and then compare them to his posts at the end of yesterday in this game.
I feel like the tone/context of these posts is very similar, but I would like insight from some others here.
I would like for some other people to go read Sir Chris' posts toward the end of Day 1 of Avant Garde Mafia, where ZDS got lynched and he was scum, and then compare them to his posts at the end of yesterday in this game.
I feel like the tone/context of these posts is very similar, but I would like insight from some others here.
I hope they are close, it would mean I played a better scum game in AG than I recall tbh.
(I have a real note on this, but I will give people a chance to respond to your question because I think it will be telling)
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I would like for some other people to go read Sir Chris' posts toward the end of Day 1 of Avant Garde Mafia, where ZDS got lynched and he was scum, and then compare them to his posts at the end of yesterday in this game.
I feel like the tone/context of these posts is very similar, but I would like insight from some others here.
I missed this post and only saw it when Chris quoted it.
I won't be able to go look for a few days but I do want to.
Rhand didn't prevent a kill
Az is claiming to be roleblocked
Cyan's scan is on the dead person
Iso the redirector is dead
We know nothing from night one then.
I still trust Cyan with my life, he's way way too different from his scum meta here.
Still don't think Proph comes after me like he did there as scum
Seppel came off as genuine in his reading of me, but he keeps insisting we kill people I think are firmly town. Seppel you have a lot of experience with Cyan, what scum game do you think he is like here? And why do you think we don't have an investigative role?
Also I think redirecter could be, balance wise, seen as a type of protection which means strictly speaking we don't have to have a bodyguard. Although if that was the case I'd imagine scum would just have killed cyan last night.
Why are you not talking about the redirector + vig double scum kill possibility in this post?
If the cop AND vig are real, scum can be wasted in 1 Night purely with our PR's (vig 1, redirect NK to another, cop the third)
that's assuming we have 3 anti-town parties ofc, but I think that's pretty safe to assume in a 12-man setup.
Why are you not talking about the redirector + vig double scum kill possibility in this post?
If the cop AND vig are real, scum can be wasted in 1 Night purely with our PR's (vig 1, redirect NK to another, cop the third)
that's assuming we have 3 anti-town parties ofc, but I think that's pretty safe to assume in a 12-man setup.
Is there some reason you would like me to bring this up? The point of that post wasn't a comprehensive thought on every possible PR interaction. If you have a thought share it with the class Rhand, don't ask why I didn't do your job for you.
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I mean..Iso said he was going to redirect me, and flipped town(meaning that there would be no reason for him to be lying). I assumed you guys could put 2 and 2 together there.
Seppel's vote on me is also really unimpressive. There is literally no universe where I, as scum, 'forgot' that I was supposed to fake an investigation result on someone. I feel like his case on Iso was also 'he claimed Redirector', and had nothing at all to do with behavior, which is a great line for scum to take.
You still haven't claimed what you did and I think you're scum for it.
I would like for some other people to go read Sir Chris' posts toward the end of Day 1 of Avant Garde Mafia, where ZDS got lynched and he was scum, and then compare them to his posts at the end of yesterday in this game.
I feel like the tone/context of these posts is very similar, but I would like insight from some others here.
Lesse.
Looking at Chris's posts at the end of Avant-Garde:
Quote from Chris »
I like how I went back to ZDS' previous games and found he isn't acting like his scum self from two different games and no one gives a **** at all.
Wait, no, that's horrible and I don't like it.
It feels like people have just decided to fall asleep at the end and just take the lynch they have been handed. Only a couple of people on ZDS have really actively been going at it with him (Plow and Cyan) and the rest are just "I guess this sounds good LOL" when ZDS is just giving so much more earnest effort than KA could ever hope to muster.
Like I know effort isn't a tell, but jesus ZDS has been nothing but nose to the grindstone since this game began, isn't even in his scum meta, and no one seems to care.
Gives a half-hearted defense of ZDS here, while pushing his scumbuddy KA. He also invokes the "we're all playing apathetically" card.
On that same page he also provides reads on some players and such.
In this game.. Chris pretty much ignores ZDS? He just solely focuses on pushing Wheat. I looked at the previous page as well and he doesn't mention ZDS. The only thing that Chris mentions about ZDS in this game was in the twilight period, which is kind of a throwaway post for scum!Chris to make since the lynch has already gone through.
