I've had my PPP set at 50 or 60 before with no issues, but I don't have a real preference. If it helps people like Iso to have lower PPP, it doesn't make a difference to me.
I personally use 50ppp because that means I can work out what page a post was on more easily. More relevantly, I only use a computer to browse the forums.
Idem as EtR. Ppp isn't an issue for me.
My issue with mobile playing is readability and the inability to hide signatures.
Issues I have in general:
* can't see who's reading. Try finishing a game in lylo where you need a coordinated hammer. It's awkward.
* the preview function doesn't refresh the thread
* no timestamps without mouseover
* late e-mails for private messages
* longer loading times in general
For those of you with the timestamps issue, there are hard timestamps in place. Just hover over the relative timestamp for the full stamp.
TK is right however that the techs are currently looking at that area as a place to trim JavaScript to improve performance (especially for mobile browsing).
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
Having just now come upon this rule, I want to bring it to a greater debate, because I think it's a bad rule and a hassle: the mandatory review rule.
I'm of the opinion that (a) the rule's purpose is not literally to require that every setup get someone to give it some special attention, but rather to make sure people don't just put their setups on the list without considering balancing/whether their setup needs review, and (b) there are some setups for which review is a waste of time.
Case in point: I want to run a second of my experimental open minis. Not only is it pointless to get a review for it, since the setup is open and intuitive, but I'm of the opinion that a reviewer could not definitively say whether the setup is balanced or not - because that's the point of the setup! I make many disclaimers to the effect that the setup may be imbalanced and that it's up to the players to decide whether they should play or not, and the last one I ran went over without a hitch for precisely that reason.
Furthermore, I don't think there's a great distinction between my setup and the types of setups that very obviously don't need to be reviewed - setups that have already happened before, and super-simple setups in a similar vein (i.e. vanilla townies vs. vanilla mafia).
I suspect my case is just due to Void being extra-cautious, but I'd still like some consideration whether this rule needs to be so immoderately written or enforced.
Open setups and mountainous setups (which, if you think about it, are open setups too) don't need to be reviewed because players know exactly what they're getting themselves into and therefore won't have to worry about any nasty surprises.
Xyre, the Council actually implemented that rule (not Void!) after we had a handful of setups that only got half-assed reviews, one review, or no reviews and flopped spectacularly (Starcraft comes to mind, for example). And in certain instances where mods have ignored reviewer feedback and plowed on ahead, it's generally had negative feedback. It's a check in place for the sake of the players as well as the mod.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yeah, I'm still reviewing setups that have things like, say, traitor roles in them and encouraging folks to weed those out of the final version, or otherwise catching roles that could single-handedly implode games.
I think there is an argument that some people need reviewer help much, much less than others, but even for experienced mods, a second set of eyes certainly doesn't hurt.
Xyre, the Council actually implemented that rule (not Void!) after we had a handful of setups that only got half-assed reviews, one review, or no reviews and flopped spectacularly (Starcraft comes to mind, for example). And in certain instances where mods have ignored reviewer feedback and plowed on ahead, it's generally had negative feedback. It's a check in place for the sake of the players as well as the mod.
Oh, don't misunderstand: I knew this wasn't Void's doing at all. I just posted it here because I think open setups are worth an exception more broadly (and not just because that's my new niche, either).
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I will be adding Xyre to the Mini Queue in a moment. There appears to be a consensus showing that open setups allow the players to decide the risk factor.
I would still prefer to have at least one reviewer to look at Xyre's game for the sake of balancing. If that one reviewer comes back and states the game cannot be balanced properly, then I would be willing to bypass the second reviewer for that reason. Of course this not my decision, but just my thought.
Apparently I'm alone in thinking that open setups should still need some degree of review. The issue isn't whether the player knows what they're getting in for, but to try and ensure that the game is as balanced as possible, and that the game does not suffer from any obviously broken problems. Maybe they need less stringent review because any big problems in a fully open setup should become clear when the game thread comes under public scrutiny, but I think it's silly to assume that a host will be able to spot all of the problems before that point: that's why we want reviewers in the first place, in open setups flaws are just found before the game starts.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Is it really that big of a problem in this case though given that not only is it an open, but an experimental setup? I mean when you think about it, you can bet most open setups we are familiar with were not balanced when they were first created. There needs to be a testing ground for said setups as not even a reviewer is going to see all the holes in a setup without actual playtime on the setups. I say as long as a mod makes it thoroughly clear that a setup is experimental and may be broken/unbalanced, then let them have a shot at it.