Thoughts, Cyan? I'm uncomfortable about relying on meta stuff like this and would prefer to lynch Wheat Today since his posts Today have been absolutely terrible.
Quote from Wheat »
How far are you willing to go to find out the answer?
You stated that "Az is super scummy but he's self-resolving" which doesn't mesh with your statement here, which is "I will not consider the possibility of any claimed PR to be scum".
It continues to baffle me why you have me as your primary scumread and you basically go out of your way to avoid pushing me. Like, if I'm "transparently scum" and ZDS flipped town, you look at... DCIII, of all people? Why not vote me and case me? It shouldn't be hard, seeing that you think that I'm transparent scum.
----
Going to do a vote analysis/rereading post soon. The way the ZDS wagon went down felt.. disingenous to me, and I'd imagine there are scum all over the wagon. The problem is that most of the people on the ZDS wagon are townreads of mine (DCIII, Cyan, GJ, maybe Rhand?) so I just feel like I'm horrifically wrong in my reads somewhere. I think scum are massively outplaying us (but then again I think that in every game).
Seppel is just off on his own world right now, but I don't know if that's something he does as town or scum.
I really want more input from Cythare. He's just been massively lurking and contributed a bandwagon vote onto ZDS after ducking most of the conversation from Yesterday.
Okay the secret is out of the bag and it only makes my town read on proph grow stronger: my play here compared to AG is very different. I assumed cyan knew this and was hoping a lazy scum would just pile on me and so I held off raising an eyebrow at cyan. Proph seeing the differences when he suspected me day 1 is major town cred.
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I want to lynch one of: WG, Cythare, or Seppel. Not really sure which, and I'm really paranoid about being wrong now. I've never felt this insecure about a game after a single mislynch before, and I really dislike it.
by thinking Cyan is scum, you are saying "town doesn't have any sort of investigation ability."
I didn't use big words, Seppel.
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Can you please cite reasoning/evidence for having town reads on Seppel and Cythare? Neither of them have done anything particularly noteworthy, and the little that they have done of note has been decidedly anti-town.
Also I think redirecter could be, balance wise, seen as a type of protection which means strictly speaking we don't have to have a bodyguard. Although if that was the case I'd imagine scum would just have killed cyan last night.
Yes Rhand, what a damning case I was building against you.
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Can you please cite reasoning/evidence for having town reads on Seppel and Cythare? Neither of them have done anything particularly noteworthy, and the little that they have done of note has been decidedly anti-town.
Seppel's early activity is very much off the cuff. Cythare is typically more scummy than the average bear, but has so far seemed within his standard baseline.
Challenge entire playerbase to read page 4 of thread and not conclude that both WG and GJ are scum together.
Still looking for scum #3 on reread.
I'll look at page 4 but I don't think you're right about GJ. At the end of the Day Yesterday you listed Wheat, me, and him as possible vig targets. He went out of his way to defend me to you AFTER the ZDS lynch had gone through. So you list him and Wheat and they're buddies but he bothers to push back on my inclusion in the list and instead pushes for Chris? That would have been after following Wheats vote on ZDS to hammer and while knowing that you could be role blocked. Theres very little value in him trying to discourage you from shooting me if he's scum with Wheat there, or really just generally.
I'll look at page 4 but I don't think you're right about GJ. At the end of the Day Yesterday you listed Wheat, me, and him as possible vig targets. He went out of his way to defend me to you AFTER the ZDS lynch had gone through. So you list him and Wheat and they're buddies but he bothers to push back on my inclusion in the list and instead pushes for Chris? That would have been after following Wheats vote on ZDS to hammer and while knowing that you could be role blocked. Theres very little value in him trying to discourage you from shooting me if he's scum with Wheat there, or really just generally.
Okay the secret is out of the bag and it only makes my town read on proph grow stronger: my play here compared to AG is very different. I assumed cyan knew this and was hoping a lazy scum would just pile on me and so I held off raising an eyebrow at cyan. Proph seeing the differences when he suspected me day 1 is major town cred.
Can you please cite reasoning/evidence for having town reads on Seppel and Cythare? Neither of them have done anything particularly noteworthy, and the little that they have done of note has been decidedly anti-town.
Challenge entire playerbase to read page 4 of thread and not conclude that both WG and GJ are scum together.
Still looking for scum #3 on reread.
I'll look at page 4 but I don't think you're right about GJ. At the end of the Day Yesterday you listed Wheat, me, and him as possible vig targets. He went out of his way to defend me to you AFTER the ZDS lynch had gone through. So you list him and Wheat and they're buddies but he bothers to push back on my inclusion in the list and instead pushes for Chris? That would have been after following Wheats vote on ZDS to hammer and while knowing that you could be role blocked. Theres very little value in him trying to discourage you from shooting me if he's scum with Wheat there, or really just generally.
It's possible DC3 is defending GJ so strongly here because he knows I'm wrong on that point.
It would be pretty ballsy for both WG and GJ to jump on that end of day wagon as scum. Maybe I'll take a look at page 4 again and see if it's possible that only WG is the scum there.
When I was trying to figure out Iso, the only reason I could justify him brute forcing a massclaim if he was telling the truth, was so that he wouldn't accidentally redirect a PR towards him. Instead, he purposefully forces Cyan to target him. So forgive me if I am not super motivated in this game right now, as either Cyan is lying, which means Iso was lying as town about his plans to redirect, or Cyan is telling the truth and Iso gave the mafia a free roleblock. I don't like either outcome.
Proph's 778 makes me feel better about his read.
I am predicting the scum team in some cluster of Azreal, Cythare, Chris, Wheat. Iso flipping means if a PR is lying, I think its probably Az, but like someone already said, it will resolve itself.
Az, humor me. You got roleblocked (fine, fine). You are relatively insistent that one of me or WG is scum, why is your vote on neither one of us?
When I was trying to figure out Iso, the only reason I could justify him brute forcing a massclaim if he was telling the truth, was so that he wouldn't accidentally redirect a PR towards him. Instead, he purposefully forces Cyan to target him. So forgive me if I am not super motivated in this game right now, as either Cyan is lying, which means Iso was lying as town about his plans to redirect, or Cyan is telling the truth and Iso gave the mafia a free roleblock. I don't like either outcome.
Proph's 778 makes me feel better about his read.
I am predicting the scum team in some cluster of Azreal, Cythare, Chris, Wheat. Iso flipping means if a PR is lying, I think its probably Az, but like someone already said, it will resolve itself.
Az, humor me. You got roleblocked (fine, fine). You are relatively insistent that one of me or WG is scum, why is your vote on neither one of us?
Yeah I mean like..Iso already ruined this game. Seemingly all of the tower's power is neutralized because of him. But there is nothing we can do about that now, other than try to salvage the situation.
As for him actually re-directing me, presumably he did so because he had to. He likely would have gotten lynched otherwise.
I'm still hoping that someone can show me one of Cythare's scum games.
@Az - I literally just explained why I thought he was being sincere - because there's no value in trying to discourage you from shooting me there if he's scum with Wheat and especially if there's a role blocker and they were just going to block you anyway. You'd be threatening to shoot among his scum buddy, him, and a townie. He'd effectively be arguing against you shooting a townie that you want to shoot when your other options are him and his buddy, while seeing that you had a stronger town read on the other player he was recommending for your list and knowing that the player (ZDS) that I just pushed to lynch was about to flip Town. And this would have been after he just hammered ZDS immediately following Wheat moving from Chris to ZDS.
Rather than giving your thoughts on my reasons, you ask me why I assumed he was being sincere, which I wasn't assuming, I was drawing the conclusion based on the reasons that I explained in that very post... then after Seppel points out that we disagree, you reconsider my point as being viable and throw out the idea that I'm making it because I know that you're wrong. But if the points that I was making are enough to reconsider the GJ read, then why were you asking me why I assumed he was being sincere to begin with?