If people desperately wanted to bypass the reviewer system, we'd have seen more complaints about it. I don't think many people want to run open games or we'd have seen more of them. By far the biggest thing I've seen hosts want to do is come up with wacky roles and rules, the kind that don't work in open setups, and those have to get reviewed. I'm not at all worried.
If people desperately wanted to bypass the reviewer system, we'd have seen more complaints about it. I don't think many people want to run open games or we'd have seen more of them. By far the biggest thing I've seen hosts want to do is come up with wacky roles and rules, the kind that don't work in open setups, and those have to get reviewed. I'm not at all worried.
That has pretty much been the only thing stopping me from taking a straight up wacky or insane xylbot setup and running it as a possible bastard mafia style game. I mean, who wouldn't want roles like these:
-XylBot- Soulshifter (sk; super-rare; 6+ players): You can kill. If you die, you choose another player to become a Serial Killer in your place. Actions: kill
-XylBot- Jackie Chan (town, sk; super-rare; 4+ players): You can kill another player each night. You are immune to all actions. Actions: kill
-XylBot- Chuck Norris (town, sk; rare; 4+ players): You have 10 one-shot abilities. You can only use one ability each night. You are immune to kills. Actions: eradicate (1 use) track (1 use) protect (1 use) block (1 use) antidote (1 use) exorcise (1 use) frame (1 use) abduct (1 use) inspect (1 use) kill (1 use)
To continue with the PPP thing again. Unless there are plans to really fix the mobile experience I am of the [slightly biased] opinion* that the forum should not consider mobile users when deciding the PPP, because as of right now there seems to be only be a limited number of people that can even use this site on mobile. Having a mobile PPP amount won't help the mobile users since the mobile experience is already bad because of a lot of other things most of which seem like they won't be helped/fixed with a real low PPP.
*Pure desktop user. But did confirm today that the site is basically unusable on my phone.
There's nothing wrong with what we're currently doing, but it might catch the eye of people not already within our community that check out the sub if we switch it up - just curious on opinions on this. I like it how it is, myself.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Now, moving all completed game threads to a "completed games" sub (say, a week after the game ends to allow for discussion) might help, since that greatly reduces front page clutter.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I agree with Meg as well. If it is a concern then a completed games sub forum is best. If it is not a concern then how we do things now is fine. I personally wouldn't mind seeing a completed games sub forum to clean up the clutter, but it's more of a want than a need I think.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
In the 'recommended reading' section of the games archive... should there be a town victory somewhere?
Thoughts on giving recommended reading an update?
(I mean, those games are ancient.)
Basic #49 - The Last Airbender Mafia is a fantastic read. Lots of high level (and low level) play that ended in a LyLo Town victory. Many have agreed on this in the past.
Almost feels like this should be Theory and Discussion, but what the heck -
- I personally find Katawa Shoujo fun to read, though it might be my guilty pleasure of mafia games.
- Both of the MTGS Mafia Redux games are amazing.
- Endgame of The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey. As AsianInvasion put it, "This endgame is perhaps quintessential Mafia: Disregard distractions. Analyze behavior."
- Cyberspace, as mentioned, had outstanding scum and town play all around. (Would recommend skipping Cyberspace thread and read Realspace; a novel idea but was mostly empty)
- Steins;Gate and Innistrad for solid scum play throughout.
- Ataghan - good playerbase, amazing design.
Ah ha! Signed in through the old website and found my email that way. If you need help getting into the scribe account, LMK, or you can do it the same way.
OK, update from the Crosstown committee. We finally have a third setup ready sans flavor (Though that will come shortly.) I have heard though that some players on the MTGS side have dropped out. If this is the case, I think now would be a good time to find some before game start.
OK, update from the Crosstown committee. We finally have a third setup ready sans flavor (Though that will come shortly.) I have heard though that some players on the MTGS side have dropped out. If this is the case, I think now would be a good time to find some before game start.
So long as I have not seen the setup I will be able to play in it.
I've had my PPP set at 50 or 60 before with no issues, but I don't have a real preference. If it helps people like Iso to have lower PPP, it doesn't make a difference to me.