@Az - I literally just explained why I thought he was being sincere - because there's no value in trying to discourage you from shooting me there if he's scum with Wheat and especially if there's a role blocker and they were just going to block you anyway. You'd be threatening to shoot among his scum buddy, him, and a townie. He'd effectively be arguing against you shooting a townie that you want to shoot when your other options are him and his buddy, while seeing that you had a stronger town read on the other player he was recommending for your list and knowing that the player (ZDS) that I just pushed to lynch was about to flip Town. And this would have been after he just hammered ZDS immediately following Wheat moving from Chris to ZDS.
Isn't it optimal play, if he knew he was going to roleblock Az, to defend the townie there though, DCIII? I mean from your perspective think about it. He knows the shot doesn't matter because its in his head already to block Az. Why would you NOT talk up a townie? Classic buddying, yeah?
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You stated that "Az is super scummy but he's self-resolving" which doesn't mesh with your statement here, which is "I will not consider the possibility of any claimed PR to be scum".
It continues to baffle me why you have me as your primary scumread and you basically go out of your way to avoid pushing me. Like, if I'm "transparently scum" and ZDS flipped town, you look at... DCIII, of all people? Why not vote me and case me? It shouldn't be hard, seeing that you think that I'm transparent scum.
I expected to finish my sentence with "apparently the answer is not 'back a few pages' because I explained why already" but apparently you actually did read.
So, I'll give you a recap:
Pretty much every claimed PR had nothing to gain by claiming a PR if they were scum. This is still true.
Az still being alive means he has to be the vig. Because if he wasn't the vig, then the real vig would have shot him. And if the real vig was RB'd (which is already very unlikely), then the vig should have spoken up about it because then he's no longer able to self-resolve the situation. The only way Az is scum is if there was no vig in the first place, in which case he was one lucky SOB and the last point still holds.
I just realized my last sentence didn't make any sense. What I meant to say instead of "and the last point still holds" is "but he's not because the last point still holds"
One shot vig claim is super meh. It really doesn't deserve that much consideration, especially now that Az has claimed to have been RBed. If someone else comes forward tomorrow and says that they were RBed, that will be another story. That is also why Az is off the table as a lynch for..today.
The thing is like..it's just not possible that all 4 of us are town. The scum would have to have SO MUCH going for them. Something has gotta give here.
This sonds like a great time for you to extrapolate on your assessment(yesterday) that the mass-claim had 'solved' the game, WG. Because from where I am sitting, it was an unmitigated ******* disaster. The scum gained everything from it, and the town gained **** all nothing. So please explain what you want. Because the more I think about that statement, the more I think you were just talking out of your ass.
Also, I wish Iso would replace back into the game so I could thoroughly berate him. But only if it were as someone that might be scum, so we could lynch him and feel a little better.
I hate these situations. On the one hand, you claiming to have been RBed here is so, so obvious. It literally gets you off of the hook forever. On the other hand, my play as town is fairly consistent and transparent, and if anyone on the scum team has seen my response to this situation before(such as in Wu Tang, where Rhand claimed Doc Day 1 and then was vanillafied by the mafia N1), they would know that I would react with extreme skepticism toward you revealing this.
So, I think we need to wait and see if another person gets RBed tonight, and then decide what to do. Because I certainly don't believe that, if the scum RB were only one-shot, he was going to fire on you last night.
Time to review.
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Are you slow-rolling your cop result for reactions/info, or what?
I wasn't roleblocked nor redirected, so there's that.
I'm itching to vote Az, but he still has a provable claim so it would make no sense to lynch him now.
Vote Cyan
Rhand is confirmed town because they didn't want their shot to go unwasted or to remove wifom.
Az confirms a Roleblocker.
I'll have to review ZDS but my best guess for a third is still in the Proph/Cythare range.
Rhand didn't prevent a kill
Az is claiming to be roleblocked
Cyan's scan is on the dead person
Iso the redirector is dead
We know nothing from night one then.
I still trust Cyan with my life, he's way way too different from his scum meta here.
Still don't think Proph comes after me like he did there as scum
Seppel came off as genuine in his reading of me, but he keeps insisting we kill people I think are firmly town. Seppel you have a lot of experience with Cyan, what scum game do you think he is like here? And why do you think we don't have an investigative role?
Also I think redirecter could be, balance wise, seen as a type of protection which means strictly speaking we don't have to have a bodyguard. Although if that was the case I'd imagine scum would just have killed cyan last night.
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Seppel's vote on me is also really unimpressive. There is literally no universe where I, as scum, 'forgot' that I was supposed to fake an investigation result on someone. I feel like his case on Iso was also 'he claimed Redirector', and had nothing at all to do with behavior, which is a great line for scum to take.
I'm still having a hard time reconciling Az's claim of having been RBed. The mafia could have been counting on that, but would they really take my singular reaction that heavily into account? This is hard for me to believe, but nothing else really makes sense.
Just something I'm going to keep in mind as I re-read today. I have a couple of other specific things to re-check also.
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I feel like the tone/context of these posts is very similar, but I would like insight from some others here.
How far are you willing to go to find out the answer?
I hope they are close, it would mean I played a better scum game in AG than I recall tbh.
(I have a real note on this, but I will give people a chance to respond to your question because I think it will be telling)
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I missed this post and only saw it when Chris quoted it.
I won't be able to go look for a few days but I do want to.
Why are you not talking about the redirector + vig double scum kill possibility in this post?
If the cop AND vig are real, scum can be wasted in 1 Night purely with our PR's (vig 1, redirect NK to another, cop the third)
that's assuming we have 3 anti-town parties ofc, but I think that's pretty safe to assume in a 12-man setup.
Is there some reason you would like me to bring this up? The point of that post wasn't a comprehensive thought on every possible PR interaction. If you have a thought share it with the class Rhand, don't ask why I didn't do your job for you.
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Rhand and Cyan can't both be scum, can they?
Lesse.
Looking at Chris's posts at the end of Avant-Garde:
Gives a half-hearted defense of ZDS here, while pushing his scumbuddy KA. He also invokes the "we're all playing apathetically" card.
On that same page he also provides reads on some players and such.
In this game.. Chris pretty much ignores ZDS? He just solely focuses on pushing Wheat. I looked at the previous page as well and he doesn't mention ZDS. The only thing that Chris mentions about ZDS in this game was in the twilight period, which is kind of a throwaway post for scum!Chris to make since the lynch has already gone through.
Thoughts, Cyan? I'm uncomfortable about relying on meta stuff like this and would prefer to lynch Wheat Today since his posts Today have been absolutely terrible.
You stated that "Az is super scummy but he's self-resolving" which doesn't mesh with your statement here, which is "I will not consider the possibility of any claimed PR to be scum".
It continues to baffle me why you have me as your primary scumread and you basically go out of your way to avoid pushing me. Like, if I'm "transparently scum" and ZDS flipped town, you look at... DCIII, of all people? Why not vote me and case me? It shouldn't be hard, seeing that you think that I'm transparent scum.
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Going to do a vote analysis/rereading post soon. The way the ZDS wagon went down felt.. disingenous to me, and I'd imagine there are scum all over the wagon. The problem is that most of the people on the ZDS wagon are townreads of mine (DCIII, Cyan, GJ, maybe Rhand?) so I just feel like I'm horrifically wrong in my reads somewhere. I think scum are massively outplaying us (but then again I think that in every game).
Seppel is just off on his own world right now, but I don't know if that's something he does as town or scum.
I really want more input from Cythare. He's just been massively lurking and contributed a bandwagon vote onto ZDS after ducking most of the conversation from Yesterday.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
I want to lynch one of: WG, Cythare, or Seppel. Not really sure which, and I'm really paranoid about being wrong now. I've never felt this insecure about a game after a single mislynch before, and I really dislike it.
You are voting for Cyan, the claimed town cop
by thinking Cyan is scum, you are saying "town doesn't have any sort of investigation ability."
I didn't use big words, Seppel.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Challenge entire playerbase to read page 4 of thread and not conclude that both WG and GJ are scum together.
Still looking for scum #3 on reread.
So far, town-reads on Seps, Chris, Cythare. Provisionally leaving Cyan and Rhand alone since they're lightning rods for kills.
Proph and DC3 I'm trying to read, not getting anywhere yet.
WG and GJ are each scum.
Yes Rhand, what a damning case I was building against you.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Seppel's early activity is very much off the cuff. Cythare is typically more scummy than the average bear, but has so far seemed within his standard baseline.