Usually, mobile sites are noted in the URL (like m.facebook.com) which you can access just like any other website. Usually.
My issue with mobile playing is readability and the inability to hide signatures.
Issues I have in general:
* can't see who's reading. Try finishing a game in lylo where you need a coordinated hammer. It's awkward.
* the preview function doesn't refresh the thread
* no timestamps without mouseover
* late e-mails for private messages
* longer loading times in general
TK is right however that the techs are currently looking at that area as a place to trim JavaScript to improve performance (especially for mobile browsing).
Body Count: GRRRUUUUUUUUUUU
إن سرقت إسرق جمل
Level 1 Judge
My Cube for use with 6th ed. Rules
I'm of the opinion that (a) the rule's purpose is not literally to require that every setup get someone to give it some special attention, but rather to make sure people don't just put their setups on the list without considering balancing/whether their setup needs review, and (b) there are some setups for which review is a waste of time.
Case in point: I want to run a second of my experimental open minis. Not only is it pointless to get a review for it, since the setup is open and intuitive, but I'm of the opinion that a reviewer could not definitively say whether the setup is balanced or not - because that's the point of the setup! I make many disclaimers to the effect that the setup may be imbalanced and that it's up to the players to decide whether they should play or not, and the last one I ran went over without a hitch for precisely that reason.
Furthermore, I don't think there's a great distinction between my setup and the types of setups that very obviously don't need to be reviewed - setups that have already happened before, and super-simple setups in a similar vein (i.e. vanilla townies vs. vanilla mafia).
I suspect my case is just due to Void being extra-cautious, but I'd still like some consideration whether this rule needs to be so immoderately written or enforced.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Xyre, the Council actually implemented that rule (not Void!) after we had a handful of setups that only got half-assed reviews, one review, or no reviews and flopped spectacularly (Starcraft comes to mind, for example). And in certain instances where mods have ignored reviewer feedback and plowed on ahead, it's generally had negative feedback. It's a check in place for the sake of the players as well as the mod.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I think there is an argument that some people need reviewer help much, much less than others, but even for experienced mods, a second set of eyes certainly doesn't hurt.
Oh, don't misunderstand: I knew this wasn't Void's doing at all. I just posted it here because I think open setups are worth an exception more broadly (and not just because that's my new niche, either).
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
And I'm pretty sure that's one of those "unstated rules" things, Xyre
We can poke Void to update the Hosting List OP if you're really bothered by the fact that it's not explicitly stated there.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I would still prefer to have at least one reviewer to look at Xyre's game for the sake of balancing. If that one reviewer comes back and states the game cannot be balanced properly, then I would be willing to bypass the second reviewer for that reason. Of course this not my decision, but just my thought.
Yup.
No one's stopping them.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands
That has pretty much been the only thing stopping me from taking a straight up wacky or insane xylbot setup and running it as a possible bastard mafia style game. I mean, who wouldn't want roles like these:
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands
*Pure desktop user. But did confirm today that the site is basically unusable on my phone.
There's nothing wrong with what we're currently doing, but it might catch the eye of people not already within our community that check out the sub if we switch it up - just curious on opinions on this. I like it how it is, myself.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Thoughts on giving recommended reading an update?
(I mean, those games are ancient.)
I vote we change nothing.
We should put Cyberspace in recommended reading.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
EDIT: I should probably read that game then.
Basic #49 - The Last Airbender Mafia is a fantastic read. Lots of high level (and low level) play that ended in a LyLo Town victory. Many have agreed on this in the past.
Thoughts, Council?
- I personally find Katawa Shoujo fun to read, though it might be my guilty pleasure of mafia games.
- Both of the MTGS Mafia Redux games are amazing.
- Endgame of The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey. As AsianInvasion put it, "This endgame is perhaps quintessential Mafia: Disregard distractions. Analyze behavior."
- Cyberspace, as mentioned, had outstanding scum and town play all around. (Would recommend skipping Cyberspace thread and read Realspace; a novel idea but was mostly empty)
- Steins;Gate and Innistrad for solid scum play throughout.
- Ataghan - good playerbase, amazing design.
EDIT: I no longer know the proxy email address I used to create the Mafiascribe account, and can't sign in. : /
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands
So long as I have not seen the setup I will be able to play in it.
No offence to tare btw