I'll look at page 4 but I don't think you're right about GJ. At the end of the Day Yesterday you listed Wheat, me, and him as possible vig targets. He went out of his way to defend me to you AFTER the ZDS lynch had gone through. So you list him and Wheat and they're buddies but he bothers to push back on my inclusion in the list and instead pushes for Chris? That would have been after following Wheats vote on ZDS to hammer and while knowing that you could be role blocked. Theres very little value in him trying to discourage you from shooting me if he's scum with Wheat there, or really just generally.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
(1) Wheat_Grinder - Prophylaxis
(1) Sir Chris - Rhand
(1) Cyan - Seppel
Not voting: Azrael, Cyan, Cythare, DCIII, Gentleman Johnny, Sir Chris, Wheat_Grinder
With 10 alive it's 6 to lynch.
Cythare and Gentleman Johnny have been prodded.
(I make post tomorrow, peasants)
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Why assume his sincerity?
Proph is off my "want to lynch" list. I don't see how that's true. DCIII is town. This is his towngame.
I didn't read page four but I'll trust you on this.
Unvote, vote WG Haters can't be choosers. Okay. Not my most favorite response. Oh crap but DCIII disagrees with Az.
*muses*
It's possible DC3 is defending GJ so strongly here because he knows I'm wrong on that point.
It would be pretty ballsy for both WG and GJ to jump on that end of day wagon as scum. Maybe I'll take a look at page 4 again and see if it's possible that only WG is the scum there.
That said, don't have much more time today, as I have to take my car to get its clutch replaced (yay $1,400 repair!).
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Proph's 778 makes me feel better about his read.
I am predicting the scum team in some cluster of Azreal, Cythare, Chris, Wheat. Iso flipping means if a PR is lying, I think its probably Az, but like someone already said, it will resolve itself.
Az, humor me. You got roleblocked (fine, fine). You are relatively insistent that one of me or WG is scum, why is your vote on neither one of us?
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Yeah I mean like..Iso already ruined this game. Seemingly all of the tower's power is neutralized because of him. But there is nothing we can do about that now, other than try to salvage the situation.
As for him actually re-directing me, presumably he did so because he had to. He likely would have gotten lynched otherwise.
I'm still hoping that someone can show me one of Cythare's scum games.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Rather than giving your thoughts on my reasons, you ask me why I assumed he was being sincere, which I wasn't assuming, I was drawing the conclusion based on the reasons that I explained in that very post... then after Seppel points out that we disagree, you reconsider my point as being viable and throw out the idea that I'm making it because I know that you're wrong. But if the points that I was making are enough to reconsider the GJ read, then why were you asking me why I assumed he was being sincere to begin with?
Also - assume Rhand is town. Is Cyan scum?
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@Cyan - same question Re: Az
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Isn't it optimal play, if he knew he was going to roleblock Az, to defend the townie there though, DCIII? I mean from your perspective think about it. He knows the shot doesn't matter because its in his head already to block Az. Why would you NOT talk up a townie? Classic buddying, yeah?
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
okay
anti-town players?
I expected to finish my sentence with "apparently the answer is not 'back a few pages' because I explained why already" but apparently you actually did read.
So, I'll give you a recap:
Pretty much every claimed PR had nothing to gain by claiming a PR if they were scum. This is still true.
Az still being alive means he has to be the vig. Because if he wasn't the vig, then the real vig would have shot him. And if the real vig was RB'd (which is already very unlikely), then the vig should have spoken up about it because then he's no longer able to self-resolve the situation. The only way Az is scum is if there was no vig in the first place, in which case he was one lucky SOB and the last point still holds.
The thing is like..it's just not possible that all 4 of us are town. The scum would have to have SO MUCH going for them. Something has gotta give here.
This sonds like a great time for you to extrapolate on your assessment(yesterday) that the mass-claim had 'solved' the game, WG. Because from where I am sitting, it was an unmitigated ******* disaster. The scum gained everything from it, and the town gained **** all nothing. So please explain what you want. Because the more I think about that statement, the more I think you were just talking out of your ass.
Also, I wish Iso would replace back into the game so I could thoroughly berate him. But only if it were as someone that might be scum, so we could lynch him and feel a little better.